The Flash Box Office Thread

[DCDAVE]

Looks like it’s the likes of Peacemaker, Waller and possibly Blue Beetle who will make the cut. It would be a bad idea to keep and of the major DCEU characters. If it’s Momoa playing Lobo instead that also is different and won’t be the same as if he was still Aquaman in the DCU.

Peacemaker and Waller are on the Max side so you can hide them in streaming. Blue Beetle is low budget I think it could actually surprise if it is mildly entertaining. Do you know when Blue Beetle was completed? Was Gunn able to at least put his mark on it?

 

[Karelia]

Oof. I guess I owe the guy an apology who told me this would bomb hard lol. I said we didn't know for sure (this was pre-release) but they were right. Sheesh.

 

[Iceman]

Peacemaker and Waller are on the Max side so you can hide them in streaming. Blue Beetle is low budget I think it could actually surprise if it is mildly entertaining. Do you know when Blue Beetle was completed? Was Gunn able to at least put his mark on it?

I don’t know, but Gunn recently made a comment that suggested Blue Beetle is “the first DCU character”. I guess that could change if the film turns out to be poor but at least a chance there.

 

[Pfeiffer-Pfan]

This has to be an issue with the DC brand in general, right? Gunn/Safran have a lot of work ahead of them.

 

[TheSmoothKnight]

This has to be an issue with the DC brand in general, right? Gunn/Safran have a lot of work ahead of them.

Yikes, that’s wild and sad right there.

 

[Pfeiffer-Pfan]

Yikes, that’s wild and sad right there.

I will admit, I'm a little sad for Keaton. This should have been a triumphant return for him.

Still, he's in London filming Beetlejuice 2, reuniting with Burton on a character he truly loves. He'll be alright.

 

[Comicbookguy339]

I will admit, I'm a little sad for Keaton. This should have been a triumphant return for him.

Still, he's in London filming Beetlejuice 2, reuniting with Burton on a character he truly loves. He'll be alright.

Keaton's scenes were actually great but he ends up being in the movie for sheer fan service. He doesn't have an arc or an ending. Compare that to Tobeyman and Garfield in NWH. Both got a decent farewell.

 

[DCDAVE]

I don’t know, but Gunn recently made a comment that suggested Blue Beetle is “the first DCU character”. I guess that could change if the film turns out to be poor but at least a chance there.

Was that to try to save the box office? One of the complaints about Shazam and Flash is that the actors are done with DC and the characters will not be part of the DCU going forward. I do think the Hamada verse has been more of a disaster then the Snyderverse.

 

[Iceman]

Was that to try to save the box office? One of the complaints about Shazam and Flash is that the actors are done with DC and the characters will not be part of the DCU going forward. I do think the Hamada verse has been more of a disaster then the Snyderverse.

Could be actually so can’t put total faith in any comments he makes till those films are done.

 

[Comicbookguy339]

Was that to try to save the box office? One of the complaints about Shazam and Flash is that the actors are done with DC and the characters will not be part of the DCU going forward. I do think the Hamada verse has been more of a disaster then the Snyderverse.

In terms of box office it absolutely has been a bigger disaster.

 

[Pfeiffer-Pfan]

Some pretty good points made in this Deadline article:

The Flash Loses Speed - Here's Why

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

This has to be an issue with the DC brand in general, right? Gunn/Safran have a lot of work ahead of them.

Box office? I would say certainly. But the Cinemascore would be issues with this specific film.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

Keaton's scenes were actually great but he ends up being in the movie for sheer fan service. He doesn't have an arc or an ending. Compare that to Tobeyman and Garfield in NWH. Both got a decent farewell.

It actually got me to like the Garfield Spider-Man whom I hated in his own films.

 

[DCDAVE]

In terms of box office it absolutely has been a bigger disaster.

Would Aquaman be part of the Hamada verse? It was the only one that made a billion out of both universes. I guess you could include Aquaman in both. Wan was a Hamada hire.

 

[DCDAVE]

Oof. I guess I owe the guy an apology who told me this would bomb hard lol. I said we didn't know for sure (this was pre-release) but they were right. Sheesh.

We all do. I almost got my account suspended for trying to defend the movie.

 

[Comicbookguy339]

Some pretty good points made in this Deadline article:

The Flash Loses Speed - Here's Why

How much do those late night /press circuit interviews actually contribute to people wanting to see a movie? I don't think Miller and Keaton doing interviews would have made any difference.

I also see people debating whether the reason for the failure of The Flash can be attributed to Miller's bad reputation or to Gunn announcing that he's rebooting the DC cinematic universe. Both of those probably contributed (we can't say how much because we'll never know how aware the GA is of behind the scenes troubles) but I can personally think of one main reason.

The Flash came out 6 years after the theatrical cut of Justice League and the Flash was a nothing character in that version of the film. It would have been very hard to maintain the hype even if Snyder's version of the film was released back then and everybody loved the turning back time scene.

The DCEU hasn't really had any forward momentum since Aquaman. There haven't been any new team-up movies to remind people of these characters. If you want to wait 6 years between introducing a character and giving them a solo movie then they need to make meaningful appearances in other movies in the meantime. It was just way too late for this movie regardless of any reboot plans.

 

[TheVileOne]

Why what? Why keep them? I’m not saying they should, just what the plan looks like it could be from things posted from Gunn on the Hype. The characters are low profile and I’d bet people I know have no clue who they are. Even I haven’t seen Peacemaker yet and I spend my life on a superhero board lol.

Yes, why keep them if you are getting rid of everyone else?

 

[TheVileOne]

How much do those late night /press circuit interviews actually contribute to people wanting to see a movie? I don't think Miller and Keaton doing interviews would have made any difference.

I also see people debating whether the reason for the failure of The Flash can be attributed to Miller's bad reputation or to Gunn announcing that he's rebooting the DC cinematic universe. Both of those probably contributed (we can't say how much because we'll never know how aware the GA is of behind the scenes troubles) but I can personally think of one main reason.

The Flash came out 6 years after the theatrical cut of Justice League and the Flash was a nothing character in that version of the film. It would have been very hard to maintain the hype even if Snyder's version of the film was released back then and everybody loved the turning back time scene.

The DCEU hasn't really had any forward momentum since Aquaman. There haven't been any new team-up movies to remind people of these characters. If you want to wait 6 years between introducing a character and giving them a solo movie then they need to make meaningful appearances in other movies in the meantime. It was just way too late for this movie regardless of any reboot plans.

Whenever something like this happens, I don't think it's ever just one thing you can point to. It's always multiple contributing factors. Everyone just wants an easy uncomplicated explanation and scapegoat.

 

[Pfeiffer-Pfan]

Whenever something like this happens, I don't think it's ever just one thing you can point to. It's always multiple contributing factors. Everyone just wants an easy uncomplicated explanation and scapegoat.

Exactly, WB will be spending a lot of time dissecting just what went wrong with The Flash. Some they know and other reasons they will come to discover.

As the article stated, WB did the best they could considering the circumstances.

 

[TheSmoothKnight]

Welp, this will make even more easier for Gunn to quickly hit the reset button on the whole thing.

 

[samsnee]

Ezra was only in Justice League. That’s it, 1 appearance as the Flash. And that movie bombed. So not surprising audiences didn’t really care to see a whole movie about him.

Add on to the fact that it was Zod again, who audiences already saw in MoS, which had a mixed reception at best. So as a villain, I don’t think it was enough to draw audiences in.

The only real hook for this movie was seeing Keaton as Batman again. But for people like me, the negative outweighs the positive that I’m willing to wait to see it on Max later this year.

 

[Comicbookguy339]

Ezra was only in Justice League. That’s it, 1 appearance as the Flash. And that movie bombed. So not surprising audiences didn’t really care to see a whole movie about him.

Add on to the fact that it was Zod again, who audiences already saw in MoS, which had a mixed reception at best. So as a villain, I don’t think it was enough to draw audiences in.

The only real hook for this movie was seeing Keaton as Batman again. But for people like me, the negative outweighs the positive that I’m willing to wait to see it on Max later this year.

Let's imagine that MCU phase 1 went down exactly the way it did but then after The Avengers Marvel Studios put out nothing other than Thor The Dark World (Aqauman) in 2013, Ant-Man in 2015 (Shazam), Ant-Man 2 in 2017 (Shazam 2) and then expected everyone to get hyped for a new solo Hulk movie with Ruffalo (The Flash) in 2018.

 

[SomeOldGuy]

The Flash came out 6 years after the theatrical cut of Justice League and the Flash was a nothing character in that version of the film.

This is the key. With any kind of multi-episode or ongoing property — be it a fantasy book series, a TV show or a superhero franchise — the thing that keeps people coming back is the characters. Growing up I got to watch a lot of MASH, which had one of the longest runs of any TV series ever. People didn’t tune in to see the Korean War or field surgical techniques or the shortcomings of army logistics (even though these were all regular plot points), they tuned in because they loved the characters.

Marvel understands this, or at least they used to. Phase 1 was a tour de force in excellent character building, both from the writers and actors, and that propelled the franchise for more than a decade. A big part of the problem with the current phase is that there are few if any characters anyone really cares about.

The DCEU never gave the audience engaging, likeable characters they wanted to come back and see again and again. Who wants to watch a Gloomy Gus Superman mope around the screen, or a paranoid murderous Batman? Or…whatever Miller’s Flash was…sort of a neurotic dork I guess?

I’m not saying everyone has to be happy jokey rainbows or something, but the characters have to be compelling to audiences, likeable in some way, to get them to sign up for more installments. And they certainly didn’t do that with Flash, unfortunately.

 

[JerseyJoker]

Brings back to Justice League's debut weekend and watching it bomb and how people dealt with that.

 

[Iceman]

Yes, why keep them if you are getting rid of everyone else?

A full reboot is always the cleaner option and additionally avoids audience confusion. Gunn seems to want to keep his low profile pet projects (or have his cake and eat it) and he’s the one in the hotseat so it may happen.

He could have been just doing PR speak when mentioning Blue Beetle, but that one I would personally like to be grandfathered in as it seems to be the only one that isn’t strictly in either the DCEU or DCU and I want the character to get a fair shot (and also like the actor).