The Dark Knight Rises The Joker sized elephant in the room

[RedSkull]

I fail to see how Harvey Dent murdering people would cause people to riot in Gotham. It would be a scandal for sure and yes I realize he was Gotham's white knight and all that stuff but I feel like telling people that Dent was a lie and that he killed people wouldn't be enough to get them to riot

 

[floreairfoot]

It seems like the Joker is gonna feel more like an anomaly in the scheme of the trilogy's story.

I like how you said that, I think that's exactly what he is.

I hope he is his own mercenary who Talia is hiring for her cause, instead of some League of Shadows reject who's only getting his chance now 8 years later.

I really hope this too; maybe even a betrayal to the LOS.

Like.... once he gets the power, he won't want to give it up, just to have everything destroyed.

 

[Fudgie]

It seems like the Joker is gonna feel more like an anomaly in the scheme of the trilogy's story.

Never going to happen. Bane has to be a reaction to the Harvey Two Face cover up which was all Joker's doing.

Just because Begins was tasteless enough to reduce Scarecrow to a lackey of the League doesn't mean Bane will be their errand boy, too.

 

[Nevincer]

Never going to happen. Bane has to be a reaction to the Harvey Two Face cover up which was all Joker's doing.

We'll see when we get there, I suppose.

 

[vox16]

I just hope that Nolan will eventually come out and describe what his initial plan was for the third movie and how he would have included Joker. You know he won't come out and say it until TDKR is last year's news; considering how excited we already are without Joker. He wouldn't want to kill the hype.

 

[floreairfoot]

Never going to happen. Bane has to be a reaction to the Harvey Two Face cover up which was all Joker's doing.

Just because Begins was tasteless enough to reduce Scarecrow to a lackey of the League doesn't mean Bane will be their errand boy, too.

Scarecrow wasn't just a lackey, they gave him something he wanted and he helped them. It was a tradeoff.

 

[MagnarTheGreat]

Scarecrow was kept in the dark about Ra's al Ghul's true plans. He thought the city was going to be held for ransom. I think Bane knows the plan in The Dark Knight Rises.

 

[MrWayne]

I thought I had read somewhere that the plan was initially for Joker and Two/Face to be in the 3rd film as well. I think it was Goyer who said it himself.

Unfortunately, it won’t be possible for Joker, but I am happy that we are getting Bane instead. I think it makes it feel more like a new movie having new villains cast.

Even though Joker reappearing for the Rises saga would’ve def been Epic. More so if Joker and Bane were in it together. I don’t think we could handle the awesomeness of that mayhem they would bring lol

 

[BestGirl]

I fail to see how Harvey Dent murdering people would cause people to riot in Gotham. It would be a scandal for sure and yes I realize he was Gotham's white knight and all that stuff but I feel like telling people that Dent was a lie and that he killed people wouldn't be enough to get them to riot

Dent was the inspiration for the Harvey Dent Act, which I've gotten the impression has been used to push ordinary people around in order to keep crime down. Add that to the fact that Gotham is already seething due to class/economic issues and the Dent scandal would be like lighting a match to some gasoline.

I thought I had read somewhere that the plan was initially for Joker and Two/Face to be in the 3rd film as well. I think it was Goyer who said it himself.

Unfortunately, it won’t be possible for Joker, but I am happy that we are getting Bane instead. I think it makes it feel more like a new movie having new villains cast.

Even though Joker reappearing for the Rises saga would’ve def been Epic. More so if Joker and Bane were in it together. I don’t think we could handle the awesomeness of that mayhem they would bring lol

Early on, Goyer wanted the events of TDK to carry over two movies, so that Dent would be scarred after TDK, and the Joker would somehow be responsible for it. Eventually everything was condensed down into one movie so there was no need to bring Two-Face back. Clearly the Joker was meant to return, though. Perhaps it's just as well that he won't.

 

[Nevincer]

I thought I had read somewhere that the plan was initially for Joker and Two/Face to be in the 3rd film as well. I think it was Goyer who said it himself.

No no no, there was originally talk of the arc they had for Dark Knight being split into two films which would be a trilogy. Eventually the whole thing got compromised into a single film, and they didn't go for the court scarring stuff. So they were never in that regard planned to be in this story, it was just the possibility of the second half of TDK being something else that would be it's own film.

 

[MrWayne]

Agreed, I can only imagine how crazy we would all be going on the boards knowing that Heath & Hardy would be sharing screen time... Some things are just not meant to be.

I do think it couldn’t hurt to mention the Joker at all, but it won’t hurt the film at all to not make a mention. I think it's just more of a fan want kind of thing. It's not needed.

In my own mind though, I do wonder what became of Joker in the last 8 years. Wondering if Joker is even in Gotham at all at this point in the time line. Did he sit in a padded cell aging? Did he escape, was still at large and hasn't been seen since?

 

[Nevincer]

Yeah, I'm not gonna lie. It kind of urks me that might not be addressed.

 

[BestGirl]

Agreed, I can only imagine how crazy we would all be going on the boards knowing that Heath & Hardy would be sharing screen time... Some things are just not meant to be.

It's not so much the reaction on the boards that would bother me, it's the fact that the Joker tends to take over any movie he's in. Bane and Catwoman deserve their own time to shine. Plus, it's hard to imagine how the Joker would even fit into TDKR. If Bane were to release him from Arkham he would probably just mess up Bane's and Batman's plans just for the hell of it and Bane would have to kill him. It would be an unnecessary subplot in an already crowded movie.

I do think it couldn’t hurt to mention the Joker at all, but it won’t hurt the film at all to not make a mention. I think it's just more of a fan want kind of thing. It's not needed.

In my own mind though, I do wonder what became of Joker in the last 8 years. Wondering if Joker is even in Gotham at all at this point in the time line. Did he sit in a padded cell aging? Did he escape, was still at large and hasn't been seen since?

Yeah, I'm really interested to see how the Joker will be handled in this movie. Will he be dead? Transferred to another city as **** starts to hit the fan?

 

[Nevincer]

I'm gonna be really disappointed if they don't touch it.

 

[MrWayne]

I imagined in my mind a scene I would’ve loved to have seen in TDKR where after killing all guards in the area, Bane approaches the highly secured 2 feet thick Plexiglass cell where Joker was being held. From there the scene would be something right out of Silence Of The Lambs and a well written dialogue between the two villains would transpire. Then Bane hits the switch, the cell doors open and Bane tells Joker “It’s time to play..”, whilst throwing him a bag of tricks; Knives, guns etc.

 

[AnneFan]

Yeah, I'm really interested to see how the Joker will be handled in this movie. Will he be dead? Transferred to another city as **** starts to hit the fan?

Yeah, I don't have a clue. I don't think he should be declared dead, but I know what you mean. If Bane breaks out Blackgate prisoners only, does he leave Arkham Asylum alone where The Joker is still sitting in his cell that whole time?

 

[Nevincer]

More importantly, if Gotham is as wrecked as we're lead to believe and there's all this anarchy, are we supposed to believe the Joker isn't present? The most tangible and realistic explanation for me would be that he's not in Arkham or Gotham at all, he's been transferred elsewhere.

 

[AnneFan]

The most tangible and realistic explanation for me would be that he's not in Arkham or Gotham at all, he's been transferred elsewhere.

Transferring him out would make sense overall. He's a high level threat and if Gotham reaches a peace time, perhaps they don't want anything to do with that sort of person, or to risk anything.

If it's good enough for a good guy (Gordon) to get the sack once peace comes, it's good enough for The Joker to be sent packing, but right out of town.

 

[atila9323]

 

[MrWayne]

Well lookey what we have here... Hmmmmmmmmm. Arkham?

 

[Herolee10]

If Nolan's plan is to make sure that Bruce will never be Batman again or that Gotham will NEVER need Batman in his franchise, then I doubt we'll hear someone saying that the Joker's escaped Arkham or wherever at the end of the film to lead to the usual.."Batman continues fighting the good fight again" scenario.

Whatever happens in this film, I don't think there'll be any villains left for Bruce to go after.

 

[AnneFan]

If Nolan's plan is to make sure that Bruce will never be Batman again or that Gotham will NEVER need Batman in his franchise, then I doubt we'll hear someone saying that the Joker's escaped Arkham or wherever at the end of the film to lead to the usual.."Batman continues fighting the good fight again" scenario.

Whatever happens in this film, I don't think there'll be any villains left for Bruce to go after.

Agreed.

 

[Mr. Fixit]

"the ONLY way to do (ledger's) joker again is CGI..."

No need for CGI at all. If Nolan wanted to stick Joker in all he'd have to do is go through deleted footage from the first movie, perhaps makeup tests, archival footage....etc...

I'm sure there's cool stuff in the vault that would be perfect for a small cameo.

Anyway it's not happening so its a moot point.

 

[Nevincer]

Well lookey what we have here... Hmmmmmmmmm. Arkham?

That pic is from Batman Begins

 

[Greens]

"the ONLY way to do (ledger's) joker again is CGI..."

No need for CGI at all. If Nolan wanted to stick Joker in all he'd have to do is go through deleted footage from the first movie, perhaps makeup tests, archival footage....etc...

I'm sure there's cool stuff in the vault that would be perfect for a small cameo.

Anyway it's not happening so its a moot point.

In case of an apocalypse, that vault is the place where I will be going. I respect Nolan's decisions but dammit...