The most boring "big character" in the DC universe?

[Aristotle]

for me the two characters who equal boring to me are aquaman and green arrow...
they may have had decent storylines perhaps for some...but i never warmed to them.

for me dc is all about superman,batman and wonder woman.

A Marvel fan would say that.

You clearly haven't read GL-GA, any of Grell's run, any of Smith's run, or any of Meltzer's run on GA.

 

[Aristotle]

It really does'nt reinvegorate anything, since its pretty clear that he's jealous of superman. he's a smug and dopey character that always gets his ass handed to him. he's a one trick poney." i must defeat superman!". that has always been his life long goal and thats all it would ever be. he's not a very multi-faceted character, that you're trying to make him out to be, he'll always have that one schtick, hovering his head. thats all the guy has ever been. Of course he has brillaint and colorful ways to go about his plans, and those are the interesting stories, but in the end he fails.

im not saying he's a bad character, but he's well overrated.

To reduce Lex Luthor to "I must defeat Superman" is like saying all superheroes can be reduced to "I must fight crime!" Which they can, but that misses a hell of a lot of nuance.

 

[Aristotle]

Actually, you wanna see why Aquaman is the baddest mambajamba on Planet Earth? Go buy Issue 39 from your local comic shop (its the one right before the comic went down the toilet and they put some new crap impostor in the Aquaman role) He acts like Aquaman in that issue.

Isn't that the one that ends with Aquaman talking about the size of seahorses? I stared at that final page for an hour trying to figure out if there was some deeper meaning. I don't think there was.

 

[CConn]

Yea, Peter David's run was the best writing for Aquaman. And after he left, the guy who finished off that '94 series didn't do terrible, but not great either. I liked the '03 series start with Waterbearer, and as I said before I disliked Sub Diego and stuff afterwards, but as I re-read and think about the idea rather than how it was written, I tend to like it somewhat.

It's a tough job defending Aquaman and why he is great. I, as many other Aquaman fans, have done this too many times to count to want to do it again. But there is no way he is a boring character.

Describe his personality to me. That's what my problem with him has always been; no disconcerting personality. Except for the whole royal bearded prick characterization, and that was just them ripping off Namor.

 

[Aristotle]

Describe his personality to me. That's what my problem with him has always been; no disconcerting personality. Except for the whole royal bearded prick characterization, and that was just them ripping off Namor.

When did ol' sea-Spock have a beard?

 

[CConn]

When did ol' sea-Spock have a beard?

Uh, humm, he didn't ever have a period. What he did - and does have - is a characterization that was very similar to Aquaman's throughout the '90s.

Ironically enough, I LOVED the whole Sub Diego stuff. Classic Aquaman, IMO. And he was even pretty badass at times. But while I loved the series, in the end, the character, to me, really had nothing that really defined or made me interested in him.

Y'know, people say Superman's perfection makes him boring, and while they may be true, the dude DOES still have a personality. He's the boy scout. The naive, optimistic voice of a bygone age. Batman has his own distinct personally. As does Flash(all of them), as does GL (all of them). But Aquaman...I don't see it. I don't see anything that makes me say "yeah, that dude is special."

 

[Erzengel]

I think if you have to go through so many "revamps" it shows that the character might be on the dull side.

Aquaman for instance.

All smiles in his orange and green. Okay lets make him dark and brooding, give him long hair and a goatee and cut off his hand. Okay now let's make him the water bearer and give him a water hand. Okay lets give him a haircut and a shave now.

 

[trustyside-kick]

^So many revamps? Dude, that is essentially only 1 revamp just like every other character in the DCU had during the time period after COIE.

When I say it's only 1 revamp because obviously him going from a happy go lucky character (as most heroes were prior to COEI) to dark and brooding is the only major change.

When he had the hook and became all dark and brooding, he had long hair and a beard.

-gasp-

Then, when he gets the Waterhand he decides to cut his hair short and shave the beard to a goatee.

-gasp-

And then he shaves off the goatee as well and only has the short hair and wears a more classic costume.

-gasp-

Yes. All of those minor changes revamped the character so much.

Seriously I cannot believe that you would say that. Yes, a character who has gone through so many changes becomes dull (keywords = MANY CHANGES). But really he has only gone through one change: from happy go lucky to dark brooding prick at times.

 

[Erzengel]

Maybe revamp is the wrong word, revision?

 

[trustyside-kick]

Costume change isn't the big deal. I don't think you seem to understand. They only changed anything about him once. You are associating costume changes with completely changing the character (even though you changed your choice from revamp to revision, it essentially means the same thing) which is utter bulls**t.

Your first picture was prior to COIE, everyone was basically changed sometime afterwards.

Your second picture is when he actually loses his hand...he didn't wear that suit afterwords just when the moment he actually lost his hand. So really you posting that poorly supports your idea on him being changed so much.

Your third picture is just one of the suits he wore in that series. He wore that one or another one.

The fourth picture is just a costume change, again, and when he gets the waterhand. All of your pictures are just costume changes after the first. None of those changes change Orin completely.

The last picture doesn't count cause I'm talking about Orin, not the new kid.

My god I cannot believe you actually tried to support your arguement with that post above.

So you mean to tell me that when Batman no longer wore the oval, it was a revamp? I mean hey..it was a costume change and appearently you think a character who goes through so many costume changes makes them dull since you associate that with revamping. Or how about when Batman went to the black suit and wore the oval again? So that was a revamp too? Or how about when he went to the blue suit again and got rid of the oval once again. Yes, that must've been a revamp.

They've only changed Orin once. As I said before he went from happy go lucky to darker and prick-like.

 

[Colossal Spoons]

Wonder Woman

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

 

[Erzengel]

Dude how many times are you going to edit your posts. LOL.

Relax. You act like I just insulted someone really close to you?

Sorry after 4-5 different series, in the past 20 years, 180 degree personality change, etc. I just find him dull.

 

[trustyside-kick]

I've had to defend Aquaman for many different reasons to people inside and outside the forums...but that was the first time that I saw someone say he was dull cause they changed his costumes several times. You were associating that with revamping/revising the character, in which you said means the character is boring and that is obviously false since the costume change doesn't change the character.

And if you read the series, the personality change makes sense story-wise. He doens't have the greatest past.

 

[yenaled]

Silver Age was a revamp.
80s Blue Costume crap was a revamp.
Peter David was a revamp.
Water Hand was a revamp.
Aqua-newb was a revamp.

He's still one of my favourite characters.

 

[Erzengel]

You mean from him going happy go lucky to brooding prick? Maybe it makes sense storywise, or maybe since it worked for Batman, let's try it with Aquaman?

 

[trustyside-kick]

Not it makes sense for Aquaman to change so much over time.

- Abandoned to die on a reef as a baby because of a belief in the Curse of Kordax.
- Discovers who he was and when he returns, becomes imprisoned any doesn't know why. Meets a man named Vulko who teaches him things, and then he discovers his mom is the Queen of Atlantis. Then she dies.
- After becoming King of Atlantis, he finds true happiness when he meets Mera and they have a happy marriage. They have a son, Orin's heir, and all is well. Black Manta kidnaps the baby, and forces Orin to fight his own "adopted son" Garth in order to save the baby. They take too long and his son dies.
- He loses his hand from a psychopathic assassin (first time he starts to get darker). He discovers that one of his other huge enemies is actually his half brother and that who he thought was his father was not his father at all. Discovers a son he never knew he had named Koryak.
- His people abandon him when he needs them most when Kordax returns. He struggles to get them back.
- The dolphin who raised him, Porm, gets killed. Goes through some pretty crazy drama and practically declares war on Japan unless they hand over the man who killed his "mother" Porm.
- After sending Atlantis back in time to "protect it" (After OWAW and after JLA: Obsidian Age), and then saving the trouble the people get into, the people turn on him and overthrow him. They try to execute him and he almost dies, saved by the Lady of the Lake and her waters.
- Bestowed Waterbearer and goes on a path to stop a rampaging monster known as the Thirst, all in the while forced to work hand in hand with his arch-nemesis who killed his son, confusing him that he changed. As the Thirst is being defeated, Black Manta betrays Aquaman, almost costing him to fail his misson.
- Sub Diego stuff...yada yada yada....the Spectre crushes Atlantis, and Orin loses everything. His son Koryak is dead, and his "adopted son" Garth is missing.

That's what he has gone through in a nut shell. I went into a little more detail, but not completely. There are things I didn't add in but I think it's clear to understand why he is the dark/prick-like character now. He gradually gets darker and darker. Heck, he almost kills his arch-nemesis before the Spectre crushed Atlantis.

 

[Brian Braddock]

I think he qualifies as a "big character" because he had his own title for several years but I would have to say Captain Atom. As funny as some of those Maxwell Lord Justice Leagues were with useless heroes like Blue Beetle and Booster Gold making me laugh my arse off, I can't remember many great moments with Captain Atom. I don't remember a SINGLE storyline from his now discontinued solo title. His origin is boring. His outfit is boring. Even his "death" in the Superman/Batman Vengeance storyline was boring. The guy spends 30 minutes crying about how he could never live up to anyone's expectations as he blasts into a giant kryptonie meteor. And that's maybe the only storyline I can remember from Captain Atom. For me, he's the most boring "big character" in the DC universe.

There was nothing boring about when Captain Atom went up against Red Tornado in issue #16.

I still get a kick out of reading it.

"I'm the guy who's gonna kick your air-mass across new Mexico!"

Definatley not boring.

 

[freemadison]

I really don't give a flying **** about Wonder Woman. She doesn't have a classic rogue gallery like Batman or Flash nor does she have high-profile villains that Superman tends to fight such as Darkseid or Lex Luthor. I also don't think her personality is engaging enough for me to ignore that fact. I mean, Ollie Queen's villains are kinda not-so-great (read: ****ty) but he's fascinating. The various differing relationships he has with his fellow heroes are interesting as hell. He's funny and has an interesting cynical, arrogant perspective that I can relate to t:.

Anyways, I think she's important (strong female woo!) but I just can't bring myself to care.

I think Superman's own titles are boring. But I love Superman whenever he's around other heroes and part of the larger DC universe.

I just can't stand his a typical supes story.

He averts some seemingly natural disaster in another part of the world, Jimmy and Lois cover it, turns out it was a villain causing the flood (or whatever), some passerby (but most probably Lois) indirectly compares Superman to Jesus as he easily defeats seriously underpowered elemental-controlling villain. Superman thinks about how humans are scared of him and how he doesn't fit in. Whisks away to Kansas to kiss Ma on the cheek and ask Pa about the baseball score. ****s Lois.

SNORE

But I love Kon-El to death (oops t.

 

[CLARKY]

If I can enter the discussion about Aquaman, I agree and disagree. I like Aquaman.
Well, I agree that he had minor changes throughout the last decade, but in my opinion it doesn't mean the character is boring, it means he doesn't sell. Furthermore, in the history of comicbooks, I think Aquaman is not the one who changed the most. When he had his hook and armor, yes, THAT was different, but the rest was almost the same : blond short haired guy, green and orange suit.
Erzengel, I think that " you have to go through so many "revamps" it shows that the character might be on the dull side" is part of the explanation of why Aquaman doesn't work. But Marvel comics is better than DC at this game : how many suits the mighty fantastic Four had ? Or the mighty Wolverine ? Or the X-Men ? (of course there are exceptions : Daredevil, Spiderman, ...) . Now would this mean that these characters might be "on the dull" ?
Well, I think, yes, a little but the thing is Marvel always manages to take advantage of the fashion. DC doesn't. Especially on Aquaman.
Personally, I liked him when he was back with his orange suit and his hand replaced by a magical one. I think it was a mature version of the golden age one.
I see Aquaman as someone who evolved a lot compared to others characters.
When it is explicated, I think the changes that have occured were good.

 

[Spike_x1]

The Post-IC mad scientist Lex Luthor is definitely the most boring "big character" for me. How many mad scientists does DC really need? I much preferred when Lex was the business man who had other people do the dirty work and ended up manipulating and screwing everyone over by the end. He was developed so well throughout the years. His childhood with Perry White was dramatic and was fantastic fuel for stories in the 80's and 90's (Perry's son, their rivalry for the people of Metropolis, etc). Lex's cancer, destroying Metropolis when his clone body was dying, and his rebirth and rise to power again; amazing story wherein he outsmarted and kicked just about everyone's ass (figuratively). Plus Lex's marriage to the Contessa was a great story, bringing in Lena, and killing his stepfather and the Contessa (no rival for Lena's affections).

And now, under the current editorial staff, Lex is reduced to hiding away in his hidden lab somewhere in the city, and he's just Coo-coo for Krypto-puffs? Pathetic.

 

[Spike_x1]

I agree with Trusty on the Aquaman issue. He hasn't really been revamped at all aside from changing from his pre-crisis happy-go-lucky personality into the modern royal and noble guy who actually seems like a king who's not at all above getting his hands dirty.

The only changes to Orin in the post-crisis continuity (losing his hand/gaining the hook, the costume switches, the waterhand, etc) were all just character development; simply Orin going through his adventures and life and rolling with the punches. They weren't revamps, or revisions, or whatever.

I think the new kid, on the other hand...

 

[trustyside-kick]

Silver Age was a revamp.
80s Blue Costume crap was a revamp.
Peter David was a revamp.
Water Hand was a revamp.
Aqua-newb was a revamp.

He's still one of my favourite characters.

I'm not including the Silver Age revamp, because numerous heroes went through the changes. Look at Batman, he used to murder people and then turned into the campy Bats in the 50s and 60s that was around for some time and then O'Neil and gang slowly tried to bring him back to being more serious in the 70s. Basically, I'm only talking about stuff after COIE because just about every hero was changed when COIE came along.

I do not really count the Blue Costume as a revamp because it was still the Silver Age origin and stuff really, it just introduced Thierna Na Oge and made Ocean Master be more of a magician then he was previously. Different? Yes. But earthshattering changes that changed Aquaman all together? No. But I can somewhat see the arguement in it being a revamp...just not a huge one to me cause of the tie ins with the Silver Age and it being a 4 part mini-series.

So really the only revamp I see is Peter David's run in '94. It's the modern day origin and changed Aquaman in many ways.

I don't see how the Waterbearer '03 was a revamp, because OWAW and JLA: Obsidian Age tied in the '94 series with the Waterbearer series. Also, it didn't change anything except add to further character development.

Aquanewb and Sword of Atlantis is obviously a revamp, but I wasn't including him or that new series because I was talking about the real Aquaman: Orin.

 

[Prognosticator]

Now that Rucka's off the book.....Wonder Woman.

 

[SpandexFan]

I think Superman's own titles are boring. But I love Superman whenever he's around other heroes and part of the larger DC universe.

I just can't stand his a typical supes story.

He averts some seemingly natural disaster in another part of the world, Jimmy and Lois cover it, turns out it was a villain causing the flood (or whatever), some passerby (but most probably Lois) indirectly compares Superman to Jesus as he easily defeats seriously underpowered elemental-controlling villain. Superman thinks about how humans are scared of him and how he doesn't fit in. Whisks away to Kansas to kiss Ma on the cheek and ask Pa about the baseball score. ****s Lois.

SNORE

But I love Kon-El to death (oops t.

I can agree with that. Superman usually does seem to work better in the larger stories or tag teams. His solo titles can get boring at times. I blame it on the fact that he's Superman. I mean really, how many ways can you think of putting him in danger when he's already the most powerful man on Earth. Especially when he has so many spin-offs.

 

[Spike_x1]

I can agree with that. Superman usually does seem to work better in the larger stories or tag teams. His solo titles can get boring at times. I blame it on the fact that he's Superman. I mean really, how many ways can you think of putting him in danger when he's already the most powerful man on Earth. Especially when he has so many spin-offs.

How many Superman stories have you actually read? I may not like Superman's Post-IC writing much at all, but that Annual made great points for showing a good number of ways it's possible to kill Superman (ie: he's got more than a dozen rogues who are right up there with him in terms of strength, and Doomsday is actually stronger than him).