The Official Batman & Robin Thread

[Naked Shia]

Because many didn't feel like it didn't work out, unlike the 60s shows, Batman & Robin wasn't exactly very self-aware, it's not too bad to bring the goofy back now and then, Grant Morrison did some amazing stories based on that, the problem is that it's difficult to handle well, for many, Batman & Robin ended up colapsing on its oun goofiness.

bat-credit card anybody?

 

[Kane52630]

I don't think you can get anymore self-aware when Schumacher is reminding the cast that they are making this kind of a movie.

 

[Lord]

The thing is that he knew he was making a film to sell toys, not an homage to the 60s series, he was constantly talking about what the Toy companies wanted him to put, he was acting as if he was making a kids movie, self-aware implies that you're trying to atract a wider and smarter audience, not just entertain the lowest denominator.

 

[CountOrlok]

Because many didn't feel like it didn't work out, unlike the 60s shows, Batman & Robin wasn't exactly very self-aware, it's not too bad to bring the goofy back now and then, Grant Morrison did some amazing stories based on that, the problem is that it's difficult to handle well, for many, Batman & Robin ended up colapsing on its oun goofiness.

You must have missed this line:

I'm a lover not a fighter. That's why every Poison Ivy action figure comes complete with him! [Bane attacks]

That shows it was self-aware.

The thing is that he knew he was making a film to sell toys, not an homage to the 60s series, he was constantly talking about what the Toy companies wanted him to put, he was acting as if he was making a kids movie, self-aware implies that you're trying to atract a wider and smarter audience, not just entertain the lowest denominator.

What about all the sexual innuendo? All of that stuff would fly right over a kid's head. Just like the 60s series, which also had the same adult humour.

You could even argue that all the crazy vehicles, gadgets and outfits is just like the 60s show too - http://batman.wikia.com/wiki/Batman_(Adam_West)

 

[Green Goblin]

I understand the hate for this movie.. Especially back in 1997, it seemed all the hard work to make Batman dark again had become undone and there was a regression back to his campy days. As if camp Batman was back and here to stay.

Now people got what they wanted, a serious crime drama version of Batman, it's time for a retrospective look at this movie. Also time to maybe bring back some of the comic book fun that has been missing from Batman movies for 17 years. Hopefully Snyder decides to ease up on the Nolanism.

Your going to be disappointed. Snyder's Superman was ver.y Nolanish

 

[C. Lee]

As I said...some people like the movie, some don't. I usually don't feel like arguing stuff like this....But I find it hard to accept the argument that Schumacher was not self aware and only targeting the movie towards kids....when the #1 complaint I hear from people are Bat-nipples and butt shots.

 

[The Joker]

Most people still hate this movie because they can't appreciate the greatness of its silliness. Those people are also, for the most part, those who dismiss the Adam West show, or TBATB animated series, because "Teh Batman is Teh Dark, not the funniez".
And while there is no denying that the Bat's roots are in darkness, the silliness is not only part of the mythos, but it's part of its roots. A man dressed as a bat is silly to his core.

It's got nothing to do with that. The 60's Batman show is a classic, with a massive fan base, and it has been homaged in movies and TV shows more times than I can remember. And still is to this day. Adam West has made a career out of his Batman fame and popularity. People still flock to conventions just to meet him. The beloved BTAS cartoon roped West in to do a voice on their show. CHRIS NOLAN has a poster of the 1966 Batman movie on his home office wall. There's whole websites and messages boards dedicated to the 60's show.

DC have recently made a new comic book series based off the 60's TV show;

They're still making new action figures, clothing, and merchandise based off the 60's show to this day because most people still love it. A couple of weeks ago I bought refrigerator magnets based off the 60's show lol.

They even put the Adam West Batman costume as a playable suit in the Arkham Origins game;

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Did you see the explosion of happiness in my 60's Batman thread a few months ago when we got the announcement that we're getting the whole series released on DVD at last? I would strongly argue the haters of the 60's show are a minority. Whereas with B&R the haters are easily the majority, and it's got nothing to do with people disliking camp. It's because it's a terrible movie. You'd be hard pressed to even find people associated with B&R who have anything good to say about it.

Clooney is constantly saying he destroyed the role of Batman; http://blogs.indiewire.com/theplayl...an-weighs-in-on-ben-afflecks-casting-20130927

 

[Green Goblin]

As I said...some people like the movie, some don't. I usually don't feel like arguing stuff like this....But I find it hard to accept the argument that Schumacher was not self aware and only targeting the movie towards kids....when the #1 complaint I hear from people are Bat-nipples and butt shots.

Bat-Nipples are cool. So is Bat-Credit Card and Bat-butt

 

[CountOrlok]

Whereas with B&R the haters are easily the majority, and it's got nothing to do with people disliking camp. It's because it's a terrible movie. You'd be hard pressed to even find people associated with B&R who have anything good to say about it.

Clooney is constantly saying he destroyed the role of Batman; http://blogs.indiewire.com/theplayl...an-weighs-in-on-ben-afflecks-casting-20130927

This is what puzzles me. Can't they tell it is a homage to the 60s show? Maybe they (like many other people) just decided to jump on the hate bandwagon without giving it any rational thought.

 

[The Joker]

This is what puzzles me. Can't they tell it is a homage to the 60s show? Maybe they (like many other people) just decided to jump on the hate bandwagon without giving it any rational thought.

Of course they can tell. 60's Batman is what associated Batman with camp to the world. Why would that make a difference? The end result is still the same. A bad movie is a bad movie, no matter what they were trying to homage making it. Rational thought should tell you that.

17 years later, the Batman franchise has well and truly recovered from the damage B&R did. Yet the movie is still as hated as ever. There is no bandwagon. People hate it because they genuinely think it's a bad movie. Simple as that.

 

[Pfeiffer-Pfan]

I quite like this movie. I find it highly amusing when fanboys get all twisted up about credit cards and bat-nipples. I guess it's just one of those things. Perhaps I was an unsophisticated 7 year old back in 1997.

I can recognise it's many flaws now, but unlike alot of Bat-fans I've never felt that it deserves the amount of hate it gets.

 

[Two-Face]

I watched this last night, Arnie as Mr Freeze cool. I haven't seen it for long time. It would been interesting if Schumacher did 3rd one with Scarecrow as the villain but I think it would been more dark than last time.

 

[Green Goblin]

I quite like this movie. I find it highly amusing when fanboys get all twisted up about credit cards and bat-nipples. I guess it's just one of those things. Perhaps I was an unsophisticated 7 year old back in 1997.

I can recognise it's many flaws now, but unlike alot of Bat-fans I've never felt that it deserves the amount of hate it gets.

I was like 2 or 3 when it came out. I loved it.

At 19 it's a bad movie but it's highly entertaining. Forgive me but who plays Alfred? Because he gives his best preformance of the four films IMO.

 

[CountOrlok]

Forgive me but who plays Alfred?

The late Michael Gough.. and Batman and Robin is his best performance, mainly because he was given more scenes to work with. In the other movies (even the Nolan ones), he was more in the background, but in Batman and Robin, he was actually a part of the plot.

 

[Two-Face]

His scenes with Clooney is just great. Bruce saying he spent his almost all to cheat death but he can't save Alfred. I thought was really touching.


This anther different scene:

[YT]XBJ93zhz2Cg[/YT]

 

[Lord]

In the Nolan films he was never that much in the background, he actually had a lot of character.

 

[Green Goblin]

The late Michael Gough.. and Batman and Robin is his best performance, mainly because he was given more scenes to work with. In the other movies (even the Nolan ones), he was more in the background, but in Batman and Robin, he was actually a part of the plot.

That's not true. Nolan's Alfred had a part in the plot too.

 

[CountOrlok]

In the Nolan films he was never that much in the background, he actually had a lot of character.

That's not true. Nolan's Alfred had a part in the plot too.

I'll leave that for another discussion as I don't want to derail the thread.

There's practically no comparison, though. Batman and Robin is the best tribute to Alfred.

 

[DigificWriter]

I like the 60s series and still think B&R ultimately stinks, so the camp isn't the issue; it's the writing and portrayal of characters/character relationships and the ridiculous and totally unexplained shift in tone that are.

 

[CountOrlok]

I like the 60s series and still think B&R ultimately stinks, so the camp isn't the issue; it's the writing and portrayal of characters/character relationships and the ridiculous and totally unexplained shift in tone that are.

What was your problem? I thought the characters and relationships were done well. Also, what was wrong with the tone? It masterfully veered between comedy, action and drama.

 

[DigificWriter]

Bruce and Dick engage in a constant 'pissing contest' where they're trying to 'out-macho' one another, and Clooney exacerbates the issue by blatantly playing up the homo-eroticism of Bruce's relationship - such as it is - with Dick.

There's also the fact that Bruce blatantly calls Dick a DICK at one point during their scuffle with Ivy.

 

[CountOrlok]

Bruce and Dick engage in a constant 'pissing contest' where they're trying to 'out-macho' one another,

Not true at all. It was Robin's inexperience and recklessness plus the added effect of Poison Ivy's pheromones that caused a rift between the two. That was the character drama of the movie - they had to learn to trust one another to be an effective partnership.

and Clooney exacerbates the issue by blatantly playing up the homo-eroticism of Bruce's relationship - such as it is - with Dick.

Don't understand what you mean, exactly. And even if so, what is the problem with that?

There's also the fact that Bruce blatantly calls Dick a DICK at one point during their scuffle with Ivy.

Yes, so? That is his name. Dick Grayson.

 

[C. Lee]

Bruce and Dick engage in a constant 'pissing contest' where they're trying to 'out-macho' one another

Would it have been better if Bruce said....on your left?

 

[CountOrlok]

Arnold Schwarzenegger doesn't regret doing Batman and Robin:

"In most cases I don't regret the movies that failed or were not as good," the former Caliornia governor told Empire. "It's always easy to be smug in hindsight, right?

"I don't regret it at all. I felt that the character was interesting and two movies before that one Joel Schumacher was at his height. So the decision-making process was not off.

"At the same time I was doing Eraser over there and Warner Bros begged me to do the movie."

http://www.digitalspy.com/movies/ne...ont-regret-batman--robin.html#~oHjFDROh1UCAR1

 

[CountOrlok]

Recent Uma Thurman interview, where she discusses Batman and Robin:

I was a kid when "Batman & Robin" came out, and I worshipped you as Poison Ivy.
So you must like Mae West? Because what I did was take Mae West and played with it.
Did you know at the time how notorious its reputation would become?
What is it notorious for?
For being campy.
Well, it came out in a different time when people were still being *****y about campy. Humor being campy and campy being a code word for gay has changed. I think one of the most beautiful things I will get to say I’ve witnessed in my lifetime is to have lived through part of the major movement of trying to quell persecution of human beings who have a different sexual orientation. If you think of the Berlin Wall coming down, people always talk about all these big things. I think what Pope Francis did 10 days ago, which people have just talked about in hushed voices: “Oh yeah, you hear the pope said that?” -- I’m not Catholic, but I have to tell you, to me, Pope Francis should be sainted for this, what he did for mankind. For the millions and millions and millions of people on the earth who have died because of who they were. God, you just got me. So anyway, the word “campy” has nothing to do with “Batman & Robin”; it just somehow made me think of this. Obviously the Batman movies went in a very serious direction, a very humorless direction. Really straight and hardcore.
Absolutely. They’re beautiful movies, but they’re not the same ones that Tim Burton and Joel Schumacher were making.
Oh no, they’re totally different: hardcore violence. And I like them. But I think at the time the idea of taking a male superhero and having fun with it and someone using the c-word [campy] on it caused people to be very nasty. And that kind of nastiness was acceptable on those terms. And I think that’s the reason some people were particularly annoyed. They didn’t like seeing that tone applied to their heterosexual male icon.
That’s an interesting perspective on it.
Well, it takes time, and the idea that that wasn’t appropriate was because there was a deep-seated discrimination at hand, and hatred and fear. So what Joel did was actually very threatening at the time, and I think it is truly one of the things that we should all feel -- and me as a person -- is beyond greater than the Berlin Wall coming down. Far more thousands or millions more have died under that discrimination and those biases and those scriptures being interpreted in such a cruel manner compared to those who died coming out of East Germany. Anyway, this is very serious.



http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/03/17/uma-thurman-nymphomaniac_n_4966880.html