The Official Boxing Thread!!! - Part 1

[antonydelfini]

Wow, Provodnikov in another epic fight. Provodnikov vs Rios would be violent.

As for the Ali-Tyson question, Ali from the Cleveland Williams fight vs Tyson from the Spinks fight would be awesome. Ali would win a UD or even a late TKO, but Mike would have his moments. Even the 80's Tyson had problems with fighters who werent scared of him, smart, and knows how to move in the ring. Tillis, Green, Tucker had some success with Prime Tyson, and Ali was a lot faster, smarter, and tougher than those fighters combined.

 

[Doc Samson]

The thing about the Ali-Tyson dream match is that both represents what the other struggled with. Ali had issues with Frazier primarily because Frazier was short and coming with those hooks that Ali couldn't time. Tyson was basically a much faster, better defensive version of Smokin' Joe, and probably more powerful too. And he was just as strong throwing hooks with both hands where Frazier only really had one.

On the flip side, Tyson (and I'm talking still in prime Iron Mike) only went the distance with a few guys before getting knocked out by Buster. And the one thing they all had in common up to and including Buster was that they were around 6'4 and up with somewhat decent jabs. Anyone with height, a solid chin and a decent jab could keep Mike off of them, even when he was a machine. Obviously Ali specialized in all of those things & had one of the all-time chins, never being knocked out (or stopped after that chin was broken), even after tangling with the likes of Sonny Liston, Norton & George Foreman, all guys probably just as strong (if not stronger) than Tyson.

I say just based off chin, stamina & tactical intelligence on the fly, Ali would probably pull it out. But he'd have to weather a hellish storm early to do so...

 

[antonydelfini]

The thing about the Ali-Tyson dream match is that both represents what the other struggled with. Ali had issues with Frazier primarily because Frazier was short and coming with those hooks that Ali couldn't time. Tyson was basically a much faster, better defensive version of Smokin' Joe, and probably more powerful too. And he was just as strong throwing hooks with both hands where Frazier only really had one.

On the flip side, Tyson (and I'm talking still in prime Iron Mike) only went the distance with a few guys before getting knocked out by Buster. And the one thing they all had in common up to and including Buster was that they were around 6'4 and up with somewhat decent jabs. Anyone with height, a solid chin and a decent jab could keep Mike off of them, even when he was a machine. Obviously Ali specialized in all of those things & had one of the all-time chins, never being knocked out (or stopped after that chin was broken), even after tangling with the likes of Sonny Liston, Norton & George Foreman, all guys probably just as strong (if not stronger) than Tyson.

I say just based off chin, stamina & tactical intelligence on the fly, Ali would probably pull it out. But he'd have to weather a hellish storm early to do so...

The Ali who fought Frazier was a completely different fighter from the Ali of the 60's. His prime was in the 60's.

But I agree that prime Mike would have his moments against Ali. Just like Liston who had some moments with Ali.

 

[Doc Samson]

The Ali who fought Frazier was a completely different fighter from the Ali of the 60's. His prime was in the 60's.

Perhaps, but he faced his stiffest competition throughout the 70's, and in my mind, displayed more prowess during that time out of sheer necessity. I judge prime not by youth necessarily, but when you were at your best with the most tools at your disposal, not just physically, but also mentally.

 

[Docker2.0]

Just watched the Quillen-Rosado fight and other than trash talk and dance a little, I can't believe people are saying that Rosado beat Quillen. Watch the fight again and notice that Rosado only danced a little but did very little after that crap. I think that Quillen won very clearly but Rosado made an entertaining fight. It's like people these days don't understand boxing but give it to an entertainer.

 

[the last son]

Ali was in his prime in his mid 20s. Some highlights like when he fought Cleveland Williams. That was prime Ali. No one could beat that Ali. No one.

 

[the last son]

Any good fights to watch on Youtube?

 

[Docker2.0]

Pacq vs Marq 4. That knock out never gets old.

 

[the last son]

I just saw that for the first time last week. I watched the whole trilogy. That knockout was crazy. Paq looked real old, slow, and lost all power by the 4th fight.

 

[the last son]

But, to your point about refs, I was watching Ward vs Dawson and the ref is so out of shape he can barely get in there to break them up. What is a good boxing ref to you all?

 

[Docker2.0]

What point about a ref?

 

[the last son]

In the NBA thread.

 

[Docker2.0]

Oh! LOL! You confused me. I was reading between two different forums and like 10 different threads.

 

[the last son]

Just watched Bradley vs. Provodnikov. That was an absolute brawl.

 

[Doc Samson]

I have a feeling Bradley is gonna be one of those guys who won't fare too well after his career is over.

 

[Docker2.0]

A lot of these guys are going to do horribly when they retire. I honestly think Pacquio is going to end up broke when he's finished. I read somewhere that he has like $10M max and had to borrow from Arum. That speaks volumes on how much Arum is robbing him but yet people try and make Mayweather look like the villian. As far as Bradley, he's just to bland. I can't see him ever being a big money draw. I'd love to see him fight Broner, Thurman or even Amir Khan, a man he dodged for awhile.

 

[Doc Samson]

Yeah, I agree, but with Bradley I was more talking about his health. He's had quite a few rough fights already, and he's still pretty young. He also came out saying how messed up he was after that Provodnikov bout. I just think he's the type of fighter that winds up in a bad way down the line.

 

[Docker2.0]

Other than the Provodnikov fight, he actually doesn't get hit a lot. Look at the Manny fight. I know a lot of people say he lost but look at that fight with the volume down and watch how much Manny misses. He actually didn't look in trouble at all.

 

[the last son]

Can you name some other fighters who are current today that I can watch on youtube?

 

[Docker2.0]

Keith Thurman. Dude is an underrated beast!

 

[the last son]

gotcha, I'm going to watch some of his fights now. Thanks.

 

[Docker2.0]

You won't be disappointed. People are talking about GGG being the truth, but Thurman has just as much potential if not more. On GGG, I have no respect for bigger fighters calling out smaller fighters when bigger fighters have called them out as well. He keeps calling out Mayweather but yet Ward has called him but he continues to ignore him.

 

[the last son]

Andre Ward? I've seen a few of his fights and really dig him as a boxer. Will have to see who GGG is.

 

[Docker2.0]

You don't know GGG?! He fights on HBO tomorrow night. He's a KO artist but he really hasn't faced anyone. Froch and Ward have been calling him out but he continues to ignore them and call out Mayweather, a smaller fighter. Very bully like.

 

[Doc Samson]

Other than the Provodnikov fight, he actually doesn't get hit a lot

Kendall Holt had him in deep water a few times too. I just think as he continues to fight stiffer competition he'll wind up in brawls more often than not. And he has good enough resolve and heart to withstand taking a beating far longer than most fighters can, or should...