The Official Costume Thread - - - - - - - - - Part 18

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[souperman]

Quote:
The Shuster estate originally did not participate with the Siegels' case because Shuster has no spouse or children. But his estate later won a ruling of a recapture identical to the Siegels, which will be effective in 2013. At that point, the Siegels and Shusters will own the entire copyright to Action Comics No. 1. That will give them the chance to set up Superman pics, TV shows and other projects at another studio.

...Is it too late to be adopted???

 

[Superman_200]

I wonder what would happen if everyone actually got what they supposedly want without settling? No one would have the "Superman" character. They'd have rights to some traits of the character and abilities and some names, but they would have wound up with a completely different character. They really need to come to an agreement.

 

[Shabadoo]

It is the most important part of the lawuit, the character and presentation of Superman. If you're WB/DC you care more about the character of Superman than you do other characters. They don't make movies about Jor-El, Lora, or Krypton unless Superman is in them right? "The Last Temptation Of Jor-El", "The Diary Of Lora", "The Wizard Of Krypton." We won't be seeing those in theaters any time soon. See below, these characters have also evolved.

Again, it isn't about the trunks or even necessarily about the suit. It's about making changes. WB/DC are taking steps to show that Superman has evolved and continued to evolve over the years. The argument being without the evolution of the character, the character would not be viable economically. While building a foundation for this case, they are also changing the character both on screen and in the comics. They want to show continued change and want to be the ones changing the character.

How can you think this is a coincidence? I'm not saying they are right or wrong, but that's the case they are presenting.

Went back and reread your post. You didn't mention the lawsuit when I thought you were. So we're basically arguing the same thing...it's not about the lawsuit. My bad, I was in "not about the lawsuit"-mode.

Remember when Snyder told everybody Zod wasn't going to be in Man of Steel. Nope.

Nope.

If you want to listen to Zack Snyder in regards to the legal issues that the character of Superman and his universe is facing that is fine.

No, I want to listen to Zack Snyder regarding what is and what isn't influencing his own movie, which is what my comments were referring to.

I prefer to listen to guys like this, ie lawyers:

http://www.comicsbeat.com/2011/06/17/the-legal-view-super-style-and-the-dcu-relaunch/

If you want to listen to lawyers who are watching from the sidelines regarding issues surrounding a movie they have no first hand involvement with that is fine. I prefer to listen to guys like Zack Snyder, ie the director. (I can needlessly dish snark too.)

But I'll say this. We're pretty much of the same opinion: that the changes have nothing to do with the lawsuit directly, but, as your link pointed out, limiting what S&S' heirs can claim going forward, which is a big distinction, and one which I didn't know. So thanks for the info.

 

[souperman]

It's all just scare tactics against S&S. I hope they are lawyered up good. In IP law it's tough to get good reps but if they did, they just gotta hold on.

I was involved in an IP suit for a major brand. If they are in the right, they will prevail as long as they can hold out. The studios will try to starve them out so to speak. In the end, the lawyers will do the best!

 

[Lily Adler]

I'm starting to worry about this lawsuit business. What else has been affected because of it?

 

[souperman]

double post

 

[souperman]

I'm starting to worry about this lawsuit business. What else has been affected because of it?

Super-sizing... obviously!

 

[Dr.]

Quote:
The Shuster estate originally did not participate with the Siegels' case because Shuster has no spouse or children. But his estate later won a ruling of a recapture identical to the Siegels, which will be effective in 2013. At that point, the Siegels and Shusters will own the entire copyright to Action Comics No. 1. That will give them the chance to set up Superman pics, TV shows and other projects at another studio.

Yes, a chance. And the Superman in question would be the strongman who can leap/Action #1 version. Might be good for a one-off, period/nostalgia movie. But I doubt there’d be any long-term interest in this character (an unfamiliar, novelty “1/2 Superman”).

Also… Toberoff (the S&S lawyer) seems to have taken a 50% share of S&S’s share. Moreover, he’s made a lot of enemies in Hollywood (he also sued Marvel on behalf of the Kirby estate). It would be very surprising if any TV studio, movie studio or publishing company were prepared to do business with him. I think S&S will end up with a white elephant. So they’ll have to settle with WB. The question is, how long will it take?

 

[souperman]

Yes, a chance. And the Superman in question would be the strongman who can leap/Action #1 version. Might be good for a one-off, period/nostalgia movie. But I doubt there’d be any long-term interest in this character (an unfamiliar, novelty “1/2 Superman&#8221.

Also… Toberoff (the S&S lawyer) seems to have taken a 50% share of S&S’s share. Moreover, he’s made a lot of enemies in Hollywood (he also sued Marvel on behalf of the Kirby estate). It would be very surprising if any TV studio, movie studio or publishing company were prepared to do business with him. I think S&S will end up with a white elephant. So they’ll have to settle with WB. The question is, how long will it take?

Contingent lawyers always take "at least" 50%

Depending on the interpretation, "evolutions, iterations, modifications etc. may be inclusive in the ownership, otherwise any copyrighted screenplay that had a rewrite would be due no royalties. I think it all comes down to "recognition" similar to Trademarks. IE: If the common "man" can recognize it as the same material... it is. or something like that

I think it will settle... but not until it gets closer to release... late 2012, early 2013 if we make it past the Apocalypse!

 

[Shabadoo]

Yes, a chance. And the Superman in question would be the strongman who can leap/Action #1 version. Might be good for a one-off, period/nostalgia movie. But I doubt there’d be any long-term interest in this character (an unfamiliar, novelty “1/2 Superman”).

Also… Toberoff (the S&S lawyer) seems to have taken a 50% share of S&S’s share. Moreover, he’s made a lot of enemies in Hollywood (he also sued Marvel on behalf of the Kirby estate). It would be very surprising if any TV studio, movie studio or publishing company were prepared to do business with him. I think S&S will end up with a white elephant. So they’ll have to settle with WB. The question is, how long will it take?

And that's the thing. I know I wouldn't necessarily be interested in a Superman character that is limited to the portrayal in Action #1, just as I wouldn't be interested in a character that consists entirely of whatever DC controls. There will need to be an agreement in order for everyone to be happy: S&S, WB/DC, and the fans. And honestly, that's all Toberoff really wants, IMO. He's smart enough to know that whatever both sides end up with it's not marketable, so he's banking on holding Superman hostage for a favourable deal with WB/DC.

And I've heard Toberoff is a huge *****e. Kuro can go off on him in the way only Kuro can. Pretty big slime, from what I've heard. But I've never really gotten a sense of what S&S' heirs feelings are. Do they really just want the rights because they feel they're rightfully their family's or are they looking for a pay day?

 

[souperman]

And that's the thing. I know I wouldn't necessarily be interested in a Superman character that is limited to the portrayal in Action #1, just as I wouldn't be interested in a character that consists entirely of whatever DC controls. There will need to be an agreement in order for everyone to be happy: S&S, WB/DC, and the fans. And honestly, that's all Toberoff really wants, IMO. He's smart enough to know that whatever both sides end up with it's not marketable, so he's banking on holding Superman hostage for a favourable deal with WB/DC.

And I've heard Toberoff is a huge *****e. Kuro can go off on him in the way only Kuro can. Pretty big slime, from what I've heard. But I've never really gotten a sense of what S&S' heirs feelings are. Do they really just want the rights because they feel they're rightfully their family's or are they looking for a pay day?

unfortunately it's the same thing. The only "remedy" the courts have...cash!

 

[Shabadoo]

unfortunately it's the same thing. The only "remedy" the courts have...cash!

Yeah, at the end of the day it ends up being the same thing. However, in my book at least, motivation counts for A LOT. If the S&S heirs sincerely want the rights because it's their family legacy and all that, then I don't blame them for fighting tooth and nail, regardless of the deal with the Devil (Toberoff). But if it's just for a pay day and they're using the cover of family for PR purposes, then screw them. I hope WB/DC nails them to the wall.

 

[souperman]

Yeah, at the end of the day it ends up being the same thing. However, in my book at least, motivation counts for A LOT. If the S&S heirs sincerely want the rights because it's their family legacy and all that, then I don't blame them for fighting tooth and nail, regardless of the deal with the Devil (Toberoff). But if it's just for a pay day and they're using the cover of family for PR purposes, then screw them. I hope WB/DC nails them to the wall.

Hard to tell motivation is...

Sorry, wrong movie!

 

[Llama_Shepherd]

Warner and S&S will come to an agreement by 2012. At this point, either side could win, and although S&S stand a greater chance of winning, Warner is still guaranteed success post lawsuit as whether it is due to the lawsuit or not, the current Superman is very distanced to the original. The biggest change at DC would the lack of book with Superman in the title. And that would only apply on the US.

 

[TheDragonator]

and S&S will come to an agreement by 2012. At this point, either side could win, and although S&S stand a greater chance of winning, Warner is still guaranteed success post as whether it is due to the lawsuit or not, the current Superman is very distanced to the original. The biggest change at DC would the lack of book with Superman in the title. And that would only apply on the US.

Don't they also get the names Clark Kent and Lois Lane? That's a pretty damn big one. Especially if the lawyers own part of it too.

 

[B]

Well it certainly doesn't look a ****ing thing like this -

*that* is spandex. Lycra, if you want the brand name, and the MOS suit looks nothing like it. At all.

All I'm saying is people should stop using spandex as a generic term for tights because it isn't accurate and it's mostly a tool for the haters to disparage a costume they happen to dislike.

I like the suit & have welcomed it with open arms so it isn't being used to disparage the costume.

The reason I'm calling it spandex is because that is exactly what it is. It's textured spandex. Its the generic & common term for such a tight fitting garment in particular, superheros.. I don't make the rules but thats what it's called. Even if the suits fabric only contains 10% spandex.. you still wouldn't be incorrect by saying the suit is made of spandex.

Tights/Spandex/Lycra, it's all the same.

 

[wobbly]

Just as a point of interest the Christopher Reeve suit was made of wool (as was the George Reeves one).

Spandex didn't even exist when Superheroes were first putting on the tights.

 

[Majik1387]

Christopher Reeve's super suit was most definitely a type of spandex.

 

[wobbly]

Christopher Reeve's super suit was most definitely a type of spandex.

I stand corrected. It was made from ‘Bridal weight spandex’ (thicker weave and not as shiny as the standard stuff).

 

[craigdbfan]

Even the suit for MOS is a type of textured lycra which is just a type of spandex.

I agree with B this is a silly point to bring up its just arguing semantics.

 

[souperman]

tired of waiting for stand up straight Superman.

Tried this. I didn't spend too much time trying to get all the texture etc. and left off the leg ribbing.

just for a quick look at another option.

Some of you guys can do much better than me.

 

[Showtime]

Went back and reread your post. You didn't mention the lawsuit when I thought you were. So we're basically arguing the same thing...it's not about the lawsuit. My bad, I was in "not about the lawsuit"-mode.

OK.

Nope.

Exactly.

No, I want to listen to Zack Snyder regarding what is and what isn't influencing his own movie, which is what my comments were referring to.

Do you think he picked out the Superman suit and was the one who decided there would or wouldn't be any trunks or was involved in any of the changes to the character? I personally don't.

If you want to listen to lawyers who are watching from the sidelines regarding issues surrounding a movie they have no first hand involvement with that is fine. I prefer to listen to guys like Zack Snyder, ie the director. (I can needlessly dish snark too.)

Heck yes I would rather pay attention to lawyers who specialize in comic and movie related lawsuits than Zack Snyder, and I'm better at the snark.

But I'll say this. We're pretty much of the same opinion: that the changes have nothing to do with the lawsuit directly, but, as your link pointed out, limiting what S&S' heirs can claim going forward, which is a big distinction, and one which I didn't know. So thanks for the info.

So then we should join forces.

 

[TheBat812]

Do you think he picked out the Superman suit and was the one who decided there would or wouldn't be any trunks or was involved in any of the changes to the character? I personally don't.

Of course he was involved. He also had the most important decision, making it the final suit. Not that I disagree, I think this will likely be the best looking suit on film for Superman.