The Official Michael Shannon IS General Zod - Part 2

[Rodrigo90]

I dont want to see this movie if Zod is in it,cause Ive already seen him in Superman II

t:

 

[Superman2007]

There's nothing wrong with using different villains. It's just ridiculous that the fans complain they want a good story, WB gets the writer of Batman Begins and The Dark Knight on board as a writer and the writer/director of Memento, Batman Begins, The Dark Knight and Inception in the Producer's chair. The fans complain they want more action, WB gets Zack "300" Snyder on board. Fans campaign Henry Cavill, Cavill gets cast along with a supporting cast of Oscar nominees. But when they announced a villain that has been in a movie before, but will obviously be different from the Terrence Stamp version, fans go up in arms and start calling the movie a remake/rehash. Was Dark Knight a remake/rehash of Batman and Batman Forever because he fought Joker and Two-Face? Will First Avenger be a remake/rehash of the Matt Salinger Captain America because he fights Red Skull? Will The Dark Knight Rises be a remake/rehash of Batman Returns and Batman and Robin because he fights Bane and Catwoman?

There's far more to these movies than what villains they use, but I guess the fact that all of the internet complaints are centralized to one thing means they're doing everything else right. A story wouldn't be helped by using someone different, a story can only be helped by using someone appropriate. Goyer chose the villains that fit the themes in Batman Begins, why wouldn't he do the same with Man of Steel?

Right on, I think people are just waiting to flip a ***** about this movie.

I can understand it a little bit though...people were really upset about SR and they really want this film to make up for it. What they don't get is that fretting about things this early on, isn't not going to help anything. They could go so many different ways with this story and right now it's just too early to tell.

 

[The Overlord]

There's nothing wrong with using different villains. It's just ridiculous that the fans complain they want a good story, WB gets the writer of Batman Begins and The Dark Knight on board as a writer and the writer/director of Memento, Batman Begins, The Dark Knight and Inception in the Producer's chair. The fans complain they want more action, WB gets Zack "300" Snyder on board. Fans campaign Henry Cavill, Cavill gets cast along with a supporting cast of Oscar nominees. But when they announced a villain that has been in a movie before, but will obviously be different from the Terrence Stamp version, fans go up in arms and start calling the movie a remake/rehash. Was Dark Knight a remake/rehash of Batman and Batman Forever because he fought Joker and Two-Face? Will First Avenger be a remake/rehash of the Matt Salinger Captain America because he fights Red Skull? Will The Dark Knight Rises be a remake/rehash of Batman Returns and Batman and Robin because he fights Bane and Catwoman?

There's far more to these movies than what villains they use, but I guess the fact that all of the internet complaints are centralized to one thing means they're doing everything else right. A story wouldn't be helped by using someone different, a story can only be helped by using someone appropriate. Goyer chose the villains that fit the themes in Batman Begins, why wouldn't he do the same with Man of Steel?

Goyer has directed and wrote Blade Trinity, I don't think we should give him a blank check in terms of trust.

Zack Snyder also made sucker Punch, which sucks, so frankly I think people have a right to be mistrustful of him and considering this a reboot, it would be better to separate this from the previous films. One of the biggest complaints about Superman Returns is it was a rehash of Superman I, with people saying before the film came out that people should just trust Singer and that turn out very well.

How do we know that Zod was chosen because he was the right villain for the story and not because he was in the Donner films? Goyer and Snyder do not deserve this level of blind faith, especially after Superman Returns being problematic because it was a rehash of the Donner films.

With Batman, almost every major member of his rogues gallery has appeared on the Silver screen, with cap, he only had one movie that had no wide relase and thus almost no one has heard, so using the villains from that film would be okay because no one is familiar with the first one. With Superman he has had 5 well known movies and only 2 villains from the comics have appeared and too often it seems like film makers just want to remake the Donner films then make a more current Superman story.That's the problem people are having, using Zod again, instead of one of the dozens unused villains, looks like looking back instead of moving forward and that could create a bad film, like it did with Superman Returns.
Over the course of the movies

 

[Orin]

You know, i'm a little annoyed how some people are trying to simplify the opinion of everyone who dosn't like that Zod will be the villain in Man of Steel. Now i know some people are desperately wanting to be positive about everything that is associated with Christopher Nolan in any way, but i feel discounting everyone who dosn't like a certain aspect of this project is a bit much.

There's really no need to act like everyone who thinks Zod isn't the best villain choice for this movie is acting like "this will be Superman II all over again" or that this movie will suck now that they've chosen to go with him again. Cause that's not the case at all. You don't need to tell people that Zod can be done in a very different way than what was done in Superman II, people are able to figure as much on their own. Besides, that's missing the point entirely. Cause no matter in which (possibly very innovative and well done) way they're gonna approach the concept for this nw movie, it's still the same basic idea. It's another Kryptoinan coming to Earth and clashing with Superman. Of course there are countles variables to this idea that can be modified. But it's far from being the only good idea the Superman mythos has to offer. And i think i'm entitled to say that i think that there are not only lots of other good concepts, but also lots better ones, which i would prefer to see and which, unlike the Phatom Zone Criminals, have never been explored on a big stage in any way shape or form.

And if they're gonna use the Zod concept again, i think the first movie of a new franchise is not the best place to do that, as you're gonna be freshly introducing a new version of the Superman character, with all the things he can do, which, in order to be comprehandable, should be kept as unique as possible.

And if you want to make him relevant for a modern audiance, which is what they said they want to do, i think the best way to do it is by showing how a modern world would be reacting to a being as powerful as this in a realistic way. Now of course you can also do that with more than one of these powerful alien beings, but from my point of view, that changes the whole basic idea of Supermans origin in its core.

Putting aside all of that, having powerful evil aliens come to earth, with Superman being the only one who can save it from them is proporbly the biggest cliche idea i could imagine. The way i see it, that also makes earth just the battleground for these beings, instead of giving the planet and it's inhabitants a more relevant role. Let them and their actions be the things that force Clark into becoming Superman and show how the most powerful humans (be it a government or someone like Lex Luthor) react to the powershift that his appeariance brings with it. Show how they're trying to find ways to come up with something that enables them to defend their power against this Superbeing, which leads into the creation of something like Metallo, that comes back to hunt them, so in the end Superman has to save them from their own creation. Sorry, but i just think something like that would make for a far more interesting basic concept to built upton than General Zod coming to Earth in any capability.

But again, that dosn't mean i write the movie of now, just because they're not doing that. It's just my opinion on their choice for the villain of this movie and i thought that's what people were supposed to post in a thread like this.

On the other hand, the only arguments i've read so far from people who like the fact that Zod will be in this movie are "it's Nolan and Goyer who've come up with the idea" and "Zod will give Superman the possibility to fight someone". Yeah, you don't really need Zod for that, but whatever. And compering Zod to the Joker, when it comes to villains being used twice on the big screen, kinda shows how little some people know about these characters...

 

[C. Lee]

I dont want to see this movie if Zod is in it,cause Ive already seen him in Superman II

t:

Did you watch The Dark Knight.....because both the Joker and Two Face were used in previous movies.

 

[HighFivingMF]

Goyer has directed and wrote Blade Trinity, I don't think we should give him a blank check in terms of trust.

Zack Snyder also made sucker Punch, which sucks, so frankly I think people have a right to be mistrustful of him and considering this a reboot, it would be better to separate this from the previous films. One of the biggest complaints about Superman Returns is it was a rehash of Superman I, with people saying before the film came out that people should just trust Singer and that turn out very well.

That's good and all, if you don't trust them, go ahead.

How do we know that Zod was chosen because he was the right villain for the story and not because he was in the Donner films?

...What's your logic behind that? I don't understand how you could think that would be something they would do.

Goyer and Snyder do not deserve this level of blind faith, especially after Superman Returns being problematic because it was a rehash of the Donner films.

I never said they deserved blind faith and I never showed any level of blind faith. I merely pointed out that WB were adhering to fans requests and got the creators of the most well-received comic book movie of all-time on board and one of the most unique action directors in the business.

With Batman, almost every major member of his rogues gallery has appeared on the Silver screen, with cap, he only had one movie that had no wide relase and thus almost no one has heard, so using the villains from that film would be okay because no one is familiar with the first one. With Superman he has had 5 well known movies and only 2 villains from the comics have appeared and too often it seems like film makers just want to remake the Donner films then make a more current Superman story.That's the problem people are having, using Zod again, instead of one of the dozens unused villains, looks like looking back instead of moving forward and that could create a bad film, like it did with Superman Returns.
Over the course of the movies

Superman had 5 well-known movies? Upon their release, yes, but a lot of people my age (I'm 20) don't even know about or haven't seen Superman Returns, much less the ones from 30 years ago. I don't see the point in the "Batman had other Rogues between" argument. Especially because I never said anything about the amount of time or villains between. A villain that's been in a movie before is a villain that's been in a movie before. If it's alright for one franchise to do it as long the villain is used well in the context of the story any franchise should be able to reuse a villain as long as it's done well in the context of a story.

 

[Llama_Shepherd]

That's good and all, if you don't trust them, go ahead.




...What's your logic behind that? I don't understand how you could think that would be something they would do.


I never said they deserved blind faith and I never showed any level of blind faith. I merely pointed out that WB were adhering to fans requests and got the creators of the most well-received comic book movie of all-time on board and one of the most unique action directors in the business.


Superman had 5 well-known movies? Upon their release, yes, but a lot of people my age (I'm 20) don't even know about or haven't seen Superman Returns, much less the ones from 30 years ago. I don't see the point in the "Batman had other Rogues between" argument. Especially because I never said anything about the amount of time or villains between. A villain that's been in a movie before is a villain that's been in a movie before. If it's alright for one franchise to do it as long they new villain is used well in the context of the story any franchise should be able to reuse a villain as long as it's done well in the context of a story.

Thank you. So very much.

 

[C. Lee]

I find it a shame that most young people today don't know much about anything if it's over 5 years old.

 

[The Shield]

I dont want to see this movie if Zod is in it,cause Ive already seen him in Superman II

t:

So if you've already handed in your chips... why do you still frequent these threads? It would be more believable if you never came in here.
You not seeing this movie means nothing (I still think you will) bc there are 11 people that I know personally who are. Just like it doesn't matter that I'm not going to see Captain America or X-Men and probably not even Thor. There will plenty of people that will happily take my place.
I think you and a few others just like reading fans argue.

 

[The Overlord]

That's good and all, if you don't trust them, go ahead.




...What's your logic behind that? I don't understand how you could think that would be something they would do.

What evidence is there that they chose Zod because he was the best villain for the role and not because of nostalgia? There is none, is saying they chose Zod because is the best villain for the role is as much of an assumption as saying they chose him because of nostalgia, I am introducing doubt to your assumption.

Also why is Zod the best villain for the role? It seems like with Zod it be an alien invasion story, so why can't Brainiac fill that role? Heck if use Zod, what will Brainiac do in a sequel, will it be two alien invasion stories in a row?

I never said they deserved blind faith and I never showed any level of blind faith. I merely pointed out that WB were adhering to fans requests and got the creators of the most well-received comic book movie of all-time on board and one of the most unique action directors in the business.

You could say the same thing for Superman Returns and look how that turned out.

Superman had 5 well-known movies? Upon their release, yes, but a lot of people my age (I'm 20) don't even know about or haven't seen Superman Returns, much less the ones from 30 years ago. I don't see the point in the "Batman had other Rogues between" argument. Especially because I never said anything about the amount of time or villains between. A villain that's been in a movie before is a villain that's been in a movie before. If it's alright for one franchise to do it as long they new villain is used well in the context of the story any franchise should be able to reuse a villain as long as it's done well in the context of a story.

I would say the Superman movies are easily more well known then the Cap movie, there have tons of pop culture references to those movies and they play on TV all the time, can the same be said of the Cap movie?

And again why does Zod fit the context of story better then any other villain, who hasn't been used yet? I like Zod, but I like Brainiac more, why doesn't he fit in with the context of story? This seems like just a big assumption that Zod fits the context of the story best and that he isn't been used for nostalgia purposes.

 

[Wheels]

I find it a shame that most young people today don't know much about anything if it's over 5 years old.

It's like those kids who watch Glee, and don't understand they're performing covers of classic songs.

 

[Project862006]

What evidence is there that they chose Zod because he was the best villain for the role and not because of nostalgia? There is none, is saying they chose Zod because is the best villain for the role is as much of an assumption as saying they chose him because of nostalgia, I am introducing doubt to your assumption.

maybe because zack has flat out said this has nothing to do with the donner films this is a fresh new take as if no superman film has ever existed

zack even said he respects the donner films but is not a slave to them

 

[Wheels]

So if you've already handed in your chips... why do you still frequent these threads? It would be more believable if you never came in here.
You not seeing this movie means nothing (I still think you will) bc there are 11 people that I know personally who are. Just like it doesn't matter that I'm not going to see Captain America or X-Men and probably not even Thor. There will plenty of people that will happily take my place.
I think you and a few others just like reading fans argue.

Rodrigo is joking.

 

[The Overlord]

maybe because zack has flat out said this has nothing to do with the donner films this is a fresh new take as if no superman film has ever existed

zack even said he respects the donner films but is not a slave to them

I haven't seen that quote till now. I'm not reading every interview with Zack Snyder. Besides you know what would have made these movies separate from the Donner ones? Using different villains. If Zack wanted his movies to seem different from the Donner movies, he shouldn't have used Zod. By using one of the two prominent villains from Donner in this movie, instead of new film, it seems far less like a clean break from the Donner films.

 

[The Shield]

I haven't seen that quote till now. I'm not reading every interview with Zack Snyder. Besides you know what would have made these movies separate from the Donner ones? Using different villains. If Zack wanted his movies to seem different from the Donner movies, he shouldn't have used Zod. By using one of the two prominent villains from Donner in this movie, instead of new film, it seems far less like a clean break from the Donner films.

You have to remember that Zod isn't a Donner creation... He's one of Supes villains. And what you are debating is spilt milk. Zod is who we are getting and if you are a fan of this movie being made it might help you to enjoy it more if you did a lil homework on the character. Find some things that you would like about one of Superman’s more dangerous and threatening villains that has been cast.

Rodrigo is joking.

If that is true I have no problems apologizing. However, what I said is still true about those "other" people who just like to rile fans up or say they are not going to buy a ticket.

 

[HighFivingMF]

What evidence is there that they chose Zod because he was the best villain for the role and not because of nostalgia? There is none, is saying they chose Zod because is the best villain for the role is as much of an assumption as saying they chose him because of nostalgia, I am introducing doubt to your assumption.

Because nostalgia proved to not work 20 years after the last movie, it definitely wouldn't closer to 30 years later.

Also why is Zod the best villain for the role? It seems like with Zod it be an alien invasion story, so why can't Brainiac fill that role? Heck if use Zod, what will Brainiac do in a sequel, will it be two alien invasion stories in a row?

Is it an alien invasion story if it's one (or two) aliens? We don't know the story, but we know what Goyer's done in the past, use villains that fit the theme and parallel the hero. Why would he stop that? Plus, what better way to establish Superman as Earth's greatest hero than having him square off with the survivors of his homeworld that are clearly bad? He could be amongst people of a similar but separate race or amongst his own people who share ideals the complete opposite of his. Of course, that's just a guess. But I don't see why they would choose Zod if there was no point.

Plus, every Superman story is about an alien that came to Earth. Superman isn't from Earth and fights a lot of villains that aren't from Earth.

You could say the same thing for Superman Returns and look how that turned out.

You could.

I would say the Superman movies are easily more well known then the Cap movie, there have tons of pop culture references to those movies and they play on TV all the time, can the same be said of the Cap movie?

I didn't say the Captain America was as well known as Superman or that it was well known at all. But it is a movie that had Red Skull in it already.

And again why does Zod fit the context of story better then any other villain, who hasn't been used yet?

We'll see.

I like Zod, but I like Brainiac more,

Oh, I can tell.

why doesn't he fit in with the context of story? This seems like just a big assumption that Zod fits the context of the story best and that he isn't been used for nostalgia purposes.

Nostalgia for who? I don't understand why you think the studio would make a tribute to the second movie after the tribute to the first movie disappointed.

 

[Project862006]

Zod talking to jor el and lara

 

[Rodrigo90]

You will bow down before me kate. You,and then one day,your heirs!!!!!!!!

 

[manofsteel4life]

Zod talking to jor el and lara

Wow.......that is awesome prog!

 

[Rodrigo90]

So if you've already handed in your chips... why do you still frequent these threads? It would be more believable if you never came in here.
You not seeing this movie means nothing (I still think you will) bc there are 11 people that I know personally who are. Just like it doesn't matter that I'm not going to see Captain America or X-Men and probably not even Thor. There will plenty of people that will happily take my place.
I think you and a few others just like reading fans argue.

Hey,hey,hey...I was being cynical about those who do say that.

 

[Wheels]

Hey,hey,hey...I was being cynical about those who do say that.

I got it.

 

[The Shield]

Hey,hey,hey...I was being cynical about those who do say that.

My apologies good sir.

 

[Alonsovich]

I find it a shame that most young people today don't know much about anything if it's over 5 years old.

The hilarious part of this is that its true, thus making the rehash argument a bit pointless...

 

[GoblinWhirlwind]

I can't believe people are still whining about Zod... when that trailer hits and Superman and Zod are duking it out like Goku and Vegeta, they won't have anything to complain about. Next year everyone will be practicing saying "KNEEL BEFORE ZOD."

 

[BH/HHH]

I can't believe people are still whining about Zod... when that trailer hits and Superman and Zod are duking it out like Goku and Vegeta, they won't have anything to complain about. Next year everyone will be practicing saying "KNEEL BEFORE ZOD."

agreed