Homecoming The Spider-Man Skepticism Thread

[marvelrobbins]

I've watched every trailer, every clip, and every tv spot. All in a desperate and earnest attempt to feel some level of excitement and hype for this movie, and I just can't on anything at all.

I find Tom Holland's performance to be over the top and trying too hard to sound young and naive. So much so that in some cases he's bordering on Disney Channel actors reading kiddish "hip" dialogue in a teen high pitched voice in order to not appear in their 20s or 30s. He also doesn't strike me as someone who has any stress or responsibility on his shoulders. Then there is the constant "I have to prove myself to Stark" and "This movie is all about Peter proving worthy of being an Avenger" nonsense.

The action looks fairly generic and uninspired.

I hate that he goes to a specialty science High school. It defeats the purpose and makes him less relatable as an everyman and makes him less of an outcast and less exceptional among his peers.

I hate that he has a billionaire benefactor with unlimited resources. Again it destroys the relatability of Peter as an everyman and by all accounts removes his independence and autonomy.

I hate that he's scared of heights. I find it completely stupid and unnecessary.

I don't like the YouTube and vlogging elements at all.

I don't like that they created a new character in Michelle and turned an existing 616 character (Ned Leeds) into an original character who has more in common with the Ultimate Spider-Man character (Ganke) than his 616 namesake. I truly dislike the direction they have taken with Flash Thompson.

I have always taken issue with the overtly cheesy cringe worthy dialogue and interactions with civilians in Spider-Man films and this movie looks like more of the same.

It's just all so sad and disappointing for me.

we agree.

 

[SpideyJJ]

I've watched every trailer, every clip, and every tv spot. All in a desperate and earnest attempt to feel some level of excitement and hype for this movie, and I just can't on anything at all.

I find Tom Holland's performance to be over the top and trying too hard to sound young and naive. So much so that in some cases he's bordering on Disney Channel actors reading kiddish "hip" dialogue in a teen high pitched voice in order to not appear in their 20s or 30s. He also doesn't strike me as someone who has any stress or responsibility on his shoulders. Then there is the constant "I have to prove myself to Stark" and "This movie is all about Peter proving worthy of being an Avenger" nonsense.

The action looks fairly generic and uninspired.

I hate that he goes to a specialty science High school. It defeats the purpose and makes him less relatable as an everyman and makes him less of an outcast and less exceptional among his peers.

I hate that he has a billionaire benefactor with unlimited resources. Again it destroys the relatability of Peter as an everyman and by all accounts removes his independence and autonomy.

I hate that he's scared of heights. I find it completely stupid and unnecessary.

I don't like the YouTube and vlogging elements at all.

I don't like that they created a new character in Michelle and turned an existing 616 character (Ned Leeds) into an original character who has more in common with the Ultimate Spider-Man character (Ganke) than his 616 namesake. I truly dislike the direction they have taken with Flash Thompson.

I have always taken issue with the overtly cheesy cringe worthy dialogue and interactions with civilians in Spider-Man films and this movie looks like more of the same.

It's just all so sad and disappointing for me.

It's like you read my mind

 

[YoungBlood]

I've watched every trailer, every clip, and every tv spot. All in a desperate and earnest attempt to feel some level of excitement and hype for this movie, and I just can't on anything at all.

I find Tom Holland's performance to be over the top and trying too hard to sound young and naive. So much so that in some cases he's bordering on Disney Channel actors reading kiddish "hip" dialogue in a teen high pitched voice in order to not appear in their 20s or 30s. He also doesn't strike me as someone who has any stress or responsibility on his shoulders. Then there is the constant "I have to prove myself to Stark" and "This movie is all about Peter proving worthy of being an Avenger" nonsense.

The action looks fairly generic and uninspired.

I hate that he goes to a specialty science High school. It defeats the purpose and makes him less relatable as an everyman and makes him less of an outcast and less exceptional among his peers.

I hate that he has a billionaire benefactor with unlimited resources. Again it destroys the relatability of Peter as an everyman and by all accounts removes his independence and autonomy.

I hate that he's scared of heights. I find it completely stupid and unnecessary.

I don't like the YouTube and vlogging elements at all.

I don't like that they created a new character in Michelle and turned an existing 616 character (Ned Leeds) into an original character who has more in common with the Ultimate Spider-Man character (Ganke) than his 616 namesake. I truly dislike the direction they have taken with Flash Thompson.

I have always taken issue with the overtly cheesy cringe worthy dialogue and interactions with civilians in Spider-Man films and this movie looks like more of the same.

It's just all so sad and disappointing for me.

 

[Shikamaru]

I'll say that the other frustrating thing about Tony is that he kinda takes away from Norman Osborn.

The rich CEO with a tech-based suit that sees Peter like a student/son and treats blue-collar people like Toomes as as an externality, you say? That's always been a core part of the Peter/Norman dynamic. If you took out Tony from this and told the same story, Norman would be the guy Toomes is talking about in that second trailer.

I mean, I wouldn't be exactly the same story - he wouldn't know Peter's identity or make him his costume. But the core themes they're tackling are very similar.

 

[2kt09]

I'll say that the other frustrating thing about Tony is that he kinda takes away from Norman Osborn.

The rich CEO with a tech-based suit that sees Peter like a student/son and treats blue-collar people like Toomes as as an externality, you say? That's always been a core part of the Peter/Norman dynamic. If you took out Tony from this and told the same story, Norman would be the guy Toomes is talking about in that second trailer.

I mean, I wouldn't be exactly the same story - he wouldn't know Peter's identity or make him his costume. But the core themes they're tackling are very similar.

and...that's where Sony's Marvel Universe comes in...

 

[GuestStar2004]

Honestly i am fine with what i have seen of this movie, not fond of the friend characters since it feels like they are gonna fit in as comic relief more then anything but overall what i have seen of wisecracking Spider-Man is what i have always loved about Spider-Man

Its interesting to see Spider-man elements being part of the MCU even if they have reduced alot of those elements for this version

 

[Shikamaru]

I've watched every trailer, every clip, and every tv spot. All in a desperate and earnest attempt to feel some level of excitement and hype for this movie, and I just can't on anything at all.

I find Tom Holland's performance to be over the top and trying too hard to sound young and naive. So much so that in some cases he's bordering on Disney Channel actors reading kiddish "hip" dialogue in a teen high pitched voice in order to not appear in their 20s or 30s. He also doesn't strike me as someone who has any stress or responsibility on his shoulders. Then there is the constant "I have to prove myself to Stark" and "This movie is all about Peter proving worthy of being an Avenger" nonsense.

The action looks fairly generic and uninspired.

I hate that he goes to a specialty science High school. It defeats the purpose and makes him less relatable as an everyman and makes him less of an outcast and less exceptional among his peers.

I hate that he has a billionaire benefactor with unlimited resources. Again it destroys the relatability of Peter as an everyman and by all accounts removes his independence and autonomy.

I hate that he's scared of heights. I find it completely stupid and unnecessary.

I don't like the YouTube and vlogging elements at all.

I don't like that they created a new character in Michelle and turned an existing 616 character (Ned Leeds) into an original character who has more in common with the Ultimate Spider-Man character (Ganke) than his 616 namesake. I truly dislike the direction they have taken with Flash Thompson.

I have always taken issue with the overtly cheesy cringe worthy dialogue and interactions with civilians in Spider-Man films and this movie looks like more of the same.

It's just all so sad and disappointing for me.

Other than the bolded parts, I share most of this sentiment.

Overall trying to be optimistic, but certain directors I'm not fond of at all.

I did find the first trailer fantastic though, so I'm a bit more excited than you, but the lack of enthusiasm exists in me too.

 

[ItchyWebShooter]

I'll be honest, I was pretty pessimistic for awhile--and it's probably just the undying optimist in me, especially when it comes to things I love--but I'm psyched. I'm ordering opening night tickets the moment they become available for my preferred theater and I'm going to go in with a big smile and a ton of anticipation.

I will, however, harbor a certain skepticism. Not just because I have my reservations about the movie, but also because I was burned before with TASM2. I won't let this ruin my movie experience, though, that much I can promise you.

 

[Spider-Ock]

After reading the junior novel, I am beginning to see why people are criticizing this movie. For me, it doesn't feel...new. The coming-of-age part is nothing that I haven't seen before. I thought that they were going to execute it well, but the high school drama feels very, very forced.

I am also bummed by the over-emphasis on the purply CGI. It comes off as really cartoony.

It also isn't helping that Holland is very very overexcited (read: borderline annoying) in some of the scenes in the trailers. I didn't notice it that much at first, but the junior novel really hammered home how much he says "cool" and "awesome".

Overall, I can't help wondering if they made a Spidey movie for the 5-9 year old age group. Granted, I know superhero films are generally for kids and teenagers, but they have always been lauded for tackling some mature themes. This one, though, just feels very superficial and shallow.

I am still going to watch it (as is everyone else), but I am not going in with sky-high expectations.

 

[harryoscop]

I don't buy their "modernizing argument" for Peter being annoying or the supporting cast. The Amazing Spider-Man was already a modernization of the comicz & it was still pretty faithful to Spidey & to the source material. And Peter wasn't an annoying little kid in that one & Gwen Stacy's name wasn't Betty Brandt & there was no "Michelle". Sally Avril was in that movie for 20 seconds (credited as "Hot girl") and her portrayal was already more faithful than what they're doing in here. Flash was also way closer to the comics. Peter was independent, and didn't need somebody to remind him of responsibility, and he wasn't wearing an Iron Man suit.


Homecoming may be the better movie but TASM will likely be the better "SPIDER-MAN" movie.

 

[ironwez20]

**** so that girl is Betty brant? Ugh!

 

[harryoscop]

**** so that girl is Betty brant? Ugh!

Yep. Marvel/Carroll doesn't seem to give a damn. They just slap random crap together and expect fans to eat it up. I'm gonna miss Raimi & even Webb's attention to detail for making sure the movies got things right

 

[ironwez20]

Yep. Marvel/Carroll doesn't seem to give a damn. They just slap random crap together and expect fans to eat it up. I'm gonna miss Raimi & even Webb's attention to detail for making sure the movies got things right

Then why the hell did they give he the black hair clip? Seriously what a stupid thing to do. That's like freaking gwens signature look next to Mary Janes red hair. Wow really? They really messed up with the cast for this movie. All cause they wanted to be different or what. Idk.

 

[GuestStar2004]

I am glad they didn't dump Peter down to being like Toby Mcguire Peter because i think it would be an outdated take on the character, but it does seem like they are playing on him being an excitable eccentric kid who uses words like "cool" and "awesome".

Personally i have no issue with it but i do hope its not over blown.

 

[SpideyJJ]

I am glad they didn't dump Peter down to being like Toby Mcguire Peter because i think it would be an outdated take on the character, but it does seem like they are playing on him being an excitable eccentric kid who uses words like "cool" and "awesome".

Personally i have no issue with it but i do hope its not over blown.

A teen who constantly says 'cool' & 'awesome' is outdated in itself tbh

 

[ironwez20]

A teen who constantly says 'cool' & 'awesome' is outdated in itself tbh

No no no. It's weird for Peter Parker to say it cause all this stuff shouldn't be new to him he never reacted to things like this before. It was always a snarky remark or confusion on how it works. Teens still say cool and stuff but Spider-Man does not. It feels weird.

 

[marvelrobbins]

Yep. Marvel/Carroll doesn't seem to give a damn. They just slap random crap together and expect fans to eat it up. I'm gonna miss Raimi & even Webb's attention to detail for making sure the movies got things right

you took words right out of my mouth.

 

[marvelrobbins]

I don't buy their "modernizing argument" for Peter being annoying or the supporting cast. The Amazing Spider-Man was already a modernization of the comicz & it was still pretty faithful to Spidey & to the source material. And Peter wasn't an annoying little kid in that one & Gwen Stacy's name wasn't Betty Brandt & there was no "Michelle". Sally Avril was in that movie for 20 seconds (credited as "Hot girl") and her portrayal was already more faithful than what they're doing in here. Flash was also way closer to the comics. Peter was independent, and didn't need somebody to remind him of responsibility, and he wasn't wearing an Iron Man suit.


Homecoming may be the better movie but TASM will likely be the better "SPIDER-MAN" movie.

The Amazing Spider-man was far ore faithful than this.yes case can be made amazing spider-man was a bit too dark for spider-man but it was faithful
blending of 616 and ultimate in modernization.the parkers really felt like
family in that film.and they had house and not apartment.as you said flash
was really faithful to comics.as was gwen.that was first film that really
made peter seem smart as he was in comics.i was cirtical of villians with
split personalitys in rami trilogy but webb made it work in amazing spider-man.I didn't feel like they were thorwing characters in and randomly giving them names of comic characters.

homecoming is bound due to marvel studio brand be a bigger hit.not sure how critics will respond.but it's doudtful it will get unamous praise from fans
online like you hear for other marvel studios films.there is already vocal group of spider-man fans not liking what they are seeing.

 

[Dark Raven]

I've watched every trailer, every clip, and every tv spot. All in a desperate and earnest attempt to feel some level of excitement and hype for this movie, and I just can't on anything at all.

I find Tom Holland's performance to be over the top and trying too hard to sound young and naive. So much so that in some cases he's bordering on Disney Channel actors reading kiddish "hip" dialogue in a teen high pitched voice in order to not appear in their 20s or 30s. He also doesn't strike me as someone who has any stress or responsibility on his shoulders. Then there is the constant "I have to prove myself to Stark" and "This movie is all about Peter proving worthy of being an Avenger" nonsense.

The action looks fairly generic and uninspired.

I hate that he goes to a specialty science High school. It defeats the purpose and makes him less relatable as an everyman and makes him less of an outcast and less exceptional among his peers.

I hate that he has a billionaire benefactor with unlimited resources. Again it destroys the relatability of Peter as an everyman and by all accounts removes his independence and autonomy.

I hate that he's scared of heights. I find it completely stupid and unnecessary.

I don't like the YouTube and vlogging elements at all.

I don't like that they created a new character in Michelle and turned an existing 616 character (Ned Leeds) into an original character who has more in common with the Ultimate Spider-Man character (Ganke) than his 616 namesake. I truly dislike the direction they have taken with Flash Thompson.

I have always taken issue with the overtly cheesy cringe worthy dialogue and interactions with civilians in Spider-Man films and this movie looks like more of the same.

It's just all so sad and disappointing for me.

Agree with all of this, but you forgot Peter's arachnophobia and repetitive strain injury on his webshooting finger.

If Michelle turns into MJ at the end of the movie a la Robin John Blake, that will be the final straw.

Actually, the final straw will be harryoscop finding he's turned into a different Hype member by the end of the movie. HOINO

 

[PeterBenParker]

If I come out feeling the same way I did with Civil War (in regards to Spidey), I'm gonna be mega bummed and probably won't wanna see any more of the Spidey sequels.

Avengers films and that's it as far as MCU Spidey goes.

 

[ItchyWebShooter]

If I come out feeling the same way I did with Civil War (in regards to Spidey), I'm gonna be mega bummed and probably won't wanna see any more of the Spidey sequels.

Avengers films and that's it as far as MCU Spidey goes.

I thought you'd go see anything featuring Spidey regardless of perceived quality..?

(Not trying to be confrontational, just want to spark a dialogue and hear your reasoning).

 

[Poppy]

If Michelle turns into MJ at the end of the movie a la Robin John Blake, that will be the final straw.

It's true. And I really dislike that only one month before the film release, we still have doubts about Marvel pulling a "Michelle Jones" and changing MJ into an introvert brunette.
We should have more faith in them but after Gwetty, anything is possible.

 

[PeterBenParker]

I thought you'd go see anything featuring Spidey regardless of perceived quality..?

Personal enjoyment > perceived quality for me at the end of the day.

"Quality over quantity" is what was expressed of Spider-Man's role in Civil War and yet I didn't enjoy their 'quality'. On the flip-side, TASM2 didn't do much in the way of quality (weird editing, some cringy moments, etc.) and yet it's one of my favorite Spider-Man films because of how much I enjoyed it overall (despite its flaws).

Spoiler

[BLACKOUT]It's also why I'm looking forward to the SMU because I liked what I got from the previous series and I don't expect it to be too much different.
[/BLACKOUT]

I'm giving Homecoming a chance because he was a glorified cameo in Civil War and we didn't get to see Peter's world (villains, supporting characters, etc.) in action (for obvious reasons). Homecoming is the true make it or break it for me with MCU Spider-Man.

Also, in direct response to your quote, I'd still be seeing the next Avenger films regardless of how I feel about their Spider-Man. Still has Cap, Ant-Man, Hawkeye, etc.

(Not trying to be confrontational, just want to spark a dialogue and hear your reasoning).

Well, here's the main takeaway of my original post from the Black Cat/Silver Sable threat:

Myself, I can't wish for anything Spider-Man related to fail

I'm not wishing for Spider-Man: Homecoming to fail. I want the film to make the money, I want it to do well with the critics and audiences alike and most importantly of all, I want to like it. That said, if I come out of it not enjoying how they handled the titular hero who is the film, what's the point of continuing further? To be more interested in the villains or some of the supporting cast?

That's not wishing for it to fail, that's me just not liking their specific take and having no desire to continue watching it further when there's plenty of other alternatives.

 

[GuestStar2004]

"Quality over quantity" is what was expressed of Spider-Man's role in Civil War and yet I didn't enjoy their 'quality'. On the flip-side, TASM2 didn't do much in the way of quality (weird editing, some cringy moments, etc.) and yet it's one of my favorite Spider-Man films because of how much I enjoyed it overall (despite its flaws).

Spoiler

[BLACKOUT]It's also why I'm looking forward to the SMU because I liked what I got from the previous series and I don't expect it to be too much different.
[/BLACKOUT]

Yeah honestly Tom Hollands Peter isn't that far off from Andrew Garfields

 

[ItchyWebShooter]

Fair enough.