The Dark Knight Rises Theme of the Third movie

[Closerframe]

The first act of the movie should portray Bruce in all of his loneliness. He's just lost a good friend to the freaks. Rachel won't have anything to do with him, or is dead. Batman is slowly realizing that he's one man fighting an uphill battle, in a never-ending war. He wants to give up, but knows that he can't.

Until Alfred reminds him, "Why do we fall?" Bruce realizes that this isn't the first time he's felt alone. His parent's murder. He decides that Batman is a loner.

Act two, after a brutal beating at the hands of Two-Face, Bruce starts to think that Harvey is lost. He cannot be redeemed. Batman wonders if maybe he's gone too far himself. Will he be able to save himself?

Act three, while still coming to grips with the fact that he may be becoming what he's trying to fight, Batman sees in a young Dick Grayson the very same kid he once was. Alone. Scared. Guilty. Angry. So instead of redeeming himself, he tries to help Dick by adopting him, and teaching him tactics to deal with all those bottled up feelings. He does this while attempting to hide his identity as Batman, fearing that if Dick finds out, he'll reveal the secret, or worse, want to be just like Batman.

Dick eventually finds out about Bruce's identity, and naturally wants to help. Batman says no, Dick runs away. Batman realizes he pushed Dick away, and must find him. After finding Dick and realizing that his help may be needed to make progress in the uphill battle, he recruits a sidekick, but not without warning that once you put on that mask and start fighting, you're in for life.

So we have loneliness, redemption, recruitment, curse.

What you think?

Nolan has already stated we would never see a Robin in his series. He said Dick Grayson is still in diapers...

 

[Man Who Laughed]

Yeah, I know. And I personally don't want to see Robin. Dick Grayson, even a very young one, I could live with. I just got caught up in the excitement of the discussion, and all the talk about Robin.

That would be if he was in the movie. If he wasn't Batman's struggle would be quite a different one. Without him in the movie, Batman would have to find it in himself to continue. I see that as being more of a... struggle to save Bruce Wayne.

One of the things I always loved about Batman, is that he understands he needs Bruce Wayne to keep him balanced. Just as Bruce needs Batman to feel useful. It's a less sick version Joe/Jack and Tyler Durden.

Back on topic though, the third movie could take an interesting turn. In BB, Bruce is trying to find a means to fight injustice. And as quoted in the TDK trailer, "I've seen now what I have to become to stop men like him." So is it possible that in the third film Batman goes to far? Will he try to stop Harvey using methods akin to Harvey's own radical actions? Two-Face offers more potential than I ever thought possible, now that I think about it...

 

[Closerframe]

I think it should go a little something like this...

After Gotham City is left in chaos because of the path of chaos the Joker has caused, Batman is still hated by police and him and Gordan's friendship has now drawn them apart. Bruce is completely torn between what has happened to Rachel, (a love interest is not necessary for the final film it would be a waste of time) he believes that he is completely responsible for her death, while on the other side Harvey blames himself while Two-Face blames the Batman. The mafia of Gotham is at the turning point where they have turned to Two-Face as their new leader, this shows that Gotham has completely become taking over by the freaks. This would be a great time to introduce Black Mask, a person similar to Two-Face but wants power instead of justice. Batman will come to the conclusion that a hero my have to kill sometimes in the name of justice and in order to keep the peace. By the end of the film Two-Face will either kill himself (fight club style) or be sent to arkham. By the conclusion of the film Gotham City is now controlled by mostly the freaks, while the mob families lurk in the shadows. Batman and Gordan are not close friends as much as they were in Begins, now their meetings are rare. But Batman feels he has created the new Gotham and it is his job to defend it.

 

[Man Who Laughed]

That's pretty good. I've always wanted to see an all out street war between the mob and the freaks. Or rather, the henchmen of the freaks. Think about it. Two-Face is leading the mob, and the freaks know the power he has. He's one of them, AND in control of the enemy.

So Harvey tells the mob he'll help them take out the freaks, in return for control of what's left of the families syndicates. Then Two-Face tells the freaks he'll divide the syndicates in exchange for their loyalty.

What no one counts on is Two-Face's line of thinking, "The enemy of your enemy is your friend." Two-Face controls both sides, and figures the only way to weed out the weak, is to call a meeting of all mob bosses, and instruct the freaks to attack them. Being the double crosser, he then notifies each side of the other's intent. The Narrows erupts in an all out war, with Batman fighting both sides while trying to get to Two-Face. Batman chases Two-Face to his hideout, only to walk in on Two-Face pointing a gun in his face. Two-Face flips his coin, catches it, laughs, and puts the gun to his head. BANG! Harvey's dead. Batman looks out the window to see what's left of The Narrows. He takes a deep breath, finishes the fight, his relationship with Gordon is shattered, and Gotham demotes its guardian to mere urban legend. Leaving Batman just another shadow in the night.

 

[Victarion]

That's pretty good. I've always wanted to see an all out street war between the mob and the freaks. Or rather, the henchmen of the freaks. Think about it. Two-Face is leading the mob, and the freaks know the power he has. He's one of them, AND in control of the enemy.

So Harvey tells the mob he'll help them take out the freaks, in return for control of what's left of the families syndicates. Then Two-Face tells the freaks he'll divide the syndicates in exchange for their loyalty.

What no one counts on is Two-Face's line of thinking, "The enemy of your enemy is your friend." Two-Face controls both sides, and figures the only way to weed out the weak, is to call a meeting of all mob bosses, and instruct the freaks to attack them. Being the double crosser, he then notifies each side of the other's intent. The Narrows erupts in an all out war, with Batman fighting both sides while trying to get to Two-Face. Batman chases Two-Face to his hideout, only to walk in on Two-Face pointing a gun in his face. Two-Face flips his coin, catches it, laughs, and puts the gun to his head. BANG! Harvey's dead. Batman looks out the window to see what's left of The Narrows. He takes a deep breath, finishes the fight, his relationship with Gordon is shattered, and Gotham demotes its guardian to mere urban legend. Leaving Batman just another shadow in the night.

I really like this idea MWL. Tell me, did you have a certain roster of "Freaks" lined up? I know I'd throw in Killer Croc and maybe his gang could be a street gang consisting of homeless people that live beneath the streets of Gotham. If the homeless "mole-people" idea interests you, check out the novel Reliquary by Douglas Preston & Lincoln Child. Why keep the fight in the Narrows though? I say let all Gotham be part of the fun.

 

[Closerframe]

That's pretty good. I've always wanted to see an all out street war between the mob and the freaks. Or rather, the henchmen of the freaks. Think about it. Two-Face is leading the mob, and the freaks know the power he has. He's one of them, AND in control of the enemy.

So Harvey tells the mob he'll help them take out the freaks, in return for control of what's left of the families syndicates. Then Two-Face tells the freaks he'll divide the syndicates in exchange for their loyalty.

What no one counts on is Two-Face's line of thinking, "The enemy of your enemy is your friend." Two-Face controls both sides, and figures the only way to weed out the weak, is to call a meeting of all mob bosses, and instruct the freaks to attack them. Being the double crosser, he then notifies each side of the other's intent. The Narrows erupts in an all out war, with Batman fighting both sides while trying to get to Two-Face. Batman chases Two-Face to his hideout, only to walk in on Two-Face pointing a gun in his face. Two-Face flips his coin, catches it, laughs, and puts the gun to his head. BANG! Harvey's dead. Batman looks out the window to see what's left of The Narrows. He takes a deep breath, finishes the fight, his relationship with Gordon is shattered, and Gotham demotes its guardian to mere urban legend. Leaving Batman just another shadow in the night.

Amazing ... This is the perfect way to end it. The film would bare that depressing cloud while have a small chance for hope. Leaving Batman to just be alone lurking in the shadows. And i agree allow Gotham to be the place where the chaos is happening.

 

[anrrd_2]

I really like this idea MWL. Tell me, did you have a certain roster of "Freaks" lined up? I know I'd throw in Killer Croc and maybe his gang could be a street gang consisting of homeless people that live beneath the streets of Gotham. If the homeless "mole-people" idea interests you, check out the novel Reliquary by Douglas Preston & Lincoln Child. Why keep the fight in the Narrows though? I say let all Gotham be part of the fun.

love love LOVE those books! "book of the dead" is my fav.

they need a movie adaption like now!t:

 

[Nepenthes]

Nice. who would the freaks be though? You've got Scarecrow and a more extreme version of Zsasz would be easily enough. Venquilotrist needs no introduction. Gator could just take of his shirt get some tattoos and starting shooting the juice. But you'd need to introduce a new leader freak in a big way. The film of course needs more than Two-Face as an added element and Catwoman I see as a lone wolf and definitely not someone who would command the lead of a bunch of sociopath criminals. They need one of their own in charge. Deadshot will have have a higher status by the 3rd movie and along Firefly (who gets a toy) they would both make alot of sense in teh NolansWorld. If Deadshot were the leader the trick would be how play him alongside Two-Face, he has a clear contrast with Batman but Harvey not so much

 

[last_life]

I think it should go a little something like this...

After Gotham City is left in chaos because of the path of chaos the Joker has caused, Batman is still hated by police and him and Gordan's friendship has now drawn them apart. Bruce is completely torn between what has happened to Rachel, (a love interest is not necessary for the final film it would be a waste of time) he believes that he is completely responsible for her death, while on the other side Harvey blames himself while Two-Face blames the Batman. The mafia of Gotham is at the turning point where they have turned to Two-Face as their new leader, this shows that Gotham has completely become taking over by the freaks. This would be a great time to introduce Black Mask, a person similar to Two-Face but wants power instead of justice. Batman will come to the conclusion that a hero my have to kill sometimes in the name of justice and in order to keep the peace. By the end of the film Two-Face will either kill himself (fight club style) or be sent to arkham. By the conclusion of the film Gotham City is now controlled by mostly the freaks, while the mob families lurk in the shadows. Batman and Gordan are not close friends as much as they were in Begins, now their meetings are rare. But Batman feels he has created the new Gotham and it is his job to defend it.

I think I just threw up in my mouth a little bit...

 

[Man Who Laughed]

Freaks... Scarecrow, some Joker Goons... I guess I don't really know. Just think 'The Warriors" Sort of all the freaks' gangs kind of mashed together. And as far as keeping it in the Narrows goes, the only reason I picked that is b/c of the signifigance it has after BB. That, and the tiny narrow streets. Also the one other idea that occured to me that I failed to put in my post was that in the ensuing battle, Arkham is damaged beyond repair, and a new one is built on an island outside the city limits.

But this whole which freaks are there thing is bothering the piss outta me. Black Mask, Scarecrow, Joker Goons, Zsasz, Two-Face, Scarface and Ventriloquist, Lady Shiva, Deadshot, Firefly, I would like to see some Freeze action, maybe Mad Hatter.

Anyone that could make an appearance in the Nolanverse should. I think most only for a second or two, just as eye candy for the fans. Hell, I wouldn't even mind seeing a glimpse of some LoS ninjas, with or without their leader.

 

[dark joker]

Honor , friendship, loyalty, trust, will to act are all valid themes and dealing with Bruce Wayne is just a shell or vessel for the Batman

 

[Two-Face]

Edit

 

[Anakinos]

I like the most of the ideas i have seen thus far.

Begins - Fear
TDK - Escalation
B3 - Duality

The only problem i have with having to many villians or Freaks in one movie is that it would end up like B&R thats all. But i like the idea of catwomen/selina being the next love interest and helping bruce learn to deal with the loss of RD ( i think she bites the farm as well.)

Just my .02

 

[ThreeActRomance]

yknow. i was thinking.

Sarah Jayne Dunn is still attached to TDK in some capacity. The Harley Quinn rumors werent 100% debunked (unless i'm wrong)

So..having said that...maybe Nolan will introduce Harlen Quinzel in TDK (as a cameo)..and she'll grow into Harley in the third one.

just an idea. sure its been posted already.

 

[Man Who Laughed]

I like the most of the ideas i have seen thus far.

Begins - Fear
TDK - Escalation
B3 - Duality

The only problem i have with having to many villians or Freaks in one movie is that it would end up like B&R thats all. But i like the idea of catwomen/selina being the next love interest and helping bruce learn to deal with the loss of RD ( i think she bites the farm as well.)

Just my .02

I agree. If my idea(or anything like it) were ever to come to fruition, I would really only want the "major players" to be Two-Face, Black Mask, the mob, and *maybe* Scarface. The rest would basically just be glimpsed in a tracking shot that goes from one end of the street to another, and whenever Bats has to deal w/ one while chasing Harvey down.

 

[wrhssaxensemble]

yknow. i was thinking.

Sarah Jayne Dunn is still attached to TDK in some capacity. The Harley Quinn rumors werent 100% debunked (unless i'm wrong)

So..having said that...maybe Nolan will introduce Harlen Quinzel in TDK (as a cameo)..and she'll grow into Harley in the third one.

just an idea. sure its been posted already.

I actually came up with that idea earlier... not sure whether its posted here or not somewhere but my idea was to have her as Dr. Quinzel in TDK and have the Joker die in TDK then have her believe its Batman's fault and go out for revenge against batman for her "beloved puddin's" death.... would also put the Joker-ish characteristics intended for the 3rd film that won't likely be seen because of the whole Ledger thing.

I think I read somewhere though in some spoiler, unfortunately, that Dunn plays a girlfriend of Moroni or something along those lines. Not sure how well she can act but if it is good, I would much prefer her to be Quinzel/Quinn instead

 

[anrrd_2]

perhaps Dunn has a cameo as heraly but we never see her face? giving them the option of geting a better actress in the 3rd should they decide to expand the character.

 

[CinematicESP]

Theme for the third film: War. All out crime war.

I like the idea of the freaks vs. the mob and Two-Face playing both sides.

With that in mind, I think Black Mask is too perfect not to include in Nolan's universe, given his involvement in the criminal underground and the fact that he's one of the most realistic of Batman's rogue gallery (plus he's a fresh face, which would keep the studios and toy companies happy).

 

[The Shadow]

Though there is already some contradictions, I think Nolan should set his 3rd Batman movie to take place after the first franchise and show Robin evolving (so to speak) into nightwing and maybe introduce Tim Drake. Also, bring in some new villians for a change. That is what I would love to see him do.

 

[The Shadow]

Though there is already some contradictions, I think Nolan should set his 3rd Batman movie to take place after the first franchise and show Robin evolving (so to speak) into nightwing and maybe introduce Tim Drake. Also, bring in some new villians for a change. That is what I would love to see him do.

 

[The Shadow]

sorry double post

 

[Man Who Laughed]

Theme for the third film: War. All out crime war.

I like the idea of the freaks vs. the mob and Two-Face playing both sides.

With that in mind, I think Black Mask is too perfect not to include in Nolan's universe, given his involvement in the criminal underground and the fact that he's one of the most realistic of Batman's rogue gallery (plus he's a fresh face, which would keep the studios and toy companies happy).

Yeah. I think it's about time we saw Black Mask.

 

[omerhead]

I don't want the third films theme to be about struggling, I think that concept
they used Spiderman 2 and Batman Forever is really lame IMO.

 

[ctkwilson]

I would like to see them approach the third movie with batman giving up on the people of Gotham. Tired, beaten down, mentally exhausted. Of course in the course of the movie he comes back to save his people. Let's get deep into his psychology.

 

[Maximus One]

Maybe we could get a scene with Batman truly questiong himself about being Batman. Sort of like doubting himself and wondering if its his fault the way the things have escalated and pondering whether or not Hes the cause for all the freak who keep popping up every. Kinda like a stary arc from Spider Man.Maybe that but I also love the redemtion idea as well although i see that only playing out if Bats has to do some things in this movie that tremendous gurlit and anguish and if Blaming himself for Rachel death. what do you think