The Dark Knight Rises The Dark Knight Rises

[C. Lee]

i'm talking about the title here, einstein. and it's the worst batman film title of the lot. lazy and too long. batman begins feels out of place now. it doesn't feel like a trilogy, and they are clearly trying to cash in on the name. i'm waiting for that to be renamed the dark knight begins.

Two things I have to say....(1) don't come on here and preference your rebuttle to someone with EINSTEIN....that's a passive aggressive insult and not needed in a discussion.....(2) creating a second name to come on and be rude will get you banned quick.

Understand?

 

[elgaz]

The Dark Knight
The Dark Knight Rises

How's it any more lazy than having:

Batman
Batman Returns
Batman Forever

 

[Chris Wallace]

It isn't. They're kind of on equal footing. Of course, the same could be argued of just using the character's name and tagging a number behind it.

 

[ALP]

I don't think the title is lazy. It does make BB not fit in though. Sort of like how the first Indy film was just Raiders of the Lost Ark but the next two had "Indiana Jones" in the title so George Lucas went back and re-titled the film "Indiana Jones and the Raiders of the Lost Ark" for all of the video releases and posters.

 

[batman11]

I can certainly understand why some don't like the fact that Begins doesn't "fit," however, I personally think it fits just fine. I look at the titles as a progression, which is why I think Begins fits in the flow from title to title to title. I made some lengthy posts on the day that the title was released, but essentially my reasoning is this:

BATMAN BEGINS - Batman, our hero, starts his crusade. At this point, he is just as his name says - a guy dressed up like a bat (clearly has issues t. This is the origin.

THE DARK KNIGHT - Bruce faces his greatest challenges yet, and by the end of the film, he falls. Our hero, Batman, has evolved into something much greater by the end of TDK. Attaining this status, he is Gotham's Dark Knight. Is he still "Batman?" Of course. But he now transcends the literal monicker, and takes on a new level of the symbolic status that he hoped to achieve ever since his training with Ra's. "He's not being a hero, he's being something more." As mentioned, this comes with a price, as the birth of the Dark Knight coincides with Batman's fall. In the grand scheme of the trilogy titles, a literal title (in the same realm as "Begins" and "Rises") for TDK really could have Birth of The Dark Knight, but that is indeed a mouthful; The Dark Knight fits the idea more elegantly.

THE DARK KNIGHT RISES - this one is obviously difficult to go into too much detail about (unless I'm Chris Nolan...), but a viable and possible idea is that now evolved yet fallen, the Knight must pick himself back up and "rise." He is no longer simply "Batman." Of course he still goes by the name, but thematically and symbolically, he is in a new place. That is why, although perhaps nicer to the tongue, Batman Rises would seem like a a bit of a step back to me (not to mention you'd get people saying that TDK now feels left out), but again, it's very hard for me to write this without considerable knowledge of where Rises is going, and how Nolan is ending his trilogy.

Unlike the "titles full circle" idea that many share, I see the three titles as a thematic progression, with a beginning, an intermediate stage, and then a definitive ending. This is why I feel that Begins very much belongs. It leads into the Dark Knight, which then leads into Rises. Begins, (Evolves - moves past just the "Batman" title), Rises. After all, he's gotta be Batman before he can become the Dark Knight.

Just my opinion on the matter. I certainly don't wish to impose it on others, save for a few (just ALP). Kidding. t:

 

[Travesty]

[/QUOTE]Found this in the rare BB photo thread. Don't know if it's been posted here.

 

[That-Guy]

I've always liked the title Batman Begins. I find the hatred towards it nitpicky and stupid.

Nolan and WB wanted to make it clear that the film was not a sequel to the previous Batman franchise that had been run into the ground. They could have possible just called it "Batman" but people would have presumably thought it was a remake of the 1989 film. So they came up with the best way of saying that without calling it "Batman: Not to be Confused with Tim Burton's Batman or Joel Schumacher's Nippleman."

I think the title is cool because it also has a bit of a dual meaning. In the literal sense, it means Batman begins his career as a crimefighter. But it also means that the story, the myth and the legend that is Batman... all of that starts with this film.

 

[RustyCage]

Again, your beef is with Margaret Lyons of EW. She is the writer implying that the title is not final. Why don't you send her a nastygram?

Because, in fact, she isn't the culprit. You are.

And I have cold hard quotes to prove it.

Here's what you said:

Over at Entertainment Weekly, Christian Bale was hinting that "The Dark Knight Rises" might not even be the actual title of the flick

Here's what Christian Bale actually said in that interview:

I don't even know if that's the right title. Until Chris tells me, I don't believe it.

(Interviewer: So if you see it on a website or a blog, it doesn't matter.)

It's got to be from his mouth, or else, I don't really know.

Him not knowing because Chris hasn't told him is utterly and completely different from him 'hinting' that it's not the real title. Not only did he not even come close to saying anything like that, as you were announcing he supposedly was, but Ms. Lyons also said nothing of the sort.

So here's what Ms. Lyons reported on the matter:

“I don’t even know if [The Dark Knight Rises is] the right title,” Bale said. “Until Chris tells me, I don’t believe it.”

Yep. A simple, honest quote.

She mentions the title once more:

But since the actual plot details for TDKR – if that is it’s real name — are so tantalizingly vague, Bale’s confirmation of something — anything — concrete attracts some added significance.

This is the part you seem to be talking about, but it's merely a funny little reference to the fact that Christian doesn't know the title. Nowhere does Ms. Lyons say 'Christian Bale is hinting that it's not the real title!' That was all you, Raku.

I'm really not trying to get into a flamewar with--and I'm not sure why you're being so hostile to me.

It's not really hostility so much as disapproval of your methods. I explained this before; it propagates misconception in the fanbase if effective. It can skew peoples' ideas of what was actually said.

So this isn't anything like a flamewar. I'm making an honest assessment of what you did and asking you not to repeat it.

 

[lordofthenerds]

The title seems to suggest that Catwoman will appear in the film.

 

[KILLING JOKER]

Because, in fact, she isn't the culprit. You are.

And I have cold hard quotes to prove it.

Here's what you said:



Here's what Christian Bale actually said in that interview:



Him not knowing because Chris hasn't told him is utterly and completely different from him 'hinting' that it's not the real title. Not only did he not even come close to saying anything like that, as you were announcing he supposedly was, but Ms. Lyons also said nothing of the sort.

So here's what Ms. Lyons reported on the matter:



Yep. A simple, honest quote.

She mentions the title once more:



This is the part you seem to be talking about, but it's merely a funny little reference to the fact that Christian doesn't know the title. Nowhere does Ms. Lyons say 'Christian Bale is hinting that it's not the real title!' That was all you, Raku.



It's not really hostility so much as disapproval of your methods. I explained this before; it propagates misconception in the fanbase if effective. It can skew peoples' ideas of what was actually said.

So this isn't anything like a flamewar. I'm making an honest assessment of what you did and asking you not to repeat it.

You're gonna have a long and draining job if you really think you can police and/or educate people on the proper way to post. Just sayin..

 

[RustyCage]

You're gonna have a long and draining job if you really think you can police and/or educate people on the proper way to post. Just sayin..

I'm aware. Just defending my point in this instance since it hasn't been much of a bother to do so.

Also, describing what I take issue with as the 'proper way to post' is rather off. I don't care how he posts in general, I care about whether or not he's lying about the news and potentially skewing the fanbase's perception of it (as newscasters can often do). I'm not trying to police or educate anyone, I'm just calling a liar out for what he is.

No one's really been effected here though, so this discussion will fizzle out shortly, if it hasn't already. No worries.

 

[-JKR-]

I don't think the title is lazy. It does make BB not fit in though. Sort of like how the first Indy film was just Raiders of the Lost Ark but the next two had "Indiana Jones" in the title so George Lucas went back and re-titled the film "Indiana Jones and the Raiders of the Lost Ark" for all of the video releases and posters.

...which sucks, honestly. To me, it'll always be "RAIDERS OF THE LOST ARK", and I don't care if the other two movies are titled "INDIANA JONES AND..."

Same with the "STAR WARS" movies. Couldn't care less about the 'continuity in title', for me the movies are and will always be "STAR WARS", "THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK" AND "RETURN OF THE JEDI".

 

[KILLING JOKER]

I'm aware. Just defending my point in this instance since it hasn't been much of a bother to do so.

Also, describing what I take issue with as the 'proper way to post' is rather off. I don't care how he posts in general, I care about whether or not he's lying about the news and potentially skewing the fanbase's perception of it (as newscasters can often do). I'm not trying to police or educate anyone, I'm just calling a liar out for what he is.

No one's really been effected here though, so this discussion will fizzle out shortly, if it hasn't already. No worries.

I'm not stressin it. I actually agree with you. There's just so much of that out there.

 

[KILLING JOKER]

...which sucks, honestly. To me, it'll always be "RAIDERS OF THE LOST ARK", and I don't care if the other two movies are titled "INDIANA JONES AND..."

Same with the "STAR WARS" movies. Couldn't care less about the 'continuity in title', for me the movies are and will always be "STAR WARS", "THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK" AND "RETURN OF THE JEDI".

I couldn't agree more. "Raiders" is my favorite movie and throwing that stupid crap in front of the title cheapens it. It may seem petty but that drove me nuts when I saw it.

 

[DarKJediKnight]

The title seems to suggest that Catwoman will appear in the film.

 

[RakuMon]

I'm aware. Just defending my point in this instance since it hasn't been much of a bother to do so.

Also, describing what I take issue with as the 'proper way to post' is rather off. I don't care how he posts in general, I care about whether or not he's lying about the news and potentially skewing the fanbase's perception of it (as newscasters can often do). I'm not trying to police or educate anyone, I'm just calling a liar out for what he is.

No one's really been effected here though, so this discussion will fizzle out shortly, if it hasn't already. No worries.

Dude! This is what I'm talking about! What's up with the personal attacks?! You're acting like I was deliberately misleading people. Maybe I misunderstood the original post on EW, but what gives you the right to question my character?! You don't know me! We can disagree about what the EW writer was implying, but I don't know why you're calling me out like that.

I was just gonna leave this thread alone, but dude, I feel like a mod needs to get in on this.

 

[steintym]

...which sucks, honestly. To me, it'll always be "RAIDERS OF THE LOST ARK", and I don't care if the other two movies are titled "INDIANA JONES AND..."

Same with the "STAR WARS" movies. Couldn't care less about the 'continuity in title', for me the movies are and will always be "STAR WARS", "THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK" AND "RETURN OF THE JEDI".

Completely agree - When I refer to Star Wars, I'm talking about the first film in the franchise to come out. A New Hope? Don't really use that.

 

[steintym]

As far as this new Batman title goes, I'm not sure. I'm sure it will grow on me the more I hear it, but right now, I don't ... It sure doesn't grab me.