Tim Burton's Alice in Wonderland

[A&W]

It's like Burton is stuck in a rutt. Over and over and over again he keeps trying to replicate his previous success by giving us something weird and unique again. the problem is just like I said. Weird and unique are not enough if it isn't good at the same time.

 

[A&W]

also The Nightmare Before Christmas and Charlie and the Chocolate Factory.

I saw nightmare as a child so I can't judge it, because it's easier to be pleased by a movie as a child in my opinion.

but Charlie and Chocolate factory sucked big blue balls. Horrible waste of a movie. It's another example of what I was saying. Burton thinks that if he throws his trademark weirdness into the movie it will automatically be a success.

that's not true. Weird isn't enough. My biggest fear about this movie is that the Hatter will not have any emotional depth at all. He will be weird but you wont relate to him at all. You wont join him in any emotinoal struggles. You wont care about the character. He will be weird for the sake of being weird and for no other reason at all.

 

[A&W]

Edward Scissorhands, Batman Returns, Ed Wood, Mars Attacks, Sleepy Hollow, Big Fish, Sweeney Todd, etc...

I was thinking of Edward Scissorhands when I wrote that but I wasn't sure if it was newer or older.

Batman Returns is not a good movie in my opinion. Way too corny and ridiculous. Think back to catwoman with the bird flying out of her mouth. I could go on, but that movie just isn't good in my opinion.

Sweeney Todd was pointless. the other movies don't stand out in my memory well enough to comment on them which leads me to believe they were not that memorable.

It seems like for a while now Burton has focused on his one skill. His movies all have a weird and unique feel to them. That's okay, but it's not enough all by itself.

I'm not saying he's a crappy director or anything like that. He's a good director. I just don't think he's one of the best and I think he's stalled in terms of making good movies. It's like he figures his weird tone is enough. He just keeps trying to make movies that are different over and over again with none of them making a really big mark.

that's why he keeps working with Depp as well. He just figures "I'll make something weird and Depp is good at acting weird so I'll just keep making weird movies with him over and over again untill I finally make a really big hit."

I guess what he really needs is some good story writers because that seems to be the big problem with his rescent movies. Planet of the Apes. The look and feel of the movie was perfect. The acting as well as the characters were done well. But the story? There was no story. It sucked.

 

[Majik1387]

that's not true. Weird isn't enough. My biggest fear about this movie is that the Hatter will not have any emotional depth at all. He will be weird but you wont relate to him at all. You wont join him in any emotinoal struggles. You wont care about the character. He will be weird for the sake of being weird and for no other reason at all.

I must have missed the depth of the character of the Hatter from the source material.

I was thinking of Edward Scissorhands when I wrote that but I wasn't sure if it was newer or older.

Batman Returns is not a good movie in my opinion. Way too corny and ridiculous. Think back to catwoman with the bird flying out of her mouth. I could go on, but that movie just isn't good in my opinion.

Sweeney Todd was pointless. the other movies don't stand out in my memory well enough to comment on them which leads me to believe they were not that memorable.

I can't take this comment seriously from someone with an Avatar avatar.

It seems like for a while now Burton has focused on his one skill. His movies all have a weird and unique feel to them. That's okay, but it's not enough all by itself.

I'm not saying he's a crappy director or anything like that. He's a good director. I just don't think he's one of the best and I think he's stalled in terms of making good movies. It's like he figures his weird tone is enough. He just keeps trying to make movies that are different over and over again with none of them making a really big mark.

that's why he keeps working with Depp as well. He just figures "I'll make something weird and Depp is good at acting weird so I'll just keep making weird movies with him over and over again untill I finally make a really big hit."

I guess what he really needs is some good story writers because that seems to be the big problem with his rescent movies. Planet of the Apes. The look and feel of the movie was perfect. The acting as well as the characters were done well. But the story? There was no story. It sucked.

I can agree he's stuck in a rut, but not to the point of the bold.
And I can agree with the Planet of the Apes comment.

 

[Iceman]

A&W I agree Burton can only (or only wants to) do weird lol but this film is one that completely suits him & Depp where weirdness is the name of the game. Also agree that the film being good or not is something very separate, even where weirdness is essential to success.

AiW could really be anything from 1-10/10 but I'm predicting that this is one of Burton's breakout films. Whether or not Burton is one of the top directors around, at least he has artistic vision rather than following a formula book like most of the other schmucks.

 

[terry78]

The Burton/Depp thing is irrelevant. Some of the greatest directors have paired with actors on multiple films over the decades.

 

[DarkKnight88]

that's why he keeps working with Depp as well. He just figures "I'll make something weird and Depp is good at acting weird so I'll just keep making weird movies with him over and over again untill I finally make a really big hit."

There are so many things wrong with this sentence, I don't know where to start.

First of all, do you really think he made Sweeney Todd because he was going for a 'really big hit'? A movie where the lead character is slicing people's throats to get revenge on a judge who raped his wife and wants to do the same to his long lost daughter? Oh yeah, and it's a musical. Sounds like a big hit to me!

No, Tim Burton does the films he does because they INTEREST him. The entire point of his films are that things that are perceived as odd and weird are not and the really odd and weird things are the people around us.
The weird character in Edward Scissorhands is not Edward himself but the seemingly "normal" people of the suburban street.

To complain about all of his films focus on "outsiders" is like complaining that Martin Scorsese always makes the same movies with characters that don't fit in with society. And he only makes them with Robert DeNiro or Leonardo DiCaprio. He's just searching for a blockbsuter.

Look, his films don't interest YOU. That's totally cool. But there are a great number of people that they do. Don't try and concoct that's there's some kind of conspiracy on why his films click with people. They just do. He's made some bombs, for sure. Planet of the Apes and Mars Attacks. But Charlie and the Chocolate Factory was a blockbuster (close to 500 M worldwide) and actually very close to the original Roald Dahl book (much more than the 1971 version). Even 83% fresh on RottenTomatoes. Remember, just because YOU don't like something, doesn't mean everybody else won't like it as well.

 

[A&W]

A&W I agree Burton can only (or only wants to) do weird lol but this film is one that completely suits him & Depp where weirdness is the name of the game. Also agree that the film being good or not is something very separate, even where weirdness is essential to success.

AiW could really be anything from 1-10/10 but I'm predicting that this is one of Burton's breakout films. Whether or not Burton is one of the top directors around, at least he has artistic vision rather than following a formula book like most of the other schmucks.

I agree with that. This movie might be absolutely incredible. At first I was real hyped, and then my hype moved to me being skeptical.

 

[A&W]

There are so many things wrong with this sentence, I don't know where to start.

First of all, do you really think he made Sweeney Todd because he was going for a 'really big hit'? A movie where the lead character is slicing people's throats to get revenge on a judge who raped his wife and wants to do the same to his long lost daughter? Oh yeah, and it's a musical. Sounds like a big hit to me!

No, Tim Burton does the films he does because they INTEREST him. The entire point of his films are that things that are perceived as odd and weird are not and the really odd and weird things are the people around us.
The weird character in Edward Scissorhands is not Edward himself but the seemingly "normal" people of the suburban street.

To complain about all of his films focus on "outsiders" is like complaining that Martin Scorsese always makes the same movies with characters that don't fit in with society. And he only makes them with Robert DeNiro or Leonardo DiCaprio. He's just searching for a blockbsuter.

Look, his films don't interest YOU. That's totally cool. But there are a great number of people that they do. Don't try and concoct that's there's some kind of conspiracy on why his films click with people. They just do. He's made some bombs, for sure. Planet of the Apes and Mars Attacks. But Charlie and the Chocolate Factory was a blockbuster (close to 500 M worldwide) and actually very close to the original Roald Dahl book (much more than the 1971 version). Even 83% fresh on RottenTomatoes. Remember, just because YOU don't like something, doesn't mean everybody else won't like it as well.

You misunderstood me. I was never complaining about his weird unique tone he brings to movies. That is a strength of his.
My complaint is that in rescent times it appears to be his ONLY strength.

Chocolate Factory was a horrible movie. 83% or no I agree with many of the critics who said Depp creepily reminded them of Michael Jackson while surrounded by children.

 

[Doc Ock]

I liked Charlie and the Chocolate Factory.....

 

[I'm Old Greg]

Becuase actors are ***holes...Burton likes working with people he LIKES and has a good time working with....I don't blame him.

 

[ross2287]

How did Depp's Wonka remind anyone of Jacko? Wonka hates kids while Michael Jackson loved them...maybe a little too much.

They were both pale and reclusive. That's about it.

 

[ross2287]

Double post.

 

[A&W]

How did Depp's Wonka remind anyone of Jacko? Wonka hates kids while Michael Jackson loved them...maybe a little too much.

They were both pale and reclusive. That's about it.

at the time of the movie's release they both had the exact same hair style. in the movie Depp's make up cause him to resemble him even more. Than take into consideration the simmillairities in clothing as well as the hat Depp was wearing. With those simmilairites it causes you to look at him being surrounded by children differently. Than look at Neverland and the Chocolate Factory. They are both exotic places that would attract children.

Then take into consideration we are extremely used to seeing mJ surround himself with kids and Depp's character was constantly surrounded by kids.

Some of that was unavoidable because that is what the story is about, but the unneccessary simmilarities cause the other simmiliarities to really stand out in your mind, and many viewers ended up being distracted, because they were thinking about Michael Jackson and children.

I'm not the only person who felt that way watching it.

All that aside the movie just never really took off.

 

[Deaths Head II]

Depp's Wonka and Michael Jackson both had that "child in an adult body" thing going on.

 

[Infinity9999x]

You misunderstood me. I was never complaining about his weird unique tone he brings to movies. That is a strength of his.
My complaint is that in rescent times it appears to be his ONLY strength.

Chocolate Factory was a horrible movie. 83% or no I agree with many of the critics who said Depp creepily reminded them of Michael Jackson while surrounded by children.

Honestly, I like it. And I don't think it was a horrible movie. I found the 70's version to be much more boring. And while I agree to an extent that Burton can focus too much on his trademark "weirdness" I think you're completely wrong in the aspect that he falls flat on character development. Depp's Wonka actually had character development. And watch Big Fish and tell me Burton doesn't put effort into character development.

You may not like some of his stuff, and that's fine. It's your opinion, but don't state your opinion like it's a fact. You think Chocolate Factory was a horrible movie, but obviously there are a number of people who disagree.

 

[A&W]

Honestly, I like it. And I don't think it was a horrible movie. I found the 70's version to be much more boring. And while I agree to an extent that Burton can focus too much on his trademark "weirdness" I think you're completely wrong in the aspect that he falls flat on character development. Depp's Wonka actually had character development. And watch Big Fish and tell me Burton doesn't put effort into character development.

You may not like some of his stuff, and that's fine. It's your opinion, but don't state your opinion like it's a fact. You think Chocolate Factory was a horrible movie, but obviously there are a number of people who disagree.

I actually have never met a person off of the internet that didn't think the chocolate factory was a horrible movie. I know many saw it in theatres and hated it.

I don't think Burton is bad at character development. I think he did a good job with Bruce Wayne in Batman. I even said that in Planet of the Apes I thought he did a good job with everybody, but the story wasn't there.

Depp's wonka however didn't have any character development at all. I do feel that that there is a good chance the Mad Hatter wont have any in this movie. I'll have to see it first.

I don't feel Burton is focusing too much on his trademark. I feel he is not focusing on other things enough. Burton is definitely talented. It's just been a while since he wowed us. I keep getting excited for new Burton movies and then end up being disapointed. That's why I'm not too excited this time.

I'm still seeing the movie just because I go to the theatres often and it definitely has potential. And not every director is going to wow the world with every movie they make, unless their name is Cameron or Peter Jackson.

 

[I'm Old Greg]

there as a flaw in Depp's Wonka...

he didn't like kids, he was even freaked out if one touched him or he was in contact with one, but yet he taps Mike Tevee on the shoulder with his hand to grab the chocolate from the tv...and next scene Mike passes by Wonkas face and he gasps that he almost touched him

Burtons Wonka was boring, it had little to no humor, and everyone just stood around when there kids were being devoured by the factory.

 

[matrix_ghost]

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/movies/news/a202872/uk-cinemas-plan-alice-boycott.html

Just read the news here that dutch cinemas ( and possibly all european cinemas) will also boycott Alice In Wonderland.

I have to agree with the cinemas as well. IMO it's a pretty dick move by Disney to release the movie so soon on dvd, especially when several movie theaters have invested millions to convert several of their normal screens into 3d screens.

 

[Rac]

I can't think of a single good movie Burton has made since Batman and Beetlejuice.

I can't think a single bad movie Burton has made. Even Apes has its moments.

 

[Dark_Gambit]

Just read the news here that dutch cinemas ( and possibly all european cinemas) will also boycott Alice In Wonderland.

I have to agree with the cinemas as well. IMO it's a pretty dick move by Disney to release the movie so soon on dvd, especially when several movie theaters have invested millions to convert several of their normal screens into 3d screens.

It will probably just resolve itself, Disney wont let an opportunity to make money go. They'll push back the dvd date.

 

[ross2287]

I can't think a single bad movie Burton has made. Even Apes has its moments.

I don't think anyone can deny that Planet of the Apes has fantastic make-up, a great score and a really nice set design.

 

[The Apatow Crew]

I hate to jump on the hate bandwagon.

But this just doesn't appeal to me at all. But maybe I'm not the demographic they are trying to go for.

I mean granted I haven't watched the cartoon in a while, but I don't remember any type of war scenario like LOTR Or Naria.

And plus is this suppose to be a sequel or something, cause the hatter says to Alice You're back or I see your back. Implying that she had been there before.

It just seems like they are trying to hard to see this movie to the kids or people from Hot Topic. lol.

 

[Doc Ock]

It is a sequel to the story, with Alice returning to Wonderland after being there as a little girl...

 

[The Apatow Crew]

So its a sequel/remake then?