Transformers Transformers 2 Info + Why The Movie Designs Are Different From G1

[blind_fury]

Even sillier misconception.

You're actually comparing literature to an 1980 toy line?

Are you saying that the reason it was successful is ONLY because of the fans?

yeah you completely missed the point. LOTR wasn't revamped to appeal to non-geeks. That would be ruining alot of the appeal.

The reason it did so well, is BECAUSE it appealed to the jocks and soccer moms in addition to the fans.

Exactly. Those people aren't they type to like Dungeons and Dragons but Peter Jackson showed them the light by staying true to the source material.

Besides, this doesn't help your argument any, as Bay is giving an epic depiction of the Transformers.

Oh I forgot, "my bad".

You concentrate on making the best film you can, and don't be a slave to fandom. It helps to take it into consideration, but never to let them be the driving force behind things.

Why even take fans into consideration? What do the lifelong fans who live and breathe Transformers know?

PS - There's even LOTR fans who were disappointed it wasn't as faithful as it could have been for what it's worth.

Yeah there were fans who thought it could've been closer to the book. But they know Peter Jackson minimized the changes and therefore appreciate his overall effort.

You missed the point. 300 the film didn't change the graphic novel. Nor did LXG change the comic. This film won't change anything about Transformers.

*sigh*

You originally said TINO would make people seek out the old stuff. Then I pointed out that LXG didn't improve the sales for the graphic novel but 300 greatly improvd sales for the graphic novel. Today 300 is a best seller. How am I missing the point?

Actually, again, you're wrong.

BB was made cause the studios wanted another franchise. If fans were responsible, why was there a ten year break between films?

The ten year wait was about allowing the general public time to forget about Batman and Robin. They got Goyer to write and Nolan to direct because they understood the appeal of the characters. TINO has the writer of Catwoman and the producer of LXG so they decided to go in the other direction.

And Jar Jar? C'mon, you're using Jar Jar to support an argument. Outside of kids, there wasn't many people who liked the character. Fans didn't cause that, the jocks and soccer moms as you put it also did.

Jar Jar is a valid point. Reduced Jar Jar screen time was mostly due to outraged Star Wars fans not because the Phantom Menace bombed at the box office.

Well, the purist can think that, but he doesn't really know now does he?

Unless he was on set and talking to Bay, or somehow a mind reader.

I'd imagine they also picture Bay setting G1 figures on fire in effigy, but that's not reality now is it?

It's appearent that Bay resents the source material and fanbase. I didn't have to be a mind reader to know the makers of Batman and Robin or Catwoman had little to no appreciation for the source material. Directors and writers who understand the appeal of the source material minimize the changes. Directers and writers who don't care and just want to exploit the popularity of the properties have a hack and slash approach.

Still to reality, where fans are exactly that, fanatics. There's a reason the word is called adaptation.

Harry Potter and the Simpsons are movie adaptations. Yet the characters that made those properties popular aren't being revamped.

You want to do a movie called Transformers because it's popular? Fine. But don't change what made it popular. That defeats the purpose of adapting it.

 

[nosebleed.]

The purist would be alot more open minded if Bay wasn't just throwing away characters and concepts wrecklessly. If he was attempting to elevate the source material it would be obvious to fans who live and breathe Transformers. The problem is Bay isn't eleveating the source material. He's giving it the lazy LXG treatment which not only alienates life-long fans but also hides the true appeal of the fantasy and characters.

A lot of BF's posts are a little too extreme for me but I wholely agree with this statement. As said a billion times, nobody is asking for an exact translation of G1...just a showing of respect to the source material instead of belittling it and calling concerned fans crybabies. Sure, there are haters but there are also a lot of fans who are just concerned about the handling of something the care about.

 

[blind_fury]

BF - You have an inapproiate analogy here...

The 'battle mode' is not like face paint, it is extra protection/extra offensive stuff.

Does a soilder go into battle without wearing a helmet?

I'm not criticizing Prime's flace plate.

The juvenille flame paint job doesn't suit the character and only distracts from what Prime represents in the story. The flames are just more evidence that Bay doesn't get it.

 

[Cth]

yeah you completely missed the point. LOTR wasn't revamped to appeal to non-geeks. That would be ruining alot of the appeal.

You continue to miss the point.

Comparing a toy line to an actual piece of literature that's discussed in colleges across the world.

The two aren't on the same level.

That's like comparing the adaptations of Gone With the Wind with adaptations of Resident Evil.

If you're seriously comparing films adapted from novels (which enjoy mass appeal in audiences, hardly a geek niche) to video games/toys/etc adaptations.. well, it's no wonder you don't like things.

Exactly. Those people aren't they type to like Dungeons and Dragons but Peter Jackson showed them the light by staying true to the source material.
They did

Hrm.. that's odd, I don't remember the Scouring of the Shire being in the film.

Tom Bombadil was missing. etc, etc, etc..

What IS the source material? The novel didn't have visual representations unless you're talking about The Hobbit, in which case it wasn't faithful at all. So, you're basing this on the cartoon or the toys? Cause the cartoon wasn't faithful to the toys AT ALL (Look at Optimus/Convoy and Megatron for starters)

If you mean giant aliens robots fighting each other over philosophical differences, then yes, it's quite faithful.

If you're talking about the cartoon, and energon cubes and Prime playing basketball, then no, it's not. Thankfully we don't get Autobots in medieval times, a girl falling in love with Powerglide, etc, etc.

Do a barrel roll! :roll:

Why even take fans into consideration? What do the lifelong fans who live and breathe Transformers know?

Obviously not how to support a comic.

If they're truly lifelong fans, they'd realize there's a ton of cheesy things in G1, that they convieniently forget about when they say idiotic stuff like "my bad" to support their arguments

Yeah there were fans who thought it could've been closer to the book. But they know Peter Jackson minimized the changes and therefore appreciate his overall effort.

Imagine if there was 7+ versions of LOTR to adapt from. Surely he'd have no problem, right?

*sigh*

You originally said TINO would make people seek out the old stuff. Then I pointed out that LXG didn't improve the sales for the graphic novel but 300 greatly improvd sales for the graphic novel. Today 300 is a best seller. How am I missing the point?

Because as I pointed out to you pretty clearly, the fact that the film exists, does not mean the comic or toys magically disappear.

No matter what Bay does, you still have Prime playing basketball and Furman's comics.

The ten year wait was about allowing the general public time to forget about Batman and Robin. They got Goyer to write and Nolan to direct because they understood the appeal of the characters. TINO has the writer of Catwoman and the producer of LXG so they decided to go in the other direction.

Yeah, that's exactly it. :roll:

If they truly "forgot" then how come fanboys constantly bring it up?

Nolan did his usual great job, but Bale's Batman was horrendous. His Wayne was spectacular don't get me wrong, but there was plenty of problems with BB, but that's another discussion.

Jar Jar is a valid point. Reduced Jar Jar screen time was mostly due to outraged Star Wars fans not because the Phantom Menace bombed at the box office.

Again, fanboys imaging they have this grand power.

If that was the case, how come they made two more films?

Fanboys were whining how bad Episode I sucked and still do to this day.

When all the reviews and average movie goer mentioned Jar Jar as the problem, fanboys can't claim THEY changed it.

It's appearent that Bay resents the source material and fanbase. I didn't have to be a mind reader to know the makers of Batman and Robin or Catwoman had little to no appreciation for the source material. Directors and writers who understand the appeal of the source material minimize the changes. Directers and writers who don't care and just want to exploit the popularity of the properties have a hack and slash approach.

Apparent to who?

Yes, it's completely understandable that he'd dislike the psychotic fanboys who have judged the film before they've even any previews.

Or to put it another way, how do you explain all fansites like Seibertron and TFW changing their opinions after actually SEEING footage? Oh right, they were bought off :roll:

Harry Potter and the Simpsons are movie adaptations. Yet the characters that made those properties popular aren't being revamped.

You want to do a movie called Transformers because it's popular? Fine. But don't change what made it popular. That defeats the purpose of adapting it.

Where do you get this information? Seriously.

You're saying they're making Transformers because it's popular? Is that why it was their second choice after GI JOE fell apart?

What made it popular exactly?

Pick one thing.

Was it the toys? The transforming aspect? The hiding? The energy metaphor? Prime? Alien conflict across galaxies? Giant robots? Spaceships? etc, etc..

Fans will have different answers every time.

Some hate Headmasters.. others hate Pretenders... Some dislike decepticon cars.. etc.

PS - The Simpsons has long outlasted its welcome long ago..

 

[Cth]

A lot of BF's posts are a little too extreme for me but I wholely agree with this statement. As said a billion times, nobody is asking for an exact translation of G1...just a showing of respect to the source material instead of belittling it and calling concerned fans crybabies. Sure, there are haters but there are also a lot of fans who are just concerned about the handling of something the care about.

I agree completely.

But those haters, ruined it for the "concerned" fans.

And now the concerned fans are becoming the haters, proving they were right to begin with in their eyes.

 

[Crimson King]

A lot of BF's posts are a little too extreme for me but I wholely agree with this statement. As said a billion times, nobody is asking for an exact translation of G1...just a showing of respect to the source material instead of belittling it and calling concerned fans crybabies. Sure, there are haters but there are also a lot of fans who are just concerned about the handling of something the care about.

I think Bay is talking about the AICN talk-backers when he speaks of crybabies rather than folks like us. I have to agree with him on that point. Those AICN guys are unbearable.

 

[nosebleed.]

I think Bay is talking about the AICN talk-backers when he speaks of crybabies rather than folks like us. I have to agree with him on that point. Those AICN guys are unbearable.

Oh man, you're right. I've got issues with this production but every single post I have doesn't contain, "DAMN YOU MICHAEL BAY" like on the talkbacks.

Stuff MB isn't even involved with gets blamed on him by AICN talkbackers.

 

[blind_fury]

You continue to miss the point.

Comparing a toy line to an actual piece of literature that's discussed in colleges across the world.

The two aren't on the same level.

That's like comparing the adaptations of Gone With the Wind with adaptations of Resident Evil.

If you're seriously comparing films adapted from novels (which enjoy mass appeal in audiences, hardly a geek niche) to video games/toys/etc adaptations.. well, it's no wonder you don't like things.

It doesn't matter if people in college study LOTR books or Batman comics or Simpson episodes. The same rule applies, make the fans happy because they understand the appeal of the properties better than anyone else. When they see what the fanboys knew all along they say "oh that's why these dorks like LOTR" or "oh that's why comic book nerds love Superman". The purpose of adapting the source material is to show audiences why the source material is appealing. You can't do that by revamping the characters and concepts. The stories change the audience not the other way around.

If you mean giant aliens robots fighting each other over philosophical differences, then yes, it's quite faithful.

LXG had the invisible man teaming up with Mr. Hyde. Doesn't make it a faithful adaptation.

If you're talking about the cartoon, and energon cubes and Prime playing basketball, then no, it's not. Thankfully we don't get Autobots in medieval times, a girl falling in love with Powerglide, etc, etc.

hmmm. Emphasizing the worst the property has to offer.

Joel Schumacher? Is that you???

Do a barrel roll! :roll:

Batman credit card anyone?

Obviously not how to support a comic.

If they're truly lifelong fans, they'd realize there's a ton of cheesy things in G1, that they convieniently forget about when they say idiotic stuff like "my bad" to support their arguments

Yeah there were cheesy things in Batman comics too. I guess Nolan should squeeze Bat-Mite into the Dark Knight film.

You said Bay was making an epic film. One idiotic comment deserves another.

Imagine if there was 7+ versions of LOTR to adapt from. Surely he'd have no problem, right?

I would probably adapt the one with the strongest and most loyal fanbase.

Because as I pointed out to you pretty clearly, the fact that the film exists, does not mean the comic or toys magically disappear.

Yeah that's a great reason to do crappy, half-assed adaptations.

No matter what Bay does, you still have Prime playing basketball and Furman's comics.

Still focusing on the worst Transforers has to offer? Joel Schumacher would be proud.

Again, fanboys imaging they have this grand power.

If that was the case, how come they made two more films?

because it was easier to cut Jar Jar's screen time?

Fanboys were whining how bad Episode I sucked and still do to this day.

When all the reviews and average movie goer mentioned Jar Jar as the problem, fanboys can't claim THEY changed it.

haha! Most complaint about Jar Jar didn't come from people who had a casual interest from Star Wars. It came from people who loved Star Wars.

Star Wars fanboys loved Boba Fett that's why he was a major character in the prequels. Not because reviewers praised the character.

Apparent to who?

Yes, it's completely understandable that he'd dislike the psychotic fanboys who have judged the film before they've even any previews.

Or to put it another way, how do you explain all fansites like Seibertron and TFW changing their opinions after actually SEEING footage? Oh right, they were bought off :roll:

Are those the same guys who buy up Energon and Armada toys? lolz!

Their standards are pretty low. They're like Batman "fans" who love Batman Forever and that movie resulted in Batman and Robin.

Where do you get this information? Seriously.

You're saying they're making Transformers because it's popular? Is that why it was their second choice after GI JOE fell apart?

Why didn't they go with Go bots?

What made it popular exactly?

Pick one thing.

Was it the toys? The transforming aspect? The hiding? The energy metaphor? Prime? Alien conflict across galaxies? Giant robots? Spaceships? etc, etc..

Fans will have different answers every time.

Some hate Headmasters.. others hate Pretenders... Some dislike decepticon cars.. etc.

Most lifelong fans will agree the characters resonated. Just like Han Solo and Obi Wan reasonated with Star Wars fans. I'm sure without the characters the metaphors and lightsabers would fail to create a loyal and dedicated following.

 

[ShadowBoxing]

I agree completely.

But those haters, ruined it for the "concerned" fans.

And now the concerned fans are becoming the haters, proving they were right to begin with in their eyes.

No....concerned fans were off put by this movie from the script leak, the inane and undeveloped plot elements, the foolish ending, the over emphasis of Spike, things like that.

Again you attempt to tell people what their opinions ought to be (which by the way is fueling the SHH admins belief that you are a plant). Fans reacted fairly poorly to Catwoman and LXG, but they did not ruin it somehow for casual moviegoers. Fan reaction is the first reaction you get on a film, because they are the only one's who give enough of a sh** to track the film months away. Casual moviegoers and "concerned fans" can only be ruined by a bad product.

You're piss poor Spider-Man analogies pretty much eat your own logic here. Very very hardcore fans argued against Spider-Man, yet the overall response (from both fans and non fans) was overwhelmingly positive. Transformers is hardly in the same ballpark. Past the designs, past flames, past Bay himself is a clunky script, with poorly designed plot points and movie camp that, in many ways, is worse than Seaspray falling in love with a meremaid.

That is what ruins it for us.

 

[YÅ«gi's BM]

No....concerned fans were off put by this movie from the script leak, the inane and undeveloped plot elements, the foolish ending, the over emphasis of Spike, things like that.

Again you attempt to tell people what their opinions ought to be (which by the way is fueling the SHH admins belief that you are a plant). Fans reacted fairly poorly to Catwoman and LXG, but they did not ruin it somehow for casual moviegoers. Fan reaction is the first reaction you get on a film, because they are the only one's who give enough of a sh** to track the film months away. Casual moviegoers and "concerned fans" can only be ruined by a bad product.

You're piss poor Spider-Man analogies pretty much eat your own logic here. Very very hardcore fans argued against Spider-Man, yet the overall response (from both fans and non fans) was overwhelmingly positive. Transformers is hardly in the same ballpark. Past the designs, past flames, past Bay himself is a clunky script, with poorly designed plot points and movie camp that, in many ways, is worse than Seaspray falling in love with a meremaid.

That is what ruins it for us.

With all due respect, that script is rather old. The most crucial element of a film is its dialogue, at least that is my opinion as a writer. A poorly plotted film can still be great with great dialogue, maybe you should wait until you have seen the film before you pass full judgement.

 

[YÅ«gi's BM]

I wasn't saying he did. I was merely commenting on Blind Fury's assertion that the concept of a soldier decorating himself is doesn't make sense.



Optimus Prime is a robot from another freakin' planet! Enough of this pandering to archaic fantasies of "great American war heroes"!

To be honest, Prime's personality is that of MacArthur/Wayne but we should look at this through Prime's mechanical eyes, he's on a strange new world, making First Contact with humans, he thinks to himself "How do I fit in better?" it's a simple mistake on his parts. That and it challenges his serious character.

sssshhhh. These characters are interchangeable to these people.

They have no clue why Transformers resonated with millions for decades.

I wouldn't exactly call twenty years 'decades' and to be fair I don't think millions keep up with the G1 comics you, my fellow geek, keep up with.

 

[Modernize73]

It doesn't matter if people in college study LOTR books or Batman comics or Simpson episodes. The same rule applies, make the fans happy because they understand the appeal of the properties better than anyone else.

Well said... but that being brought out...This is a movie being made for fans of Action Movies first and foremost. People who have never been a fan or known shred one about transformers will come see this movie . Back in the eighties the audience was 10 year olds getting home from school. Provide the same story, and you get a pokemon movie...

I cannot believe people are still complaining about the character designs...Prime looks tougher than he ever has. And even though I was a lil concerned about most charaters, they are turning out great. That pic initial pic of bonecrusher was crap...but in the TV spot he looks like a wicked bada$$...and ultimately sickly scary!!! I'll save my impression of megatron until I see him in action. But from the TV spots, I have yet to see anything that didn't just wow me.

I have read the leaked script, and I understand that its a rough draft...The schematic is the same and the general plot line is in tact, but it's all about dialog...Who know's if the geek gets girl angle is still played so heavily...we don't know from simple scenes on a trailer...or the sappy lines...

This is not a rewrite of Transformers...its a different chapter. And I'm sorry , but a better one. If they would've rolled out those generic designs of 84 they would of failed miserably, and probably looked like a polished up version of robot jox...

I am happy till this point, and save any criticisms until I see the movie. If it Sucks (which I doubt) then I'll rip it up oneside and down the other, and lead the picket outside of dreamworks offices...

I really just people are arguing for the sake of arguing at this point.

M73 out

 

[Batx69]

Anyone wana play a quick game of "Out the plant"? Well pretty obviously Modernize73 Yugis BS and Cth are, but who else do you guys think are? I would almost say spideyfan but that guy is bat-**** insain. I think the mods should do thier best to figure out who the plants and and ban the hell outa them, cause if that stuff aint aginst the rules, the it damned well should be.

 

[nosebleed.]

I wouldn't exactly call twenty years 'decades' and to be fair I don't think millions keep up with the G1 comics you, my fellow geek, keep up with.

decade: period of 10 years

20 years = 2 decades

And I'm pretty much sure he's talking about Transformer fans as a whole. You're being narrow minded.

 

[CFlash]

With all due respect, that script is rather old. The most crucial element of a film is its dialogue, at least that is my opinion as a writer. A poorly plotted film can still be great with great dialogue, maybe you should wait until you have seen the film before you pass full judgement.

I agree with you.
But, when have you ever heard good dialogue in a Michael Bay film?

 

[CFlash]

This is not a rewrite of Transformers...its a different chapter. And I'm sorry , but a better one. If they would've rolled out those generic designs of 84 they would of failed miserably, and probably looked like a polished up version of robot jox...

I don't think even the most hardcore G1 fan would disagree with that one. But, did they really have to go for the Gobot look instead?

As for it being better? Well, as much as a serious movie is "better" (in quotes) than an afterschool kids cartoon, sure... I agree. But, "better" as in it captures the great sci-fi potential at Transformers' core, hell no.

In lots of ways (I can name them) this movie is a dumbed down version of a cartoon. An afterschool cartoon! That's quite a feat only a filmmaker like Michael Bay could pull off.

I am happy till this point, and save any criticisms until I see the movie. If it Sucks (which I doubt) then I'll rip it up oneside and down the other, and lead the picket outside of dreamworks offices...
I really just people are arguing for the sake of arguing at this point.
M73 out

I reserve hope. But, I can't reserve judgement. Why? Because I've seen the rest of Bay's bombastic, empty, no-soul craptastavisions.

 

[Modernize73]

Anyone wana play a quick game of "Out the plant"? Well pretty obviously Modernize73 Yugis BS and Cth are, but who else do you guys think are? I would almost say spideyfan but that guy is bat-**** insain. I think the mods should do thier best to figure out who the plants and and ban the hell outa them, cause if that stuff aint aginst the rules, the it damned well should be.

Out the Plant?? What does Gay Folliage have to do with anything?? Leave them trees alone!

Anyhoo...I'm flattered that someone would think that my paultry 40 something posts out of ohhhhhh 1000's upon thousands on this board would be enough to sway people to go see this movie.

Here, i'll post a few bad things to make you all happy....
I think the Prime Speaks contest was lame, and the lines should be left to the writers...also the transformersmovie site sucks harder than a hoover, that's why I have this site on daily peruse (because it seems as if they never update it)...and although it's cool for some extra not privey to everyone info, the videos at sectorseven.org site (as beautiful as it is) is a very corny cheesey...not to mention the emails from "informants" are lame to anyone above the age of 12.

But the movie will rock and I'll see it multiple times...ha

M73 out

 

[Crimson King]

Anyone wana play a quick game of "Out the plant"? Well pretty obviously Modernize73 Yugis BS and Cth are, but who else do you guys think are? I would almost say spideyfan but that guy is bat-**** insain. I think the mods should do thier best to figure out who the plants and and ban the hell outa them, cause if that stuff aint aginst the rules, the it damned well should be.

Why is it that any opinion not focused on bashing the movie is automatically under suspicion? Every day I come to this place and most of the time I just want to throw a big sign up in front of people's faces that says, "YOU HAVE NOT SEEN THIS MOVIE."

Transformers could very well suck. Then again, it could be any number of different adjectives between suck and great. Until the day that you pay your obscene ticket price, however, that adjective is going to remain a mystery to me, you, and everyone else on here. Just relax.

 

[Modernize73]

I don't think even the most hardcore G1 fan would disagree with that one. But, did they really have to go for the Gobot look instead?

From what I remember the look of the gobots where even more simplified than transformers...God I hated those things!!

I reserve hope. But, I can't reserve judgement. Why? Because I've seen the rest of Bay's bombastic, empty, no-soul craptastavisions.

Yeah I pretty much turned Pearl Harbor off half way through...which was mostly because of the story line, and that hack Ben Affleck...

And even though the Island was visual stunning...it was pretty much logans run with a twist.

I hope Spielberg puts enough of his fingerprint on this one to make it worthwhile. I really think WOTW would of been a better movie with a different lead actor...tom cruise pretty much ruined it for me.

 

[CFlash]

But the movie will rock and I'll see it multiple times...ha

M73 out

I just don't see how anyone who's been to the movies in the last 10 years and witnessed debacles like League of Extraordinary Gentlemen (same Transformers Producer) or Catwoman (same Transformers screenplay writer) or Pearl Harbor or *ahem* Godzilla.... or any other <insert craptastic movie here> can say that.

I mean, I'm a huge fan of Sam Raimi (huge fan! way before Spider-man 1) and I would never even say the above about Spider-man 3. Sure, I have every reason to be optimistic, but come on!

 

[Barton Fink]

Man, this movie is gonna make ****loads of money. The studio obviously knows what its doing, as does the toy company. No matter what you think the quality of the movie is gonna me, you know it's gonna just take over the box office like nobody's business.

 

[blind_fury]

To be honest, Prime's personality is that of MacArthur/Wayne but we should look at this through Prime's mechanical eyes, he's on a strange new world, making First Contact with humans, he thinks to himself "How do I fit in better?" it's a simple mistake on his parts. That and it challenges his serious character.

You use the appropriate characters for comic relief. Optimus Prime shouldn't be clowned nor should Megatron.

If Megatron or Optimus transform and stare down some shocked civilian who then pisses himself that would be funny and wouldn't mock characters who are supposed to be the Obi Wan and Darth Vader of the story.

Jazz would be perfect for mimicking pop culture catch phrases, not Optimus Prime or Megatron. This isn't rocket science. It's like Bay is trying to annoy fans like Joel Schumcher intentionally did.

 

[Crimson King]

*double post edit*

 

[Modernize73]

I just don't see how anyone who's been to the movies in the last 10 years and witnessed debacles like League of Extraordinary Gentlemen (same Transformers Producer) or Catwoman (same Transformers screenplay writer) or Pearl Harbor or *ahem* Godzilla.... or any other <insert craptastic movie here> can say that.

I mean, I'm a huge fan of Sam Raimi (huge fan! way before Spider-man 1) and I would never even say the above about Spider-man 3. Sure, I have every reason to be optimistic, but come on!

Dude...I can't stop watching the trailers...lol

Granted I like the artsy flicks like "Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind"...and cool flicks like "Taxi Driver"

But this one goes on the History making meter CGI wise...and even with a semi flimsy story, it's still going to be a fun flick. The movie "Supertroopers" isn't going to win any awards either, but it's a great movie to drink to and it's fun to watch...

Maybe we'll have to have the "everytime they do a slow-motion shot" you have to drink for this one!!! I'm thinking I'll be wasted by the time the movie is over.

 

[Crimson King]

I just don't see how anyone who's been to the movies in the last 10 years and witnessed debacles like League of Extraordinary Gentlemen (same Transformers Producer) or Catwoman (same Transformers screenplay writer) or Pearl Harbor or *ahem* Godzilla.... or any other <insert craptastic movie here> can say that.

The writer you're referring to is definitely a hack, but he's a hack that was surrounded by two other guys who are much better writers than he is. And I could be mistaken, but I'm pretty sure he only contributed to the story and not the actual screenplay. His damage is most likely to be minimal (if at all).

Also, Don Murphy did produce LXG, but he also produced Bully and Natural Born Killers. Just want to make sure we acknowledge that he's not ALL bad.