What can DC/WB do now to move forward? Is there hope? - Part 1

[Greens]

I do think Hamada has it under control. I think The Joker is definitely happening or they would have pulled the plug already. It's the most "out there" thing they've got on their slate.

 

[Flash525]

I think plenty of people would appreciate a good solo Joker film with Jaoquin Phoenix. One of the most popular DC characters, good actor, the Scorsese prestige thing attached to it. It's far more interesting than anything involving the non-entity that is Cyborg anyway. Who really wants THAT? Justice League flopped, people only came for Batman and to a certain extent Wonder Woman.

If they recast Joker, then I guess they can go ahead with it, though I'd have thought there'd be more important characters to focus on than him. In any case, a solo Leto film, I can't remotely imagine being on board with.

Which is basically what Walter Hamada is doing.

Aside from 'AQUAMAN,' 'SHAZAM' and 'WONDER WOMAN 1984' there are only two projects which are eyeing a production start: Todd Philips' 'JOKER' and 'THE FLASH.'

Everything else is just being developed, which can mean everything and nothing.

Hamada's a smart man and knows his way around movies. He's got this.

If he thinks a solo Leto film is the way to go, then maybe not.

I'm still slightly perplexed by this Joker film though; if it was a film between Batman and Joker that's one thing, but just a Joker film? A (presumably) crime film with an element of gangster in? I don't know. I'd have thought there'd be other material (Green Lantern?) they'd want to get right first?

 

[-JKR-]

If they recast Joker, then I guess they can go ahead with it, though I'd have thought there'd be more important characters to focus on than him. In any case, a solo Leto film, I can't remotely imagine being on board with.

If he thinks a solo Leto film is the way to go, then maybe not.

I'm still slightly perplexed by this Joker film though; if it was a film between Batman and Joker that's one thing, but just a Joker film? A (presumably) crime film with an element of gangster in? I don't know. I'd have thought there'd be other material (Green Lantern?) they'd want to get right first?

Yeah, we'll see about that.
There's not much that can be said at this point, anyway. I trust Toby Emmerich (@Warner Bros.) and Walter Hamada (@DC), you don't.
We'll just have to wait and see. I have a good feeling about 'AQUAMAN', 'SHAZAM', 'WONDER WOMAN 1984', Todd Philips' 'JOKER' and 'THE FLASH'.

 

[Flash525]

Yeah, we'll see about that.
There's not much that can be said at this point, anyway. I trust Toby Emmerich (@Warner Bros.) and Walter Hamada (@DC), you don't.
We'll just have to wait and see. I have a good feeling about 'AQUAMAN', 'SHAZAM', 'WONDER WOMAN 1984', Todd Philips' 'JOKER' and 'THE FLASH'.

It's not that I don't trust those people - I don't even know who they are. I just know the state of the DCEU wasn't as well received as maybe we'd all like, and I've heard about so many stupid (or rather, unnecessary) projects that I'm always sceptical with them now.

 

[-JKR-]

It's not that I don't trust those people - I don't even know who they are. I just know the state of the DCEU wasn't as well received as maybe we'd all like, and I've heard about so many stupid (or rather, unnecessary) projects that I'm always sceptical with them now.

That's why I said all we can do is to wait and see.
What counts now is that the next three movies can deliver.

 

[Ultra Nolanite]

Which is exactly what I was talking about:

"How I want it." LOL. You do realize that most of you sound like three year olds screaming "Moooommy, how I want it is..."?

Go away, what, you don't want things from movies?

That is how I want it, you can want it the way YOU want it.

 

[-JKR-]

Go away, what, you don't want things from movies?

That is how I want it, you can want it the way YOU want it.

LOL.

Me? I want to enjoy movies, and I root for filmmakers to surprise and amaze me. Sometimes they do, other times they don't.

 

[Micromind]

Todd Philips' Joker movie (starring Joaquin Phoenix) is an Else-worlds story, set in past. It's budget is (reportedly) just 55 mil.


I think with it, WB plans to launch alternate line of "dark comic book movies", it could be an 'R' rated movie (just a guess), this movie has NOTHING to do with current DCEU.

 

[Greens]

There's definitely a chance that we could see R-rated films in this line. Low budget, low risk.

 

[Micromind]

There's definitely a chance that we could see R-rated films in this line. Low budget, low risk.

I can see some VERTIGO titles made into movies by under new banner. Maybe even some "horror" movies like SWAMP THING.

 

[Micromind]

Only DCEU movies that are currently picking up pace are The Flash and Suicide Squad 2.

 

[FunkMiller]

There's definitely a chance that we could see R-rated films in this line. Low budget, low risk.

This would be an extremely good idea. Leverage some of the lesser known properties with low budgets and hope for a Deadpool like hit.

 

[The Guard]

It's not about what characters say or don't say or about what is referenced or not. How I want it is that BvS and JL never happened. MoS never happened. So you can "NOT reference" all day long but I want Batman and Superman to meet for the first time again. I want the JL to be assembled for the first time again.

Basically a reboot that keeps Wonder Woman. Steve Trevor is just alive and Diana never had this mourning thing, it just didn't happen.

It's nice to want things.

That's what imagination is for, I guess.

 

[Fincher]

Then just pretend they didn't happen, dude. Get over it and enjoy the future movies. Done. They don't have to pander to you by telling you "alright, now when the screen turns black is when you can start to pretend the past movies didn't exist. You ready? 3... 2... 1..."

People's pretense these days that studios need to address whatever they didn't like has gotten out of hand.

I don't know what you're talking about, but it has nothing to do with what I said.

 

[Milk Tray Guy]

At this moment in time, I think DC/WB need to put everything on hold. They need to assess the release and reception of Aquaman, Shazam & Wonder Woman 2 before they decide to do anything else with any other character.

If these three film are a success, then they can look ahead to that Birds of Prey film, a Green Lantern film, and Man of Steel 2. In my opinion, those three currently have the most potential.

Any plans on a solo Joker film (especially with Leto) or a solo Deadshot film (with Will Smith) they can just scrap right now. I can't imagine anyone genuinely wants either of them. Follow these up with a Flash (and) Cyborg buddy film; from what I'm aware of, there's creative hell with these two projects, so why not combine them? I'm sure there's something original a good group of writers could do here.

If the Birds of Prey, Green Lantern and MoS2 films work out, then we can look at potentially throwing in a solo Batman film, then a Justice League 2 (one that's focused on the Injustice League rather than Darkseid) and then see where we are at the end of that.

This (is that Deadshot solo even supposed to be still happening??)

Which is basically what Walter Hamada is doing.

Aside from 'AQUAMAN,' 'SHAZAM' and 'WONDER WOMAN 1984' there are only two projects which are eyeing a production start: Todd Philips' 'JOKER' and 'THE FLASH.'

Everything else is just being developed, which can mean everything and nothing.

Hamada's a smart man and knows his way around movies. He's got this.

... and this.

 

[Cain]

There is no need to explicitly disregard the previous movies. They can just elegantly ignore them while going forward.

Shhh this actually makes sense lol

 

[BMCAABY]

That's fair. BvS Batman's kill count is well into double figures though and the deadly ultraviolence towards street thugs seemed really out of character.

And then Justice League Batman started going around admitting he was out of his league/relying totally on his tech which again seemed out of character.

The violence was quite the norm for alot of the Batman incarnations. The fight scenes with him were almost identical to the Arkham games and mind you the Batman was modeled off of Frank Millers batman.

I swear only in the cartoons does it seem like he doesn't kill people. Every other form of media he ends up battling people and you as a normal human can vouch that if that was real life everyone would be dead. But them not dying and Batman having a no kill rule although they look about dead is a classic batman trope.

It's not even a big deal. Affleck's rough characterization and fight sequences were one of the few things that I enjoyed in BvS. It was a major disappointment to see him act goofy in the next film.

 

[BMCAABY]

If they recast Joker, then I guess they can go ahead with it, though I'd have thought there'd be more important characters to focus on than him. In any case, a solo Leto film, I can't remotely imagine being on board with.

If he thinks a solo Leto film is the way to go, then maybe not.

I'm still slightly perplexed by this Joker film though; if it was a film between Batman and Joker that's one thing, but just a Joker film? A (presumably) crime film with an element of gangster in? I don't know. I'd have thought there'd be other material (Green Lantern?) they'd want to get right first?

You do realize Leto is a phenomenal actor right?. And there's alot of these soft retcons in marvel movies too when it comes to apoearance. (Ex. Thor's blond eyebrows, beard and i guess his long blonde hair now, even caps look changed in IW)
So reacting to the criticism we could definitely see a very comic book accurate Joker, in appearance and behaviour if handled as such with Leto reprising the role.

I don't blame Leto for his Joker that much, that was all Ayer.
Ayer's stylistic choice of Joker looking like a thug street criminal with tats, I'm sure Snyder's Joker wouldn't have looked like that either. Plus the script and plot did not even utilize the character to a great deal.

A Jared Leto Joker movie will work if it's done right. I feel like the todd philips one is going to be quite detached from white skin green hair Joker and be straightup a martin scorcese style film. In that much like Jerome from gotham it will be a normal looking guy with few traits of the joker but in a totally different universe with new supporting characters. It won't probably even be marketed as dc film either.

 

[Ultra Nolanite]

It's nice to want things.

That's what imagination is for, I guess.

Yep, tell it to the people responsible for the DCEU.

 

[Flash525]

This (is that Deadshot solo even supposed to be still happening??)

God I hope not!

You do realize Leto is a phenomenal actor right?. And there's alot of these soft retcons in marvel movies too when it comes to apoearance. (Ex. Thor's blond eyebrows, beard and i guess his long blonde hair now, even caps look changed in IW)
So reacting to the criticism we could definitely see a very comic book accurate Joker, in appearance and behaviour if handled as such with Leto reprising the role.

I don't blame Leto for his Joker that much, that was all Ayer.
Ayer's stylistic choice of Joker looking like a thug street criminal with tats, I'm sure Snyder's Joker wouldn't have looked like that either. Plus the script and plot did not even utilize the character to a great deal.

A Jared Leto Joker movie will work if it's done right. I feel like the todd philips one is going to be quite detached from white skin green hair Joker and be straightup a martin scorcese style film. In that much like Jerome from gotham it will be a normal looking guy with few traits of the joker but in a totally different universe with new supporting characters. It won't probably even be marketed as dc film either.

Blame aside, Leto may be a solid actor, but his portrayal of the Joker was terrible. I don't think he can rescue the character.

 

[Protar]

Perhaps a controversial opinion, but at this point I think it would be best to rest things for a few years and then do a full reboot, even if it would, unfortunately, mean rebooting Wonder Woman as well.

Instead of the gritty, edgy tone, go with the theme of hope slowly returning to a dark and troubled world. You can have darkness but don't let it be meaningless, let there be some heart in there.

Take the MCU approach, taking time to give each member of the League a solo film before the Justice League movie. Differentiate from what's gone before - a younger Batman, different league members like Martian Manhunter and Hawkwoman instead of Flash, Aquaman and Cyborg (for now).

If they really want to do a crossover fairly quickly, do a solo Catwoman flick and then have her crossover with Batman before JL. That'd be a fun crossover that wouldn't feel forced or rushed. You could even put her in The Justice League as a reluctant member.

During "phase 2" move up to three films a year, but reserve one of those slots for an Elseworlds film. This would allow the DCEU the ability to explore all sorts of crazy stories without having to worry about how - for example - Red Son would fit into the shared universe. You could do things like a Joaquin Phoenix Joker film while still maintaining a cohesive brand. Through inter-dimensional travel, these alternate realities could eventually cross-over (sparingly) into the main universe. Something like that would really set the DCEU apart from the MCU.

 

[FeedOnATreeFrog]

They just got to see how well Aquaman, Shazam, and WW2 do to see how if the current DC universe brand is toxic.

If these 2018/2019 movies do poorly even if they're well-received movies, then yeah, it's time to drop the DCEU and cast new actors for future movies, 2021 onwards.

Obviously WB still wants to pump out films in the meantime, so the 2020 movies could be the continuity-light projects, either with the Elseworld's movies like Phillp's Joker movie, or movies that are simply ambiguous as to their continuity because we're dealing with new characters (Blackhawk, Birds of Prey, etc) or because they're in a different time, like The Batman, which could be ambiguous as to whether its a prequel with a new younger actor or a reboot (like First Class was for many audience members back in the day).

 

[BaronZemo]

Even if the 2019 are well-received they have a mountain to climb. The DCEU is widely considered one of the most disappointing franchises of all time. Only Transformrs might rate lower based on the potential. They have lost so much ground, i don't know if they can recover with this universe. Audiences straight up rejected a Justice League movie for crying out loud.

 

[unholyrevenger]

Instead of the gritty, edgy tone, go with the theme of hope slowly returning to a dark and troubled world.

Why start over when this what the universe is already doing?

Take the MCU approach, taking time to give each member of the League a solo film before the Justice League movie.

Marvel Sneak in a Black Widow and a Hawkeye movie into phase one while i wasn't looking or something?

Even if the 2019 are well-received they have a mountain to climb. The DCEU is widely considered one of the most disappointing franchises of all time. Only Transformrs might rate lower based on the potential. They have lost so much ground, i don't know if they can recover with this universe. Audiences straight up rejected a Justice League movie for crying out loud.

$600 million is a rejection now?

 

[Protar]

Why start over when this what the universe is already doing?

I think that's what they're trying to do right now but it's not working. We have a Superman as dour and bitter as the world he's supposed to be saving. Besides which the main reason to start over is the poor reception to the films.

Marvel Sneak in a Black Widow and a Hawkeye movie into phase one while i wasn't looking or something?

Don't be a pedant. Ironman, Hulk, Thor and Cap all got solo films before the Avengers. Avengers was so great because almost every element of it was set up in prior movies. With the DCEU we had Man of Steel, and then after three years of nothing we jump straight into a crossover with the big three, we have a completely unrelated movie, Wonder Woman gets her solo, and then we jump straight into Justice League; when Batman, Aquaman, Flash and Cyborg all have yet to receive a solo outing. DC needs to start over and this time they need to take their time.