Homecoming What do you WANT to happen with the Spider-Man franchise?

[JOE]

Hasn't domestic declined since spiderman 1 or something?

Steadily...

SM- 403 M
SM2- 373 M
SM3- 336 M

TASM- 262 M
TASM 2- 202 M

 

[Doctor Octopus]

Domestic is just one country lol.

Drop difference for domestic is also very big between Raimi movies and ASM ones.

 

[LizardMan07]

Not really, the drop is pretty steady really. Certainly not "very big"

Domestic is super super important though.

I'd say there's no correlation between BO and fans' opinions on TASM over SM

 

[JOE]

Domestic is just one country lol.

Drop difference for domestic is also very big between Raimi movies and ASM ones.

SM- 49%
SM2- 48%
SM3- 38%
TASM- 35%
TASM 2- 29%

Total 1.576 B (DOM) / 3.96 B (WW) = 40% MURICA

Remind me again how it's "just one country".

 

[Doctor Octopus]

Disagreed. The drop between Raimi's was only 30 million each or so each time. The difference between Spider-Man 3 and ASM is over 70 million.

Domestic is not super important when the movies still make huge money overall combined with overseas take. You did not see Sony worrying about box office or franchise after any Raimi movie lol.

 

[Urich Leeds]

Disagreed. The drop between Raimi's was only 30 million each or so each time. The difference between Spider-Man 3 and ASM is over 70 million.

Domestic is not super important when the movies still make huge money overall combined with overseas take. You did not see Sony worrying about box office or franchise after any Raimi movie lol.

That's because every Raimi film grossed over 800 million.

There wasn't much room for complaint with that.

 

[JOE]

I'm just going to leave this here...

Disagreed. The drop between Raimi's was only 30 million each or so each time. The difference between Spider-Man 3 and ASM is over 70 million.

Domestic is not super important when the movies still make huge money overall combined with overseas take. You did not see Sony worrying about box office or franchise after any Raimi movie lol.

Number's don't lie Doc... 40% of Spider-Man's worldwide box office from SM to TASM 2 is still from the USA. You can't say DOM numbers aren't important. Look at the 403M DOM that SM made compare to the 202M DOM that TASM 2 made. Huge difference, DOM numbers matter. Has TASM or TASM 2 done SM DOM numbers either of them would have been the highest grossing Spidey movie.

 

[LizardMan07]

Disagreed. The drop between Raimi's was only 30 million each or so each time. The difference between Spider-Man 3 and ASM is over 70 million.

Domestic is not super important when the movies still make huge money overall combined with overseas take. You did not see Sony worrying about box office or franchise after any Raimi movie lol.

What happened to spiderman 4?

 

[Kuestmaster]

Andrew is a great Spidey and Emma was a great Gwen too. A shame that his movies were under the direction of Sony and not in the MCU. If there's a way to put Andrew in the MCU I say do it, the GA will be more willing to accept a Spidey they already know and are familiar with.

 

[Doctor Octopus]

That's because every Raimi film grossed over 800 million.

There wasn't much room for complaint with that.

Agreed. Raimi's movies made great money.

Number's don't lie Doc... 40% of Spider-Man's worldwide box office from SM to TASM 2 is still from the USA. You can't say DOM numbers aren't important. Look at the 403M DOM that SM made compare to the 202M DOM that TASM 2 made. Huge difference, DOM numbers matter. Has TASM or TASM 2 done SM DOM numbers either of them would have been the highest grossing Spidey movie.

Agreed numbers don't lie. 40% from domestic means 60% the majority comes from worldwide. I never say domestic numbers don't matter I say they are not super super important like some people say. As long as domestic and foreign together bring in big numbers it's ok.

Raimi's movies always have that. ASM movies don't.

What happened to spiderman 4?

Raimi left the project so they reboot.

 

[sl500jazz]

What happened to spiderman 4?

Raimi left during the development phase. Sony went with plan b.

Anyway, I thought domestic was more important than overseas. Doesn't the studio keep a larger percentage of box office revenue from domestic?

 

[JOE]

Agreed numbers don't lie. 40% from domestic means 60% the majority comes from worldwide. I never say domestic numbers don''t matter I say they are not super super important like some people say. As long as domestic and foreign bring in big numbers it's ok.

40% isn't super important? I'm still not understanding... It's almost half. If DOM numbers get cut in half (like SM to TASM 2) that's almost 25% of the total. That's MASSIVE.

 

[Angryfantasyfan]

Raimi left during the development phase. Sony went with plan b.

Anyway, I thought domestic was more important than overseas. Doesn't the studio keep a larger percentage of box office revenue from domestic?

Yes on both counts.

 

[Doctor Octopus]

40% isn't super important? I'm still not understanding... It's almost half. If DOM numbers get cut in half (like SM to TASM 2) that's almost 25% of the total. That's MASSIVE.

It is important not super important if foreign box office is making big numbers. That's what I say. SM movies make big box office, and until ASM movies always stayed in 300-400 million range for domestic.

Now with ASM movies they are dropped into 200 million and it is hurting box office.

Also read this.

http://deadline.com/2014/09/american-box-office-importance-studios-oversas-841427/

 

[LizardMan07]

is the Raimi series fallible at all? Even a tiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnny bit?

Or is it better than Jesus?

 

[JOE]

It is important not super important if foreign box office is making big numbers. That's what I say. SM movies make big box office, and until ASM movies always stayed in 300-400 million range for domestic.

Now with ASM movies they are dropped into 200 million and it is hurting box office.

Also read this.

http://deadline.com/2014/09/american-box-office-importance-studios-oversas-841427/

Okay, I guess important and "super" important are relative. I'm done with this debate when it's deciphering what's important and "super important".

is the Raimi series fallible at all? Even a tiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnny bit?

Or is it better than Jesus?

Way better than Jesus.

 

[Shikamaru]

Despite being far more pleased by the Webb franchise than most people, I'm at a point where I think the ideal option would be to bring Spidey home.

Sony is on a clear downward desperate spiral when it comes to this franchise. They clearly have no long-term plan for where they want to take this universe in light of TASM2's reception. They're doing the same mistake WB has done for years, which is change after change, delay after delay. A clear lack of vision despite the individual products themselves (imo) not being bad themselves.

The clear lack of a vision also emits itself in the spinoffs and universe building they're trying to go for. I honestly can't see this studio pulling off an idea as "out there" as a Sinister Six film, which I think would be hard for even Marvel to pull off at this stage. Especially given how they've only introduced one villain and plan to introduce the other five in the same film, all with their own enriched backstories and unique chemistries with Spider-Man who seems completely absent from the story. Raimi and Co. wanted to attempt the same thing at one point, showing they haven't learned from past mistakes. Then there's the issue of marketing the film. The same studio who has a hard time marketing Spider-Man can properly market a project like that? Highly wishful thinking.

We also know from several sources that many in production crew haven't been getting along with the Sony execs during the production of TASM2, Garfield included. Recent rumors suggest Garfield is gone due to some recent disagreements. If that's true, there are no other options for everyone than to hand the rights back. There's no way this declining franchise, with its many detractors from the start, would survive the marketing of a new reboot and/or another actor in the role. It would reek of nothing but a strong cash cow mentality. That would be the complete death of the franchise right there.

And as we know from the leak, Sony has now approached Marvel for a deal in an attempt to save the franchise. A clear last resort on their part.

In order to go from there, we have to take in account (1) why Marvel getting the rights would benefit Spidey and (2) Marvel's perspective.

Why Marvel getting the rights would benefit Spidey is a no-brainer. While some fans (including myself) have been skeptic of a Marvel-held Spidey due to their treatment of him in other mediums, I think it's important to remember 2 things: Feige calls the shots and Marvel's Phase 2 track record.

Compared with Sony's work, Marvel's recent track record has been at its absolute best...both in terms of individual storytelling and continuity buildup. By "recent", I mean they've been putting out nothing but very high quality content since at least the start of 2014. Cap 2 and Guardians both received critical acclaim. Agents of SHIELD is finally the world building show it was meant to be, being superior to at least half of the other Marvel films. Agent Carter is doing the same but to an even greater extent, with its writing arguably being on par with TWS and Avengers in both complexity and wittiness respectively. AoU and Daredevil appear will do the same, as well as Phase 3.

It's incredibly hard to look at Marvel's hits and argue not just they can't do a good job, but that they can't do a good job with their most iconic character.

But from Marvel's perspective, they wouldn't want to make any deal with Sony whatsoever.
http://forums.superherohype.com/showpost.php?p=30463037&postcount=294

As a result, the best option for Spidey is to wait until Sony gives in and the rights revert, which I see happening in the next 10 years. I cannot envision Sony surviving with the franchise past TASM3 in 2018 at most, and that's probably when Spidey will come home.

From that point on, the marketing would do all the work. I would sit on the property for a few years then bring it back under the Marvel logo (preferably through a Netflix series).

 

[chaseter]

Why would anyone want the best of MCU and the worst of Spidey aka ASM series to be combined? That's like combining lobster and Vienna sausages on the same plate.

 

[Doctor Octopus]

Why would anyone want the best of MCU and the worst of Spidey aka ASM series to be combined? That's like combining lobster and Vienna sausages on the same plate.

lol that is so true. I want total reboot with Marvel. No ASM anything.

 

[XtremelyBaneful]

In my case, I didn't like The Avengers, and in general I've found the shared universe fever to be a liability.

well in the source material, all the characters live in a shared universe.

how do you figure it is a liability?

I think it has to do with the fact some people...

Wait for it...

Enjoy the franchise

well, buddy. I enjoy the franchise too. I've stated that, as flawed as it may be, asm2 is the best spiderman movie i've ever seen. What I DON'T enjoy, is seeing spidey continuously being kept separate from the mcu. which is why if anything asm, add it to the mcu. letting it continue on as its own universe will be the dumbest thing sony could ever do (or one of).

and for the record, those of us who enjoy the franchise are in the minority.

 

[HarryOsborn]

is the Raimi series fallible at all? Even a tiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnny bit?

Or is it better than Jesus?

You just sound bitter that the facts are against you

 

[degraves93]

I don't even think Sony knows what they want...other than money.

 

[XtremelyBaneful]

I don't even think Sony knows what they want...other than money.

they want spiderman to be successful. not just successful, popular/liked.

because sm3 was the most successful spidey movie, but it was hated, and ended up in the reboot.

they need to realize the best thing to do is make nice with disney.

 

[Daltonio]

I'd like Sony to keep Garfield and do ASM3 and a Black Cat spinoff. I could do without Sinister Six or Venom, so it's between the first two for me. I guess I'll go with option #1.

That was the exact choice I was trying to decide between because I really want a Black Cat spinoff!

I ended up going for the other choice, but I kinda wish I could change it go with the one you chose too.

why would anyone want the asm series to continue as its own franchise and not part of mcu?

Well in my case, I've loved everything about the franchise as is and I've always preferred Spider-Man as a solo hero, so I like him being off in how own little universe.

I'd choose them moving into the MCU if it was the only way to keep the TASM series going, but other than that I like it on it's own.

 

[ImOctavius]

I'd like a Sinister Six movie. If it is well written, with a decent and competent director, it could be a great restart I think. Maybe the right person to do this job IS Drew Goddard. And Dane Dehaan as main character.

Then, "The Amazing Spider-Man 3" with Andrew and Marc. I think a nice plot could include a regular villian, like Shocker. But the real conflict could be Peter dealing with himself 'cause he doesn't think he could be Spider-Man anymore if he let the people he cares die. Maybe Black Cat could be a love interesting, but just as a detonator for Spidey to became again the superhero we always know.

Then, a Venom movie, "The Amazing Spider-Man 4", a female lead spin-off, "The Amazing Spider-Man 5", and to conclude, a film based on Spider-Verse.

Actually, I like very much Sony Pictures future plans for Spider-Man.