Homecoming Who should be the Villain in Spider-Man (2017)? - Part 1

[spideyboy_1111]

You don't have to rewrite them into something they're not to have great villains. If the story and writing is good enough, usually it works out... like it did with Ock in SM2. If not, just reinvent them. Like Nolan did with Joker & Bane.

I didn't think joker was all that re-inventive... and the fan community is still quite torn on bane... i happen to be in the boat that absolutely hates TDKR and bane was awful imo...

 

[ThePhantasm]

He wasn't Bane, that's for sure. Apart from breaking Batman's back and being sorta strong, he shared little resemblance with the comic book character.

 

[The Joker]

He was very faithful to Bane. That is a fact, not an opinion.

- Grew up in a prison
- Immensely strong
- Master strategist and leader
- Worked with Ra's Al Ghul and Talia (See the Legacy storyline)
- Worked with Catwoman (see Knightfall)
- Broke Batman
- Took over Gotham

That's not a reinvention. That is exactly what the comic book character is. He was more faithful than any Batman villain done in the Burton/Schumacher movies, too. This is a great link to the many comic book influences on him and TDKR in general; http://www.batman-online.com/featur...on-the-dark-knight-rises#sthash.XhyRe0IP.dpbs

If the Spider-Man villains were portrayed as faithfully as that to their comic book counterparts, then like their comic book counterparts most wouldn't be able to carry a Spidey movie solo.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

they also white washed him.. but that's another story. My beef with bane is that, that he sounded like the love child of snively whiplash and darth vader... was taken out pathetically easily when all was said and done, and i hated his costume design...

also.. every bat-villain has basically worked with another batvillain at this point.

 

[The Joker]

they also white washed him.. but that's another story. My beef with bane is that, that he sounded like the love child of snively whiplash and darth vader... was taken out pathetically easily when all was said and done, and i hated his costume design...

Your complaints on his costume and voice are opinionated (though his movie look is much better than the wrestler luchador mask look of the comic I thought), but the complaint about him being taken out pathetically easily, he wasn't. He was beaten down by Batman after a lengthy fight.

In comparison to the comics where it wasn't even the real Batman who took him down, it was AzBats, and he made Bane beg him to kill him like a wuss;

Bane only got to beat Batman in the comics because Batman was physically weakened. Bane basically kicked a dog while he was down. Similar to TDKR when he was 8 years out of practice and in bad shape. Bane has not got the balls to take Batman on in his prime. He's more tactical and sly. He beats him when he's weak.

also.. every bat-villain has basically worked with another batvillain at this point.

I don't mind that. Villain team ups in movies generally work as long as they're not rushed (TASM 2) or pointless (SM-3).

Anyway should probably drop this since it's more Batman than Spider-Man talk....

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Your complaints on his costume and voice are opinionated (though his movie look is much better than the wrestler luchador mask look of the comic I thought), but the complaint about him being taken out pathetically easily, he wasn't. He was beaten down by Batman after a lengthy fight.

In comparison to the comics where it wasn't even the real Batman who took him down, it was AzBats, and he made Bane beg him to kill him like a wuss;

Bane only got to beat Batman in the comics because Batman was physically weakened. Bane basically kicked a dog while he was down. Similar to TDKR when he was 8 years out of practice and in bad shape. Bane has not got the balls to take Batman on in his prime. He's more tactical and sly. He beats him when he's weak.



I don't mind that. Villain team ups in movies generally work as long as they're not rushed (TASM 2) or pointless (SM-3).

Anyway should probably drop this since it's more Batman than Spider-Man talk....

you're right it's an opinion... i hated his voice and costume. it was terrible and off-putting.

and yes.. he got taken out to easy.. catwoman just drove up and blew him away... and it was over.. the whole film was very disappointing to me.

 

[The Joker]

you're right it's an opinion... i hated his voice and costume. it was terrible and off-putting.

and yes.. he got taken out to easy.. catwoman just drove up and blew him away... and it was over.. the whole film was very disappointing to me.

That's your loss. But regarding your earlier comment about there being a divide on him, there's no evidence of that. People sometimes tend to over blow the opinions of a loud minority. In fact just recently Empire Magazine did a public vote for the 100 best movie characters, and Hardy's Bane scored the 83rd spot.

http://www.empireonline.com/features/100greatestcharacters/p4

 

[spideyboy_1111]

That's your loss. But regarding your earlier comment about there being a divide on him, there's no evidence of that. People sometimes tend to over blow the opinions of a loud minority. In fact just recently Empire Magazine did a public vote for the 100 best movie characters, and Hardy's Bane scored the 83rd spot.

http://www.empireonline.com/features/100greatestcharacters/p4

the public seemed to like him, but im talking about there being a divide on the boards.. which there was.

and it was a major loss.. TDKR was a terrible film, i don't want any spidey move remotely like it. it paled in comparison to the other 2 nolan films

 

[ThePhantasm]

you're right it's an opinion... i hated his voice and costume. it was terrible and off-putting.

An opinion shared by many. I don't think its controversial at all to dislike TDKR's Bane or to think of TDKR as inferior to the first two films.

But we're getting off topic here. Back to Spider-Man.

 

[The Joker]

the public seemed to like him, but im talking about there being a divide on the boards.. which there was.

Where? Here? I don't see it. For example he's the second highest ranking villain on this poll after Ledger's Joker; http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=470861&highlight=villain

Any dislike for him is a minority. With both the fan community and the public.

and it was a major loss.. TDKR was a terrible film

To you. It was not a major loss in any factual way. It was a huge critical and financial success, and well received with fans and audiences. That is a fact.

 

[ThePhantasm]

Someone sound the alarm! A person posted that they don't like TDKR! We must rush here to inform them that that's just, you know, their opinion, man!

Anywho, back to Spidey. Have we heard any more about those Kraven rumors?

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Where? Here? I don't see it. For example he's the second highest ranking villain on this poll after Ledger's Joker; http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=470861&highlight=villain



To you. It was not a major loss in any factual way. It was a huge critical and financial success, and well received with fans and audiences.

lol i care not about polls... i don't necissarily think they're accurate.. i know many like myself with this opinion wouldn't even of been in that thread to cast a poll vote...

but i was in the forums when the movie came out.. and the place was almost as bad as the F4 reboot forums... it was a mad house.

 

[Slade W]

I must be the only person who considers Neeson's Ra's to have been the best villain of the trilogy. I thought Ra's, Joker and Bane were all excellent villains though and I loved how all of them were portrayed.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

but thanks for the link! just voted. (Also, yeah ... multiple choice polls i don't feel are all that accurate because you don't get to choose who's better (one from the other)

 

[The Joker]

lol i care not about polls... i don't necissarily think they're accurate.. i know many like myself with this opinion wouldn't even of been in that thread to cast a poll vote...

Whether you care about polls or not is not the point, the fact is they show popularity of things on message boards, which is where you claim you saw a divide. Of which there is none. I mean I can show more polls if you want just to further prove this point. I think you're just confusing loud minorities as a divide.

but i was in the forums when the movie came out.. and the place was almost as bad as the F4 reboot forums... it was a mad house.

I was there, too. It wasn't anything like the F4 forums. Not even close.

Bane was very much loved back then, too. Here's a thread made just after the movie came out, and again he won 2nd place to the Joker; http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=389341&highlight=best

So any notion there was a division on him, whether it's on message boards, or with the public, is totally untrue.

I say that as someone who had his share of problems with Rises, but I'm not going to deny reality.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

I must be the only person who considers Neeson's Ra's to have been the best villain of the trilogy. I thought Ra's, Joker and Bane were all excellent villains though and I loved how all of them were portrayed.

ill consider this on topic since i think Batman and Spidey's rogues share alot in common... but... id rank them as this ... in the nolan trilogy

- Joker
- Scarecrow
- Ra's
- Catwoman
- Two-Face
- Bane
- Zsasz
- Talia

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Whether you care about polls or not is not the point, the fact is they show popularity of things on message boards, which is where you claim you saw a divide. Of which there is none. I mean I can show more polls if you want just to further prove this point. I think you're just confusing loud minorities as a divide.



I was there, too. It wasn't anything like the F4 forums. Not even close.

Bane was very much loved back then, too. Here's a thread made just after the movie came out, and again he won 2nd place to the Joker; http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=389341&highlight=best

So any notion there was a division on him, whether it's on message boards, or with the public, is totally untrue.

I say that as someone who had his share of problems with Rises, but I'm not going to deny reality.

joker, honey... there's been long ongoing jokes about that bat boards on the hype from the chaos that was "the bat boards"... i want whatever rose tented lenses you were wearing... im sure some mods could share their horror stories

 

[ThePhantasm]

What's funny is he thinks that poll discounts a divide... it doesn't. It says is that out of 229 people polled, 108 like Bane. (Remember it is multiple choice so he doesn't even have to be THE favorite to warrant a vote)

That's less than half of the people polled. Clearly what you'd call a divide.

 

[The Joker]

joker, honey... there's been long ongoing jokes about that bat boards on the hype from the chaos that was "the bat boards"... i want whatever rose tented lenses you were wearing... im sure some mods could share their horror stories

Are you talking about the Bat boards in general, because it sounds more like the Batman vs Superman forums you're talking about there, or specifically when TDKR was released? Because if it's the latter then you're totally wrong. There is no horror stories or chaos from when that movie was released here.

Feel free to ask any mods to chime in on that, or provide any kind of proof for that matter. Most of the TDKR threads from 2012 are still intact in the archives. For example does that villain thread I linked you to look like it was chaos, since Bane was according you such a source of division among fans? Rhetorical question, I know it's not. Nor were most of the threads. Did flame wars break out? Of course. No more than the Spidey or Marvel boards when a new movie comes out.

 

[Slade W]

ill consider this on topic since i think Batman and Spidey's rogues share alot in common... but... id rank them as this ... in the nolan trilogy

- Joker
- Scarecrow
- Ra's
- Catwoman
- Two-Face
- Bane
- Zsasz
- Talia

For me it is

Ra's
Joker
Bane
Catwoman ( I don't really consider her to be as much of a villain as the others but if I am ranking her in terms of how much I enjoyed her character compared to the others,then here is where I would place her)
Talia
Scarecrow
Two-Face
Falcone

Now to make this post relevant to the thread. So, who do you guys think should be the villain in Spiderman (2017)?

 

[ThePhantasm]

Now to make this post relevant to the thread. So, who do you guys think should be the villain in Spiderman (2017)?

For me its still Ock.

(yeah, I know what Marvel said about previously used villains...)

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Are you talking about the Bat boards in general, because it sounds more like the Batman vs Superman forums you're talking about there, or specifically when TDKR was released? Because if it's the latter then you're totally wrong. There is no horror stories or chaos from when that movie was released here.

Feel free to ask any mods to chime in on that, or provide any kind of proof for that matter. Most of the TDKR threads from 2012 are still intact in the archives. For example does that villain thread I linked you to look like it was chaos, since Bane was according you such a source of division among fans? Rhetorical question, I know it's not. Nor were most of the threads. Did flame wars break out? Of course. No more than the Spidey or Marvel boards when a new movie comes out.

... i haven't even bothered to go into the bat-boards since the mad house it was during TDKR's release... like i said, whatever you were drinking during it, i'd love some of that...

 

[spideyboy_1111]

What's funny is he thinks that poll discounts a divide... it doesn't. It says is that out of 229 people polled, 108 like Bane. (Remember it is multiple choice so he doesn't even have to be THE favorite to warrant a vote)

That's less than half of the people polled. Clearly what you'd call a divide.

nice catch

 

[ThePhantasm]

The batboards definitely had a bad rep during TDKR. They were the worst on the forum. No doubts about that.

People commented on it in the community forums all the time.

 

[The Joker]

What's funny is he thinks that poll discounts a divide... it doesn't. It says is that out of 229 people polled, 108 like Bane. (Remember it is multiple choice so he doesn't even have to be THE favorite to warrant a vote)

That's less than half of the people polled. Clearly what you'd call a divide.

He? Are you afraid to address me directly?

What difference does multiple choice make? The fact that Bane got the second highest number of votes means most people liked him. I'm not talking favorites here, because there's no doubt the favorite is the Joker. I'm talking about whether the character was liked or not.