The Defenders Who will be the villain?

If Kingpin shows up and gets taken out, it ruins the arc they have him set up for season 3. With the show runners of Daredevil show running The Defenders, I don't see The Kingpin being a huge threat other than maybe getting out of jail... But even then, I think he'll be sidelined.

Steel Serpent will probably be Iron Fist's villain and could possibly show up with the Hand. One person I don't see coming back outside of flashbacks or dream sequences is The Purple Man. He is dead. Killgrave is dead. Get over it people. Yes, he could be revived via the Hand but what would they use him for? Wouldn't he just talk his way out of being held by them? As for Blackheart and Mephisto, I don't see them coming to Netflix. The Hand has its "Beast" and it has Elektra to host/lead the group.

There's no reason The Beast couldn't be another name for a character like Blackheart or Mephisto. As for Killgrave, there's no reason the writers couldn't have The Hand or The Beast or Mepphisto or whatever be immune to his mind control, or have a form of mind control over him because their magic raised him.

Anyway, it was just a thought.
 
Wow, have to say I'm surprised you're agreeing with the popular consensus lol.




Yeah, I think it'll be the MCU version of Shadowland, with the Defender's conflict with the Hand being the war Stick was talking about. The Hand will seek to unleash the Beast in New York after obtaining the property there (like in Shadowland), and Elektra will lead the Hand ninjas. It'll take all of the street-level characters to come together and fight them.

No it won't... Spider-Man is filming in Atlanta at the same time and Moon Knight, Blade and She-Hulk didn't join the MCU yet. :p

But on a serious note, I'm getting the sense that the story that'll be used is Bendis' New Avengers story where Elektra was leading The Hand more than Shadowland.
 
There's no reason The Beast couldn't be another name for a character like Blackheart or Mephisto. As for Killgrave, there's no reason the writers couldn't have The Hand or The Beast or Mepphisto or whatever be immune to his mind control, or have a form of mind control over him because their magic raised him.

Anyway, it was just a thought.

I don't think it's Mephisto because he's more associated with Ghost Rider and it feels awkward to bring him into the MCU to fight a team of street-level heroes.
 
I don't think it's Mephisto because he's more associated with Ghost Rider and it feels awkward to bring him into the MCU to fight a team of street-level heroes.

Mephisto has fought heroes besides Ghost Rider plenty of times.

Also, Iron Fist can channel the energy of his soul into his fists in order to punch through solid steel, a power he got from killing a dragon with his bare hands, and grew up in an alternate universe. I don't think it would be weird for The Defenders to fight the devil.
 
No it won't... Spider-Man is filming in Atlanta at the same time and Moon Knight, Blade and She-Hulk didn't join the MCU yet. :p

But on a serious note, I'm getting the sense that the story that'll be used is Bendis' New Avengers story where Elektra was leading The Hand more than Shadowland.

I feel it'll be a combination of the two. Elektra leading The Hand, a la New Avengers, with the Beast/Black Sky possessing her in some way like Daredevil was in Shadowland. I'm just hoping they don't treat her like Jean Grey/Phoenix was treated in XM:TLS... I want Elektra to speak more than a few words/lines and also not die in the end.
 
Mephisto has fought heroes besides Ghost Rider plenty of times.

Also, Iron Fist can channel the energy of his soul into his fists in order to punch through solid steel, a power he got from killing a dragon with his bare hands, and grew up in an alternate universe. I don't think it would be weird for The Defenders to fight the devil.

1. Shou Lao is still alive.

2. Mephisto does have a history with Daredevil but I feel like the Netflix series are going to be shooting for a villain who's a bit more grounded and not as reliant on CGI.
 
1. Shou Lao is still alive.

2. Mephisto does have a history with Daredevil but I feel like the Netflix series are going to be shooting for a villain who's a bit more grounded and not as reliant on CGI.

Why would Mephisto be reliant on cgi? All he would require is red makeup, and that's only if you intend to give him red skin and not go the Purple Man route and have him look normal but wear red clothes.
 
please have some substantive, distinct combat-based villains with some powers/skills. Hordes of anonymous ninjas or generic henchmen only go so far in piquing my interest.
 
Since DD S3 is confirmed after Defenders. Will Kingpin be out of jail during Defenders? I think he'd make a great villain
 
Why would Mephisto be reliant on cgi? All he would require is red makeup, and that's only if you intend to give him red skin and not go the Purple Man route and have him look normal but wear red clothes.

Because his true form is massive and inhuman.

And why Mephisto when Daredevil set up Elektra to lead The Hand in the Defenders?

We also know that Harold Meachum is probably going to killed by a ninja by the end of Iron Fist so he'll have a reason to fight The Hand.

So why would Marvel use Mephisto who would be better served in a Doctor Strange sequel or a Ghost Rider reboot on The Defenders?
 
Because his true form is massive and inhuman.

And something that, traditionally, we almost never see. Mephisto usually takes the form of just a dude with red skin.

And why Mephisto when Daredevil set up Elektra to lead The Hand in the Defenders?

Because The Hand worship a great evil demonic entity, and Mepbisto is a great evil demonic entity.

So why would Marvel use Mephisto who would be better served in a Doctor Strange sequel or a Ghost Rider reboot on The Defenders?

Better is subjective. He'd be just as well served either way IMO.
 
And something that, traditionally, we almost never see. Mephisto usually takes the form of just a dude with red skin.



Because The Hand worship a great evil demonic entity, and Mepbisto is a great evil demonic entity.



Better is subjective. He'd be just as well served either way IMO.

Yeah, but why Mephisto instead of The Beast who would be more in line with the source material?

And why Mephisto over Sataanish, Shuma Gorath, Dormammu, etc?
 
Yeah, but why Mephisto instead of The Beast who would be more in line with the source material?

And why Mephisto over Sataanish, Shuma Gorath, Dormammu, etc?

No reason why Mephisto in particular. I just named a big scary demon man. Although, I's say Mephisto instead of any of those other ones because Mephisto is way more of a well known and important Marvel character than Sataanish, Mephisto, despite his Silver Surfer and Ghost Rider ties, is way more of a general purpose Marvel villain while Dormammu really is just a Dr. Strange villain, and Shuma Gorath is in fact defined by its giant inhuman form, while Mephisto can be a guy in red clothes and still be in keeping with the spirit of the character.

As for why Mephisto and not The Beast? Well, Mephisto is just an all around more important Marvel villain, and is more of a character with a personality than The Beast is. And I'm not really suggesting instead of, I'm saying that in this hypothetical scenario, they two characters would be combined into one.

And in any event, I actually think Blackheart would be a more interesting villain to combine with The Beast. He's got those daddy issues, which gives him more of a defined motivation than his father, who's just a dick.


And in any event, I'm not saying that it's what they absolutely are going to do. Just saying that it's about as plausible as anything else and would be really cool.
 
By the time the defenders roll about , Fisk would have been strengthen his position as the kingpin of new york and gotten out by then. Since most of the heroes are street level , the villain needs to be street level and Fisk has grown more powerful as we seen in DD season 2. Netflix doesn't have a huge budget so need to a villain that is feasible.
 
By the time the defenders roll about , Fisk would have been strengthen his position as the kingpin of new york and gotten out by then. Since most of the heroes are street level , the villain needs to be street level and Fisk has grown more powerful as we seen in DD season 2. Netflix doesn't have a huge budget so need to a villain that is feasible.

Elektra and the Hand with Fisk possibly factoring in from prison.
 
Elektra and the Hand with Fisk possibly factoring in from prison.

I'm all for this. Fisk needs to be more of a side-villain. He's a bad guy from behind bars and he shouldn't break loose until the final episode or Daredevil Season 3. Elektra and the hole that The Hand are digging are the biggest plot holes right now and Elektra did fight an entire team of superheroes during Bendis' New Avengers run while she was leading The Hand. Plus this would set Elektra up for her own series when she inevitably gets her soul purified and sets out to fight The Hand on their own terms in her own series.
 
I'm all for this. Fisk needs to be more of a side-villain. He's a bad guy from behind bars and he shouldn't break loose until the final episode or Daredevil Season 3. Elektra and the hole that The Hand are digging are the biggest plot holes right now and Elektra did fight an entire team of superheroes during Bendis' New Avengers run while she was leading The Hand. Plus this would set Elektra up for her own series when she inevitably gets her soul purified and sets out to fight The Hand on their own terms in her own series.

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They don't need any of that. That's why I said MCU version of Shadowland. An adaptation of the comic storyline to fit the continuity of the MCU, just like with Civil War.
And there's no way Loki or Extremis are coming to the Defenders. This is a street level team, meaning they address those type of threats. Not things the Avengers or SHIELD deal with.


Civil War in the comics was about secret identities, and yet its not about that in the movies. The same can be done for Shadowland.

And dude, it painfully obvious they're setting up for Shadowland:

-Nobu is strongly hinted at being part of the Hand (not to mention his name is similar to Hand member Kagenobu Yoshioka, which I wouldn't be surprised to find out that Marvel shortened it to prevent people from figuring it out )

-Stick mentions an upcoming war to Stone. Clearly setting up the Chaste's conflict with the Hand

-Black Sky is key here. Black Sky was shown as a young boy whom Nobu has shipped to HK. He was deemed him as a weapon of sorts. We saw that the boy was chained to the inside of the crate. Judging from the eerie supernatural vibe the child gave off; I’ve surmised that he had demonic connections. “Shadowland” deals with not only Matt controlling The Hand, but also being possessed by the demonic Beast of The Hand. This ties into if Murdock will “be ready when the gate opens”, due to the fact that the gates are probably opening for The Beast. (Not to mention Nobu tells Fisk another Black Sky is hard to get, and Stick mentions that Black Sky is not just a mere child).

-In “Shadowland”, The Hand schemes include seizing a part of the Hells’ Kitchen. In season one of Daredevil, Nobu can be seen discussing the control of numerous properties and land with Wilson Fisk. One of the blueprints include:
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The words on the map translate to Black Sky. Just like in the comics, the Hand are seeking land in New York.

-The Hand is a ninja order who have dark connections and seek to spread their darkness across the world. Having a black sky is the cause of darkness.

Now, looking to the future (how do the upcoming series feed into Shadowland):
Marvel is keeping things small with the Defenders in terms of the area they use. It seems more likely each day that they are taking Luke Cage out of Harlem and relocating him to Hell's Kitchen. Elektra is being introduced and she has ties to the Hand. Iron Fist is all about Chinese martial arts, but I am sure the K'un-L'un will have an awareness about the Hand. Colleen Wing has ties to the Hand as her own mother was part of the Hand subgroup of female warriors called the Nail. Her father Lee Wing is a professor of oriental studies, so he should have some slight knowledge of a shadowy ninja organization. And lastly, Shadowland was the big street-level event. It will take Daredevil, Jessica Jones, Luke Cage and Iron Fist to team up to take on the Hand as well as help from their allies like Punisher, Elektra, and hopefully Misty Knight and Colleen Wing.

With Nobu's name being revealed to be Nobu Yoshioka and what was shown of the Hand and their plans in Season 2, I'd say my predictions from way earlier in this thread were pretty close :woot:
 
It's prolly gonna be Elektra and the Hand.
 
It better be. I don't think Daredevil needs another "Hand" focused season. It'll also cause conflict within the group as some might not have issues with killing but he does, especially when it's someone he loved leading the group.

I just hope she doesn't have to die again, and that she gets out of the Hand and helps take them down in the final episode.
 
It better be. I don't think Daredevil needs another "Hand" focused season. It'll also cause conflict within the group as some might not have issues with killing but he does, especially when it's someone he loved leading the group.

I just hope she doesn't have to die again, and that she gets out of the Hand and helps take them down in the final episode.

I think the group will compromise to try and reason with her but if they cant in the end then take her down as a back up plan.
 
I suspect "reason" won't even be an issue. Once restored by the Hand, she'll be the proverbial Brainwashed and Crazy. The focus will be more "figure out a way to break the Hand's control on her". I also wouldn't be shocked if the "we could just kill her" angle is mooted by "we tried, we can't", due to the Black Sky/Shadowland mystical stuff going on.
 
I jus can't wait to see Luke, DD, Jessica and IF together. And whoever else they decide to put on the team. It's gonna be a dream come true.
 
I suspect "reason" won't even be an issue. Once restored by the Hand, she'll be the proverbial Brainwashed and Crazy. The focus will be more "figure out a way to break the Hand's control on her". I also wouldn't be shocked if the "we could just kill her" angle is mooted by "we tried, we can't", due to the Black Sky/Shadowland mystical stuff going on.

Plus, of the two shows we've seen we know Matt has a "no kill" rule and Jessica spends her whole season desperately trying to figure out a nonlethal way to take out the guy who destroyed her life. Killing someone is so against Jessica's nature it manages to shake her out of mind control. And I can't imagine Elektra being the person Matt is willing to bend his murder code for. There is just no way those two go with a kill plan.
 
Plus, of the two shows we've seen we know Matt has a "no kill" rule and Jessica spends her whole season desperately trying to figure out a nonlethal way to take out the guy who destroyed her life. Killing someone is so against Jessica's nature it manages to shake her out of mind control. And I can't imagine Elektra being the person Matt is willing to bend his murder code for. There is just no way those two go with a kill plan.

I agree. I also feel like after Luke was framed for a murder that he didn't commit, that he'd be the last person to just randomly kill Elektra after clearing his name. I also don't feel like Iron Fist is the type to ever intentionally kill somebody. He only uses the full power of the Iron Fist on somebody who can take the hit. Colleen Wing is an archaeologist in addition to a martial artist and she holds a respectable enough day job that that wouldn't ever kill anyone even in self-defense because her reputation would never recover. Misty Knight is willing to use lethal force but only as a last resort. If she's explicitly ordered to not kill somebody, she won't.

Punisher is the loose cannon here. He'd be willing to oppose the Defenders to kill Elektra and fight on his own side. The Hand would be the main antagonists but Punisher would function as a secondary antagonist.

And it looks like the MCU are replacing The Beast with Mephisto as leader of The Hand. Partially since The Beast seldom appears in person in the comics in his true form. Partially since Doctor Strange is also rumored to appear. Partially since it's to set up Ghost Rider in the MCU. You were totally right about Mephisto appearing.
 

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