Superman Returns With SR's dissapointing Box Office, is the "Geek Golden Age" over?

[Super Kal]

The suit wasn't changed more than Batman's suit, X-Men's suits, etc. But you didn't like it so... bad change.

in the color department, yes it was changed.

 

[El Payaso]

Oh yes. Better colors.

 

[Super Kal]

it was changed for the sake of changing because Donner colors are no longer considered in...

 

[Freddy_Krueger]

it was changed for the sake of changing because Donner colors are no longer considered in...

It was changed to meet the tone of the film. A sadder film equals darker filters, darker colors, etc. It's Film 101.

 

[Super Kal]

It was changed to meet the tone of the film. A sadder film equals darker filters, darker colors, etc. It's Film 101.

true, but Superman is not an overall sad superhero... he's an uplifting character full of hope and ideals, and even if the world around him is dull, dark, drab, and depressing, the colors he wears should reflect what he stands for... they shouldn't echo the darkness and depression of the world around him.

 

[LL2K2]

some of the same people who worship the film on here say the same thing about those who don't like it...

those of us who didn't like the film are just as much as any other Superman fan who like SR.

That's what I was trying to say. And as I said, you can't please everyone.

 

[El Payaso]

true, but Superman is not an overall sad superhero... he's an uplifting character full of hope and ideals, and even if the world around him is dull, dark, drab, and depressing, the colors he wears should reflect what he stands for... they shouldn't echo the darkness and depression of the world around him.

Not the depression of the world but his own sad feelings because, yes, as you see Superman as a 1-dimensional character, he can also have bad moments like everybody else, heros, villiains, taxi drivers or emperors. That's why I think another dimension apart from the only one you care for, seems to disturb you.

 

[Dr. Fate]

true, but Superman is not an overall sad superhero... he's an uplifting character full of hope and ideals, and even if the world around him is dull, dark, drab, and depressing, the colors he wears should reflect what he stands for... they shouldn't echo the darkness and depression of the world around him.

You are correct sir.

 

[Super Kal]

Not the depression of the world but his own sad feelings because, yes, as you see Superman as a 1-dimensional character, he can also have bad moments like everybody else, heros, villiains, taxi drivers or emperors. That's why I think another dimension apart from the only one you care for, seems to disturb you.

Even if Superman is sad, his suit should never never reflect his inward emotions. That's not what the suit is about... his suit is about hope, truth, and a positive outlook on life, and if Superman can't express a positive outlook on life, his suit should at least reflect it.

I don't know where you're getting this 1 dimensional crap, because I don't see him as that.

 

[Showtime]

Even if Superman is sad, his suit should never never reflect his inward emotions. That's not what the suit is about... his suit is about hope, truth, and a positive outlook on life, and if Superman can't express a positive outlook on life, his suit should at least reflect it.

I don't know where you're getting this 1 dimensional crap, because I don't see him as that.

I think they were trying to make Superman more of a multi-dimensional character. Forget comic books, forget any other type of media besides the first two Reeve films. This was the Superman they were continuing from, this Superman was multi-dimensional, he made mistakes. Becoming human for the love of a human being, turning back time and changing events in the world. This is a humanized version of Superman and has been through the course of the Donner movies. He is humanized because he was "raised as a human being".

His outlook on life has nothing to do with his suit, the colors on his suit are irrelevant to his outlook on life. Singer went with a darker pallette to fit with the mood and tone of Metropolis, the mood and tone of the movie. He wanted a more vintage look sighting the 40's and Fleischer as a backdrop. Did he get the exact colors of the Fleischer cartoon, no but that was his aim. That era, that vintage feel. There was a method behind the madness. Did everybody agree with it? No, but I wouldn't want the Reeve suit at this point either. It's hit or miss, and he missed with some people.

Superman leads by example but at the same time, he has flaws, and Singer tried to capitalize on the humanism of Superman that was laid down by everybody's Donner. This is Donner's Superman, whether you like it or not, not Singers. These people that rip Returns must not like STM or Superman: The Donner Cut, because Reeve doesn't follow the characteristics of Superman right?

When Superman saved the plane, saved Metropolis from the earthquakes, and sacrificed himself to save the world he loves by laucning NK into space, this is what Superman is about. It doesn't matter if his suit is the Pod Suit, The Black Suit, The Kingdom Come Suit, the Fleischer Suit, the Classic Suit, the Returns Suit.

 

[Super Kal]

I think they were trying to make Superman more of a multi-dimensional character. Forget comic books, forget any other type of media besides the first two Reeve films. This was the Superman they were continuing from, this Superman was multi-dimensional, he made mistakes. Becoming human for the love of a human being, turning back time and changing events in the world. This is a humanized version of Superman and has been through the course of the Donner movies. He is humanized because he was "raised as a human being".

His outlook on life has nothing to do with his suit, the colors on his suit are irrelevant to his outlook on life. Singer went with a darker palette to fit with the mood and tone of Metropolis, the mood and tone of the movie. He wanted a more vintage look sighting the 40's and Fleischer as a backdrop. Did he get the exact colors of the Fleischer cartoon, no but that was his aim. That era, that vintage feel. There was a method behind the madness. Did everybody agree with it? No, but I wouldn't want the Reeve suit at this point either. It's hit or miss, and he missed with some people.

Superman leads by example but at the same time, he has flaws, and Singer tried to capitalize on the humanism of Superman that was laid down by everybody's Donner. This is Donner's Superman, whether you like it or not, not Singers. These people that rip Returns must not like STM or Superman: The Donner Cut, because Reeve doesn't follow the characteristics of Superman right?

When Superman saved the plane, saved Metropolis from the earthquakes, and sacrificed himself to save the world he loves by laucning NK into space, this is what Superman is about. It doesn't matter if his suit is the Pod Suit, The Black Suit, The Kingdom Come Suit, the Fleischer Suit, the Classic Suit, the Returns Suit.

I can understand making Superman more human and making mistakes from time to time... I'm not saying not to. In fact, I support it. I like that look af Superman.

as with the suit, I just plainly disagree.

as with the whole Donner thing, I guess some people went in think that they would see the same overly positive feel Donner gave to his feel... and that wasn't there... the one liners didn't help either.

 

[buggs0268]

I think they were trying to make Superman more of a multi-dimensional character. Forget comic books, forget any other type of media besides the first two Reeve films. This was the Superman they were continuing from, this Superman was multi-dimensional, he made mistakes. Becoming human for the love of a human being, turning back time and changing events in the world. This is a humanized version of Superman and has been through the course of the Donner movies. He is humanized because he was "raised as a human being".

His outlook on life has nothing to do with his suit, the colors on his suit are irrelevant to his outlook on life. Singer went with a darker pallette to fit with the mood and tone of Metropolis, the mood and tone of the movie. He wanted a more vintage look sighting the 40's and Fleischer as a backdrop. Did he get the exact colors of the Fleischer cartoon, no but that was his aim. That era, that vintage feel. There was a method behind the madness. Did everybody agree with it? No, but I wouldn't want the Reeve suit at this point either. It's hit or miss, and he missed with some people.

Superman leads by example but at the same time, he has flaws, and Singer tried to capitalize on the humanism of Superman that was laid down by everybody's Donner. This is Donner's Superman, whether you like it or not, not Singers. These people that rip Returns must not like STM or Superman: The Donner Cut, because Reeve doesn't follow the characteristics of Superman right?

When Superman saved the plane, saved Metropolis from the earthquakes, and sacrificed himself to save the world he loves by laucning NK into space, this is what Superman is about. It doesn't matter if his suit is the Pod Suit, The Black Suit, The Kingdom Come Suit, the Fleischer Suit, the Classic Suit, the Returns Suit.

I think Singer had one idea. Like I said, when Spacey was cast, or just before, he was on a clip on either Accesss Hollywood or ET saying something like:

"Well, I am happy for him. He has been telling everyone who would listen on every one of his sets I have been on about his idea for a sequel to Superman 2" I watched it on TV so I know it happened.

So he had one idea. Since Supes and Lois had sex in the FOS in S2, it was for a kid to be produced because of that. The only conclusion. Probably said something like:

"Well they had un-protected sex, so naturally they would have had a kid from it. Blah, blah, blah."

So that was his idea. And it ended up not being a good one.

 

[Showtime]

I think Singer had one idea. Like I said, when Spacey was cast, or just before, he was on a clip on either Accesss Hollywood or ET saying something like:

"Well, I am happy for him. He has been telling everyone who would listen on every one of his sets I have been on about his idea for a sequel to Superman 2" I watched it on TV so I know it happened.

So he had one idea. Since Supes and Lois had sex in the FOS in S2, it was for a kid to be produced because of that. The only conclusion. Probably said something like:

"Well they had un-protected sex, so naturally they would have had a kid from it. Blah, blah, blah."

So that was his idea. And it ended up not being a good one.

What does it matter if that happened, that was the backbone of the emotional conflict not the entire story arc? Who disputed that it was said? The problem is you don't know if the idea was the kid or him returning after 5 years and Lois and company have moved on. You're just speculating. That's not the only conclusion, that's your speculation.

It ended up being not a good idea to you, and probably half the people on the boards. Opinion is not fact.

 

[dark_b]

i still dont think that the suit was darker because he was sad. what some here mean is that because of the filters that they used the suit got darker. so they used filters. the suit on the set was in noooooo way to dark IMO. i mean if hte suit on the set would look like in hte movie than i would get it. but no no no .

 

[Showtime]

I can understand making Superman more human and making mistakes from time to time... I'm not saying not to. In fact, I support it. I like that look af Superman.

as with the suit, I just plainly disagree.

as with the whole Donner thing, I guess some people went in think that they would see the same overly positive feel Donner gave to his feel... and that wasn't there... the one liners didn't help either.

I am not worried about the suit in a sequel, as with the Spidey movies there will be tweaks. One I assume will be the colors. I feel strongly this will not be an issue.

Again, I think the story is the most important part of a movie. I understood the colors and lighting in Returns, and why they were used. Would I have done the same thing? No I wouldn't, but this isn't my version of Superman. I have to accept that and enjoy it for what it is. That is just my thought process, not saying it is right, or yours is wrong. I can understand why others wouldn't like the suit, the kid, or the certain other aspects. I still liked the movie, but of course nothing is perfect.

 

[Showtime]

i still dont think that the suit was darker because he was sad. what some here mean is that because of the filters that they used the suit got darker. so they used filters. the suit on the set was in noooooo way to dark IMO. i mean if hte suit on the set would look like in hte movie than i would get it. but no no no .

I don't think it had anything to do with Superman's sadness either, but I think it fit with the palette. I think the suit didn't have to be as bright because the movie wasn't bright, and the backgrounds weren't bright. The suit looked spectacular in the plane sequence to me, and of course I want more of that as well.

 

[dark_b]

I don't think it had anything to do with Superman's sadness either, but I think it fit with the palette. I think the suit didn't have to be as bright because the movie wasn't bright, and the backgrounds weren't bright. The suit looked spectacular in the plane sequence to me, and of course I want more of that as well.

i didnt even had problems with the suit in the 3rd act. it fit the enviorment. it fit with everything.
first i didnt like it. now i got used to it.
i atill have big problems with this scene.

the colours personal make hell nooooooo sense. i mean i get it that he is darker because of the shadow form the plane. but hell the colours make still no sense. and i blame sony. singer was very tired that day when he said that the shot was good.
this are the colours from the set.

 

[Showtime]

I really don't know what to make of the colors changing from photo to photo and video to video. It could be filters, touch ups, different suits, who knows. I see what you mean though. Nothing was consistent.

 

[Super Kal]

I don't think it had anything to do with Superman's sadness either, but I think it fit with the palette. I think the suit didn't have to be as bright because the movie wasn't bright, and the backgrounds weren't bright. The suit looked spectacular in the plane sequence to me, and of course I want more of that as well.

that was the only time it looked good in the whole film...

 

[dark_b]

I really don't know what to make of the colors changing from photo to photo and video to video. It could be filters, touch ups, different suits, who knows. I see what you mean though. Nothing was consistent.

from photo to photo it is normal. just look on gogole at some photo albums from some people. some vacations. they took teh same photos with the same camera. but sometimes teh colours just change. but that can not happen in the movie.

i now also like the colours on the rooftop with lois. i dont know why but hte colours feel very warm and romantic.

 

[El Payaso]

Even if Superman is sad, his suit should never never reflect his inward emotions.

Which tells me how little to nothing you know about directing.

That's not what the suit is about... his suit is about hope, truth, and a positive outlook on life

Where did you get this info from? I mean, beyond what you personally believe.

and if Superman can't express a positive outlook on life, his suit should at least reflect it.

When you're directing a movie, every little detail must reflect the whole. It's not like Superman's suit is black either. Just not comic-like gaudy.

I don't know where you're getting this 1 dimensional crap, because I don't see him as that.

Then why your posts say so. "Superman can't be sad, all Superman is about is hope and joy. Even if Superman is sad, the suit can't be sad, it's hopey and joy."

 

[Manhunter]

true, but Superman is not an overall sad superhero... he's an uplifting character full of hope and ideals, and even if the world around him is dull, dark, drab, and depressing, the colors he wears should reflect what he stands for... they shouldn't echo the darkness and depression of the world around him.

Kak, the movie was a dirge, a wake for Christopher Reeve. The sad tone wasn't anything to do with the story, it was about our world. Nobody wants CR to be replaced, his performance was one of the finest ever in any movie, certainly the greatest super-hero movie. His performance validated the super-hero movie genre. Hell Raimi can't make a single spider-movie without ripping them off.

Point is, if they went with a total relaunch, they'd get backlash from us sentimental types and our kids for retconning the spirit of Reeve out of the franchise. That's why it's a requel, to pay hommage to the Reeve's legacy.

The sad colours are for Reeve's passing, like a black armband at a funeral.

It wasn't a "mistake", and it won't be the same in the sequel, now get over it. t:

 

[El Payaso]

i still dont think that the suit was darker because he was sad. what some here mean is that because of the filters that they used the suit got darker. so they used filters. the suit on the set was in noooooo way to dark IMO. i mean if hte suit on the set would look like in hte movie than i would get it. but no no no .

Of course the suit was darker because of the filters. But those filters weren't used randomly.

 

[Super Kal]

Which tells me how little to nothing you know about directing.

oh and I suppose you know everything there is to know about directing...

Where did you get this info from? I mean, beyond what you personally believe.

and where do you get your info? we can go on and on about this, but all it is is personal opinion.

When you're directing a movie, every little detail must reflect the whole. It's not like Superman's suit is black either. Just not comic-like gaudy.

since when have I said that I want gaudy and goofy colors?

Then why your posts say so. "Superman can't be sad, all Superman is about is hope and joy. Even if Superman is sad, the suit can't be sad, it's hope and joy."

I'm not saying Superman can't be sad, or angry, or down in the dumps, but the suit is NOT a mood ring... the suit is bright in comic books because he is a positive and bright character. Even when Superman himself is depressed or sad, his suit will still express his positive outlook.

that's not 1 dimensional at all...

Kak, the movie was a dirge, a wake for Christopher Reeve. The sad tone wasn't anything to do with the story, it was about our world. Nobody wants CR to be replaced, his performance was one of the finest ever in any movie, certainly the greatest super-hero movie. His performance validated the super-hero movie genre. Hell Raimi can't make a single spider-movie without ripping them off.

are you kidding me?... please, Superman comes back to earth and finds the world has moved on, Lois has a fiance, and finds out that she has a kid... I dont know about you, but that's pretty depressing.

Point is, if they went with a total relaunch, they'd get backlash from us sentimental types and our kids for retconning the spirit of Reeve out of the franchise. That's why it's a requel, to pay hommage to the Reeve's legacy.

The sad colours are for Reeve's passing, like a black armband at a funeral.

It wasn't a "mistake", and it won't be the same in the sequel, now get over it. t:

where the heck are you getting this requel stuff?... SR is not a "requel"... it's a vague sequel.

 

[Super Kal]

Of course the suit was darker because of the filters. But those filters weren't used randomly.

you're right. They weren't used randomly... they were used because BS thought a dark Superman is more uplifting than a bright Superman...