X-Men - Part 6

[psylockolussus]

Ugh Messiah Complex. That was like the beginning of the end for me buying these X-Men comics!

I think that's why I struggle with X-Men now. From when Claremont started writing with Giant-Size X-Men, everything led to the next so there was always this strong sense of history and building. That started to fall apart about the time Morrison's New X-Men was being written because there were two other X-Men books (Uncanny and X-Treme), and they were all ignoring the rest. And then after that more X-Men books came out that were ignoring what the others were doing, including characters that shared in the books. Then before long we had whole X-Men titles that play out and are canceled and never referenced again. That sense of history stopped mattering. Now we hit the point where crap happens off panel... major stuff... and it's just breezed by.

I mean, Northstar's wedding should probably have been a big deal, but outside of Astonishing, it was nothing. Elixer's recent death should have really meant something akin to Doug Ramsey's death in New Mutants, but it was a one-issue-plot point. Nate Grey's return should have been major being that he was eventually accepted as Scott and Jean's son, but it was barely a plot in a random mini and an already forgotten New Mutants title.

Too many characters... too many titles... too many writers... too fast a turn around. Other than whatever is the current "main" title... nothing else really matters.



Yeah... that irritated me too. When [blackout]Anole first lost his arm[/blackout] that was dealt with and it made it special. This was just lazy writing from an otherwise great writer.

So how many current main titles do they have now? 3 right - All New, Extraordinary and Uncanny right?

I'm still waiting for them to trim it down to two.

 

[Mike Murdock]

They have three in-continuity team books, All-New Wolverine, X-Men '92, so five not counting the whole bunch of Deadpool books. They also have significant roles for X-Men characters in Uncanny Avengers and, more importantly, New Avengers, which just had an awesome reference at the end of last issue if you're a New Mutants fan.

 

[psylockolussus]

I don't count Wolverine/Deadpool as main X-Men comics - I see them as spin-offs. While X-Men '92 is similar to X-Men: First Class right?

Anyway, they got too much characters to limit X-Men into 1 to 2 regular titles, I just wish some of the new ones would really break-out like how Emma became one of the most well known X-Men in the last decade.

And is Wikipedia right? that there hasn't been a new X-Men member since M joined?

 

[slicer4444]

So how many current main titles do they have now? 3 right - All New, Extraordinary and Uncanny right?

I'm still waiting for them to trim it down to two.

At least they don't have overlapping casts anymore. That was driving me nuts.

 

[BoredGuy]

And is Wikipedia right? that there hasn't been a new X-Men member since M joined?

Well technically, M only just joined the X-Men when the newest Uncanny run started... She's been in Gen x and X-Factor, but I don't think she's ever been a proper X-Man

So yes, factually that's correct, there haven't been any new X-men created in the last couple months

 

[Havok83]

Well technically, M only just joined the X-Men when the newest Uncanny run started... She's been in Gen x and X-Factor, but I don't think she's ever been a proper X-Man

So yes, factually that's correct, there haven't been any new X-men created in the last couple months

I think you are forgetting something

M has been an X-man for years

 

[BoredGuy]

oh, true, totally forgot that
well then I don't know what the f*** wikipedia's talking about

 

[JewishHobbit]

And thus, my complaint of meaningless books tainting X-Men history is proven.

 

[psylockolussus]

Well technically, M only just joined the X-Men when the newest Uncanny run started... She's been in Gen x and X-Factor, but I don't think she's ever been a proper X-Man

So yes, factually that's correct, there haven't been any new X-men created in the last couple months

I actually appreciate that Marvel is keeping the number down and there's no new X-Men "member" for last year and this year, but 13 for this decade is still a lot especially when the 80s/90s only had 9.

But still nothing beats the 2000s when they had at least 40 additions to the X-Men , for like every new story, there's a new member or a villain that joined the X-Men, only disappear or leave the team after 10 issues. Only Cable, Emma and maybe X23/Magik were the only ones that were really prominent additions to the X-Men. Well I don't know about Magik, she seemed pretty popular right now but I stopped reading comics after Age of X and I know comics are available online to read for free but eh, I can't seem to find an effort to read them.

 

[JewishHobbit]

Was Cable really prominant? He joined during Claremont's Revolution relaunch and faded out of it without a year or so. Then he sorta did the same thing during Carey's run. X-23 seems more of a fringe character with New X-Men (student book) and X-Force.

I'l agree on Emma and Magik, but that's about it.

 

[Havok83]

maybe he meant status/popularity? Cable and X-23 are B-listers and not like some of the random C and D listers they had join

Speaking of X-force. What is the status of Vanisher? I think I read he died a few years ago? Is that true and is he still dead? I surprisingly loved him in that book despite never caring for him. The chemistry of Yost/Kyle's roster was perfection. Wolverine, X-23, Archangel, Vanisher, Elixir, Warpath, Domino.....I miss that lineup

Unpopular opinion. Remender may have had the better written book, but I thought their team was much better

 

[BoredGuy]

it was a fun team, I especially missed Domino during Remender's run

and yeah, I think Vanisher died either during Messiah War or that event with the resurrected dead characters, I forget the name at this point
Elixir also died in UXM just recently, right? That one, I concur with JH, was some stupid off-screen bulls**t

 

[Tvar10]

Has anyone been reading X-Men '92? I loved the show and was considering picking it up but I'm not sure

 

[Specter313]

maybe he meant status/popularity? Cable and X-23 are B-listers and not like some of the random C and D listers they had join

Speaking of X-force. What is the status of Vanisher? I think I read he died a few years ago? Is that true and is he still dead? I surprisingly loved him in that book despite never caring for him. The chemistry of Yost/Kyle's roster was perfection. Wolverine, X-23, Archangel, Vanisher, Elixir, Warpath, Domino.....I miss that lineup

Unpopular opinion. Remender may have had the better written book, but I thought their team was much better

He appeared during an arc of Astonishing X-Men after that, where he was with a brainwashed group of villains made to do the bidding of a new villain for that arc.

 

[psylockolussus]

Was Cable really prominant? He joined during Claremont's Revolution relaunch and faded out of it without a year or so. Then he sorta did the same thing during Carey's run. X-23 seems more of a fringe character with New X-Men (student book) and X-Force.

I'l agree on Emma and Magik, but that's about it.

He was a big deal during the Messiah Complex trilogy story. And out of the male recruits of the 2000s, he was the most notable in my opinion.

 

[JewishHobbit]

But he wasn't an X-Man during the Messiah time period. He was just sorta there.

Regarding the male recruits of the 90s... hmm... that's a tough one. I know it's probably weird to say but I think the Xorn brothers might have the most lasting impact. The first one was an X-Man before going crazy, posing as Magneto, and killing tons of people before being beheaded (retcon continuity of course). His brother later joined and left just as quickly, but the Xorn plot still makes it's appearance here and there even now. It reached over to Avengers with the Collective arc. Heck, Xorn II is in Uncanny X-Men right now.

 

[BoredGuy]

Cannonball was a pretty big member for the X-Men starting in the late 90's too
He was on a few main X-teams and had enough prominence to become an Avenger, him and Sunspot still heavily featuring in New Avengers

 

[Havok83]

But he wasn't an X-Man during the Messiah time period. He was just sorta there.

Regarding the male recruits of the 90s... hmm... that's a tough one. I know it's probably weird to say but I think the Xorn brothers might have the most lasting impact. The first one was an X-Man before going crazy, posing as Magneto, and killing tons of people before being beheaded (retcon continuity of course). His brother later joined and left just as quickly, but the Xorn plot still makes it's appearance here and there even now. It reached over to Avengers with the Collective arc. Heck, Xorn II is in Uncanny X-Men right now.

Yeah, Cable went back to being a solo hero for the Messiah trilogy.

IDA. I think the Xorns were overall irrelevant. I never felt Xorn I really didnt do much as an X-man. He was overhyped and his biggest claim to fame was as the villian that killed Jean?

Xorn II? He did even less. I cant recall a single thing Austen did besides add him and he left not long after. Oh and BTW, Xorn was a 00 recruit, joining the team in 2001

Cannonball was a pretty big member for the X-Men starting in the late 90's too
He was on a few main X-teams and had enough prominence to become an Avenger, him and Sunspot still heavily featuring in New Avengers

90s, Gambit was probably the most notable male recruit, followed by Bishop and Cannonball.

 

[psylockolussus]

I think he meant the 00s... 90s was just a typo.

But he wasn't an X-Man during the Messiah time period. He was just sorta there.

Regarding the male recruits of the 90s... hmm... that's a tough one. I know it's probably weird to say but I think the Xorn brothers might have the most lasting impact. The first one was an X-Man before going crazy, posing as Magneto, and killing tons of people before being beheaded (retcon continuity of course). His brother later joined and left just as quickly, but the Xorn plot still makes it's appearance here and there even now. It reached over to Avengers with the Collective arc. Heck, Xorn II is in Uncanny X-Men right now.

The thing with the two Xorns is first - they didn't cross-over to the films or the cartoons or the videogames and I bet if they did, the comics would have used them more... then besides to their debut story-arc in the comics, I don't think they did much after that.

And regarding the male recruits of the 90s... Gambit/Bishop are the most prominent and managed to crossover outside of the comics (during the 90s), Forge was pretty prominent too.

I also wish if Marvel ever creates a new character for the X-Men that would eventually join the team, I just wish it is someone that doesn't have decades of history... what I noticed is a lot of recruits from the 2000s and 2010s, were either a villain before, or was part of a splinter team (Generation X/New Mutants/X-Force/X-Factor) or the X-Men already interacted with them a long time ago.

I also want a new X-Men male member that could be as popular as Iceman, Nightcrawler, Angel, Colossus and Gambit. Cable's pretty popular but I see him more of a X-Force character than X-Men. While Gambit was introduced in the early 90s... so its been a long time since the X-Men had a new popular guy on the team. LIke they always use the ones that are already popular for decades and the new ones always seem disposable and irreplaceable. So if it was up to me, I would introduce someone new to the team, and that guy will be a regular member of the team for years, build him up for years and be a big part of big events in the comics and eventually, Fox would use that characters in a X-Men movie. I thought Hope Summers had a big chance for that (though she was so Jean 2.0 for me), but she just disappeared in the main titles after she got her own series.

 

[javi1024]

So how many current main titles do they have now? 3 right - All New, Extraordinary and Uncanny right?

I'm still waiting for them to trim it down to two.

I almost don't count Uncanny X-Men as a main title. The book's agenda feels so much like an X-Force title I don't consider that team "X-Men". And All-New is totally separate from the Extraordinary roster, they're pretty much their own splinter X-Men. So as far as I'm concerned Extraordinary is the only actual X-Men team currently in Marvel right now.

 

[Mike Murdock]

That's an odd definition. X-Force, X-Factor, New Mutants type books all count as X-Books. Why would you need more than one actual X-Men team? It seems having each team be different is a good thing, not something to dismiss everything but one.

 

[JewishHobbit]

I think he meant the 00s... 90s was just a typo.

Yeah, my bad. I meant 00s.

The thing with the two Xorns is first - they didn't cross-over to the films or the cartoons or the videogames and I bet if they did, the comics would have used them more... then besides to their debut story-arc in the comics, I don't think they did much after that.

I didn't pick the Xorns because of how relevant they were as much as because no other male was MORE relevant. I'm starting to question myself on that though. Juggernaut had the same amount of exposure as Xorn in Austen's run, so they MIGHT be tied... though Juggy's time has since been ignored as having never really happened, whereas Xorn's influence is still being dealt with hit and miss (currently in Uncanny X-Men).

The one that makes me think I was wrong though is Northstar. He's actually joined the team 3 times in the 00s (or maybe late 90s?) during Eve of Destruction, Chuck Austen's run, and Mike Carey's run. The thing though is that he was always a side character appearing in a lower tier X-Book. His biggest was probably Austen's Uncanny though he was quickly moved to a background character there, but then he joined in Carey's X-Men book behind Whedon's Astonishing and Brubaker's Uncanny. Then he was moved to Liu's Astonishing X-Men where he got some prominant time due to his marriage, but even that was what... a 4th tier X-Book?

But still... he might be the most prominant new male X-Men character of the 00s (though not an actual new character).

And regarding the male recruits of the 90s... Gambit/Bishop are the most prominent and managed to crossover outside of the comics (during the 90s), Forge was pretty prominent too.

I also wish if Marvel ever creates a new character for the X-Men that would eventually join the team, I just wish it is someone that doesn't have decades of history... what I noticed is a lot of recruits from the 2000s and 2010s, were either a villain before, or was part of a splinter team (Generation X/New Mutants/X-Force/X-Factor) or the X-Men already interacted with them a long time ago.

I also want a new X-Men male member that could be as popular as Iceman, Nightcrawler, Angel, Colossus and Gambit. Cable's pretty popular but I see him more of a X-Force character than X-Men. While Gambit was introduced in the early 90s... so its been a long time since the X-Men had a new popular guy on the team. LIke they always use the ones that are already popular for decades and the new ones always seem disposable and irreplaceable. So if it was up to me, I would introduce someone new to the team, and that guy will be a regular member of the team for years, build him up for years and be a big part of big events in the comics and eventually, Fox would use that characters in a X-Men movie. I thought Hope Summers had a big chance for that (though she was so Jean 2.0 for me), but she just disappeared in the main titles after she got her own series.

I agree on all of this (save Hope Summers... I never felt she had a future). There really hasn't been an interesting new X-Man since Bishop in the early 90s. Xorn was probably the closest attempt during Morrison's New X-Men run, but the rug was pulled out of that when he was revealed to be Magneto. The retcon of it NOT being Magneto came too late and Xorn faded away as a gimick character.

Do you know who I think could have rose like Gambit and Bishop did in the 90s? Hellion. He was a dude with a bad attitude that started showing some major leadership and heroic traits during Kyle and Yost's run. He showed potential to become the next Cyclops/Cannonball type of character... but that faded as soon as Kyle and Yost left.

 

[Havok83]

I loved Hellion. Too bad the writers didnt. He along with Elixir, and X-23 were the only ones from the New X-men bunch I thought had real potential to be mainstays and only X-23 has really flourished

 

[BoredGuy]

Ideally tho

I would love it if the O5 were kicked back to their own damn time
and replaced by:

Hellion, Rockslide, Anole, Quentin Quire, Genesis, Idie, X-23, and Broo

 

[Havok83]

I have a hate for that gen of kids overall, so I say no.