Sequels X-Men Reboot

[ehh]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Fox currently has 3 timelines, not counting Daredevil or the F4 movies:

1. First Class/DOFP/Apocalypse
2. DOFP/Logan
3. Deadpool

Is that correct? I can never keep up with how messy this franchise is.

If they are serious about the reboot and are not going to make a deal with Marvel, they should start fresh with the X-Men and utilize the Deadpool timeline. That means no returning actors. No baggage carried over from any of the previous films. Just do it fresh and build off of what we have from Deadpool.

And Deadpool can easily make fun of the whole situation: "Wolverine, you were so much hotter when played by Hugh Jackman. Didn't you used to be taller?!"

The nice thing about the Deadpool timeline is that the X-Men are already established as a team. So you can get the ball rolling and skip all the origins of how Professor X got the team together (i.e. First Class) and get right to the good stuff.

 

[MadVillainy]

People keep saying "smaller scale" story.

If they go smaller scale they're going to get even more lost in the shuffle. People expect spectacle now. Certain characters can get away with it, but a team X-Men film I think needs to deliver on spectacle as well as story.

 

[GuestStar2004]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Fox currently has 3 timelines, not counting Daredevil or the F4 movies:

1. First Class/DOFP/Apocalypse
2. DOFP/Logan
3. Deadpool

Is that correct? I can never keep up with how messy this franchise is.

No chances are the deadpool timeline is the timeline created at the end of DOFP.

So any films produced since DOFP will be in that timeline created by DOFP.

If they are serious about the reboot and are not going to make a deal with Marvel, they should start fresh with the X-Men and utilize the Deadpool timeline. That means no returning actors. No baggage carried over from any of the previous films. Just do it fresh and build off of what we have from deadpool.

Chances are the reboot talk wasn't a real thing in the first place

 

[Frodo]

People keep saying "smaller scale" story.

If they go smaller scale they're going to get even more lost in the shuffle. People expect spectacle now. Certain characters can get away with it, but a team X-Men film I think needs to deliver on spectacle as well as story.

That assumes smaller scale stories can't have spectacle which isn't the case. You can have both. When i'm talking about "smaller scale" film, i'm talking about not having to have the story be about time travel, Ancient beings, alien conflicts, the end of the galaxy, turning humans to mutants or visa versa etc.

These characters are mutants with amazing abilities so you're going have spectacle with them regardless of whether the story is small or epic. What audiences have latched on in this era of film and tv are the characters and the stories not just the spectacle. A series that's been around 16 years needs to deliver on much more than spectacle. They need to have a reason to care about these characters and go to the theater beyond seeing the same old same old.

 

[ehh]

No chances are the deadpool timeline is the timeline created at the end of DOFP.

So any films produced since DOFP will be in that timeline created by DOFP.

But Deadpool has his a completely different Colossus. Of course this is me trying to rationalize the large amounts of continuity errors within the franchise. I think the Deadpool film should be the grounds for a brand new timeline/reboot.

Chances are the reboot talk wasn't a real thing in the first place

That's upsetting. Especially with Hugh Jackman on the edge of retirement from Wolverine (apparently). This is their chance to really clean things up.

 

[ehh]

That assumes smaller scale stories can't have spectacle which isn't the case. You can have both. When i'm talking about "smaller scale" film, i'm talking about not having to have the story be about time travel, Ancient beings, alien conflicts, the end of the galaxy, turning humans to mutants or visa versa etc.

These characters are mutants with amazing abilities so you're going have spectacle with them regardless of whether the story is small or epic. What audiences have latched on in this era of film and tv are the characters and the stories not just the spectacle. A series that's been around 16 years needs to deliver on much more than spectacle. They need to have a reason to care about these characters and go to the theater beyond seeing the same old same old.

I consider Deadpool to be a 'small scale' movie and look at that film received a lot of praise. Not ever superhero film needs to be an Avengers scale movie.

 

[MadVillainy]

That assumes smaller scale stories can't have spectacle which isn't the case. You can have both. When i'm talking about "smaller scale" film, i'm talking about not having to have the story be about time travel, Ancient beings, alien conflicts, the end of the galaxy, turning humans to mutants or visa versa etc.

These characters are mutants with amazing abilities so you're going have spectacle with them regardless of whether the story is small or epic. What audiences have latched on in this era of film and tv are the characters and the stories not just the spectacle. A series that's been around 16 years needs to deliver on much more than spectacle. They need to have a reason to care about these characters and go to the theater beyond seeing the same old same old.

Well smaller scale by definition means the movie is smaller in scale which would mean more reserved action.
I get what youre saying now and I agree, but it wasn't clear with that term

 

[GuestStar2004]

Any movie they make will have to have a hook, which if probably why dark Phoenix is attractive.

And while you could say deadpool was a small movie, yeah it was his origins story but the next one they will liking be stepping up by bringing in cable, even singer was going to add a end credit scene for deadpool to set up a character but couldn't because he didn't have the costume they wanted to use or something.

 

[ehh]

Any movie they make will have to have a hook, which if probably why dark Phoenix is attractive.

And while you could say deadpool was a small movie, yeah it was his origins story but the next one they will liking be stepping up by bringing in cable, even singer was going to add a end credit scene for deadpool to set up a character but couldn't because he didn't have the costume they wanted to use or something.

Which if funny because I find the X-Men costumes in 'Deadpool' to be superior to the costumes in any of the actual X-Men movies.

 

[x-er]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Fox currently has 3 timelines, not counting Daredevil or the F4 movies:

1. First Class/DOFP/Apocalypse
2. DOFP/Logan
3. Deadpool

Is that correct? I can never keep up with how messy this franchise is.

If they are serious about the reboot and are not going to make a deal with Marvel, they should start fresh with the X-Men and utilize the Deadpool timeline. That means no returning actors. No baggage carried over from any of the previous films. Just do it fresh and build off of what we have from Deadpool.

And Deadpool can easily make fun of the whole situation: "Wolverine, you were so much hotter when played by Hugh Jackman. Didn't you use to be taller?!"

The nice thing about the Deadpool timeline is that the X-Men are already established as a team. So you can get the ball rolling and skip all the origins of how Professor X got the team together (i.e. First Class) and get right to the good stuff.

that would be the funniest joke ever
i kinda like that idea

 

[x-er]

Which if funny because I find the X-Men costumes in 'Deadpool' to be superior to the costumes in any of the actual X-Men movies.

which is odd because the budgets are shockingly disparate. Deadpool 58M, X:A 178M. I guess it comes down to the team behind it.
Deadpool in general is made by people with a much fresher take on CB movies and I agree, their costumes were spot on.

 

[GuestStar2004]

The colossus costume was basically the X3 outfit with a couple of differences

 

[rockman1216]

An X-MEN Reboot will probably happen, they already did the time travel plot, and Logan looks like it's set in a post Apocalyptic future, so unless Deadpool 2 takes place after Logan which I severely doubt, heck I don't even think that Deadpool even takes place in the DOFP timeline due to the simple fact that Deadpool would have been too old before Weapon X, and it doesn't seem like mutants are a known species yes to hear people utter the word, but those are people who are affiliated with Weapon X, when Angel Dust was holding up Weasel in the bar no one uttered the word mutant, and the events on where it takes place are pretty vague bad place Deadpool would fit better in the MCU with all things considered. It doesn't seem to tie in at all with the X-MEN timeline and things in it that appear to can easily be explained to why they don't ie. the mansion blowing up which could be a reference to Apocalypse, or it could be a reference to a time where the mansion blew up, and Deadpool's timeline joke, it's just a meta reference. On a side note Legion seems to be vague about which universe it takes place in as well, nothing about it states that it takes place in the X-MEN DOFP timeline, we also see a group of government guys knowing about mutants and David himself, but none of the inmates.

Here is what I think is going on, Legion and Deadpool are apart of the same universe separate from all the other X-MEN movies, so they can start their own new continuity, but I feel like the reason they are keeping it vague is because a deal with Marvel and Fox is on the cards, and both know that if a deal were to happen and if they were too heavily tied to the other X-MEN properties, they too will be ended. I think it's going to be like this Marvel will get the Fantastic Four back from Fox that's a given, however I think the X-MEN will determine if Spidey:Homecoming does well, if it does Legion and Deadpool will be added into MCU canon, and a new X-MEN franchise will be born from it. The MCU will probably treat the mutants as they did with the Ghost Riders, there, but nothing relevant has happened to show them.

 

[ehh]

Remember what happened right before the Marvel Spider-Man deal? Sony kept giving us vague ideas for future films: well there is going to be an Amazing Spider-Man 3, but actually we are going to make a Sinister Six movie. Oh, and the Sinister Six film doesn't really take place in the same timeline as the Amazing Spider-Man films, but instead will be it's own movie. And now TASM3 comes out in 2018 and we are going to start making spin off movies.

Then we had those email leaks which gave us confirmation that the studio had no idea of what to do with Spider-Man. I don't know if the deal would have happened if not for the leaks, but Spider-Man ended up in the MCU and we have a solid plan for him now (despite Sony still talking about those spin-offs).

Until that announcement was made, Sony had the Sinister Six film locked in for November 2017. We would be seeing that film right about now! It was essentially a backup plan in case the MCU deal failed. So if a Fox/Marvel deal IS in the works, they're probably doing something similar. Playing it safe and having a backup plan in case something doesn't work out.

 

[GuestStar2004]

Logan looks like it's set in a post Apocalyptic future

I don't think its meant to be apocalyptic, just abit darker.

so unless Deadpool 2 takes place after Logan which I severely doubt

Truth be told he could still be around in the logan setting, presumably he has slow aging thanks to what they did to him.

heck I don't even think that Deadpool even takes place in the DOFP timeline due to the simple fact that Deadpool would have been too old before Weapon X

I don't quite get that logic

and it doesn't seem like mutants are a known species yes to hear people utter the word, but those are people who are affiliated with Weapon X,

Well the X-Men exist so we can assume that at some point someone see this big giant metal guy walking around openingly right?

Here is what I think is going on, Legion and Deadpool are apart of the same universe separate from all the other X-MEN movies, so they can start their own new continuity, but I feel like the reason they are keeping it vague is because a deal with Marvel and Fox is on the cards, and both know that if a deal were to happen and if they were too heavily tied to the other X-MEN properties, they too will be ended. I think it's going to be like this Marvel will get the Fantastic Four back from Fox that's a given, however I think the X-MEN will determine if Spidey:Homecoming does well, if it does Legion and Deadpool will be added into MCU canon, and a new X-MEN franchise will be born from it. The MCU will probably treat the mutants as they did with the Ghost Riders, there, but nothing relevant has happened to show them.

The difference between FOX and Sony is that sony was struggling financially and they also didn't have as many characters as FOX does, thats why some of the spin offs ideas were abit silly like the sinister 6,

Sony and marvel still have to talk about how marvel are allowed to use spidey, its not a case of marvel just saying we are using him for this or any of the other spider-man characters and thats it.

Now With Fox they ain't in financial trouble and they also own a dozen and one X-Men characters that they would have to talk through everyone of them and any potential spin offs with marvel, including deadpool just to keep the MCU in good order

So why would FOX do that?

 

[GuestStar2004]

Remember what happened right before the Marvel Spider-Man deal? Sony kept giving us vague ideas for future films: well there is going to be an Amazing Spider-Man 3, but actually we are going to make a Sinister Six movie. Oh, and the Sinister Six film doesn't really take place in the same timeline as the Amazing Spider-Man films, but instead will be it's own movie. And now TASM3 comes out in 2018 and we are going to start making spin off movies.

And sony also had financial issues, if sony had deadpool you could bet they wouldn't have made this deal with marvel.

People are trying to make the sony situation seem the same as the FOX situation but FOX have shown no desperation with this series, at least none i can see, SONY were desperate and thats why they made stupid decisions with Spider-man.

Fox are definitely not desperate.

 

[ehh]

Yeah, Sony and Fox are not in the same boat. I think if anything were to happen between Fox and Marvel, it would be with Fantastic 4, and they would probably just sell the rights back or let them expire.

Or they will be spiteful and release another reboot right before the 7 years are up to retain the rights again. Who the bad place knows.

 

[rockman1216]

I don't think its meant to be apocalyptic, just abit darker.
The mutant race is almost wiped out so apocalyptic


Truth be told he could still be around in the logan setting, presumably he has slow aging thanks to what they did to him.



I don't quite get that logic
X-MEN Origins Wolverine is still somewhat canon, their aging doesn't change, Deadpool was in his 20s in 1972(lets say 25), so he would have been in his 50s-60s before he went through the Weapon X program.


Well the X-Men exist so we can assume that at some point someone see this big giant metal guy walking around openingly right?
Colossus probably wasn't walking openly, remember when he appeared to Deadpool the road was blocked, and the police were in a deadlock, the only person that saw Colossus was Dophinder and he probably didn't know what to think of him, at best he could have saw him as Enhanced not mutant, because if he saw him as mutant he would have been scared, but then again he saw Deadpool in costume, so he probably assumed that Colossus was doing the same. The other time Colossus is walking is in a junkyard, against people who already know about mutants.


The difference between FOX and Sony is that sony was struggling financially and they also didn't have as many characters as FOX does, thats why some of the spin offs ideas were abit silly like the sinister 6,

Sony and marvel still have to talk about how marvel are allowed to use spidey, its not a case of marvel just saying we are using him for this or any of the other spider-man characters and thats it.

Now With Fox they ain't in financial trouble and they also own a dozen and one X-Men characters that they would have to talk through everyone of them and any potential spin offs with marvel, including deadpool just to keep the MCU in good order

So why would FOX do that?

Fox knows they will make more money off the X-MEN if they let them join the MCU that's why as a buisness you don't wait till your in financial destitution to start making the good deals, and also Sony still controls the spin-offs but they diverted the creative control to Marvel, Ryan Reynolds would probably want that as well.

 

[rockman1216]

Yeah, Sony and Fox are not in the same boat. I think if anything were to happen between Fox and Marvel, it would be with Fantastic 4, and they would probably just sell the rights back or let them expire.

Or they will be spiteful and release another reboot right before the 7 years are up to retain the rights again. Who the bad place knows.

Fox doesn't need to be in the same boat to realize how much more money an Avengers X-MEN Crossover would make them over their X-MEN movies, not to mention they already made a deal with Marvel over TV stuff.

Also about the Fantastic Four Fox would have to get investors on board with making another reboot, if they try another FF movie without Marvel they will lose investors.

 

[rockman1216]

And sony also had financial issues, if sony had deadpool you could bet they wouldn't have made this deal with marvel.

People are trying to make the sony situation seem the same as the FOX situation but FOX have shown no desperation with this series, at least none i can see, SONY were desperate and thats why they made stupid decisions with Spider-man.

Fox are definitely not desperate.

Fox can't just make Deadpool movies, nor would it even make sense to put Deadpool in the X-MEN.
Spin-offs don't renew the license only X-MEN movies do, and they want to make as much money on those as possible which means MCU Reboot we go, more money on their end, creative control on Marvel's end, everyone's happy.

 

[GuestStar2004]

Fox knows they will make more money off the X-MEN if they let them join the MCU that's why as a buisness you don't wait till your in financial destitution to start making the good deals, and also Sony still controls the spin-offs but they diverted the creative control to Marvel, Ryan Reynolds would probably want that as well.

They don't have to wait till they are in financial trouble because sony were in finacial trouble and even they were to stubborn to give in until they had no choice, while fox are not in any trouble at all.

They could make a deal with marvel but they really do not need too and i don't get any feeling FOX are desperate like alot of people would want to think they are.

I mean looking at logan, whats interesting is how little they ain't fan servicing it for money, they ain't throwing deadpool in there because of money, no they are letting each film sit for itself.

 

[ehh]

Actually Sony and Marvel had been trying to work out a deal for a long time, since the days of Garfield's TASM1. They were actually very close to putting Oscorp tower in the Avengers skyline but failed due to timing. And while TASM2 was in pre-production, Sony was getting feedback from Feige himself, based on those leaked emails.

I don't think that Fox and Marvel had that kind of relationship. And once Sony hit a low, they started to play ball with Marvel until a deal could be worked out.

In case people don't realize, Marvel also does not own the rights to the Hulk. That belongs to Universal.

 

[rockman1216]

They don't have to wait till they are in financial trouble because sony were in finacial trouble and even they were to stubborn to give in until they had no choice, while fox are not in any trouble at all.

They could make a deal with marvel but they really do not need too and i don't get any feeling FOX are desperate like alot of people would want to think they are.

I mean looking at logan, whats interesting is how little they ain't fan servicing it for money, they ain't throwing deadpool in there because of money, no they are letting each film sit for itself.

The reason they don't put Deadpool in Logan is because well apart from Ryan Reynolds saying no, he's the only good thing going for the X-MEN after Hugh leaves. Also Sony wasn't stubborn that was Avi Arad a lot of people at Sony were wanting it to happen, especially after they lost Andrew, Fox is going to lose Hugh, Lawrence, McAvoy, and Fassbender, Stewart, and none of the original X-MEN are coming back.

bad place X-MEN Apocalypse still needed Wolverine to sell, and guess what it's being outpaced by Doctor Strange. Fox didn't even want to do Deadpool, and thought it would flop. Also if it wasn't for Deadpool Logan wouldn't be rated R, and x-23 is in it because of popular demand.

Fox isn't as desperate as Sony they aren't a sinking ship, but I doubt as any business would they would want meddling returns on their main property, and only make money on the side stuff that doesn't renew the license.
Also it was because Sony was a sinking ship the were stubborn to keep Spidey, because he is the only good thing going for them right now, they don't have any other franchises left.

Fox clearly however made a deal with Marvel when it came to Legion, and the other unnamed X-MEN TV Show, so I don' see why a Sony type deal over all Fox properties is out of the question especially since they have absolutely no reason, to keep this continuity.

 

[GuestStar2004]

Actually Sony and Marvel had been trying to work out a deal for a long time, since the days of Garfield's TASM1. They were actually very close to putting Oscorp tower in the Avengers skyline but failed due to timing. And while TASM2 was in pre-production, Sony was getting feedback from Feige himself, based on those leaked emails.

Since TASM2 didn't seem like it fit in the MCU you can kinda guess the idea wasn't there at that time of making the movie and i remember they apparently ignored feiges feedback also

In case people don't realize, Marvel also does not own the rights to the Hulk. That belongs to Universal.

Ain't that why we ain't getting another solo hulk movie?

 

[rockman1216]

Actually Sony and Marvel had been trying to work out a deal for a long time, since the days of Garfield's TASM1. They were actually very close to putting Oscorp tower in the Avengers skyline but failed due to timing. And while TASM2 was in pre-production, Sony was getting feedback from Feige himself, based on those leaked emails.

I don't think that Fox and Marvel had that kind of relationship. And once Sony hit a low, they started to play ball with Marvel until a deal could be worked out.

In case people don't realize, Marvel also does not own the rights to the Hulk. That belongs to Universal.

"I don't think that Fox and Marvel had that kind of relationship. " Legion and the other X-MEN TV Series say otherwise if they didn't have that kind of relationship then neither shows would have materialized.

"In case people don't realize, Marvel also does not own the rights to the Hulk. That belongs to Universal" Distribution rights belong to universal, but Marvel very much owns the movie rights to the Hulk.

"]Actually Sony and Marvel had been trying to work out a deal for a long time, since the days of Garfield's TASM1. They were actually very close to putting Oscorp tower in the Avengers skyline but failed due to timing. And while TASM2 was in pre-production, Sony was getting feedback from Feige himself, based on those leaked emails." You can blame Ike Perlmutter for that one, as well as Avi Arad. Feige has said he has a good relationship with Fox.