7.11 - Siren - Discussion Thread (Spoilers)

[Whiteflag]

I found the Green Arrow and his wannabe cool hip yeah all trying to be all that act tiresome and annoying.

Agreed.

 

[Kaboom]

It's funny that people think Equilibrium was original in doing that. Bruce Lee did numerous fight scenes like that 30 some odd years ago. Ah youth....

its wasted on the young

 

[COMPO]

hey did they mention Grant's death at all in this episode?

 

[KALEL114]

Lionel did. He said it to Lana. It wasn't explained if the rest of the world knew though. I would think Lionel and or Lex would want to keep it under wraps, since he was a clone.

 

[COMPO]

didnt lois say anything or was she too wrapped up with ollie?

 

[KALEL114]

didnt lois say anything or was she too wrapped up with ollie?

She never mentioned it. That is why I believe it was covered up by one of the Luthors.

 

[Savage]

It's funny that people think Equilibrium was original in doing that. Bruce Lee did numerous fight scenes like that 30 some odd years ago. Ah youth....

Bruce Lee had gun fu fights? I must've missed that movie. I thought I had all of them.

 

[The Incredible Hulk]

She never mentioned it. That is why I believe it was covered up by one of the Luthors.

She did mention it. She said to Clark that she had hoped that when she got with Grant it would "help her forget Ollie, but if that didnt end badly enough..." which I took to mean that she knew he was murdered.

Bruce Lee had gun fu fights? I must've missed that movie. I thought I had all of them.

He didnt use the gun, but he had similar close in hand to hand combat with people trying to shoot him. I believe it was in the movie he did with Kareem Abdul Jabar, cant think of the title off the top of my head...Equilibirum just basically elongated the same sequence and gave both guys weapons

 

[reevesdamn]

As much as I enjoyed the mytho element to this episode with Ollie meeting Dinah for the first time, there was something in it that was different.

Too many people were OOC.

The clois scene was nice. But at the same time I was missing the old sarcastic, brush everything off Lois a bit. Since when does she cry infront of Clark and since when do they hug?

I think this is the first real episode where I started to realise that this isn't the same show I use to watch. A lot has changed.

There's hardly been any Clex interaction this season.

Not to mention Clana. My God! It's like Kal said in Exile "Why start something if it's just gonna end badly?"

But, despite all that, I feel that the good part far out way the not so good parts. So this ep gets 10/10 from me.

 

[mellyM]

She did mention it. She said to Clark that she had hoped that when she got with Grant it would "help her forget Ollie, but if that didnt end badly enough..." which I took to mean that she knew he was murdered.

Craig at Ksite has said that Erica mentioned Lois doesn't know Grant was murdered at this point, she just thinks he left town after that last altercation with Lex.
That could have been what she meant by it ending badly. I assumed she didnt know because of how casually she said that.

 

[MagicPrime]

So does this mean we might be getting a Perry White?

 

[KALEL114]

Craig at Ksite has said that Erica mentioned Lois doesn't know Grant was murdered at this point, she just thinks he left town after that last altercation with Lex.
That could have been what she meant by it ending badly. I assumed she didnt know because of how casually she said that.

Exactly.

 

[Olea]

It's been really long since the last time I posted at SHH, but I guess the strike can do that to you. I'm late but anyway, here is my review of "Siren":


I would like to start by saying it has been long since the last time I really enjoyed a Smallville episode. Plotwise, "Siren" is not brilliant but the dialogue between the characters brings out hidden feelings and a lot of truths that have been going unsaid for quite a while.


Clark Kent: He played supportive character yet again but strangely, I believe he was a spectator to a great lesson. Throughout the episode Tom Welling portrayed Clark beautifully as moody and skeptical. The events of "Persona" shook him to the core. He cannot reconcile the fact that Lana spend a month with Bizarro and didn't realise it was not him. Moreover, he cannot comprehend the idea that she was happier with him than she is currently. He goes after blood and attacks her where it hurts. On the other hand he watches Lois unselfishly stepping back and allow Oliver to go back to what he does best, even if that is not what she actually wants.

For my point of view, it was the first time I saw Clark so troubled about not only his relationship with Lana, but also his place in the world. He's been told off by Oliver because he has abilities like no other and he chooses to waste them away on the farm, unwilling to sacrifice his comfort for the good of others. He is still not outside the door leading to Superman, but tonight's episode is setting up for resolutions to come that will definitely free him and/or lead him to that decision.

Lana Lang: Although, she didn't have any major role in tonight's events, her failing relationship with Clark is a huge part of it. She feels guilty for not being able to see through Bizarro but instead of taking a step back and trying to understand why that was the case, she blames Clark for not letting go or accepting her apology. She accuses him of having to wake up every day knowing she'll disappoint him and for looking at her expecting to be disappointed. However, to my delight, Clark was not having any of the pass-the-blame game. He is angry, she is the woman he loves so much and she knows him not. She says she loves him but she fell into the arms of both Lex and Bizarro. This is not something he can easily put behind him. How can he trust her when she is only honest with him when it suits her?

What really annoyed me in this episode and it has been for most of season 7, is how Lana left from Smallville an idiot - no bash intended - and suddenly came back private detective material. Please, she couldn't work a laptop and now Lionel freaking Luthor is asking for her help to get incriminating information on Lex? Are we supposed to be that gullible?

Black Canary: Honestly, watching the episode becomes pretty clear that neither Gough nor Millar know the character or did some research. She is sassy in her dual identity but doesn't make any lasting impression. She is supposed to be a martial arts expert but we see nothing of it and we don't really hear her "cry". She struts her stuff around but we never get a feel of her powers.

Oliver Queen: He was brought back to support Black Canary's appearance, since she is the future love of his life and eventually wife. He returns back to Smallville with no real explanation why that is and tries to win Lois back and after she finds out who he is, he tries to make amends for past mistakes. More than anything he realises how dangerous it is knowing this secret.

Lois Lane: Erica Durance gave quite a performance playing the heartbroken Lois ready to give Oliver another chance only to realise she has to step back and let him go. Although, she doesn't need to be explained why Oliver was so secretive, she is not ready for the dual identity. She covers for him to Clark and Chloe - she doesn't know they know - but her heart cannot take the constant worrying if he's ok.
I'm not sure how I feel with the writers about the reasons she let him go. She gets that what he does is important. In the future, she is the one holding Clark together to continue doing what he does. She worries then too but doesn't run away because of it. It could be argued that her love for Oliver is not as strong as her future love for Clark. However, as Clark points out, she is not a quitter.

Speaking of which, their scene together, in her apartment was amazing. Clark is a true friend. He goes to her to make sure she's ok and to be there to support her when he knows she is down. These two have a connection which is growing day by day.

Chloe Sullivan: Her role wasn't that major either in this episode but I got angry when I realised to my horror that they are dumbing her character only to make some others - namely Lana - look better.

Lionel Luthor: In my opinion Lionel will not survive season 7. He seemed lost to me. Where was the conniving Lionel we came to know and love? Why did he need Lana's help for something he would normally solve with a phone call? Grant's death has affected him more than I would have thought and I believe it will be his demise.

Finally the last scene of the episode!!! Ok, WHY? Having built the tension between Lana and Clark so well, why oh why do you make two steps back? Why keep prolonging the inevitable? Let her go to Chloe's, allow both of them to think and come to decisions using their heads, not the past or some idyllic sense of romance. The music was like having two lovers make out, instead of two people trying to understand where they stand with one another.

Yes, they need to understand each others point of view, if they are to stay friends in the future. And that was accomplished with Clark showing Lana he is not perfect. But they should have closed the episode with Lana standing by her decision and moving to Chloe's. So now what are we supposed to think? That they worked things out? That all the bitter feelings from past mistakes are forgiven and forgotten?


I give this episode a 4.5 out of 5.

 

[Syncos]

Yes, they need to understand each others point of view, if they are to stay friends in the future. And that was accomplished with Clark showing Lana he is not perfect. But they should have closed the episode with Lana standing by her decision and moving to Chloe's. So now what are we supposed to think? That they worked things out? That all the bitter feelings from past mistakes are forgiven and forgotten?

No, we're supposed to think that they're adults and are actually trying to work through their problems, instead of four years ago, when the relationship would be over after a single fight.

 

[Dr.Doom]

So does this mean we might be getting a Perry White?

We've already had him.

 

[Serene]

What really annoyed me in this episode and it has been for most of season 7, is how Lana left from Smallville an idiot - no bash intended -

LMAO.

 

[Paste Pot Pete]

He didnt use the gun, but he had similar close in hand to hand combat with people trying to shoot him. I believe it was in the movie he did with Kareem Abdul Jabar, cant think of the title off the top of my head...Equilibirum just basically elongated the same sequence and gave both guys weapons

That's a huge difference, though. Equillibrium took existing combat forms and turned it into gunkata, which was very unique and innovative.

Then Smallville completely stole that unique form, typified in that final hand to hand duel between Preston and the Father, and transplanted it almost move for move into the Lex/Ollie fight.

I'm a Smallville fan, but my mouth was utterly agape at that scene. They obviously assumed that not many people have seen Equillibrium (which is true) but the flaw in their assumption is that a big part of their target audience (we, the fanboys) have seen it, and many (like myself) love it.

 

[The Incredible Hulk]

That's a huge difference, though. Equillibrium took existing combat forms and turned it into gunkata, which was very unique and innovative.

Then Smallville completely stole that unique form, typified in that final hand to hand duel between Preston and the Father, and transplanted it almost move for move into the Lex/Ollie fight.

I'm a Smallville fan, but my mouth was utterly agape at that scene. They obviously assumed that not many people have seen Equillibrium (which is true) but the flaw in their assumption is that a big part of their target audience (we, the fanboys) have seen it, and many (like myself) love it.

Even if I accept your initial premise that what they did in Equilibrium was some completely new groundbreaking thing (which I dont, but for argument's sake lets say I did...), why is it "stolen" from the movie? Perhaps Equilibrium was one of the director's favorite films and he wanted to pay homage to a cool scene in it? I don't get why Equilibrium can be the only film ever to show that? I mean, do you know how many films/TV shows have completely copied scenes right out of A Clockwork Orange because it was such an influential film on so many people? No one claimed Tarantino "stole" from it in Reservoir Dogs or the guy who directed Fargo. But yet god forbid Smallville does it, then they're the worst people ever to have existed. I just dont get it?

 

[jr24tw]

LMAO.

Consider the source.

 

[user123456789]

good to see some equilibrium action goin on but wow they totally fubared it LOL

christian bale ftw!

 

[user123456789]

damn clark pisses me off. wtf is "maybe someday" grow up *****.

LOLOL well put

 

[user123456789]

For some reason, this episode didn't click all the way for me. Maybe it was just the uneven balance of the A, B, and C stories. I'm not really sure, but this was a mild disappointment.

I enjoyed Alaina Huffman, and it was great to see Hartley back. Even Erica brought her A game (probably her best acting performance of the entire series). But everything outside of that, except for a great Clark/Lana scene in Lana's command center, was flat.

Mehsville for me.

fo shiz

cool episode.

As usually is this case, the character of BC worked much better in the context of the show than she did in the still photos. Alaina Huffman is only 28 BTW for whomever said BC should be in her 20's.

There were some things missing in the actual episode that we read about in spoilers or saw in the DC. They really didnt get too much into the conservative talk show thing as much as I thought, and was it just me or did they leave out the scene where she let out the cry at Lex but he had the subsonic sound muffled in his office?

Good to see Hartley back as Ollie/GA. Loved his comment to Clark about satying at home cuddled up on the couch. Had some great scenes with Clark and Lois.

Durance was on fire tonight, well played all around. The final scene with her and Welling was just great. Pretty touching and ironic since he'll be the one who actually DOES balance his two lives for her even though he's struggling with that with Lana now.

Chloe was just ridiculous tonight. Everything she does with computers is just so beyond ridiculous. Hack a secure bank server and cancel a money wire? Sure! and in 3.2 seconds to boot! They really need to scale back Deus Ex Chloe.

fo shizzle

 

[Olea]

Consider the source.

Wow, how mature of you Jana. I guess considering the source, your opinion is more important than mine!!



Serene, the point of the highlighted portion was that in 6 years we never saw Lana switch on a PC much less know how to hack complex systems with complex security and suddenly she is better than Chloe? For whom by the way, viewers were all up in arms last year for been portrayed as TOO capable of doing such things?


EDIT: To avoid double posting, I'll add my comments here:

Craig at Ksite has said that Erica mentioned Lois doesn't know Grant was murdered at this point, she just thinks he left town after that last altercation with Lex.

That could have been what she meant by it ending badly. I assumed she didnt know because of how casually she said that.

That makes sense.

Lana: Clark, I think that you doubt whether I'm the one you're really going to end up with.
Clark: I can't tell you the future, Lana. Honestly, I don't know what's gonna happen to us.

Probably the first time they are not hiding behind their fingers and see things for what they are.

I don't mind that she is darker and wants to take down Lex, but the whole cyber-tech girl thing is weird. We barely ever saw her use a computer and now she is running a computer spy project? I don't want her to be a cheerleader now, but that was the only time I personally found her likeable. I like that she seemed to be the perfect girl but had a lot of issues and made bad choices but then the witch thing happened and it has been down hill from there for her, IMO.

Thank you!!!

I'm complaining still. What flavor of Lana will we get next year? Magical Lana? Married Lana? Superspy Lana?

it's like they can't figure out what to do with the character. Now they've made her into some tech savy superspy... which the show already had one of in Chloe.

I doubt they have, otherwise they wouldn't have written her character so badly. Ever since season 4 the writers have been struggling to make Lana relevant to the story. Hence the ludicrus witch storyline or last year's fiasco with Lex. Lana was a really sweet note to the show, a breath of innocence and hidden potentials. Their lack of understanding has divided the fans who either turn off their TV because they can't stand her or because she's not on all the time.

^^ I agree that the Clark/Lana drama is getting repetitive, but I disagree that the shows are getting lamer.

Ditto.

Seeing Clark and Lana finally taking the kid gloves off and really addressing each other honestly and brutally is so overdue. Their resolve to still try and make it work made my heart squeeze just a bit, because we know it's not going to. But despite everything, they're at least proceeding with open eyes this time. I don't think they'll ever stop loving each other, but there are all kinds of love, as they will learn.

Exactly. They will never stop loving each other but they both have to move on. Now why can't the writers show us that? The transition to a mature friendship? Why do we have to go through endless wasted episodes of mooping and sad stares before they realise they are not good for each other?

Lionel is SO dead.

Yup!!!

Don't make me go all quid pro quo on you, 'cause I can't wait for this doomed relationship to finally be over. Permanently. The angst reached earsplitting levels LONG before Black Canary ever showed up on the scene. Clark was on RedK during his "Exile" in Metropolis. Lana wanted revenge when she hired Marilyn to kidnap and torture Lionel, stole Lex's money, and set up a secret surveillance operation under the cloak of helping the meteor infected. Clark is no saint, but he's been treating Lana like she was sweet and innocent for years and she just isn't that perfect. Neither knows each other like they thought they did, and at this point, it looks like they never will.

How can anyone compare the two? You're right, Clark was under the influance, while Lana made a conscious decision, to kidnap & torture Lionel, steal Lex's money, spy on him and many more because it just helped accomplish her ultimate goal. It doesn't matter whether it was against Lex who is the villain of the story. She knew they were felony crimes and that is why she lied and tried to cover them up.

 

[The Incredible Hulk]

Serene, the point of the highlighted portion was that in 6 years we never saw Lana switch on a PC much less know how to hack complex systems with complex security and suddenly she is better than Chloe? For whom by the way, viewers were all up in arms last year for been portrayed as TOO capable of doing such things?

I agree with that. i had no problem with Lana buying the whole advanced surveillance system of lex, even if it does seem a bit silly. You dont have to be a computer genius to know how to loop through video on a computer. The thing I did think was ridiculous was her triangulating brainiac's location last episode. That was totally out of left field.

 

[Serene]

Serene, the point of the highlighted portion was that in 6 years we never saw Lana switch on a PC much less know how to hack complex systems with complex security and suddenly she is better than Chloe? For whom by the way, viewers were all up in arms last year for been portrayed as TOO capable of doing such things?

You really seem to focus on all things Lana to a disturbing degree.

So, Lana's able to use a PC. Umm, is that really such a stretch for a girl that supposedly was smart enough to get into any college, managed her own business in high school, started her own (cover) foundation, not to mention orchestrating an intricately involved fake death/kidnapping/overseas hideout scenario?

You may hate Lana with a fiery passion, but to call her an "idiot" is short-sighted and totally biased based thinking.

Why some people are taking Lana's recent computer feats as SUCH a threat to Chloe, I'm not sure. I don't think Chloe's role as the show's SuperHacker is threatened in any way just because Lana apparently *isn't* an idiot and knows her way around a PC.