The Dark Knight A Letter to the Masses

GO MARCUS GO! ahaha

you can't hear it, but I'm clapping over here. I agreed with all of your points, word for word. I couldn't have written it better myself.

BRAVO noirman, bravo
 
It's a movie. We shouldn't see every little function of the suit. I know the purpose is functionality and convenience for Batman, but I had no trouble believing that the suit in Begins was functional and convenient. So why do we have to be spoonfed that it's functional and convenient?


There's a difference between having doubt in someone's artistic vision, and outright claiming that he's a "talentless hack". We shouldn't blindly trust Christopher Nolan simply because the first one was good.

Tim Burton provided the first Batman, which was well accepted and liked by most. I'm sure people trusted him after that, then look what he gave us.


Wasn't the reason for the praise that Nolan and BB got, was that we finally had a Batman movie that was true to the characters and the comics?

Because I see festively dressed Jokers and fabric suits in the comics.


Christopher Nolan is not Jesus Christ. He has the capacity to screw up a Batman movie. That doesn't necessarily mean he will, but the posibility certainly should not be ruled out.

I mean, I know we have no control over this movie, and I do have confidence in Nolan. I do trust him. But not blindly.
As well you should not. Like I said in my post, I'm not yet sold on the Joker, but Nolan has surprised me before. I'm not saying Nolan is Christ, but he is a Devil that deserves his due. I don't suggest that anyone blindly follow anything. However, Nolan has proven himself a very capable director, and I don't just mean BB.
 
It's a movie. We shouldn't see every little function of the suit. I know the purpose is functionality and convenience for Batman, but I had no trouble believing that the suit in Begins was functional and convenient. So why do we have to be spoonfed that it's functional and convenient?


There's a difference between having doubt in someone's artistic vision, and outright claiming that he's a "talentless hack". We shouldn't blindly trust Christopher Nolan simply because the first one was good.

Tim Burton provided the first Batman, which was well accepted and liked by most. I'm sure people trusted him after that, then look what he gave us.


Wasn't the reason for the praise that Nolan and BB got, was that we finally had a Batman movie that was true to the characters and the comics?

Because I see festively dressed Jokers and fabric suits in the comics.


Christopher Nolan is not Jesus Christ. He has the capacity to screw up a Batman movie. That doesn't necessarily mean he will, but the posibility certainly should not be ruled out.

I mean, I know we have no control over this movie, and I do have confidence in Nolan. I do trust him. But not blindly.

By the way, thanks, Nicky G. This is exactly the kind of intelligent disputation I was saying we needed here. :up:
 
I really agree with you. The fact is these boards are getting more anoying every day. People just bashes everything. Perhaps its because I have a feeling this is a more Marvel friendly. It all started as Spidermanhype, remember? People cry for everything! Even the things that worked. A few years, batfans were ashmed to talk. Shummy****, everyone? Now we got a film that is criticaly and popular aclaimed as one of the best in the superhero adaptations. Who knows we are heading for a classic trilogy? Who knows? If it was a start (and not a restart) it would be spider-man numbers at the BO. I keep my faith in Nolan, as batman fan but mostly as a comic book fanatic. Singer once said these forums are insane. Maybe Raimi did read these forums too much. Or worst, Avi Arad did. The result? A poor ending for a GREAT trilogy. Nolan as proved to understand the character. And everything is shaping up. Think with me about one thing: Usually the first chapter is about the main character, and usually has the nemesis in the same film. The result? A rushed and usually waste of the BEST villain in that hero universe. Spiderman wasted Green Goblin, Fantastic Four the Dr. Doom, XMen the Magneto, Superman with Lex Luthor. Considering the ones that got a "saga" treatment. Batman Begins had many villains, but the main story surrounded Batman. The villains poped. We didnt have to know everything about them. In TDK we are going to have Joker, and he will be the engine of the film. But maybe not the main character. We will be introduced to Harvey in the proper way. The alliance between Bats, Gordon and Dent. So that it becomes personal in the third chapter. We are ment to care about these characters. Nolan knows this, as he is a master in creating complicated plots easy to follow. See any of his great movies. I really hope he is in for the third chapter. At this point, the future seem so bright! Not literally, of course...

Sorry for the big post, but I totally agree with Noir, and thats why I dont hang arround here as often. I did move to other forums because of the negativity around here. But I'm still a regular board visitor. Just not as parcipative as before.
 
I have no sympathy for those feeling they need to leave because some people have more to their posts than "it's great. Nolan's the best."

Some of us are studio plants. comes with the territory.

Some of us are hardcore bat fans who just want to protect batman from becoming nipple-man.

Some of us are really casual about batman, open minded to new takes on the character. Me and Hunter Rider and really a handful.

Some are of course mindlessly devoted to Nolan with all that trust jazz.

Frankly i hate everyone except a few people who can appreciate a good movie, regardless of comic accuracy to the letter like the Hulk...

Where was everyone when the hounds were set loose to rip that film apart?

You're all animals. So I have no sympathy for anyone cryinga bout "negativity." because it's tainted with bias.
 
I have no sympathy for those feeling they need to leave because some people have more to their posts than "it's great. Nolan's the best."

Some of us are studio plants. comes with the territory.

Some of us are hardcore bat fans who just want to protect batman from becoming nipple-man.

Some of us are really casual about batman, open minded to new takes on the character. Me and Hunter Rider and really a handful.

Some are of course mindlessly devoted to Nolan with all that trust jazz.

Frankly i hate everyone except a few people who can appreciate a good movie, regardless of comic accuracy to the letter like the Hulk...

Where was everyone when the hounds were set loose to rip that film apart?

You're all animals. So I have no sympathy for anyone cryinga bout "negativity." because it's tainted with bias.

Who is all this addressed to?
 
I have no sympathy for those feeling they need to leave because some people have more to their posts than "it's great. Nolan's the best."

Some of us are studio plants. comes with the territory.

Some of us are hardcore bat fans who just want to protect batman from becoming nipple-man.

Some of us are really casual about batman, open minded to new takes on the character. Me and Hunter Rider and really a handful.

Some are of course mindlessly devoted to Nolan with all that trust jazz.

Frankly i hate everyone except a few people who can appreciate a good movie, regardless of comic accuracy to the letter like the Hulk...

Where was everyone when the hounds were set loose to rip that film apart?

You're all animals. So I have no sympathy for anyone cryinga bout "negativity." because it's tainted with bias.


I was there... And seemed ao lonely among the minority that did apreciate the Hulk. But around here, a movie is classified as a BoxOfice success or a bomb.

And I really dont need your aproval/sympathy. As you dont need mine.
 
Congrats Noirman, your telling people to not have opinions :up:


COMMUNIST
 
The following is little more than a balanced essay about The Dark Knight, fan reactions, and my personal stance. If you agree or disagree with me on whatever topic, please do so in a constructive manner.


Let me start everything out by saying I'm not pointing a finger at anyone. I'm not going to say names; I'm not going to call anyone out. Over the last month or so, there has been a lot of hooplah surrounding the next installment in the Batman franchise. Expectedly so. However, I do believe things are starting to cross a certain line here on SHH! Since I have been a member here I have found most of my compatriots to be intelligent, well-thought individuals. It is due to that fact that I find the present state of discussions to be a bit depressing here. Well developed ideas are giving way to half-witted propaganda. Calculated statements are being usurped by baseless claims.

I don't really need to go into further detail of what I'm talking about. We all know what pictures are getting what people rilled up, and who is taking what side. I see a community divided not by opinion, but by philosophy. Trust me when I tell you it's starting to get ugly. We all came to these forums to discuss the characters and stories we love with people who feel the same way. Somewhere in our good intentions things went arwy. I can't put into words some of the pigheaded, self-righteous bluster that I read here on a daily basis. The discussions over TDK are at the epicenter of the issue.

Where there once was just a group we now have "camps"; Nolanites and Doubters, Purest and Revisionist. This division in my eyes is unwarranted, for we are all under a single banner. Our vision of the big picture has become blurred by attention to detail in my opinion. I think we could stand to take a deep breath, step away, and look at things unobjectively for a second. In particular, as things pertain to the Joker and the Suit, and the direction.

I know the Joker isn't what all of us were expecting. After all, what ever is? But from what I can see, a lot of the disapproval is knee-jerk reaction to something that has been altered a bit. I'm still on the fence with the issue myself, but I will definitely just wait to see how things play out. In my heart of hearts, I do believe Nolan's direction with the character will work. I remember not digging the look of Scarecrow intially for Batman Begins. After I saw the movie I thought it made perfect sense. I was questioning Ken Watanabe playing Ra's Al Ghul. Imagine my shock when I saw he was just a decoy. Things are hardly what the intially seem, and that is never more true than with cinema.

As for the suit...my my my. Honestly, the things I read in that discussion are what prompted me to write this. My intial reaction to the suit was "Badass!" One look at it and I thought that it fitted in perfectly with what Nolan and crew have already established. Not everyone saw things as I did though. There is way too many opinions for me to discuss, but I will say this to some; Stop it. I've heard people compare the new suit to everything from Green Goblin to Robocop, and I'll tell you that that's nonsense. An old adage about making mountains out of molehills comes to mind. You have a right to your opinion, just make it something a little more concrete.

Looking at it seriously, with all truth, the suit is both like and unlike anything we have seen before in the franchise. It is due to that, I think, that so many people differ in their opinion. The suit is recognizable as what is standard for Batman on film, black rubber and all. But the new segemented look and mesh underweave are all new to us. Let's not be afraid of change here. The suit is seemingly "busy", but I can tell you, as an artist myself, that every detail in that suit has a function. Look at how the middle of the leg on the suit is designed for the hard parts to give weigh when fabric streches for Batman to kneel or run. Look a how the hip area is segmented to allow the Batman to lean his torso to either side with great flexibilty. Nolan didn't choose this suit simply to be different, he's trying to make things better. To all who would love a fabric suit, this is as close you can wish for. Imagine how great it will be to see Batman in action with a freedom of movement like never before, all the while holding continuity from what we are all familiar with.

As for those who are begining to question Nolan and his vision for this franchise, be ashamed of yourself. Everyone all but exalted Nolan as the king of comic films after Batman Begins. Now, after a few measly pictures have been released, he's a talentless hack that doesn't know Batman? Nolan's vaunted "realism" is a realative word. Watch BB again, the only things real are the people in it. Nolan's vision isn't realism, it's just to have the movie a little more grounded, as Batman should've always been, the way he was created to be. Focus on that.

We all have our own thoughts of what this should be like and what that should be like, but you know what? It doesn't matter. We're not in charge of making this movie, Nolan is. And what we expect from this movie should be nothing more than what Nolan's vision will allow. There's no room for a festively dressed Joker here. There's no place for fabric suits. Those things are taking steps back for the franchine, not forward. In all earnesty, we really shouldn't really have the audacity to question Nolan right now. Do you remeber the last movie before BB? Do you remember the 8 years of rotating director, writers, and stories? Do you remember the refreshing relief after you saw BB? For a second, maybe even longer, didn't you have to thank God for Christopher Nolan? The plain simple fact is that he has earned your trust and your respect. We may question his methods, yes, but never his madness.

In all, I hope writing this has opened some eyes out there. I hope it opened even more hearts. Look at this fantastic age of fandom we live in! How dare we waste it by bickering with one another like spoiled school children? Let's not forget that not long ago we had nothing to bicker about. Let's give each other a little more common courtesy and due process. Let's honor ourselves by making our stances reasonable and apt. And for the love of all that is good, let's be grateful. Be grateful that we are getting more of the characters we love. Be grateful that we awake to each morning with the promise that something new may come. Be grateful we have SHH. Be grateful we have each other.



D. Marcus McNeal aka NoirMan
I didn't read any of that.
 
You know KOLLUS, I find your avatar highly amusing. "Jim Gordon needs love" lol! :D

jims on top of missus gordon, pumpin' and sweatin' and gruntin'.
make no mistake, big jimmy gets it done.:ninja:
 
As long as the basic appearance is there, I care about characters. CHARACTERS! Unfortunately, I'm sure before and after the film comes out we'll STILL have to deal with "OMGZ TEH JOKER IZ 2 GRaY!" or "THE BALEMAN'Z sUIT IS TERIBBLE!". :whatever:
 
I was there... And seemed ao lonely among the minority that did apreciate the Hulk. But around here, a movie is classified as a BoxOfice success or a bomb.

And I really dont need your aproval/sympathy. As you dont need mine.

Yeah I'm cold as ice.... no need for sympathy.

Indeed. There's no such thing as middle ground, some gray area like there was before the internet, the golden age for all of us.

If you don't take most of what you read on the internet with a grain of salt, something's wrong with you, I say.
 
"Me thinks thou dost protest too much"....

Company....Villanous Company, hath been the spoil of me.
 
Who is all this addressed to?

generally anyone who's suffering from all the negativity.

This ain't negativity. :o It's more like "wtf happened to sticking to teh comics? damn, but oh well... at least nolan's a competent director, just needs to learn how to shoot fights."

Then INWT guys read that and think: "Hater!"
 
I was there... And seemed ao lonely among the minority that did apreciate the Hulk. But around here, a movie is classified as a BoxOfice success or a bomb.

And I really dont need your aproval/sympathy. As you dont need mine.

HULK ruled. 'Nuff said.
 
Congrats Noirman, your telling people to not have opinions :up:


COMMUNIST


You see? This is the exact kind of idiocy I was writing about. Nowhere in all of that did I say people aren't entitled to their opinions. I have a problem with people not organizing their feelings in a constructive and intelligent manner. I guess it's too much to ask for people to actually think these days.
 
generally anyone who's suffering from all the negativity.

This ain't negativity. :o It's more like "wtf happened to sticking to teh comics? damn, but oh well... at least nolan's a competent director, just needs to learn how to shoot fights."

Then INWT guys read that and think: "Hater!"


It is annoying when people have to nitpick every little detail of a film that isn't even finished and out yet. Imagine if the internet existed during the filming of The Empire Strikes Back or Temple of Doom? Can you imagine the talkbalks, lol...

I loved Batman Begins, and I wasn't around here during the filming of that. I just want a good follow up and I hope that BB-->TDK will be similar to Alien-->Aliens sort of escalation. :yay:
 
I have no problem with all of us having our own opinions. It would be damn boring here if we all thought the same way. Yet, that doesn't mean that we have to be venomous or ignorant about anything.

Amen! (and I ain't religious).

I'm a middling oldbie. I haven't been around since the dawn of time but I was around during the production of BB. There were some uncivilized people on the Batboards before but it seems the masses have multiplied - most likely due to BB's popularity. Then again, it could be me and my old fart-ish ways saying, "Damn those kids! When I was their age I had to walk to school uphill both ways!"... reminiscing about a time that no longer exists.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion but some just express it more intelligently than others. Oh... and by "intelligent" I don't mean using 20-letter words and whatnot but something a little more substantial than "That idea sucks! You're a moron!" "Shut up jerkface! It's my opinion!" or "Only a complete idiot would think that was cool". It seems that the level of debate has dropped since 2004.

Props to NoirMan for actually writing out that essay. I don't even mind the nitpicking, just... lets try not to be jerkfaces about it. ;)
 
Amen! (and I ain't religious).

I'm a middling oldbie. I haven't been around since the dawn of time but I was around during the production of BB. There were some uncivilized people on the Batboards before but it seems the masses have multiplied - most likely due to BB's popularity. Then again, it could be me and my old fart-ish ways saying, "Damn those kids! When I was their age I had to walk to school uphill both ways!"... reminiscing about a time that no longer exists.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion but some just express it more intelligently than others. Oh... and by "intelligent" I don't mean using 20-letter words and whatnot but something a little more substantial than "That idea sucks! You're a moron!" "Shut up jerkface! It's my opinion!" or "Only a complete idiot would think that was cool". It seems that the level of debate has dropped since 2004.

Props to NoirMan for actually writing out that essay. I don't even mind the nitpicking, just... lets try not to be jerkfaces about it. ;)

I agree.
 

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