The Force Awakens Adam Driver as Kylo Ren - Part 1

[kickass]

Someone on Twitter asked Pablo Hildago if the new "AT-AT" walkers that were supposed to be in TFA have a name? His answer was "Not yet".

Which leads me to suspect they'll be in EP 8. If they make their debut there, I really hope this isn't just a rehash of ESB, as it easily could be. Not to forget, we might even get Billy Dee Williams back as Lando in this film. Who knows? But if so, again, ESB all over again.

I understand that the NT is a continuation within the same universe so we're going to get the same characters and themes popping up, but going all the way back to pull Hayden out of the prequels and use his force ghost is trying too hard to redeem the prequels and hold on to Vader as a badass and relevant character. They need to let it go.

If they want to show Kylo still talking to Vader's helmet, then that's fine. Just one scene is the perfect amount (just like in TFA). But pulling physical actors and characters from the prequels and throwing them into the New Trilogy - ghost or not - is back peddling too much in my opinion, and seems like there's no fresh ideas moving forward.

 

[jokesonm3]

 

[ЯɘvlveR]

If they decide to do something like have the villains try to tempt Rey into joining the dark side, it would be cool IMO if they had Anakin appear before Rey as a ghost and warn her to not make the same mistakes that he did (if they do, hopefully Hayden can do a better job this time as I was not a big fan of him overall in the movies he was in).

i want him to appear to kylo to tempt him to the lightside. he clearly needs the guidance. i think luke can cover that for rey.

 

[godisawesome]

We've speculated somewhere that it's possible Snoke could project illusions using the Force. Perhaps he could project a Force Ghost of the Vader he wants Ren to emulate while Rey encounters the actual ghost of Anakin.

 

[Marvolo]

Delete this post please.

 

[Marvolo]

I want no force ghost Anakin. At what point does the new series do away with the past trilogy in order to stand on its own? Granted, I loved TFA and it's already standing on its own, but we already have Leia and now Luke back. I don't want Vader. I don't want Anakin

If Snoke has been manipulating visions for Kylo to see when he's meditating and fooling him into thinking Anakin is talking to him, that's fine. But I'd rather that come up in conversation rather than it being SHOWN.
Kylo: "Leader, I've been shown the way. My grandfather spoke to me again last night...."
Snoke: "Outstanding....

Please, for the love of all that is Star Wars, let's move forward.

This is still a sequel to the OT. A continuation. It makes no sense for Obi, Yoda and/or Anakin to never help or communicate with Luke again. Force ghosts are a part of the star wars universe and a big point throughout the saga. They are bound to come up at some point.

I'm wondering if Obi or Yoda or Anakin will help Rey or Luke defeat Snoke. One of Lucas's original plans for the showdown in ROTJ was for Obi and Yoda to appear as force ghosts to help Luke in his struggle against the Emperor.

 

[kickass]

I'm wondering if Obi or Yoda or Anakin will help Rey or Luke defeat Snoke. One of Lucas's original plans for the showdown in ROTJ was for Obi and Yoda to appear as force ghosts to help Luke in his struggle against the Emperor.

Yes, and it was awful lol.

 

[Marvolo]

Yes, and it was awful lol.

Why was it awful? Personally I prefer Luke having to do it on his own, but the concept of Force Ghosts fighting the Darkness threatening the galaxy doesn't strike me as awful.

The whole point of Qui-gon working to discover how to become a force ghost and him passing that secret on was so that Obi-wan and Yoda would still be able to help the Light fight the Darkness threatening everything even if they died. And like Obi said to Vader, "If you strike me down I will become more powerful than you can possibly imagine." That indicates to me that Lucas planned for Force Ghosts to do more than just stand around and be chatter boxes. And after seeing the Night Sisters magic and the dark spirit of Darth Bane in TCW it's got me hoping that the franchise won't just forget Force Ghosts or only use them as talking ghosts.

You say that you don't want Vader, but the franchise isn't going to ignore or forget one of its major characters. A major character that is the progenitor of at least two of our main characters and possibly Rey. I understand wanting new things from this trilogy, but it can't forget or ignore the history of the galaxy, and it's major players. This isn't a soft reboot that is going to forget or ignore events that came before. It's a continuation of a generational story, and the past is as important as the future.

And these are movies. Show. Don't tell. If Anakin or some shade posing as Anakin is communing with Ben we should see it, because something like that has a big impact on Ben's character. Even if Anakin really isn't there and it's just delusions that Ben is having we need to see it. Based on the scene of Ben talking to Vader's Mask and the fact that Dark Side objects and relics can and do effect people around them it has me thinking that Ben may in fact be having delusions. I'd like to see one of these delusions just to see what Ben is seeing or experiencing.

 

[Doc Samson]

I think that him not being a full-on villain yet is kind of the point. I seem to recall JJ mentioning that he was interesting in seeing the progression of not just a hero, but also a villain.

Right. Obviously he's well on his way, physically, towards becoming the Darth Vader-ish character he envisions himself as.

I thought Driver was brilliant. I've seen people trying to compare him to Hayden's Anakin but I can't see it. Anakin was unintentionally *****e-y to a certain degree, Kylo is supposed to be this way. Yet, Driver has a very calm and almost unnerving quality to him at times too, which is a good dichotomy when he shows his petulant side lol.

 

[kickass]

Why was it awful? Personally I prefer Luke having to do it on his own, but the concept of Force Ghosts fighting the Darkness threatening the galaxy doesn't strike me as awful.

The whole point of Qui-gon working to discover how to become a force ghost and him passing that secret on was so that Obi-wan and Yoda would still be able to help the Light fight the Darkness threatening everything even if they died. And like Obi said to Vader, "If you strike me down I will become more powerful than you can possibly imagine." That indicates to me that Lucas planned for Force Ghosts to do more than just stand around and be chatter boxes. And after seeing the Night Sisters magic and the dark spirit of Darth Bane in TCW it's got me hoping that the franchise won't just forget Force Ghosts or only use them as talking ghosts.

You say that you don't want Vader, but the franchise isn't going to ignore or forget one of its major characters. A major character that is the progenitor of at least two of our main characters and possibly Rey. I understand wanting new things from this trilogy, but it can't forget or ignore the history of the galaxy, and it's major players. This isn't a soft reboot that is going to forget or ignore events that came before. It's a continuation of a generational story, and the past is as important as the future.

And these are movies. Show. Don't tell. If Anakin or some shade posing as Anakin is communing with Ben we should see it, because something like that has a big impact on Ben's character. Even if Anakin really isn't there and it's just delusions that Ben is having we need to see it. Based on the scene of Ben talking to Vader's Mask and the fact that Dark Side objects and relics can and do effect people around them it has me thinking that Ben may in fact be having delusions. I'd like to see one of these delusions just to see what Ben is seeing or experiencing.

I agree with mostly everything you've said. But we can have glimpses of Anakin popping in and out of Kylo's visions and dreams without having Hayden Christensen pull an Obi-Wan from ESB or ROTJ. I think that's what some fans want, and even if we do in fact get Hayden back for EP 8, that's not what I want from him. That's not how I want his Force ghost to be used. It was absolutely fine for Obi-Wan, but for Anakin.....no. I don't like the idea. Glimpses and flashes and misinterpreted messages twisted and manipulated by Snoke to fool Kylo into believing a false ideal, yes, I am on board for that.

I posted this in the EP 8 thread but I guess I'll post it here too. Wonder what people think of my prediction for the next film. Screencap this comment, because I'm making a prediction right here and now :

JJ Abrams said in the beginning process of making TFA, him and Kasdan made some changes that would connect with Rian Johnson's story for Episode 8. I bet you any money Han Solo saying "People believed he (Luke) went to find the first Jedi Temple" is one of those changes. Luke went to look for the very first Jedi Temple because he doesn't believe that Anakin's prophecy was correct. That Anakin was the one to bring balance to the Force. And how could it be, to be fair, when there is still a great murderous evil in the galaxy?

Luke is looking to see where this prophecy first came about. What and who exactly led everyone to believe that such a prophecy was even true or real. And through that search, he or Rey will connect and speak to the Force ghost of Anakin.

I wouldn't even be surprised if the title for Episode 8 has the word "Prophecy" in it. "The Prophecy Strikes Back!" LOL (just kidding with that one haha).

Thoughts?

 

[an_ewok]

I think the problem with the "bring balance to the force" prophecy is that it sort of did happen, just not in the way that the Jedi imagined. That's not uncommon with prophecies, and reminds me of one of the most famous examples of such.

There was a king of Lydia, in what's now western Turkey, named Croesus. Lydia bordered what had recently become the Persian Empire, after the Persians overthrew the Medes. Croesus thought this might be a good time to expand his own kingdom at the Persian's expense. However, he wouldn't act without first consulting the gods, and so he sent for an oracle. The oracle told him that, should he attack the Persians, an empire would fall. Taking this to mean the gods favored his plan, he invaded.

Within a year, Lydia was a province of the Persian Empire, and Croesus was sentenced to death on a pyre by the King of Kings.

Balance was brought to the Force, the same way that an empire fell, just not in ways that those who held to the prophecies expected.

Hopefully they don't dwell on that prophecy in future movies, and I'm not too sure how keen they are on callbacks to the prequels anyway.

 

[Mrs Vimes]

Seems likely he will be redeemed in some way as the idea that han was killed by his only son who was evil and a dick seems abit of a crap way to end the characters legacy.

The natural move would be to carry on showing how much killin han effected him and haunts him and left a mark so han didnt die for nothing

Yeah Star Wars is not cynical or nihilistic; if a character has a shred of light in him you can bet that pesky light will win in the end. Killing his father was supposed to snuff it out, but going by Kylo's reaction I don't think it will work out like he'd hoped it would. Still, I think it's safe to say he'll be a total terror in the next episode after that extra training.

 

[MagnarTheGreat]

Saturday Night Live - SNL Host Adam Driver & Kate McKinnon Grab a Bite at The Diner

 

[Closerframe]

I agree with mostly everything you've said. But we can have glimpses of Anakin popping in and out of Kylo's visions and dreams without having Hayden Christensen pull an Obi-Wan from ESB or ROTJ. I think that's what some fans want, and even if we do in fact get Hayden back for EP 8, that's not what I want from him. That's not how I want his Force ghost to be used. It was absolutely fine for Obi-Wan, but for Anakin.....no. I don't like the idea. Glimpses and flashes and misinterpreted messages twisted and manipulated by Snoke to fool Kylo into believing a false ideal, yes, I am on board for that.

I posted this in the EP 8 thread but I guess I'll post it here too. Wonder what people think of my prediction for the next film. Screencap this comment, because I'm making a prediction right here and now :

JJ Abrams said in the beginning process of making TFA, him and Kasdan made some changes that would connect with Rian Johnson's story for Episode 8. I bet you any money Han Solo saying "People believed he (Luke) went to find the first Jedi Temple" is one of those changes. Luke went to look for the very first Jedi Temple because he doesn't believe that Anakin's prophecy was correct. That Anakin was the one to bring balance to the Force. And how could it be, to be fair, when there is still a great murderous evil in the galaxy?

Luke is looking to see where this prophecy first came about. What and who exactly led everyone to believe that such a prophecy was even true or real. And through that search, he or Rey will connect and speak to the Force ghost of Anakin.

I wouldn't even be surprised if the title for Episode 8 has the word "Prophecy" in it. "The Prophecy Strikes Back!" LOL (just kidding with that one haha).

Thoughts?

I think the prophecy was fulfilled, but as someone else stated, just not in the way the Jedi intended. In the prequels, it's pretty evident the Jedi are powerful tyrants who were just as corrupt as the Senate given their problematic ideology that they were the "peace bringers" for multiple worlds in the galaxy. So Anakin killing most of them and reducing their ranks to two living Jedi (Yoda and Obi-wan) and he and the Emperor being the only two Sith, there was a balance--briefly. But then, as the Empire gained more and more control, the balance no longer existed. Thus enters Luke. Luke restores the confidence in his father by bringing him back to the light which resulted in the Sith being completely eliminated with the end of the Emperor. Now, in this new trilogy, a new set of dark side users have come to fill the void in the form of Snoke. The problem with this is where has he been all this time? And if the Knights of Ren have been active since the Battle of Endor, was there ever truly balance? I think what we'll get by the end of this trilogy is the realization that the dark side must be embraced along with the light. There cant be a mutually exclusive title of either which is why I think Rey will be that. And with that, if she is indeed Luke's daughter, Anakin technically still brought balance to the force through his bloodline. I know this is convoluted and has some gaps in logic, but that's how I see this whole thing playing out.

 

[Spider-Gnome]

I think the Force ghosts need to be addressed. It could be part of the reason Lucas inserted Hayden in ROTJ.

Also, I think if Episodes I through IX are supposed to tell one story, I think the prophecy still needs to be fufilled. This is why I think Rey should be Luke's daughter. She can be the Light and Kylo (also a Skywalker) can be the Dark. Together, with the guidance of Luke (and Anakin's spirit), balance is finally restored.

 

[DeGenerate10]

I wonder if Kylo will have a new mask, no mask, or the same mask in Episode 8?

 

[spiderman2]

I wonder if Kylo will have a new mask, no mask, or the same mask in Episode 8?

Yeah that is something I wonder to. I cant want in till we start getting set photos. That is the cool thing with 7 now being out and with 8 not being really that far away and filming starting is it will not be long before we get set photos and casting news. I hope that he does have a mask new or old. I thought the mask was cool.

 

[Mrs Vimes]

Rewatching the movie, even though I know what Kylo looks like under the mask, he still looks damn terrifying when wearing it. I also haven't picked up until later that his garb is made of this rough, medieval-looking fabric, which goes very well with his medieval-looking lightsaber. Great costume design.

I also noticed though that even in that early scene when he's all scary and stuff, he still slouches forward a lot like an adolescent and when he makes his first entrance his walk is totally nerdy.

 

[OutOfBoose]

Mask or not, I hope that sexy piece of Darkside keeps his hair.

Seriously speaking, unless they modify him into some kind of cyborg (hope not), he doesn't need a mask or helmet. His wounds aren't too terrible.

 

[Marvolo]

I wonder if Kylo will have a new mask, no mask, or the same mask in Episode 8?

I'm more interested in his lightsaber. His lightsaber was ragged and rough due to him being inexperienced and unfocused and the crystal being cracked which required the quillons to keep the thing from blowing up. If Snoke trains him more and he moves more toward the dark side will his next lightsaber be better constructed and different.

 

[sueb1863]

I'm guessing no mask so everybody can see his big, boss scar that cuts sideways across his face. That'll be scary enough.

His hair should be OK, though maybe he'll slick it back or something to make himself look different from before.

I think it's wild that some fans on Tumblr think Kylo is a teenager since Driver's almost thirty years old!

 

[Mrs Vimes]

They did make him look awfully young in this movie, plus Kylo is probably the world's most immature almost-30-year-old.

I already knew what Adam Driver looked like and I was still surprised when he removed his helmet.

 

[Lord]

I think the problem with the "bring balance to the force" prophecy is that it sort of did happen, just not in the way that the Jedi imagined. That's not uncommon with prophecies, and reminds me of one of the most famous examples of such.

There was a king of Lydia, in what's now western Turkey, named Croesus. Lydia bordered what had recently become the Persian Empire, after the Persians overthrew the Medes. Croesus thought this might be a good time to expand his own kingdom at the Persian's expense. However, he wouldn't act without first consulting the gods, and so he sent for an oracle. The oracle told him that, should he attack the Persians, an empire would fall. Taking this to mean the gods favored his plan, he invaded.

Within a year, Lydia was a province of the Persian Empire, and Croesus was sentenced to death on a pyre by the King of Kings.

Balance was brought to the Force, the same way that an empire fell, just not in ways that those who held to the prophecies expected.

Hopefully they don't dwell on that prophecy in future movies, and I'm not too sure how keen they are on callbacks to the prequels anyway.

But here's the thing, in-universe, the Republic reigned supreme and the sith were missing in action for 1000 years, if more light = balance, then the prophecy would have taken place 1000 years ago, as Luke's defeating the Emperor and the Empire didn't bring any lasting peace and Snoke was around before and during that time.

I hated the Chosen One part of the prequels, i realy did, found it unnecessary and something so cliché that took away some of the more human elements in the victories of the good guys.

That said, the Prequels are canon right now, so is The Clone Wars show, which heavily mentioned this prophecy, therefore, i think it's important to talk and expand upon it, as it also gives a strong connection to Episode I and leads the saga to being more cohesive. The damage is already done, so i would rather see them take a weakness from the Prequels, and turn it into a strength (rather that ignore it completely and leave it as a black spot in the universe of the saga), since they can give a different twist to it, like showing that the Dark Side and the Light need to stand side by side.

 

[Havok83]

I'm guessing no mask so everybody can see his big, boss scar that cuts sideways across his face. That'll be scary enough.

His hair should be OK, though maybe he'll slick it back or something to make himself look different from before.

I think it's wild that some fans on Tumblr think Kylo is a teenager since Driver's almost thirty years old!

I didnt think teen, but he looked mid 20s at the most. His mentality also helped make him youthful as he acted very immature

 

[Spider-Gnome]

That said, the Prequels are canon right now, so is The Clone Wars show, which heavily mentioned this prophecy, therefore, i think it's important to talk and expand upon it, as it also gives a strong connection to Episode I and leads the saga to being more cohesive. The damage is already done, so i would rather see them take a weakness from the Prequels, and turn it into a strength (rather that ignore it completely and leave it as a black spot in the universe of the saga), since they can give a different twist to it, like showing that the Dark Side and the Light need to stand side by side.

That's what I say. Let the Balance to the Force be the endgame of the saga. It is started by the Chosen One Anakin and finished by his bloodline, Rey and Kylo, each representing the Light and the Dark.

Also, Kylo states he will finish what Vader started, but in actuality, he will aid in finishing what Anakin started.