The Dark Knight Rises Adapting Robin

[Nepenthes]

First, this topic is NOT about whether Robin should be introduced. We've gone over that many times and I've made a new thread to keep that stuff out of here. To do otherwise is to demonstrate that you are either a jerk, a simpleton, or a pissflap.


So let's just say that a Robin character WILL be introduced at the end of movie 3 or at the beginning of a new trilogy (continuing the more serious approach of Nolans films). There would be many things to consider when adding him in, things you might initially take for granted. These are not often discussed.


For instance

- Dick Grayson might not even be the best option, especially when you can combine elements from several Robins into one. Would you have the acrobat, the hoodlum or the detective? Which bits would you take from the various personalities and origin stories?


- Robins costume works quite well in the comics but of course it'd be much harder to adapt for film than Batmans. Personally I'd adopt a recognisable look from outside the 'spandex' genre, eg. ninja, urban commando or 'modern medieval' Robin Hood. What changes and inspirations would you use?


- Would Robin even need a cape? Sure it's part of his classic costume (until recently ) but in BB the only reason Batman has a cape is to glide around. If Robin copies this trick it will make Batman less distinctive - while Robin could rely on a more unique mode of transport (freerunning!)
Same goes for the bandit mask, it wouldn't work, but is there any alternative?


- How important is age? Does Robin really need to be a child to serve his function? To me it was never about Batman taking care of an orphan... the kid doesn't need a guardian he needs a mentor. I'd put him at 18-20, which is still quite young to be partnering with a 30+ Batman. Older Robin also makes sense from a marketing and tonal perspective.


- This being Robins introduction the villain is very important. They should be part of the theme, like both villains in BB reflected separate themes. ????


-Who would you cast? Obviously it's a while off so just pretend that a contemporary actor will be the same age then as he is now. I guess we're talking about types and examples.


Again, if you really are against including Robin then please use this thread to explain how you'd make the best of the decision rather than just opposing it

 

[Fried Gold]

- How important is age? Does Robin really need to be a child to serve his function? To me it was never about Batman taking care of an orphan... the kid doesn't need a guardian he needs a mentor. I'd put him at 18-20, which is still quite a young age to be partnering with Batman.

Error.

 

[El Payaso]

I have two tips to do Robin right.

1.- Do not open a new thread about him.
2.- Not to put him in a Batman movie.

But I agree with the cape thing.

 

[Katsuro]

Robin shouldn't be too young, but he does still need to be young. He needs to be young when his parents die, in order for Bruce to see the similarity between Dick and himself. His parents dying when he's 13 sounds good, then give him 2 or 3 years to train with Bruce before becoming Robin.

As for costume, I'd go with the current Tim Drake outfit. No green whatsover, and the only yellow being on the symbol and the inside of his cape. The rest would be red and black.

 

[Nepenthes]

1.- Do not open a new thread about him.
2.- Not to put him in a Batman movie.

Not an option! The question is about making the best of a decision that has already been made. Hypothetically. I'm just trying to move on from that ridiculous Robin thread where people biiitch at each other for nineteen pages.

If no one has anything to contribute then the thread will die. Simple. But I suspect there may be people who want to discuss Robin in more detail than is possible in the other thread. So stone me and call me George.

 

[Shedhut]

why did you put it in the Dark Knight Thread board? It belongs in the begins sequels board the best.
no robin in TDK = no mention of him in TDK boards anymore plz...
I've to slap my kids anytime i see a random Nolan add Robin!-thread. You dont want me to slap my kids, do you?

 

[mcallima]

If Robin HAD to be used (I'm against his inclusion), here's how I would do it:

-I would use Dick Grayson. I think the circus scene could be incredibly powerful under Nolan's direction.
-Grayson is a kid, no more than 10 years old.
-Include the scene from Dark Victory where Dick is going through Bruce's parents room with Alfred watching.
-Have Dick discover Bruce is Batman, not the other way around. Bruce did not take Dick in to mold a child into his side kick.
-If he does become Bruce's partner, no costume. Dick is nothing more than a scout, and doesn't need a costume beyond inconspicuous clothing.
-Preferably, Dick doesn't get outside the cave at all. Show Bruce training him, ala Bruce/Ra's, but with more focus on acceptance. Bruce doesn't want to create another Batman, he wants to create a city where Batman isn't necessary.

This satisfies the father/growth aspect of Bruce's character without creating an unrealistic 10 year old crime fighter.

 

[Adam West]

First, this topic is NOT about whether Robin should be introduced. We've gone over that many times and I've made a new thread to keep that stuff out of here. To do otherwise is to demonstrate that you are either a jerk, a simpleton, or a pissflap.


So let's just say that a Robin character WILL be introduced at the end of movie 3 or at the beginning of a new trilogy (continuing the more serious approach of Nolans films). There would be many things to consider when adding him in, things you might initially take for granted. These are not often discussed.


For instance

- Dick Grayson might not even be the best option, especially when you can combine elements from several Robins into one. Would you have the acrobat, the hoodlum or the detective? Which bits would you take from the various personalities and origin stories?

I'd have them all. He starts as the acrobat, then flees the circus and has to live like a hoodlum which is where Batman finds him and realizes that he needs guidance. Which in turn leads to him using a natural slant for detective reasoning.

- Robins costume works quite well in the comics but of course it'd be much harder to adapt for film than Batmans. Personally I'd adopt a recognisable look from outside the 'spandex' genre, eg. ninja, urban commando or 'modern medieval' Robin Hood. What changes and inspirations would you use?

Similar to Batmans. Black armor, with a deep crimson chest, and gold "R" emblem. No yellow or green.

- Would Robin even need a cape? Sure it's part of his classic costume (until recently ) but in BB the only reason Batman has a cape is to glide around. If Robin copies this trick it will make Batman less distinctive - while Robin could rely on a more unique mode of transport (freerunning!)
Same goes for the bandit mask, it wouldn't work, but is there any alternative?

Yes on the cape. Batman uses it to glide and Robin can use it in similar fashion. It may make Batman less distictive, but just adding a sidekick like Robin does that already. As for the mask, same as Batman's, minus the ears on the cowl.

- How important is age? Does Robin really need to be a child to serve his function? To me it was never about Batman taking care of an orphan... the kid doesn't need a guardian he needs a mentor. I'd put him at 18-20, which is still quite young to be partnering with a 30+ Batman. Older Robin also makes sense from a marketing and tonal perspective.

Robin should be older when he becomes Robin. He can be younger when the death of his parents actually happens. It took Bruce at least 7 years to be properly trained to be Batman, he's not just going to throw the kid out there without the proper training.

- This being Robins introduction the villain is very important. They should be part of the theme, like both villains in BB reflected separate themes. ????

If we go with the circus acrobat origin then Joker works best.

-Who would you cast? Obviously it's a while off so just pretend that a contemporary actor will be the same age then as he is now. I guess we're talking about types and examples.

Haven't a clue

Again, if you really are against including Robin then please use this thread to explain how you'd make the best of the decision rather than just opposing it

Just some thoughts.

 

[chosen1]

I said this before and I'll say it again introducing robin in one film would be a disaster nothing really would change far from the batman forever storyline.


THE BEST WAY TO DO IT PERIOD.

Introduce a young dick grayson in the next film 13 years old to be exact.
What do we know? Dick grayson lived w/ bruce for a number of years before begining his training or wearing the costume so introducing him as an 18 -20 year old is straight up dumb and has been done before.

The sentiment has always been bruce had a hand in RAISING dick.

How could he raise dick if he's already 18-years old. Introducing him in the next film would be great. Still have the story focus on batman entirely but to just have the characer there at 13 with about the same amount of screen time that little kid in batman begins had. 2-3 minutes and then in the third film show him (the same actor) at age 15 with a little more screen time 10-15 minutes would be genius. THAT WAY when robin is introduced after the third film. its not like they just threw him in there. It's like okay Dick has been living w/ him for a while and we got to see this character grow a little.

have him in robin costume from 17-23 then nightwing and so on..

"We got our thing, but it's just part of the big thing." -- Zenobia

 

[Eros]

Imo Batman forever approached it very well, Bruce and Dick were more like kindred spirits/borthers. Bruce didn't even want anyone to follow in his footsteps, and he didn't want Dick to seek out revenge. Hell batman gave Dick a great alittle speech about killing and simple revenge.

Batman-"Then it will happen this way: You make the kill, but your pain doesn't die with Harvey, it grows. So you run out into the night to find another face, and another, and another, until one terrible morning you wake up and realize that revenge has become your whole life. And you won't know why."


Dick only was allowed to become robin at the end because Batman needed help to take down riddler and two-face.

 

[Two-Face]

First, this topic is NOT about whether Robin should be introduced. We've gone over that many times and I've made a new thread to keep that stuff out of here. To do otherwise is to demonstrate that you are either a jerk, a simpleton, or a pissflap.


So let's just say that a Robin character WILL be introduced at the end of movie 3 or at the beginning of a new trilogy (continuing the more serious approach of Nolans films). There would be many things to consider when adding him in, things you might initially take for granted. These are not often discussed.


For instance

- Dick Grayson might not even be the best option, especially when you can combine elements from several Robins into one. Would you have the acrobat, the hoodlum or the detective? Which bits would you take from the various personalities and origin stories?


- Robins costume works quite well in the comics but of course it'd be much harder to adapt for film than Batmans. Personally I'd adopt a recognisable look from outside the 'spandex' genre, eg. ninja, urban commando or 'modern medieval' Robin Hood. What changes and inspirations would you use?


- Would Robin even need a cape? Sure it's part of his classic costume (until recently ) but in BB the only reason Batman has a cape is to glide around. If Robin copies this trick it will make Batman less distinctive - while Robin could rely on a more unique mode of transport (freerunning!)
Same goes for the bandit mask, it wouldn't work, but is there any alternative?


- How important is age? Does Robin really need to be a child to serve his function? To me it was never about Batman taking care of an orphan... the kid doesn't need a guardian he needs a mentor. I'd put him at 18-20, which is still quite young to be partnering with a 30+ Batman. Older Robin also makes sense from a marketing and tonal perspective.


- This being Robins introduction the villain is very important. They should be part of the theme, like both villains in BB reflected separate themes. ????


-Who would you cast? Obviously it's a while off so just pretend that a contemporary actor will be the same age then as he is now. I guess we're talking about types and examples.


Again, if you really are against including Robin then please use this thread to explain how you'd make the best of the decision rather than just opposing it

Good points! but wrong forum. ithis should be in the sequels forum

 

[NinjaTurtleFan]

Best way to do Robin:

- Make him 15 or 16 years-old.

- Have his family killed by Zucco like in the comics.

-Bruce takes young Dick Grayson in, but really has no time to become a father-figure to him, nor does he really want the boy, but takes him in anyways because he feels sorry for him. Dick rarely talks, feels cold and distant after his parent's death, and just wishes to be left alone. Alfred befriends the boy but Bruce spends more of his time at Wayne Enterprises and trying to hunt down Zucco and his goons.

-Zucco should be tied to a Batman rogue from his rogue gallery.

- When Batman finally locates Zucco, he gets ambushed and blindsided. My idea would be add Bane in the movie and have him "break the Bat." Bruce realizes he is getting too old for this and after his encounter with Bane, he realizes for the first time he's scared.

- Alfred suggests maybe he trains the boy. Bruce is reluctant at first, but when crimesprees and a wave of police assaults start rising up since Batman's absence, Bruce starts to see he is needed again, but must make a fighter and a partner out of the young lad.

-Finally, in the end they become Batman and Robin and take down Zucco, Bane, and what other supervillain you can throw into the mix.

 

[Lobster Charlie]

Best way to do Robin:

Don't do it all. Give it up.

Have a nice day!

 

[El Payaso]

First, this topic is NOT about whether Robin should be introduced. We've gone over that many times and I've made a new thread to keep that stuff out of here. To do otherwise is to demonstrate that you are either a jerk, a simpleton, or a pissflap.

I appreciate your words but iof we're talking of

a decision that has already been made.

We already know what that Nolan desicion is. So to start a Robin thread about a decision that leads to no Robin is... you know the idea behind.


Anyway, no one is glad with the original Robin. Everyone starts from Tim Drake suit. That speaks volumes about the character's vision.

 

[chamber-music]

I would use Jason Todd and give him the current robins costume but in a very dark red and no yellow on the inside of the cape.

 

[tamron]

Can't remember who it was, but someone on these boards came up with these Robin costume concepts based off of the BB League of Shadows ninja garb. Were Robin to appear, I would go for a similar design.

I agree with Adam West, incorporate elements of all three Robins origins. An acrobat whose parents are killed, he runs away from the circus, figuring he will exact revenge on his parents killers. Batman is on the case, and by chance saves Robin from getting killed. He first drops him off with Leslie Thompkins, but when he runs away again, Bruce is forced to take him in to rein him in.

I would figure a good age range would be 14-16. Young enough where he needs a mentor, not so young as to be creepy.

 

[Rorschach2012]

i dont like the costume or the age in those pics bleh!

 

[Robin91939]

Robin should not be introduced until at the very soonest, the last act of movie 3. Dick Grayson, on the other hand, should be introduced in either the second act of movie two, or the first act of movie three (if he were to become Robin at any point) or just any time in movie three (if he is not going to become Robin in the trilogy).

If he becomes Robin:
-Have him introduced as Dick Grayson in movie two. He is not scouted out by Bruce Wayne, but Bruce is very interested in the boys talents. He attends the Circus charity with Selina. You can have the backstory of how his mother loved the circus and the money she used to raise through it would go to the Children's hospital of Gotham...this would be the only reason Bruce would entertain the idea of attending. That, and Alfred's insistence of Bruce's "bachelor persona".
-In part of the gang war the Joker started, Zucco, Maroni and the Falcones are in a deadly battle. The Circus is a racket of Maroni. Zucco attacks the circus as an act against Maroni. The Graysons are caught in the crossfire.
-The boy is kicked around for most of the movie, we get a few short quick scenes following where he is. A similar scene with Gordon telling him "it's okay" as the one between young Bruce and Gordon 20 years ago.
-Bruce takes the boy in to train him and also to improve his image after burning his own house down.
-He sees great hope in Dick. But also sees a grave threat. He sees the same anger and thirst for vengeance in Dick's eyes as he did in his own years ago. He recalls Ra's and his guidance and how easy it was to get lost in the darkness. He couldn't afford to let Dick conceit to the darkness, he could become very formidable left to his own devices.
-Batman remembers Ra's and the idea of being a symbol, immortal. That he himself will one day be gone and the work he does must continue, enter Dick.


Movie Three:
-Dick is trained by Bruce and by the end of the film dons the costume much like DARK VICTORY without Bruce's knowledge and saves him against Two-Face and the Joker.



If he doesn't become Robin.
-Just everything I outlined in movie two, but place it in movie three. Just have the final scene in the film be an exchange between Bruce and Alfred (much like that at the end of BATMAN BEGINS in the rubble of the Manor).

ALFRED
And what of the boy?

BRUCE
He needs me. He's apart of this now.

ALFRED
If I may sir, I think it's you who needs him.
(beat)
You've seen what tragedy can do to a young man. You've lost Mr. Dent to it, and almost yourself all those years ago. But if you are keeping this boy only to rectify your own demons-

BRUCE
No. This is something he wants to do.

ALFRED
What does he want, sir?

BRUCE
I'm going to train him.


FADE TO BLACK​

Then end with another rooftop scene with Batman and Gordon.

Robin can work. Dick Grayson can work. Any character can work if they are done respectfully. And any character can be broken if done irresponsibly (BATMAN RETURNS, BATMAN FOREVER, BATMAN & ROBIN) just because, Batman, Penguin, Robin, Mr. Freeze, Poison Ivy, Riddler, Two-Face, Bane and Batgirl were done poorly in these movies doesn't mean they were bad characters...I hate when people reference Schumaker's Robin as a reason Robin couldn't work. I could do the same and say Nolan shouldn't do Two-Face because of what Schumaker did to him. These great characters are stronger than one directors vision. Let's see it on screen.

-R

 

[Matt.S99]

i know who drew them just dont know his name on these boreds,his name on bytb is phil
and as for which robin,i would use tim drake,but a little older,probably my age(14 or even 16-18,but looks younger)i have a casting choice just i know people wont like it so ill keep it secret

 

[Sun_Down]

ALFRED
And what of the boy?

BRUCE
He needs me. He's apart of this now.

ALFRED
If I may sir, I think it's you who needs him.
(beat)
You've seen what tragedy can do to a young man. You've lost Mr. Dent to it, and almost yourself all those years ago. But if you are keeping this boy only to rectify your own demons-

BRUCE
No. This is something he wants to do.

ALFRED
What does he want, sir?

BRUCE
I'm going to train him.


FADE TO BLACK​

Then end with another rooftop scene with Batman and Gordon.

Robin can work. Dick Grayson can work. Any character can work if they are done respectfully. And any character can be broken if done irresponsibly (BATMAN RETURNS, BATMAN FOREVER, BATMAN & ROBIN) just because, Batman, Penguin, Robin, Mr. Freeze, Poison Ivy, Riddler, Two-Face, Bane and Batgirl were done poorly in these movies doesn't mean they were bad characters...I hate when people reference Schumaker's Robin as a reason Robin couldn't work. I could do the same and say Nolan shouldn't do Two-Face because of what Schumaker did to him. These great characters are stronger than one directors vision. Let's see it on screen.

-R

I really like that exchange. I can really hear Caine and Bale saying those lines. Nice work

And great point about the villains. So many people have written Robin off completely, but if you really think about it, he's no less believable than the Joker or Two-Face, he just needs to be handled with the same care and seriousness as Batman was in BB.

 

[astheniac]

I'm dead set against robin, BUT if it had to happen:

His parents death would have to be an accident that was partly batmans fault, its the only way i could see bales batman taking that much sympathy on the kid. and secondly his costume would have to be something like the costume in Kingdom Come

Because as cool as i honestly do think it looks sometimes, i just don't buy the whole "a mask over his eyes means no-one has a clue who he is" thing, not in nolans reality-grounded world at least.

 

[Matt.S99]

if it has a different mask and symbol,im happy

 

[Matt.S99]

i like the cape

 

[astheniac]

i didn't mean exactly because the red wouldn't work, more the idea of the mask protecting his identity because in reality it just wouldn't work.

 

[Robin91939]

I think that Nolan and Bale's minds might be changed.

Bale especially LOVES Frank Miller's interpretation of Batman. Now, Frank Miller is giving his interpretation of Robin in a gritty story "ALL STAR BATMAN AND ROBIN THE BOY WONDER" I think that it might change his mind a little.

-R