Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. Agents of SHIELD TV series for ABC - General Discussion - Part 7

[Lord]

It didn't trully get great until Season 2, but still hit many right notes, aimed right at what it was trying to do and told a strong story, introducing well the characters and mythology.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Short of Coulson and Skye,none of the characters have grown. Ward alternates btw. Grumpy and blank expressions, while Maye is permanently pissed off,

are you watching a different show?

Fitz and Simmons as well as Skye have already grown alot since the show began... Fitz and Simmons looked lost outside of there lab.. and now can stand on there own.

May's cold persona has been stripping away and we've been learning exactly what makes her tick (she's even gotten softer) especially as we learn why she does what she does. She's very much the tough love character...

Ward other than the development of his brother dying, is the only one who really hasn't grown much.... and is the one i see as the most expendable.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

It didn't trully get great until Season 2, but still hit many right notes, aimed right at what it was trying to do and told a strong story, introducing well the characters and mythology.

the only thing season 1 had going for it was that it was pretty much the only show of it's kind, and the first of it's kind. It wouldn't last if it re-aired today.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

The problem is that the protagonists are the "normal ones" whereas the rest of the world is far more larger-than-life.

that's the point of the show and been it's conception since the beginning...

 

[Shikamaru]

that's the point of the show and been it's conception since the beginning...

Exactly. The point is that it is a flawed concept. People tune into this universe to see larger-than-life characters. Normal characters don't have that same level of appea. This show should have had less bland characters from that start in that sense.

 

[Lord]

the only thing season 1 had going for it was that it was pretty much the only show of it's kind, and the first of it's kind. It wouldn't last if it re-aired today.

If it aired today it's obvious that the show itself would be much different, that's just the nature of the beast, Citizen Kane and Star Wars would probably not stand as well if they were created today.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Exactly. The point is that it is a flawed concept. People tune into this universe to see larger-than-life characters. Normal characters don't have that same level of appea. This show should have had less bland characters from that start in that sense.

to YOU. It's hardly a flawed concept. This same concept is exactly what the new Gotham show is doing, and it's the same reason one of the most beloved graphic novels MARVELS is still celebrated today.

if you don't like the concept, then this show obviously isn't meant for you.

This show is not, nor was it ever going to be the show you wanted. That's not the show's fault for being what it is or what it wants to be. Many of us like this concept alot. It's not for everyone (thus the dropped ratings) but The ratings are still pretty good so quite alot of us are perfectly happy

 

[spideyboy_1111]

If it aired today it's obvious that the show itself would be much different, that's just the nature of the beast, Citizen Kane and Star Wars would probably not stand as well if they were created today.

im aware. i'm just stating that nostalgia can cloud an opinion far more than quality.

 

[Lord]

im aware. i'm just stating that nostalgia can cloud an opinion far more than quality.

I started watching Buffy some 4 years ago, so it's clearly not Nostalgia, when i started watching it, it had already ended, even the comic book season 8 was close to ending

 

[spideyboy_1111]

I started watching Buffy some 4 years ago, so it's clearly not Nostalgia, when i started watching it, it had already ended, even the comic book season 8 was close to ending

I watched the show late as well.. finished right before season 8, and i can still say season 1 was pretty boring for anyone but Buffy

 

[Shikamaru]

to YOU. It's hardly a flawed concept. This same concept is exactly what the new Gotham show is doing, and it's the same reason one of the most beloved graphic novels MARVELS is still celebrated today.

if you don't like the concept, then this show obviously isn't meant for you

There is a huge misconception here. There is nothing wrong with characters like Ward and Skye (or Gordon, for the Gotham show). They can still be SHIELD agents. Them not having any powers is fine. Them just being young people growing into the SHIELD role is fine. Them being on a plane with Coulson is fine. But they don't feel enough larger-than-life. That is the problem. They feel too normal.

Assuming he is the same Gordon of the comics, Gordon in the Gotham show won't have that problem. Why? Because he is still a very complex character in his own right and thus has that larger-than-life vibe to him, even if he isn't dressed as a bat or does everything Batman does.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

There is a huge misconception here. There is nothing wrong with characters like Ward and Skye (or Gordon, for the Gotham show). They can still be SHIELD agents. Them not having any powers is fine. Them just being young people growing into the SHIELD role is fine. Them being on a plane with Coulson is fine. But they don't feel enough larger-than-life. That is the problem. They feel too normal.

Assuming he is the same Gordon of the comics, Gordon in the Gotham show won't have that problem. Why? Because he is still a very complex character in his own right and thus has that larger-than-life vibe to him, even if he isn't dressed as a bat or does everything Batman does.

meh, in all honesty.. while i enjoy Arrow quite alot.. it's still smallville level of complexity.. and i think so far Shield is not only on par with that, if not more. I still think the agents are more complex than most cop/procedural shows that last for year on television...

this show is moving forward and in the right way. Sorry it's not instant for you, but many of us are perfectly happy. if you don't like it, no one is forcing you to watch it

 

[Shikamaru]

meh, in all honesty.. while i enjoy Arrow quite alot.. it's still smallville level of complexity.. and i think so far Shield is not only on par with that, if not more. I still think the agents are more complex than most cop/procedural shows that last for year on television...

Cool. But now you're on a whole different topic altogether.

this show is moving forward and in the right way. Sorry it's not instant for you, but many of us are perfectly happy. if you don't like it, no one is forcing you to watch it

So in other words, you have no idea what you're talking about. I stated many times that I'm perfectly happy with the show so far since the second half started. Even said that I hope the show continues at the exact rate as these last 2 episodes, thus I don't know where you get the idea that I'm "unhappy" with the direction in which the show is currently moving. But if you want to jump to baseless conclusions like that, sure.

 

[Human Torch]

The characters are NOT supposed to be "larger than life".That's the whole point of the show.It's amusing that not many seem to grasp that core element of the concept.

It's equally amusing that I thought I'd hate the show for those very reasons.I'm sure people with time to kill could find my posts from before the show started where I said the show would be a big snooze.

But,(I,reasoned ) I like Coulson,I'll give it a shot the year or two it lasts.I went into it knowing what to expect,and they gave me just that.I thought the cast was good,and while the writing wasn't earth-shakingly good,nor was it awful.I could see it had potential that it's been reaching for the past several episodes.

I like the concept of comic characters on the show,but if the wanted to make a show based around an existing character,they would've done it.(and they will do it on Netfix apparently) But the show is what it is.And I suppose you already know by now if it's your cup of tea or not.

As a fan of Arrow,I think both shows provide a great contrast.On Arrow,I get the Superhero heroics in the traditional manner that AoS doesn't provide,but in the same way there's a sense of fun and mystery following the characters that AoS provides that the soap-laden plots of Arrow doesn't allow.

 

[Dark Raven]

Watch an ABC show like Castle. That has no "supers" in it, because it's a show about normal, regular people who are still heroes. Yet that cast and all the characters are far more engaging and charismatic than any of the actors in AOS.

The Blacklist is another show that doesn't contain any "supers". Yet James Spader has the charisma to drive the entire show by himself, and Megan Boone and Harry Lennix are no slouches either.

I wouldn't care if they didn't have any super-powered characters in AOS as long as they gave us better actors in the role, better characters and better plotting. Castle is fairly episodic but occasionally has a bigger story arc. However, it still is miles above AOS.

If they can't give us better actors (as it's a little late now), then AOS need to add someone with the charisma of James Spader to the cast who will literally infuse the entire show with his dominant personality and change the entire dynamics of both the team and the way the other actors play off this star player.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Cool. But now you're on a whole different topic altogether.



So in other words, you have no idea what you're talking about. I stated many times that I'm perfectly happy with the show so far since the second half started. Even said that I hope the show continues at the exact rate as these last 2 episodes, thus I don't know where you get the idea that I'm "unhappy" with the direction in which the show is currently moving. But if you want to jump to baseless conclusions like that, sure.

No i know what i'm talking about, your opinion just obviously wasn't very clear.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

The characters are NOT supposed to be "larger than life".That's the whole point of the show.It's amusing that not many seem to grasp that core element of the concept.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Watch an ABC show like Castle. That has no "supers" in it, because it's a show about normal, regular people who are still heroes. Yet that cast and all the characters are far more engaging and charismatic than any of the actors in AOS.

The Blacklist is another show that doesn't contain any "supers". Yet James Spader has the charisma to drive the entire show by himself, and Megan Boone and Harry Lennix are no slouches either.

I wouldn't care if they didn't have any super-powered characters in AOS as long as they gave us better actors in the role, better characters and better plotting. Castle is fairly episodic but occasionally has a bigger story arc. However, it still is miles above AOS.

If they can't give us better actors (as it's a little late now), then AOS need to add someone with the charisma of James Spader to the cast who will literally infuse the entire show with his dominant personality and change the entire dynamics of both the team and the way the other actors play off this star player.

i think one big trade off is the fact that unfortuantely when a show has big budget effects, and takes place in a much bigger world (than those in both Castle and Black List) there is a factor of not as great writting. No one is acting like this show should get an emmy for it's writting, but for what the show is, it's fun, and fine. For me, i compare it to Once Upon A Time, the writting and acting isn't anywhere near ... lets say The Black List, Breaking Bad, or American Horror Story.. but it's also not trying to be. I see another common error and that's when people start watching more and more 13 episodic drama seasons.. with high quality and great actors.. they start expecting other shows to be the same.. and they're not, and shouldn't really be compared.

 

[JB-the-Hunter]

Watch an ABC show like Castle. That has no "supers" in it, because it's a show about normal, regular people who are still heroes. Yet that cast and all the characters are far more engaging and charismatic than any of the actors in AOS.

The Blacklist is another show that doesn't contain any "supers". Yet James Spader has the charisma to drive the entire show by himself, and Megan Boone and Harry Lennix are no slouches either.

I wouldn't care if they didn't have any super-powered characters in AOS as long as they gave us better actors in the role, better characters and better plotting. Castle is fairly episodic but occasionally has a bigger story arc. However, it still is miles above AOS.

If they can't give us better actors (as it's a little late now), then AOS need to add someone with the charisma of James Spader to the cast who will literally infuse the entire show with his dominant personality and change the entire dynamics of both the team and the way the other actors play off this star player.

The actors are nothing special, aside from Clark Gregg, but they all play their parts well, and the characters and their interactions with each other are all entertaining. I can't quite see where you're coming from.

Any problems I have had with the show have nothing to do with the cast or the characters, but rather the occasionally spotty writing. I want every episode to be great all the way through like FZZT was, rather than just being decent with a lot of good moments and bad moments. FZZT, while not very comicy, is an example of consistently good writing. If they can provide an episode like that, but with more comic book flair, that would be ideal for me.

 

[cherokeesam]

The show was pitched, and still is, as "normal humans in a world with supers", not as "a show about supers". How is this even in debate?

Oh, I dunno, maybe because Skye is an 084 with hundreds of people literally killing themselves over her, and because Coulson is now a "thing," by the Bad Doctor's own reckoning?

Let's see: super-spies Ward and May; 084 Skye; super-genius FitzSimmons; space alien Phil Coulson; cyborgs Deathlok (Agent Peterson) and John Garrett....

....good luck finding your "normal, regular rag-tag underdog humans" amongst that lot, WT. And Spidey-boy.

 

[Whiskey Tango]

Hey sam, from now on just don't quote or respond to anything I say, alright? Put me on ignore, whatever. I am sick of this condescending attitude you have whenever someone disagrees with your ridiculous fanfic. We've already been into it twice over your crap and I've had it. Enough is enough.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Oh, I dunno, maybe because Skye is an 084 with hundreds of people literally killing themselves over her, and because Coulson is now a "thing," by the Bad Doctor's own reckoning?

Let's see: super-spies Ward and May; 084 Skye; super-genius FitzSimmons; space alien Phil Coulson; cyborgs Deathlok (Agent Peterson) and John Garrett....

....good luck finding your "normal, regular rag-tag underdog humans" amongst that lot, WT. And Spidey-boy.

Ok beyond whatever the hell you think coulson is... Until there's definitive proof about either coulson or skye ... Lets not act like there's definitive proof

And i never said they were "regular" no shield agent is your average human being..... They just arnt "super powered"

Mike Peterson/ Deathlok also is not a lead cast member on the show, he's a reoccuring guest on the show... There's no point in bringing him up until he becomes a major cast member. And even then... Shows evolve. I assumed eventually some one with powers would join the team... Its not like shield in the comics is without supers or telepaths

They're just not the initial focus of the show

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Hey sam, from now on just don't quote or respond to anything I say, alright? Put me on ignore, whatever. I am sick of this condescending attitude you have whenever someone disagrees with your ridiculous fanfic. We've already been into it twice over your crap and I've had it. Enough is enough.

I share mutual thoughts...

Sam, sometimes i agree with ya man... And sometimes i don't. You run with your assumptions as fact farrrrrr too often and act holier than thou because if it. Its pretty much like trying to have a discussion with a brick wall. There's no point

 

[cherokeesam]

Hey sam, from now on just don't quote or respond to anything I say, alright? Put me on ignore, whatever. I am sick of this condescending attitude you have whenever someone disagrees with your ridiculous fanfic. We've already been into it twice over your crap and I've had it. Enough is enough.

Pot: kettle: black.

 

[cherokeesam]

I share mutual thoughts...

Sam, sometimes i agree with ya man... And sometimes i don't. You run with your assumptions as fact farrrrrr too often and act holier than thou because if it. Its pretty much like trying to have a discussion with a brick wall. There's no point

I don't give a damn if people agree with my speculations or opinions or not. That's *never* part of the equation. Whether I'm right or wrong in an argument, I don't care; I'm just expressing an opinion. The only times I get into "holier than thou/condescending" mode, if that's what you want to call it, is when YOU guys start in with snark and snide insults. Damn straight I'll throw that **** back in your faces.

Learn to debate with some decorum, and I'll gladly extend the courtesy. Otherwise, I can sling mud same as you guys.