Anubis' "How would you do it?" Thread.

[deemar325]

Not much into Blade, but I'll get into what I always felt was "wrong" with him. Mainly, he is too simple of a character to be long-lasting for very long; his vendetta against vampires basically locks him into a very static and inflexible genre, especially since Marvel doesn't really invest much into "horror" after October and the market, they claim, is not there. True, Kirkman's WALKING DEAD is getting critical raves, but it sells like garbage.

Now, there are plenty of characters who have been "stale men of action" who have managed to be in successful series, but one needs to do more with them. Firstly, Blade needs a more stable supporting cast; usually he just gets involved with various groups of vampire hunters who all get killed. These characters need to give him ways to flesh himself out emotionally, make friends, even lovers.

Secondly, Blade has to get more tragic in a sense; here is someone who, much like a mutant, is cursed by what he was born as, and has shut out EVERYTHING in his life in pursuit of a goal that seems to never end. For every vampire he kills, more crop up. Dracula keeps getting resurrected. Not even Dr. Strange, the Sorceror Supreme, could kill every vampire on earth for long. Not saying we need 5 issues of Blade crying and talking to wall or something, but he needs to become more of a character, and not a walking "attitude and action sequence" man. Someone needs to hit home that maybe he needs to find some additional purpose in his life beyond killing vampires, because he may need one eventually. Maybe he even QUITS for a while and tries it, to rediscover who he is. For too long Blade has seemed like yet another archetype.

Thirdly, he needs to grow a good haircut. Tired of every black hero being bald now, and the afro look was rather lame in the 70's.

And fourthly, he needs to become a staple of the Marvel universe by establishing, DE FACTO, that he is THE authority on vampires. No one, not even Dr. Strange in a sense, knows as much details about vampires and all their vast powers. Everyone has to have something.

Blade also may need some writers/artists who can capture his pulp hero feel, like Hellboy and The Goon have. Of course, again, neither Hellboy or The Goon sell the way Marvel likes. Marvel should accept that some books exist to fill a niche and to tell a good story, not to outsell something. Blade's stories should be exotic, urban thrillers, and perhaps this means a better class of villians. True, this may mean "vampires with gimmicks", but how about others? How about gothies who pretend to be vampires, a serial killer who also takes on the motif, or maybe even people who, like in a CROW movie, seek to capture Blade and drain some of his blood to get a little power. Every good hero needs some villians and relying on Dracula all the time barely works for CASTELVANIA games these days. What would happen if a vamp Blade happens to kill was also a mafia boss with some very angry allies? That sort of thing. Get creative, but still workable within that pulp thing (like no "Blade in space" stories, unless maybe some vampires were in a space station for some reason...).

I like that reasoning, Blade needs to move beyond the 'Ghoul of the month' mix it up. I'd be happy if they threw in some werewolves (Colombian druglord werewolves!)

 

[deemar325]

I had an idea of a vampire sect made up of turned mutants. Imagine an X-Gene coupled with the power of a vampire. I'd also like to see him take on other supernatural things like Werewolves or ghosts or devil worshipers or whatever. Gotta be more to him than killing Vamps. Nazis are always nice. but hellboys kinda got that genre locked.

I had an idea for a whole line of books that focus on the supernatural. Like Strange and Brother Voodoo, and Blade, and I also had an idea for a new character who fits something I have yet to see from Marvel. A John Constantine type of character. The type of guy that deals in the dirty side of magic. Not this defending the mulitverse from some supernatural entity but some dude who takes on a serial killer who takes out people on the Astral Plane. Or a guy who steals souls for a shot at eternal life. weird, black magic type of s**t. I can't do it justice, but I figure somebody like Alan Moore or Grant Morrision would have a field day. A guy who looks like a grown up Harry Potter, only shabby and depressed. He also suffers from OCD and is all crazy and anal about everything. Like if Monk was a paranormal investigator.

I like! right on.

 

[Anubis]

Precisely, and Marvel needs to realize that copying what worked in 1995 won't work because they can't use high sales as an excuse to continue it. Nearly every X-spinoff launched in 2004 was cancelled one after the other, from JUBILEE to NIGHTCRAWLER to NYX's lateness and so on. The X-Line is horribly stretched, won't sell books by itself anymore aside for a handful of titles, and can't support their entire universe on its back if DC steps up their game with something beyond Batman and Superman, which they certainly have this year.

How about what they did for HOWLING COMMANDOES; a 2-3 page preview in a slew of their comics, a different one every few weeks. One month it's a few pages of MTU, maybe next it is SHE-HULK or RUNAWAYS.

They Promote what they wanna promote. I mean, that Howling Commandoes trash was put in because, guess what? It's Hollowen. Lets see if we can get these saps to buy it. Meanwhile, the books that are actually good, that are actually about something, are forced to fend for themselves. You've pointed it out many a time before. Word of mouth can only do so much. Because Fanboys are a stubborn lot. And you can only convince so many to change their buying habits. It's gotten to the point were I don't even care anymore. Someone wants a recommendation, I'll toss out a few. But I'm no longer activly trying to get people to read books I enjoy. It's a lost cause. The book might get canned. But another ground breaking peice of art will come along, that nobody will buy except me, and I'll enjoy that in it's place. Thats all any of us can do really. I don't know. I don't really wanna sit here and complain about crap I know little about. I don't understand the business side of things. I've always been about the art form. I figure if your gonna put out art, then support the f**King art. How can it get a chance if your too caught up in your focus groups, and projections of what you "THINK" the people want. Most people don't even know what they like because their too focused on the same old crap they shove in front of em. Never gonna try anything new because f**kin Spider-Man aint on the cover. So whats wrong with two or three pages at the end of ASM previewing that little comic that isn't selling so well, but has so much critic acclaim and a small loyal fanbase? But they don't think like that. And I'm probally an idoit for thinking that they should.

 

[Zoken]

What if they went back to what worked in like the eighties or so. multiple stories per book? I mean, I know people have issues about decompression and all, but what if you dedicate half the book to one story line, then the other half to another. you can cut the number of X-Books in half, and still tell all the stories, but in a slower manner that requires the reader to pick up more books. it makes sense to me. I mean I have a title wherein half of it is the death of Proteus 2, and the other half is Mystique saying her last good bye to Destiny... heck, there was even time for them to show Freedom Force.

 

[Dread]

They Promote what they wanna promote. I mean, that Howling Commandoes trash was put in because, guess what? It's Hollowen. Lets see if we can get these saps to buy it. Meanwhile, the books that are actually good, that are actually about something, are forced to fend for themselves. You've pointed it out many a time before. Word of mouth can only do so much. Because Fanboys are a stubborn lot. And you can only convince so many to change their buying habits. It's gotten to the point were I don't even care anymore. Someone wants a recommendation, I'll toss out a few. But I'm no longer activly trying to get people to read books I enjoy. It's a lost cause. The book might get canned. But another ground breaking peice of art will come along, that nobody will buy except me, and I'll enjoy that in it's place. Thats all any of us can do really. I don't know. I don't really wanna sit here and complain about crap I know little about. I don't understand the business side of things. I've always been about the art form. I figure if your gonna put out art, then support the f**King art. How can it get a chance if your too caught up in your focus groups, and projections of what you "THINK" the people want. Most people don't even know what they like because their too focused on the same old crap they shove in front of em. Never gonna try anything new because f**kin Spider-Man aint on the cover. So whats wrong with two or three pages at the end of ASM previewing that little comic that isn't selling so well, but has so much critic acclaim and a small loyal fanbase? But they don't think like that. And I'm probally an idoit for thinking that they should.

I agree on this little rant here, too often when art and business become dependant on something, like comics, the former suffers because of the latter. At the very least, the buisness end of relying on digests now has revived some books and saved others from the chopping block...at least for another few months.

Fans alone can't do it; Marvel needs to seriously consider what they and their puppets at WIZARD or NEWSRAMA or something can do to actually make some of the high sellers they seek. Not everything can be a Bendis book, but how about launching a slew of books that sell 33,000 copies a month regularly like EXILES does?

What if they went back to what worked in like the eighties or so. multiple stories per book? I mean, I know people have issues about decompression and all, but what if you dedicate half the book to one story line, then the other half to another. you can cut the number of X-Books in half, and still tell all the stories, but in a slower manner that requires the reader to pick up more books. it makes sense to me. I mean I have a title wherein half of it is the death of Proteus 2, and the other half is Mystique saying her last good bye to Destiny... heck, there was even time for them to show Freedom Force.

X-MEN: DEADLY GENESIS seems to be doing that with back-up stories introducing new mutant characters. It's not a bad idea to have some back-up tales, especially as comics reach a $3 average. The problem is that it is easy for those stories to be overlooked.

 

[Anubis]

What if they went back to what worked in like the eighties or so. multiple stories per book? I mean, I know people have issues about decompression and all, but what if you dedicate half the book to one story line, then the other half to another. you can cut the number of X-Books in half, and still tell all the stories, but in a slower manner that requires the reader to pick up more books. it makes sense to me. I mean I have a title wherein half of it is the death of Proteus 2, and the other half is Mystique saying her last good bye to Destiny... heck, there was even time for them to show Freedom Force.

I really dig that idea. I was noticing that in X-Men: Deadly Genisis too. Both were very interesting reads. It's a concept that needs to make a come back.

 

[Dread]

I'd be happy if they threw in some werewolves (Colombian druglord werewolves!)

I read this and I instantly thought of the Lobo Brothers from 1988-89 issues of SPECTACULAR SPIDER-MAN. They were basically ganglord brothers who also had mutant powers that made them basically have the same shifting and prowess as mythical werewolves (as well as the same vulnerabilities, like silver and needing a full moon to shift fully). One of them died but Carlos Lobo is still in prison somewhere. You never know...

 

[Anubis]

I was thinking about a mini series, set in the alternate future where Humanity spread to the stars and started conquring worlds lead by their Galactic Avenger Battalion. (As seen in Avengers Forever) Focusing on Emperor Rickard in particular and the coming mass invasion by a combined force of Shi'Ar, Badoon, and Kree armies. As well as having to deal with the terrorist threat of the Gaurdians of the Galaxy.

 

[Zoken]

That'd be pretty good, throw in a deal-with-the-devil situation with the brood by someone. oh, and MR. IMMORTAL!

 

[Anubis]

Gotta have Mr. Immortal.

 

[deemar325]

They Promote what they wanna promote. I mean, that Howling Commandoes trash was put in because, guess what? It's Hollowen. Lets see if we can get these saps to buy it. Meanwhile, the books that are actually good, that are actually about something, are forced to fend for themselves. You've pointed it out many a time before. Word of mouth can only do so much. Because Fanboys are a stubborn lot. And you can only convince so many to change their buying habits. It's gotten to the point were I don't even care anymore. Someone wants a recommendation, I'll toss out a few. But I'm no longer activly trying to get people to read books I enjoy. It's a lost cause. The book might get canned. But another ground breaking peice of art will come along, that nobody will buy except me, and I'll enjoy that in it's place. Thats all any of us can do really. I don't know. I don't really wanna sit here and complain about crap I know little about. I don't understand the business side of things. I've always been about the art form. I figure if your gonna put out art, then support the f**King art. How can it get a chance if your too caught up in your focus groups, and projections of what you "THINK" the people want. Most people don't even know what they like because their too focused on the same old crap they shove in front of em. Never gonna try anything new because f**kin Spider-Man aint on the cover. So whats wrong with two or three pages at the end of ASM previewing that little comic that isn't selling so well, but has so much critic acclaim and a small loyal fanbase? But they don't think like that. And I'm probally an idoit for thinking that they should.

*clap.clap.clap*

 

[DBM]

So, I’ve been thinking a lot about Nick Fury lately. As many of you know, he’s pretty much my favorite character and I’ve taken the time to collect every appearance of him in comics (in one form or another, some are in reprints).

The thing I’ve been thinking about the most is how Marvel’s “floating timeline” affects Nick Fury. As the timeline keeps moving forward, with the “start” of the Marvel Universe taking place at a perpetual “10-15 years ago” it continues to age Fury more and more. He got his start in WWII and thanks to the Infinity Formula is still in the prime of his life. As the timeline stands right now, Nick Fury is at least 80 years old.

But as the timeline moves forward, the start of SHIELD moves forward as well, which leaves an ever growing gap in between Fury’s time in WWII and when he took over as Director of SHIELD. During that gap he worked for the OSS for a short time and then the CIA once it was created. Rough guessing it, I’d say that Fury had at least 40 years between the time he got out of the military and when he took over SHIELD. Most of that time spent working for the CIA during the real heart of the Cold War. And while a few stories are set in this time period, it’s mostly been ignored.

Having said all of that, I would propose a new ongoing Nick Fury series that takes place during this gap in his history. The time when we see the real formation of what Nick Fury is to become in the present day.

The key thing to remember about this series would be that it’s not the Nick Fury most people are aware of. When Nick Fury was first seen it was during WWII where he was a rough, gruff Sergeant leading his men in battle. When he showed up in the “modern” Marvel universe, he was already a suave secret agent (especially after Steranko got a hold of him). But what I would want to show in this new series was how he went from point A during WWII to point B in the modern world. How did he go from an uneducated army sergeant to the slickest spy in the world? That would be the main thrust of the story.

We’d see Nick Fury coming out of the army and into the OSS, then dealing with the changeover into the CIA. We’d see him developing the skills of strategy and infiltration that we take for granted in the modern day. We’d see the development of a man who has to learn to see the big picture because he’s living through decades and decades of history and is still expected to go on. We’d see the happier Nick Fury, back in the days before he became cynical and overbearing. It’d show Nick Fury being a spy during the Cold War, not the leader of a paramilitary organization in the modern age.

This would obviously be a period piece, much like the original Sgt. Fury and the Howling Commandoes was. I see the stories being told out of chronological order though, with each story arc taking place in a different time. In the 50s all the way through the 80’s.

These would be spy stories plain and simple. Espionage, disguises, deception, infiltration and plots within plots would be the ongoing MO of the series. Take one part Jack Ryan, one part James Bond, one part Jack Bauer and have it incubated inside of John Wayne and you’ll get a feel for what Nick Fury will be like.

I see the first story arc to be set very early on in Nick Fury’s career as a spy, in the late 40’s/early 50’s. WWII is just over, rebuilding has begun, and the Cold War is just getting started. While Fury is no stranger to the world, he is fairly new to the intelligence game at this point. His not quite as suave and collected as we see the modern Nick Fury. He’s going to make mistakes, and sometimes serious mistakes.

The main story throughout the first arc will focus on Fury trying to identify the double agent(s) in the CIA’s network. Due to his experience in Europe during WWII and his nearly unwavering loyalty to the US, Nick Fury is seen as the perfect man to go to Berlin and ferret out a double agent or agents that are leaking information to the Russians. Sent in undercover with a fake back story, he’s immediately met with suspicion. No one trusts him and he knows he can’t trust anyone else because at least one of them is a double agent. This mission is the one where Nick Fury really learns to stand on his own. While he’s never really been dependent on others, he’s always known someone was there to back him up. This time he has to sink or swim on his own. A twist at the end leads Fury to realize just how complex espionage really is. Things aren’t as black and white as they had seemed to him before. And the key thing he learns is that once you add just a little bit of black into the white, no matter how much white you add in, you’ll always have gray.

Also these stories would be firmly established as in the Marvel universe, no quasi-connected stories like Ennis does. These stories would interweave themselves between the already existing stories in the Marvel Universe that take place during this time period with as little retconning as possible. Nick Fury might team up with Wolverine at some point, not because Wolverine is the ubiquitous guest star but because Wolverine was also a spy during that time. Fury might fight a plot against the Red Skull, but in the 50’s it wouldn’t be the German Red Skull but rather the Communist Red Skull. And one story I would absolutely love to tell would be how Nick Fury recruited Richard Parker into the Agency (as briefly seen in Untold Tales of Spider-Man # -1).

So that’s my Nick Fury idea. What do you think?

 

[Dread]

So, I’ve been thinking a lot about Nick Fury lately. As many of you know, he’s pretty much my favorite character and I’ve taken the time to collect every appearance of him in comics (in one form or another, some are in reprints).

The thing I’ve been thinking about the most is how Marvel’s “floating timeline” affects Nick Fury. As the timeline keeps moving forward, with the “start” of the Marvel Universe taking place at a perpetual “10-15 years ago” it continues to age Fury more and more. He got his start in WWII and thanks to the Infinity Formula is still in the prime of his life. As the timeline stands right now, Nick Fury is at least 80 years old.

But as the timeline moves forward, the start of SHIELD moves forward as well, which leaves an ever growing gap in between Fury’s time in WWII and when he took over as Director of SHIELD. During that gap he worked for the OSS for a short time and then the CIA once it was created. Rough guessing it, I’d say that Fury had at least 40 years between the time he got out of the military and when he took over SHIELD. Most of that time spent working for the CIA during the real heart of the Cold War. And while a few stories are set in this time period, it’s mostly been ignored.

Having said all of that, I would propose a new ongoing Nick Fury series that takes place during this gap in his history. The time when we see the real formation of what Nick Fury is to become in the present day.

The key thing to remember about this series would be that it’s not the Nick Fury most people are aware of. When Nick Fury was first seen it was during WWII where he was a rough, gruff Sergeant leading his men in battle. When he showed up in the “modern” Marvel universe, he was already a suave secret agent (especially after Steranko got a hold of him). But what I would want to show in this new series was how he went from point A during WWII to point B in the modern world. How did he go from an uneducated army sergeant to the slickest spy in the world? That would be the main thrust of the story.

We’d see Nick Fury coming out of the army and into the OSS, then dealing with the changeover into the CIA. We’d see him developing the skills of strategy and infiltration that we take for granted in the modern day. We’d see the development of a man who has to learn to see the big picture because he’s living through decades and decades of history and is still expected to go on. We’d see the happier Nick Fury, back in the days before he became cynical and overbearing. It’d show Nick Fury being a spy during the Cold War, not the leader of a paramilitary organization in the modern age.

This would obviously be a period piece, much like the original Sgt. Fury and the Howling Commandoes was. I see the stories being told out of chronological order though, with each story arc taking place in a different time. In the 50s all the way through the 80’s.

These would be spy stories plain and simple. Espionage, disguises, deception, infiltration and plots within plots would be the ongoing MO of the series. Take one part Jack Ryan, one part James Bond, one part Jack Bauer and have it incubated inside of John Wayne and you’ll get a feel for what Nick Fury will be like.

I see the first story arc to be set very early on in Nick Fury’s career as a spy, in the late 40’s/early 50’s. WWII is just over, rebuilding has begun, and the Cold War is just getting started. While Fury is no stranger to the world, he is fairly new to the intelligence game at this point. His not quite as suave and collected as we see the modern Nick Fury. He’s going to make mistakes, and sometimes serious mistakes.

The main story throughout the first arc will focus on Fury trying to identify the double agent(s) in the CIA’s network. Due to his experience in Europe during WWII and his nearly unwavering loyalty to the US, Nick Fury is seen as the perfect man to go to Berlin and ferret out a double agent or agents that are leaking information to the Russians. Sent in undercover with a fake back story, he’s immediately met with suspicion. No one trusts him and he knows he can’t trust anyone else because at least one of them is a double agent. This mission is the one where Nick Fury really learns to stand on his own. While he’s never really been dependent on others, he’s always known someone was there to back him up. This time he has to sink or swim on his own. A twist at the end leads Fury to realize just how complex espionage really is. Things aren’t as black and white as they had seemed to him before. And the key thing he learns is that once you add just a little bit of black into the white, no matter how much white you add in, you’ll always have gray.

Also these stories would be firmly established as in the Marvel universe, no quasi-connected stories like Ennis does. These stories would interweave themselves between the already existing stories in the Marvel Universe that take place during this time period with as little retconning as possible. Nick Fury might team up with Wolverine at some point, not because Wolverine is the ubiquitous guest star but because Wolverine was also a spy during that time. Fury might fight a plot against the Red Skull, but in the 50’s it wouldn’t be the German Red Skull but rather the Communist Red Skull. And one story I would absolutely love to tell would be how Nick Fury recruited Richard Parker into the Agency (as briefly seen in Untold Tales of Spider-Man # -1).

So that’s my Nick Fury idea. What do you think?

Actually I like it, and think that it is actually very sellable to Marvel. Granted, Marvel's also been pushing out entirely random mini's starring low level characters these days (was there REALLY demand for Doc Savage, Silver Sable or Daughters of the Dragon? Because if there was, I surely missed it amung all the cries for MOON KNIGHT, THOR, or AVENGERS WEST COAST WRITTEN BY ANYONE BUT BENDIS...), but the point is I could very easily see Marvel putting out such a series and it selling well if it has a good writer and art. I agree that Nick Fury has become sort of a "gruff stereotype" that Ellis is likely going to mock with "Dirk Anger" in NEXTWAVE, and it gets just as old as when Batman is always being a jerkwad. Making someone a perpetual "gruff leader-man" 24/7 doesn't make them "realistic"; it makes them boring archetypes. And of course I like the "linking up continuity thing", because it's not a retcon; it's simply taking past material and elaborating. Peter Parker's parents were said to be spies for over 20 years now; it's not the same as, oh, claming Dr. Light raped Sue Dibney and she just quietly never mentioned it for about 30 years nor displayed any sort of reaction to it (just used that as an example to show that, yes, DC can retcon stuff too).

 

[Anubis]

Thats a great idea. Lost tales of a super spy.

 

[Zoken]

I have a new character for my Ultimate MC2 universe, but it needs some tweaking.

Weapon C. the latest edition to the weapons Plus program. He literally has the martial arts skills of Shang Chi, the Weapons Mastery of Frank Castle, the Healing abilities of Deadpool. and the stealth of a ghost. He is the remorseful tool of the Weapons Plus Program, kept when not in use on so many drugs that he can barely think straight, not to mention totally addicted to them. but even in his drug addled haze he has one dream: Freedom. he has one memory from before his incarceration: A beautiful tossing her hair and smiling at him. nothing else.

The thing is I want him to be someone from current marvel, but I'm not sure who. I don't want him to be any of the people I mention, though his powers and skills are literally copied off of them (I figure if they can remove memories they can implant skills).

So who should it be? Possible canidates:
Craig Hollis: Mr. Immortal
David Allyene: Prodigy
????????????: Patriot (I didn't start reading the Young Avengers title till recently so I'm not to good on their names yet).
Chase Stein: Talkback (With the added angst of the fact that Gert still carries a torch for him and thinks he's dead)

suggest away or pick one of them.

 

[Dread]

I have a new character for my Ultimate MC2 universe, but it needs some tweaking.

Weapon C. the latest edition to the weapons Plus program. He literally has the martial arts skills of Shang Chi, the Weapons Mastery of Frank Castle, the Healing abilities of Deadpool. and the stealth of a ghost. He is the remorseful tool of the Weapons Plus Program, kept when not in use on so many drugs that he can barely think straight, not to mention totally addicted to them. but even in his drug addled haze he has one dream: Freedom. he has one memory from before his incarceration: A beautiful tossing her hair and smiling at him. nothing else.

The thing is I want him to be someone from current marvel, but I'm not sure who. I don't want him to be any of the people I mention, though his powers and skills are literally copied off of them (I figure if they can remove memories they can implant skills).

So who should it be? Possible canidates:
Craig Hollis: Mr. Immortal
David Allyene: Prodigy
????????????: Patriot (I didn't start reading the Young Avengers title till recently so I'm not to good on their names yet).
Chase Stein: Talkback (With the added angst of the fact that Gert still carries a torch for him and thinks he's dead)

suggest away or pick one of them.

Patriot from YOUNG AVENGERS is named Eli Bradley.

 

[deemar325]

Good stuff DBM I'd read it. Good stuff!

 

[deemar325]

I have a new character for my Ultimate MC2 universe, but it needs some tweaking.

Weapon C. the latest edition to the weapons Plus program. He literally has the martial arts skills of Shang Chi, the Weapons Mastery of Frank Castle, the Healing abilities of Deadpool. and the stealth of a ghost. He is the remorseful tool of the Weapons Plus Program, kept when not in use on so many drugs that he can barely think straight, not to mention totally addicted to them. but even in his drug addled haze he has one dream: Freedom. he has one memory from before his incarceration: A beautiful tossing her hair and smiling at him. nothing else.

The thing is I want him to be someone from current marvel, but I'm not sure who. I don't want him to be any of the people I mention, though his powers and skills are literally copied off of them (I figure if they can remove memories they can implant skills).

So who should it be? Possible canidates:
Craig Hollis: Mr. Immortal
David Allyene: Prodigy
????????????: Patriot (I didn't start reading the Young Avengers title till recently so I'm not to good on their names yet).
Chase Stein: Talkback (With the added angst of the fact that Gert still carries a torch for him and thinks he's dead)

suggest away or pick one of them.

I'd go with Chase.

 

[Dread]

Alright, as I have basically run out of ideas for now, I figured I would go back into some of the past pages and pluck out some of my older ones, and see if I have anything to add or change. In doing so, I came across one that definately needs from updating from a few pages back.

Here's the link:
http://www.superherohype.com/forums/showthread.php?t=162747&page=11

It's basically AVENGERS: NEXT GENERATION, an idea that seems to become more and more "obsolete" with each issue of YOUNG AVENGERS, but because it takes a lot of past younger heroes as the cast I figure it could fit into the Marvel slot right now, so long as there is no AVENGERS WEST COAST sort of title. What I'll do is state the basic purpose, the cast, and the various details about the cast as pertaining to story ideas and direction. The link above was my last repost and take on this idea, and some of the ideas may repeat themselves, but bare with me.

The premise of AVENGERS: NEXT GENERATION is that in the wake of Disassembled, and probably M-Day and whatever other nasty events you want to think of, a few former Avengers get the idea that it may be a good idea to seek out the "next generation" of heroes (that is, heroes who are in their teens or 20's by this point) and try to make up for the mistakes of the past Avengers by helping form a more rounded out and balanced team in the future, since in a good 5-10 years, many of these heroes will (or should) be ready to fill in for the adults. And maybe sooner.

The INSTRUCTORS included:

Stingray: A definate lock, this series would see him get some more exposure as one of Marvel's resident genuises. Sure, he's no Reed Richards or even Tony Stark, but who says that you need to keep all your "smart guys" in the Illuminti? His Hydrobase would serve as one possible base for the Avengers: NG as well. He's been "dormant" as of late mostly because he has been spending time with his wife and because, despite the fact that he is capable of building a suit that could actually enable him to FIGHT Namor the Sub-Mariner and is pretty much a master ocean biologist (which includes a lot of biology), he is a sort of passive character who would feel right at home helping to show some new heroes the ropes. Until they're threatened, that is. Despite his incredibly potent mind and suit, I see him as having some esteem issues; he could easily be one of Marvel's greatest heroes if only he felt he deserved it. But he doesn't, and part of that is because of Tiger-Shark, his evil brother-in-law who he feels responsible for because of his love for his wife.

Justice & Firestar: I included them together because it's just easier that way. Much like Stringray, these two heroes were also heroes who in the end chose a family life over 24/7 superheroics (Firestar would be visibly pregnant by now with their first child). Both also managed to rise to the rank of Avengers and were good at what they did, overcoming the awe of the big time heroes, and had years of experience with the New Warriors. Being on this sort of endeavor will allow them to reconnect with some of their old NW friends as well as act as "peer advisors" who heroes who really aren't much different from them. Firestar, for the sake of her unborn baby, tries not to use her microwave powers during her pregnancy, and so Justice is usually devoted to protecting her because, well, they DO have enemies.

James Rhodes: Color me odd, but it seems weird for him to be part of SENTINAL ONE SQUAD. That's like if someone reorganized the KKK as "peacekeepers" and someone wanted a minority as their leader; the Sentinals should be seen as symbols of anti-mutant hatred at it's most cold and cruel, and it seems silly for a comic series that is overwhelmingly liberal not to see this point with their continued insistance that the government would back them (and this comes even during the Clinton days). He's been on a team with mutants (Beast, Wanda, Quicksilver) and it seems odd for him to be in this sort of program, but I don't read the book. Anyway, here Rhodes would bring to the table the fact that he is "just a man", and in a way like some of the younger heroes, once actually WAS a "big shot" (he once did serve as Iron Man), and had to deal with the downfall. Besides, we need someone who is a little gritty without being too cold and could have some fun, and that's Rhodey.

The Wasp: And no, not instantly tied with Dr. Pym, who could maybe cameo at times. I just wouldn't want Pym to overshadow Stingray, plus it may be nice if Wasp could do something alone for a change; women in real life typically do not work at the same job/company as their husbands and can have a decent marriage; why not in comics? Basically as a founding Avenger and former leader of the team, she has a world of experience on the Avengers and would be a vital cog in the instruction.

Quasar: Another longtime Avenger, Quaser comes down to provide instruction on the very delicate, but important, matters of space. Quite often the worst threats an Avenger faces come from offworld. This includes not only knowing how to fight in alternate atmospheres/planets/zero-gravity, but knowing proper manners for Kree, Skrulls, etc. Basically this came between him or Starfox, and I liked him more.

The NEXT GENERATION included:

Night-Thrasher: Dwayne Taylor has actually moved on a bit from his "angry vigilante" days because of one reason; his family. He has an adopted son in Rage and reconciled with Silohette. He runs a small chain of martial arts dojo's while Silohette teaches. In a way Dwayne can sympathize with Rage because while he had to "grow up fast" after his parents were killed, Rage LITERALLY is a teenage boy inside an adult's body; a physical expression of Dwayne's emotional growth. Rage still dabbles with being a hero but is going to school, sees Luke Cage as his hero and is also partial with becoming an UCW member (Unlimited Class Wrestling, which is superhuman wrestling, a concept that frankly should be bigger than it seems considering how well WWE is doing in real life). When Dwayne is invited to take part in this sort of thing, at first he refuses; he's stablized into a normal life, despite still being a noble man who dislikes crime on the streets (and if he, say, saw a mugger somewhere may don a mask and pummel him for the cops, or at least be tempted to). In the end, like many heroes, it is that wanting to make the world better for a family that leads him to join up. In the recent NEW WARRIORS series he seemed to lose the skateboard and deal mostly with his suit and a bo-staff/nightsticks, and I could go with that. Essentially the Robin or Nightwing of the group.

Nova: A longtime solo hero and a New Warrior like NT, Nova's a natural for this sort of team and would probably seem like a "jock" to some of the others, as in that hero who you KNOW is going places and is going to be big. Nova can be cocky at times, but at heart is decent and modest. He also has experience with affairs outside of earth, which can be just as vital and dangerous.

Kymera: Formerly Namorita, she changes her name so she can hopefully step out of the shadow of Namor. She's also Nova's ex-girlfriend, which adds some tension. Much like Stringray, she also brings an appreciation of the sea as well as incredible Atlantian might.

Dusk & Prodigy: With Ricochet busy in LA with EXCELSIOR, this half of the one-time SLINGERS team has come together and they seem even closer than they were before, having had to rely on each other on a tragedy that has seemed to alter the course of their lives; the death (or "murder" as they see it) of their friend, teammate, and for Dusk, a possible lover, Hornet. This loss, and their feeling that Wolverine essentially "got away" with it because he's "in the 'Old Boys' network with all the other adult heroes" has defined their direction as heroes, and without help it will be a dark one. They feel that young heroes need to forge their own path, instead of simply aspiring to become "like the adults", and essentially being their "copies". They also are completely cynical and impatient with how grown up heroes seem to "let pass" all the sins of their peers (Wasp being an instructor will likely add fuel to this, and also provide some coping). These two would be your loudspoken "rebels", the ones on the outside of the status quo who aren't completely right, but are far from incorrect, either.

One of the first lessons of the team would be to deal with the darkest feelings of their own members and learn about each other; the Wasp feels that their inability to connect to and aid The Hulk back when he co-founded the Avengers was a lost oppurtunity to spare both him and the world a lot of pain. Dusk and Prodigy's feelings quickly come to the forefront and the team must gather to prevent them from actually going out and killing Wolverine in revenge (or at least trying to). However, there will be some who, at least not vocally, can admit that these two have a fair point about eventually forging their own destiny, even if it clashes with what Captain America or Iron Man or whoever might want.

Speedball: To pop the balloon of negativity, Speedball is another former NW member who as he grows older is starting to become a very Spider-Man like hero; a bouncey type who uses humor as a way to offset himself and his enemies, but deep down is very emotional. His powers are wonky and also make him physically invulnerable, and as his costume is formed by his powers, it can change with his mood if he is not careful. I could imagine it becoming a swurling mass of black and red should he lose his temper. And yes, that would be a plot point; usually the "funny goofball", one adventure actually causes him to display his temper, and now he and the others have to face the fact that he's more than a stereotype, he has moods too.

Squirrel-Girl: I stuck her on here before GLA/GLX-MAS and so on, and while she's been used to comedic effect on those titles, here would be the attempt to try to take her a little seriously. She would still be very fun, light, happy, and yet confident in her abilities, odd as they may seem; a breath of fresh air to many of her comrades. She is also quite experienced with a variety of enemies, and the others wouldn't be able to believe that she once defeated the likes of Dr. Doom, Mandarin, Thanos, etc. But she has because she uses her powers to their fullest extents, adapts, and is incredibly imaginative and clever; valueable lessons for an Avenger. She also wants to be everyone's friend. Before I Heart Marvel was solicted, I imagined her romantically paired with Speedball, and I still think it works.

Persuasion: Why this character has remained in the Limbo of the Weapon X "Neverland" facility I cannot understand; she is a former Canadian member of Gamma Flight (which was connected to Alpha Flight or something) and is the mutant DAUGHTER of The Purple Man, who's gone from F-Lister to creepy powerhouse. Naturally that means a return for her is due. Back from the horrors of Weapon X and an inner duty to attone for the countless evil that Purple Man has done, Persuasion naturally accepts the team's offer (heck, maybe they even helped rescue her from Weapon X!). Formerly jovial, her experiences have made her a little more hardened, but not so much as Dusk in that she could still go out and party with some friends. She can control people much like her father, but when she does, their skin turns purple (so it is not as easy for her to hide her actions). She does know, of course, that there are other reasons to be a heroine aside for attoning for her wicked father, but...

Ultra-Girl: No, this isn't a member of the LEGION OF SUPERHEROES. Back in the late 90's, PAD wrote a very short series for Marvel called ULTRA-GIRL, which starred a teenage girl who was essentially a sort of "ripoff" of DC's Supergirl, only subbing the always reliable Kree aliens for Kryptonians. The series lasted maybe 3-4 issues and then from there she went into limbo. While she would be the team's second blonde, She naturally brings with her some space history, which may make her twinkle in the eyes of Nova (or vice versa). She's kept a low profile but in a way reminds some of the more experienced heroes of themselves at one time; very eager to become an adult superhero like the Avengers, and still innocent of some of the horrors that can come with it.

Sun-Girl: To get in some "legacy" in Marvel, this heroine is the grand-daughter of the Golden Age heroine of the same name, who derived some power, and long life, from her sun-bracelet. Turns out that bracelet is an artifact from the same sort of alien race that the Mandarin's infamous rings come from, however, it has a major drawback. Over time, wearing it and using it gives the user cancer, which her grandmother eventually died of. Discovering the bracelet (which, because her DNA is naturally not the same as her grandmother, adapts some different powers for her, but still based around harnessing light as bright flases or beams that can cut almost anything, yes even adamantuim), she decides to take on the legacy after a shooting near her school as the masked Sun-Girl. The A:NG soon discover and recruit her, she's the resident "newb".

Machine Teen: Fresh from the MARVEL NEXT series of the same name, and because every team needs a good robot. Adam Aaronson, having escaped the corrupt Radcliffe's organization for a time, is trying to get used to a normal life, at least as normal as you can have when you're secretly an inhumanly strong & durabile robot who consistantly has to move from place to place. Unlike a lot of robot heroes, Adam is essentially no different from a typical lad his age, and even forgets at times that he is a robot. He has come to better adjust to his potency and knows to limit what he shows others, and has become less of a glory-hog. He gets the attention of the team and eventually decides to join them for the sake of having better protection for his girlfriend and family. He would naturally wear a mask into battle. While his abilities are rather general "stat powers" for a hero, being a robot also comes with other advantages; he never tires, does not need to eat or sleep if he has to, can be "repaired" instead of being killed or critically injured, and certain forms of gases, mental posession, and so on that would work for an organic being would naturally have no effect on him. Plus we could also throw in some "Bionic Man" bits like enhanced hearing, vision, etc.

MISSIONS: Basically most of these characters have already been heroes, and even teammates; this series is about teaching them to be Avengers, which means serving on a larger sort of team, knowing intimate knowledge of their allies yet managing to develop a rapport with each other and accepting everyone's differences as possible advantages later on. Their adventures would mostly focus on the areas between NY and LA, which their instructors have learned have become a "hotbed" of supervillian activity. Basically a score of villians have learned to avoid NY or LA and have essentialy formed a sort of "mafia" that divides up the rest of the states in-between, where there are fewer heroes to deal with said threats. Tskuri (I know I spelled it wrong), the Mandarin's son, would be part of this, as well as Madman and a score of other enemies.

Another story idea would naturally consist of a showdown with the murderious Tiger Shark. He invades their base and seems to act as a much more powerful version of Sabretooth, having little mercy for his enemies. Basically he seeks to put down Stingray; he was content to ignore him while he was in exile, but as soon as Stingray starts to get back into "the game" in some way, Tiger Shark returns to belittle him, and also prey on his own guilt. I could imagine a line from TS like this: "At least I was routinely called for Masters of Evil raids; your precious Avengers were content to let you rot in your aquarium for years! The hell does that say about YOU!?" Naturally it would involve a good moment or so for Stingray's development.

Naturally such stories would lead to have both the C-Lister adults and the young heroes earn their ropes via a Trial By Fire, sort of like the JSA I guess.

 

[Anubis]

I do love Legacy characters. Sun-Girl sounds interesting. And her whole "Powers give her cancer" thing is a nice addition. She would learn quite a bit from Firestar who had the same problem. Maybe even get Stingray to build her a suit similar to the one that Hank Pym made for Firestar. I would say she could use hers, but FS's was adapted to help her build up her own mutant immunity which she was lacking. So I don't know if it would work for somebody who isn't really a mutant per say.

 

[Anubis]

I had an idea recently for an evil organization type of deal. I'm adding it to my Universe 101 ideas.

This is a chaos cult. I was thinking, Lords of "Chaos"? Or just plain ole "Chaos" as the name? Anyway, they are a cult that feel that, the only way that humanity will evolve, or reach a higher plain of exsistance is by experiencing chaos and disorder. Basically they feel that by causing destruction and murder, they can help humanity flourish. They would be like a much more hardcore Hydra. Battling mainly the Last Line and various other heros trying to stop their plans for causing mass destruction and Mayham. I think it's a decent way to go with this sort of thing, and it's certainly better than your run of the mill comicbook Nazi's or your avarage terrorists sort of deal.

 

[Dread]

I do love Legacy characters. Sun-Girl sounds interesting. And her whole "Powers give her cancer" thing is a nice addition. She would learn quite a bit from Firestar who had the same problem. Maybe even get Stingray to build her a suit similar to the one that Hank Pym made for Firestar. I would say she could use hers, but FS's was adapted to help her build up her own mutant immunity which she was lacking. So I don't know if it would work for somebody who isn't really a mutant per say.

Firestar's suit seemed set to work only for her mutant nature; Sun-Girl is powered by alien technology so that would require something else. So, yeah, Stingray could build her a new suit once she brought it up with Firestar or something.

Despite not being a DC Zombie, which has plenty of "legacy" heroes, I do like them, so long as they're not done to death. Marvel has precious few legacy characters who aren't villians (multiple people have been Green Goblin, Hobgoblin, Mysterio, Mr. Fear, Chemistro, etc). Nova sort of has one with the former Nova Corps, Kymera's related to Namor, and Persausion has Purple Man for a dad (proving that heritage is not always a good thing!). I could imagine her wanting to rename herself Sun-Woman after enough time and experience.

Naturally an appearence with Machine-MAN could be in order for a Machine Teen related story, y'know, give the kid someone to look up to. The instructors would be willing to hollar down the grapevine for some old buddies who have needed expertise.

Glad you like it.

 

[Anubis]

I never even heard of that Ultra Girl chick, just did a little research and she seems kinda cool. Kinda like Ms. Marvel.

 

[Dread]

I never even heard of that Ultra Girl chick, just did a little research and she seems kinda cool. Kinda like Ms. Marvel.

A young Ms. Marvel, basically. The Kree are plenty reliable to produce some Avengers.

 

[Anubis]

Yeah, Capn' Marv, Ms. Marvel, you could count Crystal because of the Kree screwing around with humans and Terrigen mists. Are there any Brood/human Hybrids that aren't dangerous out there?