General Trek Talk Are you a Star Trek fan? The official Star Trek thread where no fan has gone before..

[The Question]

Why he got to be hatin? Klingons are all about honor, dawg!

Positive stereotypes are still harmful.

 

[LOBO3315a]

You have to admit, you chuckled....

 

[afan]

He was racist and bigoted towards Klingons. You can be a racist and a bigot towards a specific group.

And, in any event, that doesn't matter. Even if I am wrong about how to use those words, you know exactly what I mean. I've explained it well enough.

One more explanation if you would......How do you explain racist bigot Kirk offering his hand to save Kruge, the Klingon commander who is instrumental for the death of David, in "The Search for Spock"?

 

[Pink Ranger]

Kirk was definitely prejudiced towards Klingons, which was a character flaw that I'm sure was deliberate, in order to make him interesting (cough, Janeway, cough). But keep in mind, as well as being a species, the Klingons in TOS are also a massive political entity with an expansionist policy that was in a cold war situation with the Fed.

It's like if you guys went to war with Mexico tomorrow, and someone said "I don't trust Mexicans, let them die, they killed my son" is that really racist? Or are you expressing your opinion against a political entity alone? So what if instead of Mexico, you're at war with Canada, and you say the same thing about Canadians, which definitely is not a race at all?

 

[The Question]

One more explanation if you would......How do you explain racist bigot Kirk offering his hand to save Kruge, the Klingon commander who is instrumental for the death of David, in "The Search for Spock"?

Because having an irrational dislike of a group of people doesn't mean that you want to see them all die, maybe? Archie Bunker was racist, but I doubt he wanted George Jefferson to die.

Kirk was definitely prejudiced towards Klingons, which was a character flaw that I'm sure was deliberate, in order to make him interesting (cough, Janeway, cough). But keep in mind, as well as being a species, the Klingons in TOS are also a massive political entity with an expansionist policy that was in a cold war situation with the Fed.

It's like if you guys went to war with Mexico tomorrow, and someone said "I don't trust Mexicans, let them die, they killed my son" is that really racist? Or are you expressing your opinion against a political entity alone? So what if instead of Mexico, you're at war with Canada, and you say the same thing about Canadians, which definitely is not a race at all?

It's not racist, exactly, but it's definitely an irrational, prejudiced statement. There is a distinction between a specific political/military organization and the general civilian population who's lives they control. In a time of war or harsh political tensions, it is easy to confuse the two, as Kirk did on several occasions, but it's still not okay.

 

[Sam Fisher]

Come on Netflix...start streaming those episodes!!

They had season 1 of TOS-R, but they took it off

 

[Sawyer]

I want a new series, dammit.

 

[The Question]

Which brings me to my previous point.

If they do make another TV show, in what way would you like to see the Star Trek 'verse approached?

 

[TheCorpulent1]

I would like to see it approached from... the left.

 

[Sawyer]

Which brings me to my previous point.

CG animation.

 

[Pink Ranger]

Which brings me to my previous point.

Whether we like it or not, it should be set in the Abramsverse continuity, as having 2 different canons running at the same time (movies and TV) would be confusing.

I would like it to focus on an "Enterprise B or C" timeline, or sometime in the future past Kirk but before Picard. Kind of a Next Generation without it being the Picard/Riker generation.

One thing is we've never seen an incarnation of a crew with all the major friendly races represented on the same show. On TOS, we had Spock as a sole alien. On TNG and DS9, we had Worf but no Vulcans. On Voyager and Enterprise, we had Vulcans but no Klingon (if B'Elanna is a Klingon then so am I).

In my just-pretend crew of an idealized new show, it would be a Federation crew working alongside a Klingon task force assigned to their ship. The captain would be human but the first officer would be a real Klingon, honour, swords, singing, drinking, all of that. And then you could throw in a smart Vulcan somewhere and an Andorian (just because they're cool) and some redshirts, and then you've got a party.

 

[The Question]

Whether we like it or not, it should be set in the Abramsverse continuity, as having 2 different canons running at the same time (movies and TV) would be confusing.

I don't think so. TV shows and Movies of the same franchise are often separate from each other. Plus, keeping them separate would keep the show and the movie from stepping on each other's toes in terms of storytelling.

 

[C. Lee]

In my opinion...we now have a new time line started with the last movie, I believe that it needs to be incorporated into any new TV series thay make (unless the series is set before the incidents from the last movie). So there is an even greater universe to explore through a series now.

I would like to see a new series with a more diverse crew....and by that I mean more non Earth humans in the crew. A ship with only about half the crew being human would be very interesting.

 

[Pink Ranger]

I don't think so. TV shows and Movies of the same franchise are often separate from each other. Plus, keeping them separate would keep the show and the movie from stepping on each other's toes in terms of storytelling.

Fair enough. With an Enterprise B or C crew, you could argue that it's removed enough from the Kirk plotline that Roddenverse vs. Abramsverse doesn't matter. However, the destruction of Vulcan and its aftermath is an interesting enough plot device, it would be a shame to pass up the opportunity to explore that in a TV series.

 

[misjuevos]

but should a new series be set in the "past" or should we continue to look to the "future". i would like to see the next evolution of the star trek universe. we have already caught up to some of the gadgets of the old star trek, cell phones, computers. i would like something new to strive for technology wise.

 

[Franklin Richards]

We need Star Trek : The Next Next Generation.


NCC-1701-G


Have a very old Wesley Crusher show up and christen the thing. Plus ya gotta have him quote Bones.

"You treat her like a lady and she'll always bring ya home."

 

[Pink Ranger]

We need Star Trek : The Next Next Generation.


NCC-1701-G


Have a very old Wesley Crusher show up and christen the thing. Plus ya gotta have him quote Bones.

"You treat her like a lady and she'll always bring ya home."

The problem with going far into the future again is you have to keep inventing technologies that surpass the previous generation. I'm not talking about things like the size of computers, tricorders and communicators, that can change incrementally as our own real-world technology develops, I'm talking about the big ticket things, like holodecks, warp technologies and teleportation. If we keep going farther into the future Star Trek will end up 10000 years into the future like Dune, with people warping ships and creating solid matter with nothing more than their minds.

 

[Franklin Richards]

Or you could...


Destroy Earth...
Split up the Federation...
Take a technological step back due to resources and loss of records...



Tons of stuff can solve that problem. They had concrete in Rome but once that civilization fell, most of the world didn't know how to replicate that tech.

 

[misjuevos]

then just pick it up after the dominion war, or after whatever happened in voyager, never saw that to completion so no idea what happened there. pick up right after.

 

[GhostPoet]

We haven't had a series yet that takes place inbetween TNG and TOS. Would be nice to see.

 

[GhostPoet]

Or you could...


Destroy Earth...
Split up the Federation...
Take a technological step back due to resources and loss of records...



Tons of stuff can solve that problem. They had concrete in Rome but once that civilization fell, most of the world didn't know how to replicate that tech.

I actually had a smiliar idea. Basically, the Federation has to start from scratch in being re-built again.

 

[misjuevos]

We haven't had a series yet that takes place inbetween TNG and TOS. Would be nice to see.

but then you have to worry about what you can show and how it has to sync up with the tng ds9 voy universe. would be better to start after them so you can explore more options.

 

[C. Lee]

but then you have to worry about what you can show and how it has to sync up with the tng ds9 voy universe. would be better to start after them so you can explore more options.

After the last movie the timeline was changed....so anything can happen.

 

[misjuevos]

After the last movie the timeline was changed....so anything can happen.

was that part of the ST universe? i thought abrams made his an alternate timeline so he could do what he wanted and not worry about tng,ds9,voy. so he could make sequels and be free to do whatever. i thought the regular star trek universe was still there, and abrams was just its own thing now. i know archer's beagle was referenced. can't there still be 2 separate timlines. abrams and the tv show's.

 

[Superfreak]

Or you could...


Destroy Earth...
Split up the Federation...
Take a technological step back due to resources and loss of records...



Tons of stuff can solve that problem. They had concrete in Rome but once that civilization fell, most of the world didn't know how to replicate that tech.

been there, done that, and Rodenberry wrote it... at it was obvious what it was supposed to be, but for some odd reason, the powers that be didn't let it.