Best action sequence in any comic book adaptation!!!!

[The Joker]

I dont think Spidey would pull his punches when Aunt May and Mary Jane are in danger

Why not? You think he'd risk killing someone by knocking their head off? Pretty much defeats his philosophy of with great power comes great responsibility.

He beat the snot out of the burglar that killed Uncle Ben, but he didn't kill him. Didn't knock him unconscious either, come to think of it. And that's a man who actually killed his beloved Uncle.

but I agree that it was the arms that seemed to be keeping him awake in the fights, I assumed this anyway. But the extended version of the bank/building fight scene it sort of confirmed it for me. Watch when they crash through the window and Spidey is laying into Ock, Ock looks out, I mean knocked out, then the arms grab Spidey and a few seconds later we see Doc conscious. This sorta confirmed for me that it was the arms keeping him conscious in the fights.

Cool. Never noticed that before. Been ages since I watched the 2.1 version. I prefer the original cut.

 

[Dragon]

The worst thing is the hits provided nothing, they had no effect on ock which then underminds spidey (aunt hanging for dear life on verge of death, spidey playing tag with incredibly difficult person to hit but when he get the opportunity doesn't make the most of it).

it's just there.....for the sake of it...

.

Let's clear a few things up regarding Spidey vs. Ock.

Spidey as we all know, pulls his punches in order to not murder non-superhuman foes. But the thing we have to rememder is that, because he's moving rapidly and his foe is also moving, it isn't always easy for him to measure how much power to put into a punch to shake his opponent up without killing him. This would be especially hard while fighting Doc Ock.

Add to this that in the film, Peter did like and admire Ock, was likely aware that his actions were the result of his suffering some type of brain damage, so he'd be more concerned about his welfare. Then, when MJ was kidnapped, he certainly couldn't total Ock- or he'd never find MJ.

But- there were numerous times when Spidey did stun Ock. Such as when May was imperiled. Spidey fires the webline, draws Ock in and socks him in the face, which did stop him momentarily so that Spidey could go after May.

Also, when MJ was being pulled into the reactor he again stuns Ock when they were fighting in the water to go after her. So it isn't as though the fights were unrealistic, for the characters, at least.

 

[Dragon]

I dont think Spidey would pull his punches when Aunt May and Mary Jane are in danger.

Yeah he would. Peter simply isn't a killer. It isn't even about making a conscious decision to not kill someone. He simply won't allow himself to hit someone with full impact. It's a reflex.

 

[Ace of Knaves]

What are you accomplishing by writing so much?

You're such a little nob ain't ya? I bet in real life you wouldn't say boo to a goose!

 

[Mutagen]

I dont think Spidey would pull his punches when Aunt May and Mary Jane are in danger, but I agree that it was the arms that seemed to be keeping him awake in the fights, I assumed this anyway. But the extended version of the bank/building fight scene it sort of confirmed it for me. Watch when they crash through the window and Spidey is laying into Ock, Ock looks out, I mean knocked out, then the arms grab Spidey and a few seconds later we see Doc conscious. This sorta confirmed for me that it was the arms keeping him conscious in the fights.

Never noticed that either. Cool.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Why not? You think he'd risk killing someone by knocking their head off? Pretty much defeats his philosophy of with great power comes great responsibility.

He beat the snot out of the burglar that killed Uncle Ben, but he didn't kill him. Didn't knock him unconscious either, come to think of it. And that's a man who actually killed his beloved Uncle.

He doesnt have to knock their head off, but if my old Aunt was hanging by an umbrella from a height that would splat her on the floor, I wouldnt be pulling them that much, I would want to incapacitate my foe quickly, and with him being an overweight old man, it shouldnt have taken Spidey that long. One measured punch would have done it.

Cool. Never noticed that before. Been ages since I watched the 2.1 version. I prefer the original cut.

The 2.1 cut sorta confirms that the arms keep him conscious, at least at some points.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Yeah he would. Peter simply isn't a killer. It isn't even about making a conscious decision to not kill someone. He simply won't allow himself to hit someone with full impact. It's a reflex.

He wouldnt have to kill Doc to incapacitate him or punch him full power, hell a healthy fit young man could knock Ock out with a good punch.

How are you anyway Dragon, havent seen you around for a while, I miss our pages long discussion about Ang Lee's Hulk.

Never noticed that either. Cool.

Its in the 2.1 cut when they crash through the window of the building.

 

[The Joker]

He doesnt have to knock their head off, but if my old Aunt was hanging by an umbrella from a height that would splat her on the floor, I wouldnt be pulling them that much, I would want to incapacitate my foe quickly

So if you were Spidey you would only fight harder when it's someone you care about is in danger from a villain? With other innocent civilians you'd make less of an effort?

So how does he incapacitate Ock without putting his fist thru his face? As Dragon pointed out above, he did stun Ock temporarily on several occasions, but short of killing him, he wasn't going to knock him out with punches that wouldn't seriously hurt or kill Ock.

and with him being an overweight old man, it shouldnt have taken Spidey that long. One measured punch would have done it.

Two things:

1. Ock is not old. He's in his late 40's to early 50's. That is not an old man.
2. What is one measured punch? If pulling his punches isn't going to knock him out, what other kind of punch can he deliver that wont seriously hurt or kill Ock? There is none. Add to this that even if he could knock Ock out without killing him, what good would that do with sentient tentacles that could still fight him? That's what some people keep forgetting. Ock's tentacles are very different to his comic book versions. These are A.I. and they don't need Ock to be conscious to operate.

 

[Chris Wallace]

Yeah he would. Peter simply isn't a killer. It isn't even about making a conscious decision to not kill someone. He simply won't allow himself to hit someone with full impact. It's a reflex.

I think the best proof of this is his final fight with Harry. Pissed-off, betrayed, feeling arrogant, and even stronger than usual, he still didn't f*** Harry up like he could have-apart from the bomb, that is.

 

[Jay#1]

I think the best proof of this is his final fight with Harry. Pissed-off, betrayed, feeling arrogant, and even stronger than usual, he still didn't f*** Harry up like he could have-apart from the bomb, that is.

thats very true, he could have killed him if he wanted to.

 

[Mutagen]

Seeing as how no one will mention it;

Obviously not the best, but when Castle waged his assault on the Club at the end of the 2004 Punisher movie, I thought it was sweet.

 

[Chris Wallace]

'Twas at that, DD.

 

[Ace of Knaves]

I think the ending of Batman 89 is great. The part where Joker pulls that frickin hand cannon out of his draws is one of the greatest things I've ever seen! And the fight between Batman and Joker at the finale is straight out the comics. I love when he goes "You wouldn't hit a man with glasses would ya?" and Batman just smashes him

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

So if you were Spidey you would only fight harder when it's someone you care about is in danger from a villain? With other innocent civilians you'd make less of an effort?

I think anyone would, no matter who they were, you are going to fight harder for the people you love rather than some random who for all you know could be a bastard.

So how does he incapacitate Ock without putting his fist thru his face? As Dragon pointed out above, he did stun Ock temporarily on several occasions, but short of killing him, he wasn't going to knock him out with punches that wouldn't seriously hurt or kill Ock.

Have you never knocked anyone out? Thats incapacitating someone and you dont have to cave their face in, Ock was a scientist not a fighter. I'm a big guy, bigger than Alfred Molina, I bet I could knock him with one good punch. And I dont have super-strength.

Two things:

1. Ock is not old. He's in his late 40's to early 50's. That is not an old man.
2. What is one measured punch? If pulling his punches isn't going to knock him out, what other kind of punch can he deliver that wont seriously hurt or kill Ock? There is none. Add to this that even if he could knock Ock out without killing him, what good would that do with sentient tentacles that could still fight him? That's what some people keep forgetting. Ock's tentacles are very different to his comic book versions. These are A.I. and they don't need Ock to be conscious to operate.

Late 40's to early 50's takes a toll on the body, and Ock wasnt exactly fighting fit for his age was he? And you talking about the A.I of the arms, not once in the movie were they able to move location when Ock was out, grab things yes, but if Spidey knocked him out and then got out of their reach, he would be fine to save Aunt May.

 

[The Joker]

I think anyone would, no matter who they were, you are going to fight harder for the people you love rather than some random who for all you know could be a bastard.

I wouldn't. I'd fight as hard for any innocent civilian threatened by a villain. LOL! You don't go around as a hero assuming some of the people you save might be horrible

Same as if I was saving a little baby or an old lady. I'd put in full effort to save either one.

Have you never knocked anyone out? Thats incapacitating someone and you dont have to cave their face in, Ock was a scientist not a fighter. I'm a big guy, bigger than Alfred Molina, I bet I could knock him with one good punch. And I dont have super-strength.

Three things:

1. Ock doesn't combat Spidey with his flesh and blood body. That's why Ock will never tire in a fight. His tentacles do the fighting.
2. Spidey cannot knock Ock out without seriously hurting him. That is clearly evident.
3. I'm sure you could knock out Alfred Molina. But I bet you couldn't knock out movie Doc Ock t: If Spidey couldn't, you sure as hell couldn't. He'd wipe the floor with you.

Late 40's to early 50's takes a toll on the body, and Ock wasnt exactly fighting fit for his age was he?

Once again, Ock wasn't fighting with his body. He fights with the tentacles. He lifts things with his tentacles, He climbs with his tentacles. He destroys things with his tentacles.

He doesn't expend an ounce of energy himself.

And you talking about the A.I of the arms, not once in the movie were they able to move location when Ock was out, grab things yes, but if Spidey knocked him out and then got out of their reach, he would be fine to save Aunt May.

And you're basing this on the ONE time Ock was unconscious, which was in hospital, and the tentacles didn't have to move anywhere, as all the doctors were within reach in that confined operating room.

Second, if Ock can walk on two tentacles, then they could most certainly carry him, conscious or unconscious.

 

[Punisher_MAX]

Seeing as how no one will mention it;

Obviously not the best, but when Castle waged his assault on the Club at the end of the 2004 Punisher movie, I thought it was sweet.

while it was good, I prefer the shoot outs in War Zone. Him totally killing off a ton of goons from a table was epic.

 

[Mutagen]

I haven't caught it yet.

 

[Jay#1]

Listen, the Prewitt building in The Dark Knight. Batman was badass in saving all those hostages from being mistakenly killed and he beat the swat team. Then his battle with Joker. There it is.

 

[shadowdog]

one of my favorites is the school invasion scene from X-Men 2
lots of cool cameos and displays of power
and seeing mutants vs soldiers just feels right

 

[Dragon]

I'm doing good, man and it's great to be back. And yeah, our Hulk debates were always a blast t:

I think anyone would, no matter who they were, you are going to fight harder for the people you love rather than some random who for all you know could be a bastard.

The thing here to remember is that, ultimately in each case, Spidey was successflu. He managed to save May and MJ without totalling Ock. It wasn't easy, nor should it have been.

Have you never knocked anyone out? Thats incapacitating someone and you dont have to cave their face in, Ock was a scientist not a fighter. I'm a big guy, bigger than Alfred Molina, I bet I could knock him with one good punch. And I dont have super-strength.

First off Molina is actually quite a big guy. And while I don't know about his real life fighting ability, he certainly looked convincingly menacing when he gave that gang of guys a beat down in "Maverick". I don't think he's that easy to drop.

But- for Spidey the problem is more complex. For one thing, it isn't that easy to knock a person out. Professional fighters, whose job it is to do so can't always manage to do it when desired. Fighting is too fluid a situation. Again with your oppoent moving and you moving, angles shifting and weight distribution being constantly changing.

And then for Spidey it becomes even harder. As these factors shift, he has to keep trying to gauge how much pressure is behind each punch. Compunded by his having to deal with Ock's rapidly moving tentacles. Spidey, because of his strength level can't know how much is too much, so he has to err on the side of caution in order to not kill Ock. I know this from my own experience in teaching martial arts. My students, who have less control are moving so quickly that I have to constrain every movement I do because if they move toward me too quickly, it's harder for me to put the brakes on a punch, to avoid hurting them.

And you talking about the A.I of the arms, not once in the movie were they able to move location when Ock was out, grab things yes, but if Spidey knocked him out and then got out of their reach, he would be fine to save Aunt May.

The tentacles did move while Ock was shook. When he slams into the taxi, Ock is clearly out of it, (His head is dangling as though unconscious) and the tents lift him and stand him up, at which point he revives.

And Spidey did what you said. During the wall fight, Spidey fires the web into Ock's face, pulls him in and belts him, sending him tumbling off the wall. This is how Spidey climbs the wall to reach May. But then, again, the tents grab Spidey. So the terntacles had to have taken over and saved Ock from falling to his death and went back after Spidey.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

I wouldn't. I'd fight as hard for any innocent civilian threatened by a villain. LOL! You don't go around as a hero assuming some of the people you save might be horrible

Same as if I was saving a little baby or an old lady. I'd put in full effort to save either one.

As would I, I would make an effort to save everybody no matter who they were, BUT, if it was one of the only 3 in the world that I loved and cared for most, I would look to incapacitate the villain that much quicker. I wouldnt mean to do it, but because it is your family, its natural.

Three things:

1. Ock doesn't combat Spidey with his flesh and blood body. That's why Ock will never tire in a fight. His tentacles do the fighting.
2. Spidey cannot knock Ock out without seriously hurting him. That is clearly evident.
3. I'm sure you could knock out Alfred Molina. But I bet you couldn't knock out movie Doc Ock t: If Spidey couldn't, you sure as hell couldn't. He'd wipe the floor with you.



Once again, Ock wasn't fighting with his body. He fights with the tentacles. He lifts things with his tentacles, He climbs with his tentacles. He destroys things with his tentacles.

He doesn't expend an ounce of energy himself.

Actually, he does use his body in the fights, on a few occasions, in each fight, so that theory doesnt really fly.

And you're basing this on the ONE time Ock was unconscious, which was in hospital, and the tentacles didn't have to move anywhere, as all the doctors were within reach in that confined operating room.

Second, if Ock can walk on two tentacles, then they could most certainly carry him, conscious or unconscious.

Actually no, just after he was electrocuted at the end as well, they couldnt move him, until HE focused and made them do so.

I'm doing good, man and it's great to be back. And yeah, our Hulk debates were always a blast t:

That they were I am still recovering t:!

The thing here to remember is that, ultimately in each case, Spidey was successflu. He managed to save May and MJ without totalling Ock. It wasn't easy, nor should it have been.

He was successful, but in Aunt May's case, she seemed to be in a lot more danger than was necessary.

First off Molina is actually quite a big guy. And while I don't know about his real life fighting ability, he certainly looked convincingly menacing when he gave that gang of guys a beat down in "Maverick". I don't think he's that easy to drop.

He was only a bit bigger than Tobey, and Tobey isnt big. I am bigger than Molina I can guess that much t:.

But- for Spidey the problem is more complex. For one thing, it isn't that easy to knock a person out. Professional fighters, whose job it is to do so can't always manage to do it when desired. Fighting is too fluid a situation. Again with your oppoent moving and you moving, angles shifting and weight distribution being constantly changing.

And then for Spidey it becomes even harder. As these factors shift, he has to keep trying to gauge how much pressure is behind each punch. Compunded by his having to deal with Ock's rapidly moving tentacles. Spidey, because of his strength level can't know how much is too much, so he has to err on the side of caution in order to not kill Ock. I know this from my own experience in teaching martial arts. My students, who have less control are moving so quickly that I have to constrain every movement I do because if they move toward me too quickly, it's harder for me to put the brakes on a punch, to avoid hurting them.

All of this is true, but with the benefit of Super-strength and reflexes, it shouldnt have been a problem for Spidey.

The tentacles did move while Ock was shook. When he slams into the taxi, Ock is clearly out of it, (His head is dangling as though unconscious) and the tents lift him and stand him up, at which point he revives.

He gets straight back up and is conscious as you hear him grunting when he picks himself up.

And Spidey did what you said. During the wall fight, Spidey fires the web into Ock's face, pulls him in and belts him, sending him tumbling off the wall. This is how Spidey climbs the wall to reach May. But then, again, the tents grab Spidey. So the terntacles had to have taken over and saved Ock from falling to his death and went back after Spidey.

Exactly my point, Spidey did do it in the fight, and wasnt successful, so why didnt he try it again with a bit more power in his punch?

 

[Ace of Knaves]

Yea if I was Spidey though I would punch his head off!

 

[The Joker]

As would I, I would make an effort to save everybody no matter who they were, BUT, if it was one of the only 3 in the world that I loved and cared for most, I would look to incapacitate the villain that much quicker. I wouldnt mean to do it, but because it is your family, its natural.

Well, that's you then, isn't it. Of course I'd be more scared and concerned if it was one of my loved ones in danger, but I'd be giving full effort to saving them, loved one or not.

And thankfully, I'd say Spidey does, too.

Actually, he does use his body in the fights, on a few occasions, in each fight, so that theory doesnt really fly.

Examples of when he used his body to fight Spidey, please. And be very specific.

Actually no, just after he was electrocuted at the end as well, they couldnt move him, until HE focused and made them do so.

Wrong. He was electrocuted, and so were the tentacles. If you recall, it was the tentacle piercing the electric cable that caused him to get electrocuted. They were temporarily knocked out of whack, too. Watch them struggling to come back to life when Ock is sat there after being electrocuted.

That's what allowed Peter the chance to reason with Ock.

 

[November Rain]

There's no point trying to defend ock, his fights aren't comic accurate and don't belong in this thread. No one can argue it's comic accurate.

the rest of it is really filler.

 

[Dragon]

That they were I am still recovering

The sign of any great debate..t:

He was successful, but in Aunt May's case, she seemed to be in a lot more danger than was necessary.

Watching the fight again, he really did act as quickly as he could.

Here's how it unfolds:

1. Ock is climbing the building with May in tow.
2. Spidey lands in front of them and demands her release.
3. Ock drops her ("Butterfingers!" )
4. Spidey fires his weblines and bungees May upward.
5. May hooks the statue with her umbrella (One badass bumbershoot that..)
6. Ock is slamming Spidey into the wall.
7. Spidey stablizes himself, fires the web into Ock's face, draws him in and belts him, sending him falling.
8. Spidey goes after May.

Spidey didn't waste time. Ock was just giving him hell.

He was only a bit bigger than Tobey, and Tobey isnt big. I am bigger than Molina I can guess that much

Molina's got a good six inches on Tobey and is at least 6' 1", maybe two. If you're bigger than him, the NBA has a spot for you t:

All of this is true, but with the benefit of Super-strength and reflexes, it shouldnt have been a problem for Spidey.

But strength has to be controlled, which slows him down. And relfexes are reactionary, not anticipatory. Granted, he has his spider sense, but that still makes Ock's tents a handful.

He gets straight back up and is conscious as you hear him grunting when he picks himself up.

As this image will show t:

Ock is out and the tentacles are lifting him. He then awakens. If he were already conscious, his head would be looking up.

Exactly my point, Spidey did do it in the fight, and wasnt successful, so why didnt he try it again with a bit more power in his punch?

In the next exchange, they're together tumbling down the wall, so it would've been hard for Spidey to get leverage. Then Ock throws him to the building across the street.