Captain Marvel Brie Larson is Captain Marvel!

[kvz5]

Oh yeah, Evans especially clearly hates her...

Yup. Totes hates her!

 

[flickchick85]

Lol, I just posted that in the other thread.

 

[Jh7058622]

After the RT bombardment, the next stop in the Captain Marvel smear campaign was to make March 8th "go see Alita" day. Because according to these mostly male trolls, Alita is feminism done right (eg, the people on that press tour kept their mouths shut).

Actually most do not say that. It is because they promoted inclusion without denigrating anyone. During the press tour they were about making sure that they said that Alita was a character not just for women just like Indiana Jones isn't just for men. That is at least what they claim. Now whether or not that's true for all of them is up in the air but there is not necessarily just coming from a place of misogyny from my understanding.

 

[Mysteryman]

I'm probably going to skip CM. She doesn't appeal to me as an actress. I used to read comics prolifically and I was never enticed by Ms Marvel. I also dislike how they are artificially making her the most powerful character in the Marvel Universe, which is just painfully incorrect. Planetbreaker Hulk anybody??? Warlock with the infinity stones??? Silver Surfer, Thor, Living Tribunal, Thanos, Galactus etc. It is just ridiculous how far down the list she'd be. But nowadays comicbook lore, story continuity and history is secondary to marketing, mass media and cross segmental commercial appeal etc. From a business perspective I kind of understand it.

As an aside I really enjoyed Alita.

just curious, have you ever seen Brie Larson in Room?

 

[flickchick85]

Actually most do not say that. It is because they promoted inclusion without denigrating anyone. During the press tour they were about making sure that they said that Alita was a character not just for women just like Indiana Jones isn't just for men. That is at least what they claim. Now whether or not that's true for all of them is up in the air but there is not necessarily just coming from a place of misogyny from my understanding.

And yet, they are still pitting two female-led movies against each other in an attempt to stick it to one of 'em because its star dared speak her mind at a venue where she was asked to.

 

[Jh7058622]

And yet, they are still pitting two female-led movies against each other in an attempt to stick it to one of 'em because it's star dared speak her mind at a venue where she was asked to.

As is their right. You don't have to support anything that goes against your values and can recommend other films that do and yes even protest/boycott things that aren't to your liking either. This "either you only say good things about CM or your sexist" trope is wearing thin.

 

[flickchick85]

As is their right. You don't have to support anything that goes against your values and can recommend other films that do and yes even protest/boycott things that aren't to your liking either. This "either you only say good things about CM or your sexist" trope is wearing thin.

And NO ONE is saying this. You are making a strawman argument. People ARE against Brie because of lies being perpetuated about what she said, and they ARE trolling websites to spread those lies, and a lot of those same people are using Alita as their prop to say, "look, I'm not sexist!" when they're really just using it to stick it to Captain Marvel, which ironically, is pitting two women against each other which DOES further suggest that yeah, they actually are kinda sexist. Those trolls are the people Rotten Tomatoes and other media are shutting down. But there's a difference between these trolls and people who simply don't want to see the movie or don't think it looks good. Whether you want to see that difference or not is irrelevant. But no one cares that the movie doesn't look good to you. Good for you, don't see it if it doesn't appeal, no one is forcing you to. Go see Alita if it does. It's fairly decent.

As for "their right" to carry out their hate campaign, yeah, it's their right. It's also everybody else's right (including Rotten Tomatoes) to say, "no thanks, not interested in hearing it."

 

[Heretic]

I'm probably going to skip CM. She doesn't appeal to me as an actress. I used to read comics prolifically and I was never enticed by Ms Marvel. I also dislike how they are artificially making her the most powerful character in the Marvel Universe, which is just painfully incorrect. Planetbreaker Hulk anybody??? Warlock with the infinity stones??? Silver Surfer, Thor, Living Tribunal, Thanos, Galactus etc. It is just ridiculous how far down the list she'd be. But nowadays comicbook lore, story continuity and history is secondary to marketing, mass media and cross segmental commercial appeal etc. From a business perspective I kind of understand it.

As an aside I really enjoyed Alita.

I'm a little behind the times here. Could you please direct me to which MCU movies featured appearances by Planetbreaker Hulk, Warlock with the infinity stones, Silver Surfer, Living Tribunal, and Galactus? I'd like to compare their power levels to what I see in Captain Marvel. If these movies don't exist, then your point loses merit because she can't be more or less powerful than nonexistent characters.

 

[Warlock]

just curious, have you ever seen Brie Larson in Room?

No but I saw her in Basmati Blues and Kong...

 

[Jh7058622]

And NO ONE is saying this. You are making a strawman argument. People ARE against Brie because of lies being perpetuated about what she said, and they ARE trolling websites to spread those lies, and a lot of those same people are using Alita as their prop to say, "look, I'm not sexist!" when they're really just using it to stick it to Captain Marvel, which ironically, is pitting two women against each other which DOES further suggest that yeah, they actually are kinda sexist. Those trolls are the people Rotten Tomatoes and other media are shutting down. But there's a difference between these trolls and people who simply don't want to see the movie or don't think it looks good. Whether you want to see that difference or not is irrelevant. But no one cares that the movie doesn't look good to you. Good for you, don't see it if it doesn't appeal, no one is forcing you to. Go see Alita. It's fairly decent.

That's like saying that Blade is better than Black Panther (I don't believe that but I'm sure others do) and being accused of racism because it's pitting two black central characters against each other. You seem to be the one composing the strawman fallacy too. Why are you using capital letters? Is that supposed to be yelling at me? You only prove my point that some are incapable of seeing this beyond their own vantage point if that is the case. This thinking comes across like fandoms on Twitter violently defending [insert pop star here] and not even entertaining the fact that they form a good argument or are anything more than a "hater" or a "troll."

I don't care what she said or didn't say. At the end of the day it is partly on her shoulders to promote a movie and I don't agree with some of the marketing but the biggest issue is her acting imo in the trailers. She seems to be phoning in her performance hard and I don't want to see it from what I've seen. Compounding that tragedy is I loved her in Room very strong but even in that she had some problems with selling more than just a numb look. In that film though it worked for the character not so much with this one imo.

And last I checked I can give my views even if they aren't praises of this film. This isn't the only positive feeling about this movie board. You know that though. I am not seeing this for my own reasons i'm just pointing out a common thread I'm seeing with people dismissing legitimate arguments because they don't like them and how it makes something they support look. If you like this film go see it and I still am able to give my views when I eventually watch it on streaming.

 

[flickchick85]

That's like saying that Blade is better than Black Panther (I don't believe that but I'm sure others do) and being accused of racism because it's pitting two black central characters against each other. You seem to be the one composing the strawman fallacy too. Why are you using capital letters? Is that supposed to be yelling at me? You only prove my point that some are incapable of seeing this beyond their own vantage point if that is the case. This thinking comes across like fandoms on Twitter violently defending [insert pop star here] and not even entertaining the fact that they form a good argument or are anything more than a "hater" or a "troll."

I don't care what she said or didn't say. At the end of the day it is partly on her shoulders to promote a movie and I don't agree with some of the marketing but the biggest issue is her acting imo in the trailers. She seems to be phoning in her performance hard and I don't want to see it from what I've seen. Compounding that tragedy is I loved her in Room very strong but even in that she had some problems with selling more than just a numb look. In that film though it worked for the character not so much with this one imo.

And last I checked I can give my views even if they aren't praises of this film. This isn't the only positive feeling about this movie board. You know that though. I am not seeing this for my own reasons i'm just pointing out a common thread I'm seeing with people dismissing legitimate arguments because they don't like them and how it makes something they support look. If you like this film go see it and I still am able to give my views when I eventually watch it on streaming.

I used capital letters for emphasis, as is common online etiquette. Some people push italics, but that's just an extra step, lol. And no, saying Blade is better than Black Panther is not the same thing because no one's leading a campaign to promote that notion in an attempt to sabotage Black Panther's prospects. That's the difference (like those italics better?). But seeing as I know I saw @Spider-Fan already explain this concept to you just a day or two ago, I know that you won't accept that difference, so whatever, moving on. We're not gonna go 'round in circles again.

You don't care what Brie said? Great. Plenty of trolls do, and have been vocal beyond reason and running smear campaigns about it. So if that's not you, then we're not referring to you when we talk about those trolls.

And yet again, for the last time, no one is saying you can't share your views if they're negative. I don't know how to make that clearer. Multiple posters have posted their reservations with the film here and faced no blowback. I don't care that you don't like what you've seen of this film or of Brie. Makes no difference to me. People are also free to disagree with your views on here, though, that's how it works.

 

[Warlock]

I'm a little behind the times here. Could you please direct me to which MCU movies featured appearances by Planetbreaker Hulk, Warlock with the infinity stones, Silver Surfer, Living Tribunal, and Galactus? I'd like to compare their power levels to what I see in Captain Marvel. If these movies don't exist, then your point loses merit because she can't be more or less powerful than nonexistent characters.

It's like you deliberately missed the point. You didn't address Thor, and Thanos for some reason, a god and a titan. SS and Galactus were shown in FF:Rise of the Silver Surfer, a Fox Production, sure. Nonetheless the evidence is there for non-comicbook Marvel fans if they were legitimately interested in a sincere discussion on the topic, unlike you. There was also Chaos, Infinity, The Beyonder and Abraxus who were other celestial beings just to name a few off the top of my head. Can't have someone with an opposing viewpoint to your own though, can we. This is Superherohype forums right? Not MCU-movies-made-post-2018 forum for comic neophytes exclusively.

 

[flickchick85]

It's like you deliberately missed the point. You didn't address Thor, and Thanos for some reason, a god and a titan. SS and Galactus were shown in FF:Rise of the Silver Surfer, a Fox Production, sure. Nonetheless the evidence is there for non-comicbook Marvel fans if they were legitimately interested in a sincere discussion on the topic, unlike you. There was also Chaos, Infinity, The Beyonder and Abraxus who were other celestial beings just to name a few off the top of my head. Can't have someone with an opposing viewpoint to your own though, can we. This is Superherohype forums right? Not MCU-movies-made-post-2018 forum for comic neophytes exclusively.

Except she was declared the most powerful hero in the MCU, and that's what excludes those Fox films, not us. And so far, Thor has not been shown to be as powerful in the MCU as he is in the comics, so until further notice, Carol is apparently more powerful. MCU is its own canon separate from the comics, and always has been.

 

[Mysteryman]

No but I saw her in Basmati Blues and Kong...

She won The Best Actress Oscar for Room.
I can't say enough how great that performance was.

 

[flickchick85]

She was also fantastic in Short Term 12, imo.

 

[Jh7058622]

I used capital letters for emphasis, as is common online etiquette. Some people push italics, but that's just an extra step, lol. And no, saying Blade is better than Black Panther is not the same thing because no one's leading a campaign to promote that notion in an attempt to sabotage Black Panther's prospects. That's the difference (like those italics better?). But seeing as I know I saw @Spider-Fan already explain this concept to you just a day or two ago, I know that you won't accept that difference, so whatever, moving on. We're not gonna go 'round in circles again.

You don't care what Brie said? Great. Plenty of trolls do, and have been vocal beyond reason and running smear campaigns about it. So if that's not you, then we're not referring to you when we talk about those trolls.

And yet again, for the last time, no one is saying you can't share your views if they're negative. I don't know how to make that clearer. Multiple posters have posted their reservations with the film here and faced no blowback. I don't care that you don't like what you've seen of this film or of Brie. Makes no difference to me. People are also free to disagree with your views on here, though, that's how it works.

Okay I was so confused like "why are you shouting?" lol

So anyone who is like minded and doesn't want to see this film and don't like her comments are "trolls?" I think it is just coincidental that some of these people decided to vote the not see button and isn't as much of a concerted effort as some are saying because by the time the score got down to 40 people, even the ones who were the biggest critics, were flabbergasted by that development. It wasn't until then that they started to see that they weren't as small of a minority as they assumed and started cultivating plans on how to further downvote it (which you are right is smarmy) but hey to each their own.

I know I can and will continue to speak my mind on this because I think most of the conversation is a bit one sided around here. I wasn't suggesting you didn't know that I said that you did.

 

[flickchick85]

Okay I was so confused like "why are you shouting?" lol

So anyone who is like minded and doesn't want to see this film and don't like her comments are "trolls?" I think it is just coincidental that some of these people decided to vote the not see button and isn't as much of a concerted effort as some are saying because by the time the score got down to 40 people, even the ones who were the biggest critics, were flabbergasted by that development. It wasn't until then that they started to see that they weren't as small of a minority as they assumed and started cultivating plans on how to further downvote it (which you are right is smarmy) but hey to each their own.

I know I can and will continue to speak my mind on this because I think most of the conversation is a bit one sided around here. I wasn't suggesting you didn't know that I said that you did.

No, people who don't like her comments are not trolls. People who lie about the comments and participate in smear campaigns spreading lies are trolls. That's the definition of troll behavior. Smear campaigns in general are trollish, tbh.

And it seems one-sided around here because for the most part people here are excited for the movie, simple as that. Sucks to be in the minority, I know - that was me in the lead-up to BvS on the DC boards. But it is what it is. There are definitely some others here who aren't into it, though.

 

[Warlock]

She won The Best Actress Oscar for Room.
I can't say enough how great that performance was.

I can appreciate it must have been decent if she got an Oscar.

 

[Jh7058622]

No, people who don't like her comments are not trolls. People who lie about the comments and participate in smear campaigns spreading lies are trolls. That's the definition of troll behavior. Smear campaigns in general are trollish, tbh.

And it seems one-sided around here because for the most part people here are excited for the movie, simple as that. Sucks to be in the minority, I know - that was me in the lead-up to BvS on the DC boards. But it is what it is. There are definitely some others here who aren't into it, though.

Fair enough on your first point. I know many here that fit that category for other films constantly spamming negativety to take make public opinion lessened. Still we can't call them "trolls" here though so that's the only thing I'm finding not fair to say just because it's another website. It's as if people aren't held to the same standard because of it being on RT for this sites code of conduct.

And I think you're misunderstanding me when I said "one-sided" what I meant was misinformation about the other side of an argument like the phrase "review bombing" (yah know the thing that never happened) people, even mods, consistently said it as if it were true and when were corrected on it said it was the "same difference" when what happened was a complete misrepresentation of the facts just to make the CM supporters seem more righteous. It's unfortunate some can't support an argument without spouting lies.

 

[flickchick85]

Fair enough on your first point. I know many here that fit that category for other films constantly spamming negativety to take make public opinion lessened. Still we can't call them "trolls" here though so that's the only thing I'm finding not fair to say just because it's another website. It's as if people aren't held to the same standard because of it being on RT for this sites code of conduct.

And I think you're misunderstanding me when I said "one-sided" what I meant was misinformation about the other side of an argument like the phrase "review bombing" (yah know the thing that never happened) people, even mods, consistently said it as if it were true and when were corrected on it said it was the "same difference" when what happened was a complete misrepresentation of the facts just to make the CM supporters seem more righteous. It's unfortunate some can't support an argument without spouting lies.

I can see you're trying to steer this into a studio wars thing and I'm not going down that hole. Think what you want. If you can't see the difference between what those trolls did and what people who are negative about a movie here do, then I'm done trying to explain. I know @Spider-Fan already has tried this with you as well. I will just say, do not turn this into a Fox vs. Marvel thing in here.

I suggest you keep the discussion here on the movie, and let go of the topic of what does or does not constitute trolling. Here, that's for the mods to decide.

 

[Jh7058622]

I'm just saying it's unfair to call someone a troll that disagrees with you that only further emboldens them to feel what they feel. It never solves the problem only worsens it (hence why the critics of Star Wars and CM united in the first place). Which was why I thought we couldn't go around saying it here. I don't know how you can not see the parallels in that unless you're just refusing to.

I wasn't even saying it was wrong just not fair to me. And I'm sure you think it's fine to do because you literally just have said it several times within this conversation.

Anyway I don't have any ill will just wanted the facts to be known so people could make the best decisions on the matter.

 

[Webfoot Hero]

 

[flickchick85]

I'm just saying it's unfair to call someone a troll that disagrees with you that only further emboldens them to feel what they feel. It never solves the problem only worsens it (hence why the critics of Star Wars and CM united in the first place). Which was why I thought we couldn't go around saying it here. I don't know how you can not see the parallels in that unless you're just refusing to.

I wasn't even saying it was wrong just not fair to me. And I'm sure you think it's fine to do because you literally just have said it several times within this conversation.

Anyway I don't have any ill will just wanted the facts to be known so people could make the best decisions on the matter.

"Troll" is not just an insult, it's an actual term that describes a certain internet behavior, and as mods, it is in our job description to determine who is exhibiting that behavior and identify trolls (we literally have an infraction called "trolling"), so...we're gonna use the term. And as I've said MULTIPLE times now, no one got called that for disagreeing with me, or with the majority. It's other behavior that earns the troll moniker.

And I will say for the 2nd time now, it's time to drop the troll topic.

 

[Webfoot Hero]

 

[Shuri]

*Sighs* This movie can't come out soon enough. I'm tired of all the drama.