Can someone explain some things to me?

[Halcohol]

I really don't understand a lot of people's greivances with the first movie, especially the problems people have with Tim Story. Since he's going to be directing the 2nd movie as well, I feel this is relevant to how people will enjoy this new film. People blast the director, but I don't understand WHAT FOR. Are there seriously people out there that want to see the Fantastic Four directed by Ridley Scott? Does that not seem a little overboard?

The F4 is one of the most comic of all of Marvel's comic books. It's supposed to make dysfunctional family jokes (Ben, Johnny, and shaving cream). It's supposed to show these newfound celebrity superheroes accepting their powers and using them in everyday situations (ie running out of tp). It's not supposed to be a deep, compelling character study. I wouldn't even say it's supposed to be epic, because 'epic' implies an inherent seriousness to the material. It has a 'really big scale', I'll say, especially the parts involving Galactus and the Silver Surfer. This is MY definition of a fun summer popcorn movie, and I enjoyed the hell out of the first movie. If that makes me vapid or 'unappreciative of the source material', then so be it. But I don't understand the hatred.

I'm not going to lie, I don't know the details of any of the new characters, to be perfectly honest with you I don't even know why everyone's making such a big deal out of the Silver Surfer. Is it just because he's going to look cool on screen? I never really read much about him as a kid, so as such I don't understand the fuss.

Please, I just need to know, flat out:
1) Why does (seemingly) everyone hate Tim Story's direction on the first movie?
2) What's the appeal of the Silver Surfer and Galactus?

 

[TripleF]

Oh lordy, lordy, you just opened up a huge can of worms.

 

[Halcohol]

Well, I don't understand it. I mean, with X3 and Superman, I understand why some people had problems with it. I don't get the hatin' on F4.

 

[GhostPoet]

I for one loved the FF movie. I've seen it quite a few times.

 

[murdock_matt]

I'm not one of those haters or one of those "I'll say something bad about a movie so it will make me look smarter" kind of people, but I really didn't like the first film.

I loved the "lightness" of the film. I loved the comedy bits, the everyday life bits, the whole celebrity angle. What I didn't like was the way the film "felt." I haven't been able to really explain it at any point during the last year, but the pacing of the film felt like it was a commercial. And I don't mean product placement or "hey let's just sell some toys", I mean the actual flow of the film felt like an extended commercial. Instead of building up to a scene, we're just thrown into the scene. For example, no blast off shots of the shuttle, just the shuttle flying through space. No shots of Johnny getting into the X-Games arena or talking to staff, just Johnny on a bike. And I know that's just a couple of petty instances, but that's how the whole film felt to me.

And some people may like that. They may have the whole "Get me to the action!" mentality. But I'm more of a "Take me on the journey... don't just zap me to the destination" sort.

I also had a problem with some of the dialogue. Especially the part where Reed says "A couple of days in space. What's the worst that can happen?" I know that's a comedic/foreshadowing/wink-wink kind of line, but really think about what he says. Would you say to your friend, "Hey, let's go skydiving! What's the worst that could happen?" No. So why is the smartest man on Earth saying, "Hey, let's get in a rocket ship and leave the fricking planet!!! What's the worst that can happen?"

And I know that line was in there so that the Thing could later have his Die Hard/John McLane "Come out to the coast, have a few laughs" line, but it just bothered me that they put that line in Reed's mouth, and not somebody like Johnny... or even Victor, for that matter.

As far as Dr. Doom, he didn't bother me. You'll get tons of people whining about how they ruined that character. It didn't bother me too much. That's the character they wanted/needed him to be in THIS film. It's okay by me. Tweek the characters, mold the characters... that's fine. But just deliver a film that feels like a film and not like a 90-minute Mentos advertisement.

 

[Obi-Ron]

Doctor Doom is one of the greatest villains of all time. Regretting the fact that he was a watered down Norman Osborne in the movie isn't "whining."

 

[murdock_matt]

Doctor Doom is one of the greatest villains of all time. Regretting the fact that he was a watered down Norman Osborne in the movie isn't "whining."

I totally understand your point of view, and while it didn't bother me, I can see why it bothered others. Therefore I respectfully retract "whining" from my last post and would like to substitute "complaining".


Sorry.

 

[gambitfire]

i liked the first movie. But i felt it could of been so much more.

They spent all this hard effor time to develop the characters when what it really felt like was that they where lying around doing pretty much nothing. Yes the moments where enjoyable but to me seemed unnecessary.

And they became heroes in a day, Spider-man took 2 acts to become a heroe .

And the incident they stoped was the one they caused! which bugged me.

Not to mention i felt that Doom not only did not get good character development but was Schumafied to the characters possible extent.

 

[Visionary]

It's been said a million times how most feel about the first film, and it's not good. I'm worried about the second film even more myself.

A light-hearted and fun popcorn movie with likes of Silver Surfer and especially Galactus, who murders billions everytime he devours a planet...why that would sicken me beyond belief. Silver Surfer and Galactus are nothing short of epic characters, serious and dramatic characters. Silver Surfer is as powerful as Superman, if not moreso, Galactus dwarfs both of their powers and more. He could wipe out every Star Wars character in the blink of an eye, this is considered epic, in every sense of the word. It has to be taken seriously, or neither Silver Surfer or Galactus' planetary threat will seem valid on screen. A good/great director or/and writer would know this.

 

[Fantastic-Boy]

Thanks for the support!

 

[GL1]

Honest fair questions.

1) Why does (seemingly) everyone hate Tim Story's direction on the first movie?

It's easy to hate Tim Story. He's "new," he has a black comedy pedigree, he's black, he's not the director anyone wanted or expected. He came on at the last minute. Fox was all excited about netting this 'Tim who?' director. It's just EASY to hate him. It's easy to blame him because we don't really know who he is, what he can do or what he's responsible for. We don't have to know who's fault anyting is, because we have a convenient name to place all our hate on: Tim Story.

It must be 100% his fault, not becaue we know what he did and did not do, but because he's easy to hate.

2) What's the appeal of the Silver Surfer and Galactus?

Raw power. Make no mistake, kiddies. They have the same appeal as Venom, a cool factor that makes middle school comic nerds go gaga. Silver Surfer has something called the "Power Cosmic" which allows him to do anything. *Literally.* Any power or effect can be done by the Silver Surfer at any time. Galactus, standing at least 50 feet tall, consumes planets and life forces to stay alive, and he gives out the Power Cosmic. These characters are uber-powerful and the epic flavor they bring to the comics is exciting. That's their appeal. These aren't deep developed or comedic characters. They are raw power. Which is cool.

As for the 'light heartedness' of the film, I wouldn't call the last mintues of FF1 "Light hearted" and the same will likely go for the third acts of FF2 and FF3. Galactus is not going to be in ALL of FF3, but more likely at the end. It's not like Galactus is going to get a lot of character development. He's show up, there'll be some conversation, there'll be a "battle," then more conversation, then the Ultimate Nullifier. When Galactus shows up, the tone shifts to dangerous, a sensation heightened by the lightness of the previous scenes. Same with FF2, Doom's scenes will be dark and brutal, as they should be.

 

[ClarkLuther55]

Why does (seemingly) everyone hate Tim Story's direction on the first movie?

http://www.superherohype.com/forums/showthread.php?t=249993

Tim Story simply has no vision. This movie had little story, and absolutely no sense of importance. Perhaps "epic" is the wrong word to use to describe what the movie's detractors wanted to see. It's not Star Wars or Lord of the Rings, with vast armies battling for the fate of an entire world, or galaxy. What I wanted to see was a movie that was suspenseful and that felt important. Batman Begins and Spider-Man weren't "epic" either, since they were movies about lone street-level crime fighters. But they had themes, explored the very meaning of heroism, and portrayed things in a way that looked like it mattered. When Ra's Al Ghul's plan was revealed to be capable of destroying ALL of Gotham, or when Osborn played Satan and tempted Peter to use his powers for personal gain, it gave the viewer the feeling that they were watching something grand and epic.

Yes, the source material was light and silly at times, and superhero movies should be fun. But movies like Spider-Man were able to balance the camp with great action and drama. FF fails to do this. Not even the parts which SHOULD be serious were done correctly. When Ben got frustrated and tried to attack Reed, Reed's stretching abilities were played for laughs, complete with "funny" music. As I said in that thread that I linked to, this movie was about some people who get powers and do nothing but goof around.

This was not an epic movie, and it was barely even an action movie. The FF make ONE rescue after getting powers (saving people from an incident which wouldn't have even happened if not for themselves), and have ONE short fight. Some heroes.

And as most people agree, movie Doom was a disgrace. Way to wussify a great villain.

 

[ClarkLuther55]

It's easy to hate Tim Story. He's "new," he has a black comedy pedigree, he's black, he's not the director anyone wanted or expected. He came on at the last minute. Fox was all excited about netting this 'Tim who?' director. It's just EASY to hate him. It's easy to blame him because we don't really know who he is, what he can do or what he's responsible for. We don't have to know who's fault anyting is, because we have a convenient name to place all our hate on: Tim Story.

It must be 100% his fault, not becaue we know what he did and did not do, but because he's easy to hate.

Are you actually saying one of the reasons people hate on him is because he's black?

And so what if we don't know everything about what he did behind the scenes. The studio meddling is well known, as is the mediocre performances by some of the actors and the stupid decisions by the writers. However, that does NOT vindicate Tim Story. The director still deserves blame for things the things that go wrong with a movie, and somehow I doubt he did everything in his power to push for vastly different film.

 

[Visionary]

Hate him because he's black? So I guess we all hate Joel Schumacker because he's white, and not because he directed a crap Batman movie.

 

[I SEE SPIDEY]

I have to agree, the director does deserve blame and credit if he makes a good or bad film. And I don't think that 95% of the people on hype cared that he was black. I did see some people bring it up as a bad thing though, so I'm not going to sugar code that, that 95% number is my feelings on that subject.

Okay, I'll say this, I understand why some people didn't like the movie. It wasn't the most well made film, two of the actors were miscast the script as it was shot, didn't seem like anything special and the movie was a little too fluffy (I want it too be mostly fluff and lighter than the first Spider-Man movie but things seemed to get out of hand) and the movie was too short and did seem like it was a montage of scenes thrown together.

But! I liked the movie for what it was, dumb extremely watchable fluff. It wasn't the best kind of fluff but that didn't bother me too much. I still watch it on DVD. I can see why some folk didn't like but I don't really give a flip because I have/had fun with it.

Whatever!

P.S

I do have to say that I don't get why X-Men gets off the hook, when that movie was beyond a mess.

 

[terry78]

I have to agree, the director does deserve blame and credit if he makes a good or bad film. And I don't think that 95% of the people on hype cared that he was black. I did see some people bring it up as a bad thing though, so I'm not going to sugar code that, that 95% number is my feelings on that subject.

Okay, I'll say this, I understand why some people didn't like the movie. It wasn't the most well made film, two of the actors were miscast the script as it was shot, didn't seem like anything special and the movie was a little too fluffy (I want it too be mostly fluff and lighter than the first Spider-Man movie but things seemed to get out of hand) and the movie was too short and did seem like it was a montage of scenes thrown together.

But! I liked the movie for what it was, dumb extremely watchable fluff. It wasn't the best kind of fluff but that didn't bother me too much. I still watch it on DVD. I can see why some folk didn't like but I don't really give a flip because I have/had fun with it.

Whatever!

P.S

I do have to say that I don't get why X-Men gets off the hook, when that movie was beyond a mess.

X-Men gets a pass because the director made some fanboy favorites, like Usual Suspects(which I feel is way overrated as is).

And half of the Story hate is because he was black, as I heard constant comments of "the FF are going to be slang spouting, hip hop, their races will be changed, etc." With the exception of Alicia, they were pretty much intact.

 

[I SEE SPIDEY]

X-Men gets a pass because the director made some fanboy favorites, like Usual Suspects(which I feel is way overrated as is). You are right.

And half of the Story hate is because he was black, as I heard constant comments of "the FF are going to be slang spouting, hip hop, their races will be changed, etc." With the exception of Alicia, they were pretty much intact.

It probably was more than that 5% that I wrote, maybe I "was" being too nice in that post because I did read alot of that same stuff.

 

[Visionary]

Wow, first it was because of FOX execs., then the movie was rushed, then the writers, then the director had little say so over the project, now it's because he's black.

I'm judging based on what my eyes saw and my ears heard, and my brain computed. When are you people going to stop making asinine excuses for this director? If he wants the majority of people's feelings to change about the film and about what people think of him as a director, put out a kickass Fantastic Four sequel--show us all. I will personally will be the first one to kiss his ass!

 

[TripleF]

Wow, first it was because of FOX execs., then the movie was rushed, then the writers, then the director had little say so over the project, now it's because he's black.

I'm judging based on what my eyes saw and my ears heard, and my brain computed. When are you people going to stop making asinine excuses for this director? If he wants the majority of people's feelings to change about the film and about what people think of him as a director, put out a kickass Fantastic Four sequel--show us all. I will personally will be the first one to kiss his ass!

When are you going to realize that some simply don't have the same opinion as you do.

 

[Visionary]

I realize it every day...and it's such good fun.

 

[TripleF]

i liked the first movie. But i felt it could of been so much more.

They spent all this hard effor time to develop the characters when what it really felt like was that they where lying around doing pretty much nothing. Yes the moments where enjoyable but to me seemed unnecessary.

And they became heros in a day, Spider-man took 2 acts to become a hero .

And the incident they stoped was the one they caused! which bugged me.

Not to mention i felt that Doom not only did not get good character development but was Schumafied to the characters possible extent.

Ya know, I pretty much agree with what you've said. I actually had never thought of the difference between how long it took Spiderman to become a hero and the F4. Of course that certainly goes along with some (myself included) people's unhappiness with the length of the movie. Hell there wasn't enough time for them do much of anything except become heros.

 

[I SEE SPIDEY]

Wow, first it was because of FOX execs., then the movie was rushed, then the writers, then the director had little say so over the project, now it's because he's black.

I'm judging based on what my eyes saw and my ears heard, and my brain computed. When are you people going to stop making asinine excuses for this director? If he wants the majority of people's feelings to change about the film and about what people think of him as a director, put out a kickass Fantastic Four sequel--show us all. I will personally will be the first one to kiss his ass!

I wasn't talking about you!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I think that we pretty much agree on most things, so I don't even know how you think that I was refering to you. I think your opinion is legit but other peoples weren't.

END OF STORY. (not the director ofcourse )

 

[I SEE SPIDEY]

When are you going to realize that some simply don't have the same opinion as you do.

S**t, he ain't ever gonna realize that just like I most likely won't.

 

[markie06]

hi im new and i have been reading this thread and i really dont care what some of you naysayers think cause i think the ff and it wasnt that bad. and if it was would there be a sequel? but anyway i think it was a stupid and racesit comment about not likeing the dirtrector casue hes black that was really dumb, and now i dont read the comic book but i heard about and i think the movie really made me want to know about ff. so i dont know why its a big deal that the first movie being bad but really it was a fun a good movie. so what if the movie wasnt perfect its a comic book movie! and its one a my favs along with batman. so i dont what you naysayers say i still liked it and i bet some of you still liked it too, but if not who care!t: ps. my favs are the thing and the human torch cause i liked both actors who played them.

 

[markie06]

hi im new and i have been reading this thread and i really dont care what some of you naysayers think cause i think the ff and it wasnt that bad. and if it was would there be a sequel? but anyway i think it was a stupid and racesit comment about not likeing the dirtrector casue hes black that was really dumb, and now i dont read the comic book but i heard about and i think the movie really made me want to know about ff. so i dont know why its a big deal that the first movie being bad but really it was a fun a good movie. so what if the movie wasnt perfect its a comic book movie! and its one a my favs along with batman. so i dont what you naysayers say i still liked it and i bet some of you still liked it too, but if not who care!t: ps. my favs are the thing and the human torch cause i liked both actors who played them.