Closure on the Spidey Marriage

[jaydawg]

I hope MJ kicks the bucket.

So.... are you trying to become the new Golden Age Hero around here?

 

[Darthphere]

I could swear I've seen you make exceptions about change a couple of times. You have even been a little accepting of it in regards to the Mar-Vell thing.

Just because I accept change for one thing, doesn't mean I accept every single change ever made.


I'm just tired of pretty much, the whole anti-marriage thing with comic book characters, specifically, and mostly Peter/MJ and Lois/Clark. Its not like somehting that happened over night.

 

[BrianWilly]

The anti-marriage thing is so ******ed. The only reason people want these couples to be separated is because they are together. If they actually were separated, you know what you happen? Everyone would just want them to be together again. That's what would happen. I'm calling it right now; the very second that MJ splits from Pete -- and at this point I'm not discounting the possibility -- either due to death or divorce, there's gonna be masses of people clamoring that they should be together again. All that any writer is going to be doing is to hint and tease at the possibility that they would get together again, just like they've been hinting and teasing that they would be separated for years and years now. And Quesada would just turn his obnoxious fan-baiting in the opposite direction, just to get a rise out of people.

Same with the fixation on Gwen. If, by some unholy disaster, Gwen ended up alive again while MJ died, you know what would happen? Everyone would just want MJ to live again and Gwen to die. That's what would happen. The only reason writers are so obsessed about Gwen with things like House of M and Sins Past is because they know they shouldn't use her. Same with the fans. People want to tamper with the forbidden fruit. They want what's not there. The more that they shouldn't want it, the more they tease at it. It's the same reason Bucky, and Jason Todd, and Captain Marvel came back, even though they were doing perfectly fine not being alive.

And don't even get me started on Lois and Clark. I don't know what repressed, idiotic adolescent musings could possibly compel people to want Lois back as "Superman's Girlfriend!" who's constantly going through wacky shenanigans trying to find out his secret identity, and I don't want to know.

 

[DACMAN]

I'm thinking about not reading Spider-Man any more after nearly 20 years. If they do this. Maybe. I really love Spider-Man, it'll be hard. And this is from a huge Gwen fan. But I'm a Gwen fan because of how she was killed, how it affected Peter, and how he developed as a man because of it. Marvel.... don't make me angry..... you wouldn't like me when I'm angry.

 

[Darthphere]

The anti-marriage thing is so ******ed. The only reason people want these couples to be separated is because they are together. If they actually were separated, you know what you happen? Everyone would just want them to be together again. That's what would happen. I'm calling it right now; the very second that MJ splits from Pete -- and at this point I'm not discounting the possibility -- either due to death or divorce, there's gonna be masses of people clamoring that they should be together again. All that any writer is going to be doing is to hint and tease at the possibility that they would get together again, just like they've been hinting and teasing that they would be separated for years and years now. And Quesada would just turn his obnoxious fan-baiting in the opposite direction, just to get a rise out of people.

Same with the fixation on Gwen. If, by some unholy disaster, Gwen ended up alive again while MJ died, you know what would happen? Everyone would just want MJ to live again and Gwen to die. That's what would happen. The only reason writers are so obsessed about Gwen with things like House of M and Sins Past is because they know they shouldn't use her. Same with the fans. People want to tamper with the forbidden fruit. They want what's not there. The more that they shouldn't want it, the more they tease at it. It's the same reason Bucky, and Jason Todd, and Captain Marvel came back, even though they were doing perfectly fine not being alive.

And don't even get me started on Lois and Clark. I don't know what repressed, idiotic adolescent musings could possibly compel people to want Lois back as "Superman's Girlfriend!" who's constantly going through wacky shenanigans trying to find out his secret identity, and I don't want to know.

*slow clap* Exactly, exactly.

 

[Dread]

The anti-marriage thing is so ******ed. The only reason people want these couples to be separated is because they are together. If they actually were separated, you know what you happen? Everyone would just want them to be together again. That's what would happen. I'm calling it right now; the very second that MJ splits from Pete -- and at this point I'm not discounting the possibility -- either due to death or divorce, there's gonna be masses of people clamoring that they should be together again. All that any writer is going to be doing is to hint and tease at the possibility that they would get together again, just like they've been hinting and teasing that they would be separated for years and years now. And Quesada would just turn his obnoxious fan-baiting in the opposite direction, just to get a rise out of people.

Same with the fixation on Gwen. If, by some unholy disaster, Gwen ended up alive again while MJ died, you know what would happen? Everyone would just want MJ to live again and Gwen to die. That's what would happen. The only reason writers are so obsessed about Gwen with things like House of M and Sins Past is because they know they shouldn't use her. Same with the fans. People want to tamper with the forbidden fruit. They want what's not there. The more that they shouldn't want it, the more they tease at it. It's the same reason Bucky, and Jason Todd, and Captain Marvel came back, even though they were doing perfectly fine not being alive.

And don't even get me started on Lois and Clark. I don't know what repressed, idiotic adolescent musings could possibly compel people to want Lois back as "Superman's Girlfriend!" who's constantly going through wacky shenanigans trying to find out his secret identity, and I don't want to know.

Precisely. Great post.

Some proof? Look at the "bold, different" Ultimate Spider-Man. Who dies at the hands of a crazied villian? Gwen. Who is destined to be with Peter no matter what? MJ. Who was teased to return and did, sort of? "Gwenage". And no matter whatever opputunities the new universe allowed them, instead they followed the same formula as 616. Because that is what people expected. In a way I see USM as Marvel's best wish Spider-Franchise. Joe Q & Co. got to build it exactly their way from the beginning with no continiuity to hinder them, and it's gone to pot in under 100 issues, and is now reduced to what it is now. Thank heavens these guys didn't start the franchise in 1962, he'd probably have NEVER recovered from the 90's at all. In some ways he hasn't.

Things would happen exactly as they said. If MJ goes, they'd just tease her return, etc. Marvel's played these kinds of games with Spider-Man for years now, and it's why after 12+ years I've never felt committed to returning regularly. After CW I'll be back off ASM like I was for years before. No problem.

 

[Fading]

The anti-marriage thing is so ******ed. The only reason people want these couples to be separated is because they are together. If they actually were separated, you know what you happen? Everyone would just want them to be together again. That's what would happen. I'm calling it right now; the very second that MJ splits from Pete -- and at this point I'm not discounting the possibility -- either due to death or divorce, there's gonna be masses of people clamoring that they should be together again. All that any writer is going to be doing is to hint and tease at the possibility that they would get together again, just like they've been hinting and teasing that they would be separated for years and years now. And Quesada would just turn his obnoxious fan-baiting in the opposite direction, just to get a rise out of people.

Same with the fixation on Gwen. If, by some unholy disaster, Gwen ended up alive again while MJ died, you know what would happen? Everyone would just want MJ to live again and Gwen to die. That's what would happen. The only reason writers are so obsessed about Gwen with things like House of M and Sins Past is because they know they shouldn't use her. Same with the fans. People want to tamper with the forbidden fruit. They want what's not there. The more that they shouldn't want it, the more they tease at it. It's the same reason Bucky, and Jason Todd, and Captain Marvel came back, even though they were doing perfectly fine not being alive.

And don't even get me started on Lois and Clark. I don't know what repressed, idiotic adolescent musings could possibly compel people to want Lois back as "Superman's Girlfriend!" who's constantly going through wacky shenanigans trying to find out his secret identity, and I don't want to know.

Agreed, good post.

My opinion is that ppl complain much louder when disatisfied. Many ppl love the marriage and haven't *****ed about it because they like where it is and are content. It's only now becoming vocal because it's being hinted as going to be done away with.

On the opposite side are those disatisfied with it, and constantly *****ing over it on every forum they can because it angers them, and hurts the book in their eyes. Those who make the most noise are usually heard, and JQ is probably looking for backing from those like minded to him. He probably has thought it was controversial, and has heard the voice of a smaller group of fans agreeing, and hasn't thought about the larger populace that are happy because they don't spam forums with "MJ and Peter are great together".

There are plenty of ways to spice up Spiderman without turning to destroying his marriage first. However destroying the marriage is the easy out and will most likely be taken. It will cause drama, controversy, and stir emotions in the fans that liked it, and make the fans that hated the marriage happy. To me Parker's been more of a family man for years, and is more than ready to have a kid. Reverting him to a bachelor and having him act like a kid again is kind of a backwards step.

 

[stillanerd]

The anti-marriage thing is so ******ed. The only reason people want these couples to be separated is because they are together. If they actually were separated, you know what you happen? Everyone would just want them to be together again. That's what would happen. I'm calling it right now; the very second that MJ splits from Pete -- and at this point I'm not discounting the possibility -- either due to death or divorce, there's gonna be masses of people clamoring that they should be together again. All that any writer is going to be doing is to hint and tease at the possibility that they would get together again, just like they've been hinting and teasing that they would be separated for years and years now. And Quesada would just turn his obnoxious fan-baiting in the opposite direction, just to get a rise out of people.

Same with the fixation on Gwen. If, by some unholy disaster, Gwen ended up alive again while MJ died, you know what would happen? Everyone would just want MJ to live again and Gwen to die. That's what would happen. The only reason writers are so obsessed about Gwen with things like House of M and Sins Past is because they know they shouldn't use her. Same with the fans. People want to tamper with the forbidden fruit. They want what's not there. The more that they shouldn't want it, the more they tease at it. It's the same reason Bucky, and Jason Todd, and Captain Marvel came back, even though they were doing perfectly fine not being alive.

EXACTLY! I would also add that the reason behind a lot grumbling about the Spider-marriage, about Gwen's appearances is a misguided sense of nostalgia, that the presumption is that since Spidey was at his best when he was single, a teenager, and on the dating scene, then they automatically assume that by getting rid of MJ and thus making Spidey single, almost a teenager, and on the dating scene again, then all the problems will magically be fixed. In reality, it's a sign that maybe, just maybe, they're not skilled or imaginative enough writers to use what they have and develop around this. Because if the marriage between Spidey and MJ magically dissolves and the writing quality of the book still sucks, what Joe Q's complaint going to be then since he no longer has Mary Jane to blame?

And don't even get me started on Lois and Clark. I don't know what repressed, idiotic adolescent musings could possibly compel people to want Lois back as "Superman's Girlfriend!" who's constantly going through wacky shenanigans trying to find out his secret identity, and I don't want to know.

And we know darn well the only reason why the notion of having Lois and Clark somehow no longer be married and Lois no longer knowing is thanks in large part to the Smallville TV series which makes it appear Lana Lang is Clark's one true love--a notion that was tried and which failed miserably by Chuck "I single-handedly almost ruined the X-Men franchise" Austen. Same difference with regards to Spider-Man and using Mary Jane as the scapegoat for all that character's problems.

 

[Tropico]

Gotta agree with the others, BrianWilly, awesome post. I've wondered why they haven't made MJ change her hair color to blond. If they're on the run, shouldn't she try to change a bit? And red heads are uncommon enough that they would get more noticed than a blond. And then we would have to go into the whole creepy thing of how she might look like Gwen and stuff. With the morbid stuff Marvel has been doing lately I wonder why they haven't gone there.

 

[BrianWilly]

Christ, I'm awesome.

 

[Tropico]

Damn! I knew I shouldn't have posted praise.

 

[Darthphere]

Christ, I'm awesome.

Christ: Not awesome enough!

 

[supermarvelman]

So.... are you trying to become the new Golden Age Hero around here?

What the ****?

How do you get that from me wanting MJ to bite the bullet?

 

[Son_of_W]

I miss Macfarlene. And Claremont. Hell, even Stan with his outdated ideas should be writing. Most of the stuff they wrote was at least interesting in comparison to most writer's (Miller's good, but he kinda' get's stuck on ideas and never let's go). Those were interesting times. I honestly feel that alot of Marvel's stuff now is crap because the editors have let the oddest crap slip through.

Like Hulk is great example. Mega base strength past what wa sorginally accpeted? fine. Healing factor out of control? Fine. Can now crushThing like a grape fruit? fine. Grow gills to breath underwater? Hell no. Over stepped your grounds (sorry Dacman) there bud. HUlk's not human anymore, he's a Namor wanna' be.Same with JSM's stuff for spider man and this Totem thing. And now Wolverine (he's been in the bucket awhile though unfortunetly), and even Iron Man is out of control now with Extremis. They had House of M as a great "Flip a switch" and continuity is fixed, new problems arose, and new enemy births, etc. etc. And they blew it. They really did. So much more could have happened that would have swept the board and left comic book readers both drooling and screaming in frustration. But they didn't. Just decimation, which is now of course being slowly reversed. (sorry about this, kinda' wanted to get that off my chest).

Should MJ die? no. Should Gwen be alive? no. Are writer's worth crap and not doing anything good? Yes. I think Pete should have a kid. A kid named Ben Reilly Parker, or Richard Benjamin Parker, or a daughter (can't think of good names related to spidey characters here). Someone's already mentioned this, and they are completely right. Petey is too close to being father figure in character now to turn him back into a bachelor. It's also a good way to make sure continuity sticks. Other superhero kids (Franklin and Valeria Richards) then have to age proportionally to the little parker kid instead of jumping between all sorts of ages for god knows what reason. The totem BS should be dropped. I think if they wanted to shock us really bad, they'd kill Aunt May, or put her into a terminal coma, so she's there as inspiration, but as a potential character. It would be a good "Casualties of War" kind of thing.

Marvel needs to go backwards to fix it's mistakes though, and if they've got the right idea, they are applying it to the wrong area. For sure.

 

[Artistsean]

I agree some characters have gotten away from themselves, with ideas that go far beyond acceptable. It would be awesome if Peter had a kid, or at least talked about it. Maybe even struggled with the idea for a year, and havd "what if styled dreams" about what could happen. Talk with lots of other heroes about it, like the Fantastic Four, and stuff. maybe have them try, and maybe even find out he can't and that they have to adopt. That could also raise some dramma, like him and MJ trying to prove that they can be good parents while he constantly has to slip out to be Spider-Man. Or maybe, after they are deemed as unworthy of adopting, have MJ get pregnant. She could have the baby after a year or something, and then have the child be a baby for a few years. Then after a few years the child could be like 4 or something. Having him alone again, and unhappy (especially if she is killed off, he will think no one can get near him) just doesn't seem right.

I would like them to stay together, alive and married, and I want Aunt May to stay alive too. I know its more "real life" if she divorces him or if she is killed by a villian or something, but thats why I read comics. They are an escape from real life, where a criminal can mutilate people and get away with it. Its also real life that super heroes don't exist and that Peter Parker wouldn't be Spider-Man. Why have them break up now? To shake things up? I just don't think its a good idea, you don't have to kill her or break them up, or crush Peter again, to make dramma and boost sales.

 

[SpideyInATree]

The anti-marriage thing is so ******ed. The only reason people want these couples to be separated is because they are together. If they actually were separated, you know what you happen? Everyone would just want them to be together again. That's what would happen. I'm calling it right now; the very second that MJ splits from Pete -- and at this point I'm not discounting the possibility -- either due to death or divorce, there's gonna be masses of people clamoring that they should be together again. All that any writer is going to be doing is to hint and tease at the possibility that they would get together again, just like they've been hinting and teasing that they would be separated for years and years now. And Quesada would just turn his obnoxious fan-baiting in the opposite direction, just to get a rise out of people.

Same with the fixation on Gwen. If, by some unholy disaster, Gwen ended up alive again while MJ died, you know what would happen? Everyone would just want MJ to live again and Gwen to die. That's what would happen. The only reason writers are so obsessed about Gwen with things like House of M and Sins Past is because they know they shouldn't use her. Same with the fans. People want to tamper with the forbidden fruit. They want what's not there. The more that they shouldn't want it, the more they tease at it. It's the same reason Bucky, and Jason Todd, and Captain Marvel came back, even though they were doing perfectly fine not being alive.

And don't even get me started on Lois and Clark. I don't know what repressed, idiotic adolescent musings could possibly compel people to want Lois back as "Superman's Girlfriend!" who's constantly going through wacky shenanigans trying to find out his secret identity, and I don't want to know.

Honestly, I'd be doing backflips if Peter Parker and Mary Jane stayed separated. I know deep down in my heart of hearts that when they do separate the two, by whatever means they do it, that eventually they are going to come back together.

Because....

A. With time things change and so do editorial positions. Joe Quesada isn't going to be Editor In Chief forever and it's only a matter of time before someone else takes the seat, someone who enjoyed the Mary Jane/Peter Parker marriage.

B. Fans, like the many, many clamoring hatred of this idea right now, will probably get their way eventually due to the massive amounts of complaining they do. If complaining were an Olympic event Spider-Man fans would be the Utlimate Gold Super Duper I'm the Champion of it all medalists.

Though I like the fact that you tried pulling that, "Oh, they hate the marriage because their together but if they were separated they'd want them together" stuff. Dude, if they weren't together already I'd be happy and there would be no need for this conversation. And Peter would be nailing a bunch of different superhero chicks every night. I think Pete could bag She-Hulk. I mean if Clay Quartermain can...Peter Parker can.

 

[GoblinScrier]

Quesada is the worst thing to happen to Marvel and especially Spiderman. Never I have seen a character get attacked as much as him. If they get rid of the best supporting character probably in comics today, then Quesada really doesn't have a clue and he is living proof that his ego is even bigger than the planet Ego or even the biggest ego in Marvel Universe, Doctor Doom.

He doesn't want the baby around (I never have forgiven him for that), he wants MJ gone in some format or another, all this organic/mystical spider garbage, etc....I swear I never thought the Clone Saga would look so appealing...at least we were getting interesting new characters (Traveller, Scrier, Kaine, Reborn Jackal, Spidercide), we had a baby on the way, Osborn was being very sinister (i.e. taking over the Bugle)...there were some dark spots in that time but nothing compared to this insanity.

 

[jaydawg]

What the ****?

How do you get that from me wanting MJ to bite the bullet?

Its just that you've got this GAH flavor about you. It disturbes me.

 

[supermarvelman]

Gah flavor? Could you just explain what you mean in english?

 

[Xofenroht]

Even if they do split, it wouldn't bother me too much. I enjoy their marriage quite a bit, but it'd leave a place open for Pete to find someone new which is always interesting.

 

[Artistsean]

Didn't they already try some of these ideas?
They had Peter and MJ split, tried marriage councelling, MJ "died" in a plane crash, and stuff like that.
Didn't they already do this?

 

[supermarvelman]

So.

 

[The Leaguer]

What the ****?

How do you get that from me wanting MJ to bite the bullet?

It's probably that he is so used to seeing GAH's name next to stupid ideas that when he saw another stupid idea, he just thought it was GAH's. I'm sure he apologizes, and assures you that he will give you full credit for your stupid ideas in the future.

 

[King Namor]

The sniper is actually a blue haired old lady who caught Aunt May giving her man the eye at bingo. Because she is not wearing her bifocals, she only wounds Aunt May. The stress of having a convelescent May causs undue stress on the happy marriage. MJ demands May be sent to the nursing home; which ushers in the seperation. Peter uses his time away from MJ to have that love child with the Black Cat I been hoping for. Aunt May recovers and MJ & Peter get back together. The love child grows up and takes out Spidergirl for stealing all of Daddy's love.

 

[supermarvelman]

It's probably that he is so used to seeing GAH's name next to stupid ideas that when he saw another stupid idea, he just thought it was GAH's. I'm sure he apologizes, and assures you that he will give you full credit for your stupid ideas in the future.

Thanks a lot dude, your a pretty cool guy.