CW and African American shows.

[Phatman]

Examples?



How is this different from other white comedies like Friends and The Drew Carey show? Unless the primary characters in a sitcom are a married couple, most sitcoms eventually turn into soap operas that focus on a love story between two characters.

Not all the time. The Cosby show never turned into a soap. Neither Did Sanford & Son, or Smart Guy. And when it comes to white shows, Friends and Drew Carey were two of the worst sitcoms ever made. When it comes to white sitcoms, Seinfeld never turned into a soap, neither did I love Lucy, the Honeymooners or The Odd couple. The sitcom devolving into a soap thing is something that happens when writers run out of ideas. Check out a little site called Jump the Shark, it'll give you some insight on when TV shows go downhill.

How do black people live. Please, enlighten us, since most of these sitcoms you speak of miss the mark. I guess accurate portraits of black life are either Good Times or the Cosby Show.

Black people are as diverse in their opinions and viewpoints as White people are. There is no one true picture of "black" life nor can we ask anyone to define what "Black" is. What is "Black here in New York may not be in South Central. A lot of the stories just aren't being told because Hollywood producers don't want them released to the general public.

The usual excuses are "not bankable", "Not appealling to a broad audience" or "doesn't pull in the ratings. But these stories about Black life are out there and they're being produced. If you want to see different viewpoints about black life you're going to have to go to your video store. On the direct to video rack are dozens of great Black movies that show a myriad of different viewpoints. If you really want to see different perspectives I suggest you go rent some of Spike Lee's movies or check out Darryl Roberts' How U Like me now; the latter film makes great commentary on the different viewpoints in the Black community. There's also "Never 2 Big" and "Motives" With Shemar Moore or Book of Love With Salli Richardson. You can also pick up "Sistas in the City".

And "Black" TV shows aren't completely accurate portrayals of life; no TV show is ever an accurate portrayal of real life. Images on TV is based on a consensus of what White writers, producers and directors THINK is a reflection of reality of a situation.

Good Times would have been worse if Not for John Amos and Esther Rolle Fighting with the producers to get better scripts. (You don't want to know what they wanted JJ to do.)

And The Cosby Show was far more accurate of Black life than the jive-talking afro wearing pimp suited hustlers we used to see in the early-mid 80's. (Check out Sporty James in Hunter) Back then we only had Benson (butler) Diff'rent strokes, (coons) and Webster (child). It was also ground breaking in that Blacks were writing and producing stories about the black experience.

Not to take away from those shows, but if those are your examples of better sitcoms compared to the current crop, I'd say your argument is pretty thin.

My argument is valid. I enjoyed The silly humor of the Wayans Brothers and I loved Jamie Foxx unitl it became a soap. Let's face it UPN and WB weren't bastions of quality entertainment, but compared to what we're getting today this is gold. Everybody Hates Chris is the best we've had in a while, (which isn't saying much) Girlfriends has run too long, All of us is a soap, and The Game is Played.
The only way this is going to get better is for more Blacks to get behind the camera. The stories are out there. I know, I'm trying to get them published. But the industry is a brick wall. It refuses to acknowledge any experience outside of the old sterotypes.

End Rant.

 

[batman7289]

this thread is bringing in too much heat.
close

 

[Cmill216]

this thread is bringing in too much heat.
close

Can't take a discussion that requires a smidgen of thought?

 

[Colossal Spoons]

I don't think anybody's "heated". We've actually remained quite civil, given the potential for a conversation with this topic to get out of hand.

 

[Kaboom]

I don't think anybody's "heated". We've actually remained quite civil, given the potential for a conversation with this topic to get out of hand.

i agree.

 

[Darthkush]

lmao!!! I noticed that!!! Seriously, what is up with that? It's like CW is trying to prove something by having one night devoted to black shows. It's like they're saying: look, we're not racists! Even though most of our shows have an all white cast, we have a whole night devoted to black people.

To me, it looks more like they're saying,"hey look, we're putting all the black shows on in one night so everyone who doesn't like them knows not to watch MOndays and can go the rest of the week black free on the CW".

The saddest thing about CW's monday night? Those shows aren't that bad. As everyone's mentioned, Chris is great. No real surprise there. But the rest aren't that horrible either. They're just all mediocre. They're the black equivalent of other sitcom junk like According to Jim and 8 Simple Rules or Hope and Faith. Bland happy sitcom junk with no creativity behind it.

I prefer smarter comedy like 30 Rock(that show is great. Only one episode so far and i'm hooked) or My Name is Earl. Shows that aren't just a typical family comedy. Most of those have been done to death to the point where it's difficult to have ANY originality left.

 

[KenK]

Not all the time. The Cosby show never turned into a soap.

I mentioned the married couple exemption, remember?

Neither Did Sanford & Son, or Smart Guy.

I never said all sitcoms turn into soap operas, did I? Furthermore, you're trying to argue that this phenomenon is more prevelant in black sitcoms, and that it should always be seen as a negative.

And when it comes to white shows, Friends and Drew Carey were two of the worst sitcoms ever made.

According to what authority?

When it comes to white sitcoms, Seinfeld never turned into a soap, neither did I love Lucy, the Honeymooners or The Odd couple.

Married couple, married couple, two men in the 70s. You keep bringing up examples that directly apply to the exception I made in my last post.

The sitcom devolving into a soap thing is something that happens when writers run out of ideas. Check out a little site called Jump the Shark, it'll give you some insight on when TV shows go downhill.

Again, why do you believe this is exclusive to black sitcoms?

Black people are as diverse in their opinions and viewpoints as White people are. There is no one true picture of "black" life nor can we ask anyone to define what "Black" is. What is "Black here in New York may not be in South Central. A lot of the stories just aren't being told because Hollywood producers don't want them released to the general public.

The usual excuses are "not bankable", "Not appealling to a broad audience" or "doesn't pull in the ratings. But these stories about Black life are out there and they're being produced. If you want to see different viewpoints about black life you're going to have to go to your video store. On the direct to video rack are dozens of great Black movies that show a myriad of different viewpoints. If you really want to see different perspectives I suggest you go rent some of Spike Lee's movies or check out Darryl Roberts' How U Like me now; the latter film makes great commentary on the different viewpoints in the Black community.

I've actually seen several Spike Lee movies, although I'm frankly tired of him being used as the standard for black cinema. As for experiencing differing viewpoints in the black community, I don't need any movies to give me that insight, 'cause I live it every day of my life. From black adults raised here in the states their whole lives, to my parents, who both have west indian backgrounds, to the children of those west indian perants who have lived in my native Montreal, Canada.

And "Black" TV shows aren't completely accurate portrayals of life; no TV show is ever an accurate portrayal of real life. Images on TV is based on a consensus of what White writers, producers and directors THINK is a reflection of reality of a situation.

But if that's an instance in ANY show regardless of race, why single out black series?

And The Cosby Show was far more accurate of Black life than the jive-talking afro wearing pimp suited hustlers we used to see in the early-mid 80's. (Check out Sporty James in Hunter) Back then we only had Benson (butler) Diff'rent strokes, (coons) and Webster (child).

No, it was "more favorable" depiction of black life. We STILL have the jive-talkin' pimps in real life (they have conventions for god's sake!), and last time I checked, white celebrities were making news for their adoptions of black children.

My argument is valid. I enjoyed The silly humor of the Wayans Brothers and I loved Jamie Foxx unitl it became a soap. Let's face it UPN and WB weren't bastions of quality entertainment, but compared to what we're getting today this is gold. Everybody Hates Chris is the best we've had in a while, (which isn't saying much) Girlfriends has run too long, All of us is a soap,

What if All of Us, for example was a drama series, instead of a comedy, and given the premise, of course there's going to be a focus on romantic situations, so your real argument would seem to be that it and other black sitcoms don't focus enough of the comedy. In which case, race isn't even a factor!

The only way this is going to get better is for more Blacks to get behind the camera.

I've never doubted that.

 

[terry78]

People that don't have to deal with racism don't like to talk about it, so they want to immediately change the subject. We all know this. Keep the thread alive.

 

[Primal Slayer]

I dont really see the difference in having all the comedies grouped together in one night from having drams grouped together.

Right now their comedies have prominate black cast members, so ofcourse its considered "black night" by some but whats the difference between that and say 7th Heaven and Runaway, two shows grouped together on the same night with prominate white cast members, shouldnt be called "white night".

Once Reba comes back ofcourse things will change a little.

 

[Cmill216]

but whats the difference between that and say 7th Heaven and Runaway, two shows grouped together on the same night with prominate white cast members, shouldnt be called "white night".

Uh, in the world of network TV, EVERY night is White Night...except for Monday.

 

[Colossal Spoons]

People that don't have to deal with racism don't like to talk about it, so they want to immediately change the subject. We all know this. Keep the thread alive.

Would now be a good time to yell "Hollaaaa!" ?

 

[PyroChamber]

]People that don't have to deal with racism don't like to talk about it, so they want to immediately change the subject.[/B] We all know this. Keep the thread alive.

That kinda reminds me of how they say that someone who's white can go their whole life without knowing someone of another race, and it's ok.

Yet, if you're a minority, you have to experience being around white folks.

 

[Nivek]

It's sucks when people have an open discussion, when things get to the point where everyone needs to talk about why they feel certain ways, theres always the few nitwits who have to go "This is too racist! Close the thread!"...

It's really sad that because some people have a negative view of certain cultures in America, they are racist. Whatever happend to not liking a certain group of people? I hate Urban Thug Culture, whether they be White, Black, Asian, Hispanic... Why do I have to justify my feelings and give a long complicated explanation?

 

[Colossal Spoons]

It's sucks when people have an open discussion, when things get to the point where everyone needs to talk about why they feel certain ways, theres always the few nitwits who have to go "This is too racist! Close the thread!"...

It's really sad that because some people have a negative view of certain cultures in America, they are racist. Whatever happend to not liking a certain group of people? I hate Urban Thug Culture, whether they be White, Black, Asian, Hispanic... Why do I have to justify my feelings and give a long complicated explanation?

Because it's very rare that people dislike a certain group of people w/o attaching some race to it. Stereotypes are getting that common and strong that we make connections subconsciously. We hear thug and think black, prep and think white, math and think Asian , etc

 

[terry78]

If a white guy has a problem with me and he basically hates me as a person, that I can respect. But if he's pissed at me and starts bringing culture into the equation, then I'd get angrier about that. "You black guys and your *insert random archetype here*" That I don't like. I remember we all had to have a debate in our sociology class about affirmative action, and, you guessed it, the black kids sided on one stance, the white kids on another. God forbid a white guy think AA is ok and a black guy think it's not. They'd get lynched.

 

[KenK]

If a white guy has a problem with me and he basically hates me as a person, that I can respect. But if he's pissed at me and starts bringing culture into the equation, then I'd get angrier about that. "You black guys and your *insert random archetype here*" That I don't like. I remember we all had to have a debate in our sociology class about affirmative action, and, you guessed it, the black kids sided on one stance, the white kids on another. God forbid a white guy think AA is ok and a black guy think it's not. They'd get lynched.

I'd probably have to look up the statistics, but anytime there's a news program about blacks getting into a certain college because of affirmative action, it's always someone going for a sociology degree. That all we're studying in college?

Seriously though, I definitely agree, there's always a divide when it comes to certain issues, especially this. Lord knows black people and white people were divided on the whole O.J. Simpson fiasco. Media made it clear this was to be a blacks versus whites trial. Had Nicole Brown been black, the trial would never have been as sensationalized in the media as it was.

 

[terry78]

I'd probably have to look up the statistics, but anytime there's a news program about blacks getting into a certain college because of affirmative action, it's always someone going for a sociology degree. That all we're studying in college?

Seriously though, I definitely agree, there's always a divide when it comes to certain issues, especially this. Lord knows black people and white people were divided on the whole O.J. Simpson fiasco. Media made it clear this was to be a blacks versus whites trial. Had Nicole Brown been black, the trial would never have been as sensationalized in the media as it was.

Yes, we do love to take classes and have majors in things relating to society and culture.

 

[Colossal Spoons]

If a white guy has a problem with me and he basically hates me as a person, that I can respect. But if he's pissed at me and starts bringing culture into the equation, then I'd get angrier about that. "You black guys and your *insert random archetype here*" That I don't like. I remember we all had to have a debate in our sociology class about affirmative action, and, you guessed it, the black kids sided on one stance, the white kids on another. God forbid a white guy think AA is ok and a black guy think it's not. They'd get lynched.

<------

Bring on the lynching lol.

 

[vibeke_T]

Yes, we do love to take classes and have majors in things relating to society and culture.

ha!!


Anyway, the point I take issue with is that all black people get are SITCOMS!!! or else we can hope we get a bit part on a good drama like the XFiles...or Lost...(even though that series really doesnt count).

But then again...there's ONE asian or something on the CW's shows...thats not right...anyway.

 

[ObakeTora]

Heres my opinion, all black shows suck. They try too hard to imitate true black comedy like Sanford and Son, Good Times seasons 1 through three until james Evans died, and The jeffersons. You know what i wish? These casting people to stop hiring these hyperactive overacting actors and invest some time in finding the next Richard Pryor. If I see another Keenan and kel or the Wayans brothers it will be too soon.



And The Cosby Show was far more accurate of Black life than the jive-talking afro wearing pimp suited hustlers we used to see in the early-mid 80's. (Check out Sporty James in Hunter) Back then we only had Benson (butler) Diff'rent strokes, (coons) and Webster (child). It was also ground breaking in that Blacks were writing and producing stories about the black experience.




Yea what in the Hell was the deal about all those shows about anglos adopting black children? Webster, Different Strokes, etc.?

 

[Phatman]

Beats me. I guess they were trying to say the anglos were "tolerant" and "Non-racist" because they adopted a black kid. Too bad both Diff'rent Strokes and Webster were two of the most patronizing and stereotypical shows of all time.


Y'know I'd love to see another Black drama like New York Undercover or Under One roof. (A Black 7th Heaven, that came on in the late 90's Cancelled way to early)I t's been a long time since we've seen stories about the black experience done in a serious fashion. New York Undercover was the s*** back in the day. One of the highest rated shows in Black households until it was retooled by Dick Wolf to "Encompass the Whole City"
I'd love to see an original Black drama.