Dragon Age 2 Incoming. - Part 1

[Why Are You Crouching Spock?]

Regarding http://forum.notebookreview.com/alienware-m11x/560971-dragon-age-2-no-dx10-option.html:

The writer loses all credibility with his opening statement. Any professional writer - hell, any amateur writer, too - who begins and formulates a critique off a stupidity-of-language comparison (read: "...Mass Effect: Fantasy Land") should find another line of work.

It's like beginning the critique of a book that has pirates with "This is great, it's just like Pirates of the Caribbean!"

Also, his assessment that DAO was super-fine and in no need of corrections is blatantly incorrect, and any fan of DAO should be able to agree with that. He then goes on to almost spoil his own point with: "It felt like BioWare took every criticism to heart and fixed each and every one." Yes, this is called progress.

But, hey, at least he attempts to explain his stance. That's more than most people do.

Wrong link.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

I should have stopped reading when I read "Mass Effect Fantasy Land" but, I didn't. I DID however stop when the guy started complaining that Hawke spoke and because of that you feel "less connected" to the character.

Haha, that's another thing that bugs me. Heaven forbid you roleplay an existing character in a roleplaying game.

 

[Benstamania]

Haha, that's another thing that bugs me. Heaven forbid you roleplay an existing character in a roleplaying game.

I HATE when people say "When a character talks I feel less connected" or... reviewers for the most part. Nintendo still uses that as an excuse as to why Link's a mute in the LoZ games and I disagree with there too.

If anything a character showing NO emotion in speech or facial expression (Our Warden(s) from DAO were stone faced in everything they "said.") is what makes me not relate to a character.

I swear half the time it's just complaints from guys who want to read what they selected in a snarky British accent themselves.

 

[Why Are You Crouching Spock?]

I swear half the time it's just complaints from guys who want to read what they selected in a snarky British accent themselves.

Those poo-poo heads need to stop role-playing and go outside.

 

[Benstamania]

Yeah, they should. There's all sorts of wonderful things outside. Girls too, real ones, not make believe elf women.

 

[Why Are You Crouching Spock?]

It's surprising he didn't complain about the presentation beyond blood (which are actually one of the best looking things in blood games). The game is also optmised pretty badly.

 

[El Bastardo]

Wrong link.

Whoops. Thank you.

Haha, that's another thing that bugs me. Heaven forbid you roleplay an existing character in a roleplaying game.

Yeah.

I mean, were there this many complaints about Shepard? Onoes, Shepard makes us feel less connected!

Also, given that I have anywhere between 3-5 possible responses to choose from in a typical conversation path in DA2, I fail to see how this is in any way limiting, provided I had the same number of possible responses in DAO.

 

[Master Chief]

I liked how they added visual aids to the dialogue wheel. My Hawkes are sarcastic to everybody and mean to Carver & Anders lol.

Other than that though Bioware could have done a lot more and the dude has some valid points. It only really felt like a Bioware game when the Mage/Templar drama exploded.

 

[Benstamania]

Whoops. Thank you.


Yeah.

I mean, were there this many complaints about Shepard? Onoes, Shepard makes us feel less connected!

Also, given that I have anywhere between 3-5 possible responses to choose from in a typical conversation path in DA2, I fail to see how this is in any way limiting, provided I had the same number of possible responses in DAO.

Like I said... the complainers can't voice out the lines if the character does it for them.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Whoops. Thank you.


Yeah.

I mean, were there this many complaints about Shepard? Onoes, Shepard makes us feel less connected!

Also, given that I have anywhere between 3-5 possible responses to choose from in a typical conversation path in DA2, I fail to see how this is in any way limiting, provided I had the same number of possible responses in DAO.

The dude did mention Shep, but it was to point out that Mass Effect is all about playing "this guy" whereas Dragon Age was about creating our own guy, or something to that effect. It's a silly complaint, plain and simple. Origins may have been about creating your own guy--which is probably why it was called Origins--but BioWare never stated that all Dragon Age games must follow that format. This time around, you play a unique character. There's still plenty of latitude to shape that character (and, for that matter, others--I'm looking forward to corrupting the everloving s*** out of Sebastian with my jerkwad mage Hawke ), but he/she has some inherent characteristics that can't be changed. This might be a concern if the storytelling suffered for it, as it often does when other games shoehorn you into a specific character, but this is BioWare we're talking about. If there's one thing you can absolutely always count on them for, it's rock-solid storytelling. Who cares if you can't play as an elf this time around?

The complaint about the framing device was my favorite, though. First off, it's a narrated story, not just a flashback. Second, BioWare uses that framing device for some fun and surprising effects. Like making the exaggerated telling at the beginning a handy tutorial for how to control a mid-level Hawke--the kind you're going to be playing with for the majority of the game--instead of showing you some elements with your dinky level 1 Hawke and filling in everything else with boring text boxes. I was also very entertained by the "unreliable narrator" moments--tutorial-Bethany's massive rack and [blackout]Varric's account of his unholy vengeance against his brother's forces[/blackout], for example.

 

[Benstamania]

That spoiler part with Varric had me LOLing. GREAT stuff there.

 

[Soapy]

30 hours in and the game finally starts to get interesting. Did Bioware farm this one out to Square or what?

 

[El Bastardo]

Yes, clearly. It is in no way, shape, or form a BioWare game, nor possessing any of BioWare's indicative features.

 

[Why Are You Crouching Spock?]

nor possessing any of BioWare's indicative features.

Characters with extreamly large breasts?

 

[Upset Spideyfan]

Just finished the game at 45 hours. I have to say I liked this game but I didn't love it. In regards to Bioware's "modern generation" of games it's better than Jade Empire, probably on even terms with the first Mass Effect but not nearly as good as an "experience" as the first Dragon Age/KoTOR or Mass Effect 2. I think Soapy does bring up a legitimate point, the story takes a bit too long to get anywhere really interesting I just felt like I was sort of bouncing around the town for a good chunk of the first act and that Kirkwall is so small with so many areas repeated doesn't really help. Hawke's initial drive of just trying to make a living is fine, and refreshing, but the game doesn't really have any great hooks like most BW games do from the beginning so its all a bit too vague once you hit Kirkwall and start trying to hit those 50 sovereigns.

Act 2 and 3 get better in this regard, the Qunari are probably my favorite part of this game. They're fantastically written and come off as intelligent and imposing foes and the Mage/Templar situation explodes in a pretty dramatic way.

As for act 3 [BLACKOUT]Anders turning into a Mage Terrorist and blowing the Chantry starting off a massacre was a jaw dropping moment. I was literally waiting for the option to kill him to pop up. The strongest moment of the game by far. Managed to get everyone else in the party through alive but there was no way I was letting Anders survive that night.[/BLACKOUT]

Hawke is a great character as well, I only played MaleHawke (I toyed around with FemHawke for a bit just to see) but I have to say the voice actor did a really great job being a snarky bastard. Hawke and the cast grew on me quite a bit by the end.

I'm kind of leaning towards a 7.5 or 8 right now. It does a lot of things really well and some other things not so well. The combat is pretty good but there are some pretty serious glitches (Isabella's friendship perk was actually permanently LOWERING my attack speed, even when she wasn't in party!). I'd probably be up for a 8.5 if not for that reusing so many maps over and over again, that's really just unacceptable at this point when you're putting down $60+. I'd rather have less original content than more rehashed maps.

 

[Fenrir]

Good game. Doesn't hold a candle to its predecessor though.

Spoiler

I sided with the Templars in Act 3. First of all, Anders blowing up the only sensible character in the whole Templars-Mage charade just pissed me off. He acted like a selfish a-hole extremist and there was no way I was going to side with the Mages after that, especially with just about every other mage I encountered or spared during my entire quest somehow ending up doing blood magic. And when I found out that the Orsini bastard knew about the blood mage that killed my mother and not only did nothing to prevent it, but also uses that very blood magic himself made me glad that I chose the Templars' side. Mages have been a constant headache in Dragon Age 2 and I am glad being with the Templars gave me a chance to slaughter these ticking time bombs. I let go of the mages who beg amnesty and didn't use blood magic and saved my sister, but I sure as hell relished executing Anders.

 

[Upset Spideyfan]

Spoiler

There are people actually defending Anders. Its really mind boggling and a bit sickening.

 

[Benstamania]

See, I thought DAO was a "good" game but no where even close to ME1 or KotOR. It was a bland and ugly game... I thought Awakening, as a whole was so much better than Origins was.

I hated, HATED the Circle and Orzammar in DAO... like, to a point where I didn't want to continue. Not because those areas were hard... but because they were overly boring and felt like they took FOREVER to complete.

DAII, while not perfect was a much, much better game IMHO. I was never bored, even the smallest side quest in the game was interesting and the story structuring was flawless IMHO... I have NO idea how anyone could be lost or not understand whats going on. I mean, you're pretty much being read to...

I'd give it, over all an 8.5 with the first being like a 7.5. If DAII was a bit "bigger" which I suspect we'll get in DLC or any expansions, it would easily be a 9 in my book.

 

[Upset Spideyfan]

See, I thought DAO was a "good" game but no where even close to ME1 or KotOR. It was a bland and ugly game...

Visually, I agree - I thought Origins overcame its visual weaknesses but it wasn't a pretty game.

I hated, HATED the Circle and Orzammar in DAO... like, to a point where I didn't want to continue. Not because those areas were hard... but because they were overly boring and felt like they took FOREVER to complete.

DAII, while not perfect was a much, much better game IMHO. I was never bored, even the smallest side quest in the game was interesting

While on a story front I liked DA2's sidequest I think by literally re-using what 3-4 maps for every dungeon in the game the team shot themselves in the foot. It just screams of a rushed development cycle that areas like the Deep Roads were totally unique/expansive in Origins but we couldn't be bothered to get more than a single cave map in DA2.

The ME team moved away from this type of sidequest design for ME2 and its sad to see the DA team rely on it so heavily.

The Circle for me was the only part of Origins that really dragged, though I know whether or not you liked Orzammar tends to depend on the person.

Regardless we spend so much time of Dragon Age 2 essentially walking in a circle between the shockingly few zones of the game world that this limited setting of Kirkwall which should be fleshed out and amazing ends up coming off so tiny. I could draw some maps at this point I know them so well.

and the story structuring was flawless IMHO... I have NO idea how anyone could be lost or not understand whats going on. I mean, you're pretty much being read to...

I'd give it, over all an 8.5 with the first being like a 7.5. If DAII was a bit "bigger" which I suspect we'll get in DLC or any expansions, it would easily be a 9 in my book.

I don't think anyone was lost or didn't understand, I certainly didn't feel that way, but there were a lot of times mostly during the first act when I felt like really - I need to collect 50 sovereigns? That's it?

This feeling lessened as the game got into Act 2 and 3, ironically as the narrative started to introduce city-wide threats and moved to more traditional Bioware structures.

 

[Benstamania]

Oh I agree that the one major issue I had with the game was reused dungeons. They did that in DAO and I was annoyed to see it return in 2. That's why I am hoping for some epic DLC... because the DLC for Origin's was.... less than stellar IMHO.

 

[Upset Spideyfan]

Don't say that out loud or El Bastardo will come and get you in your sleep.

Spoiler

I do have to say I'm going to miss Hawke. I actually was sad that we didn't get all the ending slides but I guess it wouldn't have fit the Varric narrative.

 

[Benstamania]

Spoiler

Is Hawke going to be "gone for good"? I was under the impression that BioWare created him so they could have a solid main character ala Shepard in future DA games.

 

[Upset Spideyfan]

Spoiler

Is Hawke going to be "gone for good"? I was under the impression that BioWare created him so they could have a solid main character ala Shepard in future DA games.

Spoiler

The writer when asked why they were switching protagonists from the Warden to Hawke explained that Dragon Age is about the Age and not a single character. So I'm guessing probably not. We'll have to wait and see but I wouldn't be surprised if its a new character for DA3.

 

[Benstamania]

Spoiler

BOOOOOOOOO!!!! Unless of course we get an expansion that allows me to wrap up Hawkes story completely. If my Warden can "settle down" so should Hawke.

 

[Upset Spideyfan]

Spoiler

Ironically, only the Morrgian romancing Warden got closure from Witch Hunt. The rest just up and vanished.