Ant-Man Edgar Wright Leaves Ant-Man!! - Part 1

[C. Lee]

are you his mom?

You can stop the condescending smart alec responses now.

 

[Whiskey Tango]

You can stop the condescending smart alec responses now.

Thank you.

 

[Mike Murdock]

either would work. personally, i think it'd be a nice touch to have Pym be one of the heroes that bailed on S.H.I.E.L.D; maybe suspecting some form of corruption (i.e. Hydra). they'd paint him as paranoid. but he'd be one of the ones that saw the bad things coming.

I'm not so sure about that. To me, the movie has to start with him at his lowest point. If he has at least that, there's a little bit of redemption before the plot begins.

 

[Rock Sexton]

That probably will be the best for everyone. It won't surprise me if you'll never hear a big name director attached again to a Marvel movie in the coming years.

We'll hold you to that comment.

Bookmarked.

 

[jmc]

We'll hold you to that comment.

Bookmarked.

Will it cost me anything if I'm wrong?

 

[Tanin]

I've heard that Wright wanted Michael Douglas to play Hank in the 1960s, with Kirk Douglas as the present day Hank.

Faithful or not... that would be really an awesome way to handle it and I would have bought a ticket just on that alone.

 

[Ant-manic]

You can stop the condescending smart alec responses now.

well you certainly haven't changed from the FF boards. can't wait until you return. maybe you can take some of this flame bait with you.

 

[Ant-manic]

I'm not so sure about that. To me, the movie has to start with him at his lowest point. If he has at least that, there's a little bit of redemption before the plot begins.

that's why i said that he'd be painted as paranoid. maybe his ousting from SHIELD was embarrassing or something.

 

[Krystal]

Faithful or not... that would be really an awesome way to handle it and I would have bought a ticket just on that alone.

Kirk Douglas? Kirk Douglas is 97 and can't speak because of a major stroke---very difficult to understand.

perhaps you are thinking this is the year 1984.

 

[Dark Raven]

I've heard they want Kirk Douglas as Hank Pym in the 1960s and his father, Herschel Danielovitch's skeleton as the present day Hank Pym.

 

[C. Lee]

well you certainly haven't changed from the FF boards. can't wait until you return. maybe you can take some of this flame bait with you.

Neither have you.....have some time off.

 

[Dr. Evil]

The rumored choice of Louis D'Esposito (via Devin Faraci) is not surprising.

 

[Tanin]

Kirk Douglas? Kirk Douglas is 97 and can't speak because of a major stroke---very difficult to understand.

perhaps you are thinking this is the year 1984.

I hasn't heard about his stroke unfortunately, but the concept of a father/son or mother/daughter duo playing the same character in two eras is still a concept I would love to see done in a comic film sometime.

 

[Dark Raven]

I hasn't heard about his stroke unfortunately, but the concept of a father/son or mother/daughter duo playing the same character in two eras is still a concept I would love to see done in a comic film sometime.

Well I did suggest Kirk Douglas and his father.

 

[Whiskey Tango]

They should rename this thread 'Ant-Maniac leaves SuperheroHype!!'.

 

[Dark Raven]

They should rename this thread 'Ant-Maniac leaves SuperheroHype!!'.

It's taken long enough... just like Edgar Wright's script.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

Now that I hear it was just Feige that axed him himself, well damn, that's cold. If that's the case, I do think they should have given him is chance with the movie, especially when it's so late in the process.

With the debate in this thread, basically it comes down to track to track record. This talk of "Blind Devotees" is stupid. A fan can't have faith in a company that hasn't mad a bad or terrible movie and treats all their characters with the respect and consistency that most fans have been only dreaming of up until 2008? We don't know the specific changes, and despite all the behind the scenes problems with the past few movies like Iron Man 2 and Thor TDW, they've still been successful with critics and audiences alike.

 

[Human Torch]

the entitlement and unwillingness to compromise?

B'bye maniac.I'll send you a Cornetto as a parting gift.t:

 

[Human Torch]

It's taken long enough... just like Edgar Wright's script.

 

[Keyser Soze]

Indeed. I think they lucked out with Gunn, Black and Whedon for various reasons. I think because the gave Gunn all of space to play with, there are no rules outside of how he handles Thanos, which he has gotten into discussions with Marvel about, but that's all the mandates he has. He can do pretty much whatever he wants, so when he brought it in, Whedon was like: go crazy, and Feige didn't at all try to counteract that, because, why? What's the problem if some alien planet doesn't fit in with the Avengers, or if they kill off Drax or anything really? Doesn't stop anything at all.

Black, I think, because of the RDJ bond, there really wasn't anything they could stop Black from doing with RDJ's support, and RDJ wanted and Tony Stark movie and he got it. I think the needs for an evil malfunctioning robot and brain slot were small enough, and the movie big enough, that Black couldn't feel robbed by them. It wasn't like he got saddled with a huge subplot like Favreau did in IM2. It's not like he got his editing room taken over like Favrea in IM2. Or the big emotional scene gutted like Taylor in Thor 2. In fact, it was in direct response to the criticism of IM2 for being meddled in that they left IM3 largely alone, promising no SHIELD presence. So Black got lucky based on how they mishandled IM2.

Whedon, they put him in a position of power, almost instantly. Remember he was coming of Wonder Woman and proved he knew how to walk away if a studio was jerking him around. They knew they needed Whedon, that he was not expendable and they acted like it, and they have been much, much, much better off for it.

With Wright, no more a prima dona than anyone else, when they finally decided to move forward, despite the script detail questions still in Marvel's mind, they treated Wright as expendable, because he was, they already had the Wright script. They had major requirements because he's kicking off Phase 3, requirements that would not have been able to have been given to him until recently, and, timeline-wise, he's in the middle of SHIELD's past, which, thanks to two different TV series, now has it's own set of brand new narrative and thematic requirements. So he doesn't really have his own sandbox, like Gunn, he doesn't have them avoiding giving him limitations like Black and he doesn't have power/leverage like Whedon.

If they're going to hire another great director, including those from TV they need to treat them like the other great directors, either give them power/defer to them like they do Whedon, intentionally try not to ask much of them like Black or give them a space they can go crazy with and not hurt the MCU, like they did Gunn. Hiring directors with vision to keep their vision to themselves is like hiring a ninja to slice pizza. You hired a NINJA, don't be surprised when he starts throwing ninja stars around the Pizza Hut.

Marvel, if they want to continue to supremely prioritize the Phase/Avengers marketing cycle, can't hire great directors to play 'positions' either in the timeline or on the Avengers team. They need to get hungry guys who will make an inferior movie if need be to pay the bills and make a name for themselves. They need to get by the book guys who aren't going to come up with very many interesting (and thus potentially conflicting) ideas in the first place, and aren't going to hang on to those interesting ideas. Or, be honest and upfront about what you need from them, ask for what you actually got from Wright, you need them to develop a great story and then pass it off to a filmmaker who will take that great story and allow it to be diluted for the good of the universe, but still be good. Or they could hire guys like the directors from Community who enjoy taking anything and making it good from DnD games to Batman parodies to situational comedy. Getting directors from Premium Channel shows like Game of Thrones and Breaking Bad is bringing in guys that aren't used to putting down good ideas for the good of a story they may never see. But guys from network TV are always getting trash and being told to make gold out of it, it's how they work, and it shows in how the Russos took the Algorithm and put it into the center of a great story that was originally supposed to be about, y'know The Winter Soldier. Basically, you want guys who are used to having execs say no.

And if they do get another Wright saying that they want to do Ant-Man, no matter how good the pitch sounds, offer them something with it's own corner, and let them go crazy. Of course, they didn't know the 60s was going to be so full 8 years ago, so maybe Marvel just couldn't help but pull the wool out from under Wright. Corporations are inherently psychotic after all.

Great post, really well-presented analysis of the situation. Though I hope the trend doesn't sway away from getting talented directors involved with these films.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

Will it cost me anything if I'm wrong?

Remember the last time you made a deal like this?

 

[dark_b]

yeah thats why we like Wright.
http://badassdigest.com/2014/05/29/what-marvel-lost-when-they-lost-edgar-wright/

in a way its funny because Marvel liked his style. the script was the problem.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

I saw that video. I loved the video though I though the narrator was a bit of a dick.

 

[R_Hythlodeus]

They should rename this thread 'Ant-Maniac leaves SuperheroHype!!'.

wait, what? what did I miss?

 

[Dark Raven]

Now that I hear it was just Feige that axed him himself, well damn, that's cold. If that's the case, I do think they should have given him is chance with the movie, especially when it's so late in the process.

With the debate in this thread, basically it comes down to track to track record. This talk of "Blind Devotees" is stupid. A fan can't have faith in a company that hasn't mad a bad or terrible movie and treats all their characters with the respect and consistency that most fans have been only dreaming of up until 2008? We don't know the specific changes, and despite all the behind the scenes problems with the past few movies like Iron Man 2 and Thor TDW, they've still been successful with critics and audiences alike.

Wait, where did you hear that? Is there a link?