EDIT: Shinobi got banned. What a surprise....
I was under the impression you said people didn´t want more dar Batman. I don´t see any strong evidence of that.
I don't know where you got that impression from. I flat out said earlier that dark Batman is what the audiences want now, and that's great.
Not really. I think this is just an example of how opinions and perceptions can vary from place to place, social circle to social circle.
Not indicative of any consensus though. For example you can find websites dedicated to people hating on something really popular. That doesn't mean it's a general common opinion. It's easy to be misled by reading in the wrong place.
Hell if you go on the IMDb forums you'd think the whole world and it's mother hated Chris Nolan.
It´s pretty common for movie to have high ratings with a low number of votes. Around 20.000 votes, TDK had almost a perfect 10 on IMDB. TWS was in the 9´s. TDKR was in the 9´s too. There are movies that drop over 3 points as the number of votes increases. It´s not too far fetched to assume that if B66 had 100.000 more votes its rating would be a little lower.
Low number of votes? TDK has over a million votes. TDKR has over 900'000. For IMDB those vote numbers are HUGE. The likes of The Empire Strikes Back and The Avengers don't even have close to that many votes:
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0080684/
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0848228/
The fact that the majority of the 10'000 votes that B'66 does have are high should tell you that if it had more then the score would be higher.
You´re being too literal. I´m just giving you an example. I´m not saying B66 only had 1 M viewers.
What i´m explaining to you is that something can be very successful without the majority of the population who know about it liking it. Millions and millions know about B66. But only like 10 or 20 k care enough to vote or give opinion about it. Those 10 k could easily just be the hardcore fans. 10k is a freaking small number. So, if from all those millions, can only have access to the opinions of 10 or 20 k, and that opinion isn´t particularly GREAT(7.5 is good, not great), how are you so sure that all those other millions that don´t even bother to talk about the show actually like it?
I know you're giving an example of 1M viewers. I'm using your scenario that you created to explain why it's faulty thinking. It takes millions of people, a sizable number, to elevate Batman '66 to the status it has.
If IMDb was a website geared towards the comic book fan base, like this website is, I would agree the votes could be predominately Batman fans or comic book fans. But it's a general movie website. The biggest on the net.
It's just one of several statistical sources that show the votings whether they're in hundreds or thousands, all weigh in favor of the show. There's nothing else to show otherwise. There's no big bad word of mouth against the show to show that there is a heavier scale of hatred against the show. You can only go by the facts, and the love and influence the show still gets.
I´m not even saying the show is hated by the General Audiences. I´m simply saying that i don´t get the impression that it´s loved by everyone who knows about it.
Fair enough.
A movie which has a production budget of 100 M can easily spend an additional 50 M on marketing. Some movies will spend even more. Then, you have the theaters cut. I don´t know exact numbers, but it can vary from 20 and 40%. Then you have taxes. 40%? I don´t know, something like that. If you take all those things in consideration, it´s not very difficult to imagine a scenario where Ghost Rider actually loses money. The Harry Potter movies lost money, according to WB, and they made much more than just 2x.
But it didn't spend 50M on marketing. It didn't make a bad profit. That's what I'm telling you. The fact it got a sequel means the profit it made was enough to warrant a sequel. Movies that don't make profit in this game don't get green lit another multi million dollar sequel. Doesn't happen.
Lots of movies lose some money. It's if they make enough of a profit to justify a sequel is what counts.
Based on what i´ve heard from producers and directors, i´d say a movie like Ghost Rider would need around 400 M to make a profit, at least.
I don't know where you heard that from, but it made a profit, that's why it got a sequel. Even the god awful second one made a profit which is why they were considering a third one:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R7NCfwmCHTw
If only actual good movies like Dredd made a profit like this.
I´ve already gave you an example. Batman 66 is certainly not seen with the same eyes it was in 1966. This is a fact.
No movie is seen with the same eyes decades later as it was when it was released. That doesn't mean they are not loved by the consensus as so many great classics can attest to.
The number and variety of opinions we can have access regarding B&R it´s like 200 times bigger than B66. It´s much easier to a draw a conclusion out of a film everybody remembers and talks about than a show from the 60´s that has no more than like 10 k people online voting on it.
That's because Batman and Robin is a more recent movie, with more notoriety attached to it. But that doesn't change the fact that the numbers, be they 10k or 100k still reflect the consensus for the movie. Most people think it's bad.
10 k, my friend. That´s nothing. That´s not even my neighborhood. You can have access to over 1 M votes on TDK and TA. That´s something. 10 k is nothing.
It's 10k more evidence than you've shown to show any kind of consensus towards the show. I don't have access to 1M votes for TA, or The Empire Strikes Back, or a lot other big popular movies, but that was my point. You don't need it to know how loved or hated something is.
Honestly, this conversation is absolutely over. I´m not gonna continue going around in circles with you.
Fair enough. For what it's worth I feel the discussion has run it's course, too.
I don´t believe B66 is loved by the majority of people who know about it. The best you could do was to show me 10.000 people who think B66 is a 7. That´s hardly any indication of unconditional love. 7 is not a great rating at all. It´s good, not great. A show that was as loved as you say, would easily have over a 9 with 10.000 votes. The show might even be more liked than disliked, but it´s certainly not seen as great, and there is certainly a good percentage of people who don´t care about it, and nothing you´ve posted until now is enough to change my views.
You can believe what ever you wish. It was never my intention to try and change your view of this, just defend my own since you decided to challenge it in the first place. My stance was not primarily based on just the high ratings for it, but the influence it had and still has in movies, video games, and comic books.
I never said the show was unconditionally love either. You keep overstating what I said. I said the majority like it. It is not 50/50 or most hate it. That was and always has been my stance. There is nothing that shows otherwise. But plenty that shows that most like it.
