"Flame On!" The Human Torch Thread

[SpideyFan866]

being on a list is not the same as being cast...for either part...

I'm not saying and never said she was cast. I specifically said she was shortlisted.

Casting reports that came out for Sue had a WHITE actress named to shortlist.

http://www.joblo.com/movie-news/all...hortlist-for-the-reboot-of-the-fantastic-four

My point is that they are still going to cast a white actress for the part.

Johnny being black isn't affecting that. And yes, Johnny WILL waay more than likely be played by Jordan. Despite him repeatedly playing coy, its obvious the rumors are true based on his reaction.

Allison Williams casting rumor pre-dates Michael B. Jordan's too

By 2 ****ing days. The Williams report came out on April 30th, and the Jordan report came out on May 2nd.

If you honestly think that is a huge difference or that it means something as far as the castings go (whether or not Sue will be black), then I don't know what to tell you. Cause odds are, Jordan being cast won't stop them from casting everyone else with white actors, like everyone has assumed they won't.

 

[SpideyFan866]

edit

 

[mkilban2]

How come whenever people use a "random" hypothetical assortment of folks to back up their own views, that same "random" hypothetical assortment always happens to agree with them?

Let me try that tactic...

If you asked 100 random people, how do you feel about making Johnny Storm black in the new Fantastic Four movie I'm willing to say that 20% would be for for it, and 80% would be upset of the race change.

Awesome. No heavy lifting involved at all!

because my made up percentages were drawn from logic, while yours were not. Like I, and others have mentioned, 8 out of 10 people would probably have no problem with a race change or even have no idea who Johnny Storm is, a small majority will be the ones with the problem.

If I was in the wrong here I wouldn't be using a random hypothetical assortment to back myself up.

 

[Bruce Malone]

I strongly disagree that a poll of the general audience would have the vast majority being "upset" about a race change for a character most of them are probably barely aware of.

There was very little backlash to hemdall being portrayed by a black actor the same with perry white in the new MOS.

Among comic book fans johnny storm may be a more "important" character but to the general audience he isn't a huge deal. For example if Ghost Rider even for whatever reason was to be played by a black actor in the next film again probably very little backlash among the public.

 

[Kelly]

I strongly disagree that a poll of the general audience would have the vast majority being "upset" about a race change for a character most of them are probably barely aware of.

There was very little backlash to hemdall being portrayed by a black actor the same with perry white in the new MOS.

Among comic book fans johnny storm may be a more "important" character but to the general audience he isn't a huge deal. For example if Ghost Rider even for whatever reason was to be played by a black actor in the next film again probably very little backlash among the public.

For the most part, I agree with you....but for a franchise to make a decision like this that as we have seen has ticked off a good majority of those fans you speak of, in my opinion is not very smart since it is those fans that talk the most on ther internet today, give the most feedback, go to multiple showings which today is a good way for these franchises to make their money, and they buy the merchandise that goes along with this brand. So to even come close to nullifying this part of the movie going audience, IMO is a pretty stupid move on the part of Fox. Especially since that portion of the moviegoing audience is still pissed from the first 2 tries for the most part.

 

[TheComicbookKid]

For the most part, I agree with you....but for a franchise to make a decision like this that as we have seen has ticked off a good majority of those fans you speak of, in my opinion is not very smart since it is those fans that talk the most on ther internet today, give the most feedback, go to multiple showings which today is a good way for these franchises to make their money, and they buy the merchandise that goes along with this brand. So to even come close to nullifying this part of the movie going audience, IMO is a pretty stupid move on the part of Fox. Especially since that portion of the moviegoing audience is still pissed from the first 2 tries for the most part.

Again. Most of these fans, like it or not, will still be in line if it looks amazing and gets good reviews. Fanboys are no where near the majority to make or break a film. How many Scott Pilgrims or Judge Dredds do we have to have before we get over ourselves a little?

Plus, in the era where a multi-ethnic series like Fast and the Furious is pulling down 200 million plus. I don't see why letting some black 6 year-old is kid maybe have a black Johnny Storm toy to play with is going to ruin the world of a 30 year old grown men.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

For the most part, I agree with you....but for a franchise to make a decision like this that as we have seen has ticked off a good majority of those fans you speak of, in my opinion is not very smart since it is those fans that talk the most on ther internet today, give the most feedback, go to multiple showings which today is a good way for these franchises to make their money, and they buy the merchandise that goes along with this brand. So to even come close to nullifying this part of the movie going audience, IMO is a pretty stupid move on the part of Fox. Especially since that portion of the moviegoing audience is still pissed from the first 2 tries for the most part.

I'm pretty sure that if MBJ is cast as Johnny it won't that many people from the theater for it to matter that much. Of course people are going to be mad, but it's not like millions of fans are going to stay home because of the race change. They're going to see it, and if it's good, they're going to see it again and the point will for the most part be moot. For the most part, most fans will complain, but they're going to be in line to see it if it gets good reviews.

I can't imagine people saying this:

Guy A: Hey, I heard that Fantastic Four movie is good.

Guy B: Yeah, but the Human Torch is a black guy, I'd rather not see it.

 

[Kelly]

I'm pretty sure that if MBJ is cast as Johnny it won't that many people from the theater for it to matter that much. Of course people are going to be mad, but it's not like millions of fans are going to stay home because of the race change. They're going to see it, and if it's good, they're going to see it again and the point will for the most part be moot. For the most part, most fans will complain, but they're going to be in line to see it if it gets good reviews.

I can't imagine people saying this:

Guy A: Hey, I heard that Fantastic Four movie is good.

Guy B: Yeah, but the Human Torch is a black guy, I'd rather not see it.

I'm not talking so much about the number going to the movie...I'm talking more about the "word of mouth" at the beginning. The "word of mouth" when people began to realize that we were not going to see Galactus was HUGE...

The fact that the "word of mouth" already is "oh crap, Fox is putting the movie out...well its going to suck like the other 2" already has a good number of CB internet sites taking the negative route. Why add to that when you don't really have to?

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

I think you're overreacting about the word of mouth at this point. It never matters what the word of mouth is at this point. This is pre-production. People were pissed when Heath Ledger was announced as the joke. People were pissed when Keaton became Batman.

You know what changes people's minds? A trailer. If the movie looks good, interests people, and gets good reviews, very few people are going to care what the race of Johnny Storm is.

 

[Kelly]

I think you're overreacting about the word of mouth at this point. It never matters what the word of mouth is at this point. This is pre-production. People were pissed when Heath Ledger was announced as the joke. People were pissed when Keaton became Batman.

You know what changes people's minds? A trailer. If the movie looks good, interests people, and gets good reviews, very few people are going to care what the race of Johnny Storm is.

I'm really not overreacting at all (honestly I've become pretty "meh" about this whole issue)....I just know from history of this franchise what the internet "word of mouth" can do. Honestly, at this point, doesn't matter to me personally who they cast, I'm going to make up my own mind on their performance when I see the movie. I just think that setting yourself up for fanboy backlash with an already floundering franchise, is pretty stupid. That's all....

It's apples and oranges using movies from different "internet eras" to compare anything, hell the internet has changed since 2004 and 2007. There are far more sites, far more people seeking out trailers, talk, etc on the internet than ever before.

The only thing, IMO, that can turn that around is an UNBELIEVABLE PERFORMANCE from MJB, and although I'm sure he will do a fine job, I don't necessarily see it as going to be SO GOOD, that it would have out shined another choice that not only looks the part from the comic, but also acts the part.

As I said, not a major deal for me personally....if he does a good job, then great. Just seems to be an unnecessary change, and nothing more.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

Yeah, I can see how that's bad. I just think that it's not necessarily the first time people didn't like the casting of an actor only to love the final result.

 

[Kelly]

Yeah, I can see how that's bad. I just think that it's not necessarily the first time people didn't like the casting of an actor only to love the final result.

Oh definitely agree with you there....

I'm just excited to see the movie, and if the casting stays as what we have seen thus far, then good luck to them....and I hope they do a great job.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Haven't we heard filming would be starting in July?

Shouldn't we be getting a cast soon, soon, soon if that's true? I still think we haven't heard anybody who will actually be in the final film yet, but our curiousity should be satisfied soon.

 

[Kelly]

Haven't we heard filming would be starting in July?

Shouldn't we be getting a cast soon, soon, soon if that's true? I still think we haven't heard anybody who will actually be in the final film yet, but our curiousity should be satisfied soon.

Remember we didn't a cast for the first one until right before Comic Con....so we should be hearing something soon if they are in fact starting to film in July. That could also mean scoping out places to film, or simply opening up the offices in Vancouver.

 

[Project862006]

liam hemsworth didn't look too bad in paranoia trailer i honestly think thats who fox should go after

 

[Kelly]

I would love to see him in that role, but I don't think that Fox would even pay the money for him. They will probably go with someone that would do it for far, far less money.

 

[Gunga Diner]

I'm all for the dude from Chronicle playing Johnny Storm. He'd be great for the role. Anybody who thinks that Johnny's whiteness is a crucial aspect to his character has some growing up to do. That said, I think it would be a chicken***** move on the studio's part to cast a white actress as sue if they're gonna go in that direction. As if her whiteness is more important than Johnny and Sue being biologically related brother and sister. As if audiences aren't ready for a half-black fantastic four, or an onscreen interracial married couple in a superhero movie.

 

[Bruce Malone]

I'm all for the dude from Chronicle playing Johnny Storm. He'd be great for the role. Anybody who thinks that Johnny's whiteness is a crucial aspect to his character has some growing up to do. That said, I think it would be a chicken***** move on the studio's part to cast a white actress as sue if they're gonna go in that direction. As if her whiteness is more important than Johnny and Sue being biologically related brother and sister. As if audiences aren't ready for a half-black fantastic four, or an onscreen interracial married couple in a superhero movie.

I admit i don't follow the F4 comics really but is them being biologically siblings that an important factor to their relationship as opposed to them just being brother and sister?

Is something about them being biologically related extra stressed or relevant to the stories?

If the chronicle guy is cast i don't think their intent was purely to change the racial dynamics of the whole family, just that he happens to be the actor they want and he happens to be black.

 

[Gunga Diner]

I admit i don't follow the F4 comics really but is them being biologically siblings that an important factor to their relationship as opposed to them just being brother and sister?

Is something about them being biologically related extra stressed or relevant to the stories?

If the chronicle guy is cast i don't think their intent was purely to change the racial dynamics of the whole family, just that he happens to be the actor they want and he happens to be black.

I'm with you on the last part there. His performance in Chronicle SCREAMED Johnny Storm. It just seems wonky to me that they would alter a character dynamic so that they could justify casting a white actress as his sister when you already have a black actor there in the role.

And although them being adoptive siblings wouldn't be the worst thing ever, I think it would be a loss. Johnny and Sue being brother and sister gives them a dynamic that none of the other characters have. Ben and Reed are LIKE brothers, but that's the kind of friendship that forms when two people FIND each other. Ben and Johnny are also LIKE brothers because their love for one another is intermingled with petty squabbling that comes from being in constant contact. You push eachothers' buttons. But Johnny and Sue actually share a mother. When the rest of the team is sort of a "found" family, it gives it a little more weight that two of them are actually related.

But at the same time, I guess you could get that dynamic from adoptive siblings. I'm just cranky because it seems like it might make more sense to just find a black actress for the role who can pull it off. I love the Paula Patton suggestion, she would do wonderfully with the role. We've also seen that she can do action. It would give us something we've never seen before, and would be really cool for all the black kids growing up who don't have any cool, fun, powerful characters in these superhero movies that they can identify with the way I can with all the white male characters. Although I do look forward to Anthony Mackie as Falcon

 

[Snikt]

Shouldn't we be hearing some casting announcements soon. I thought I read somewhere filming would begin this July.

 

[Kelly]

Shouldn't we be hearing some casting announcements soon. I thought I read somewhere filming would begin this July.

Same thing happened with the first movie. We didn't know the full cast until Comic Con...they said they were starting to shoot in July and then pushed it to September. I have a feeling we are going to do the same thing here.

 

[Dr. Evil]

If you have Johnny as Black and Sue as white, maybe they change the sibling story and mention that Johnny was adopted?

 

[Kelly]

Yeah, that has been mentioned once or twice.

 

[bapi]

Liam Hemsworth or Joel Kinnaman would be be great but if it's Michael B. Jordan... Well, I have to accept it.

 

[mercureyx]

It's not shooting in July anymore.