The Last Jedi General Episode VIII News/Speculation/SPOILER Thread - - - - Part 13

[Grootster]

I knew mentioning the complaints about gravity would start something.

It didn't have anything to do with that post, I actually remembered the BB-8 scene yesterday and didn't get around to posting it here until today.

For the record, I have no problem with the bomb/gravity thing. I just assumed the bombers had some sort of mechanism propelling the bombs downward and out of the ship (probably the same with Tie Bombers and whatnot.) Or maybe the bombs have boosters on them, there are a lot of explanations for something like this, I really don't see why it's become an issue with some people.

I actually had more of a problem with the fact that the bombers were designed to exhaust their entire payload in one shot. But I understand the plot convenience here, (and we don't know exactly what those bombers were originally designed for.)

Neither of those are really comparable to BB-8 sticking his fingers into a circuit-board to plug up a "leak" of sparks. That's not just a visual cheat for plot's sake, that's a Looney Tunes-level joke that would be more at home in a Star Wars parody.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Also, what was up with the scene where BB-8 fixes Poe's X-wing? The idea was neat, but the visual was one of the most baffling images I've seen put to screen in a while. It's like he's trying to plug a leak with his robot fingers, but instead of an actual leak it's sparks! Wouldn't it have made more sense for the ship to be leaking oil or something?

I'm not sure if the original intention was lost in translating the script to the screen, or it was just a cheap joke and "us dumb audience" isn't supposed to know how fixing a circuit-board works.

He is trying to complete the connection/circuit, using his metal body. That seemed pretty obvious.

 

[Grootster]

I didn’t think it was corny. Rose’s sister died sacrificing herself in a battle they didn’t need to fight. If Finn flew into the cannon, he likely wouldn’t have stopped the First Order or saved the Resistance with his sacrifice, so the best thing to do was find another way. And they did. You don’t always have to die for the fight.

But Rose's line didn't have anything to do with sacrifice, it had to do with fighting (which she was doing five minutes earlier.) I kind of get what she was going for, but I came across as more of an anti-fight/anti-violence message than an anti-needless sacrifice message.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Ever since the Nolan Batman movies (Which I love) people have gotten obsessed with "realism" in their fantasy, it's gotten tiresome.

The best thing about this is Nolan's Batman is fantasy as hell. Its like some took the wrong lessons from those films.

You must not have watched many movies last year.

Considering how often he goes into a thread to tell everyone he hasn't seen it or other films from the past, I find this rather possible.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

But Rose's line didn't have anything to do with sacrifice, it had to do with fighting (which she was doing five minutes earlier.) I kind of get what she was going for, but I came across as more of an anti-fight/anti-violence message than an anti-needless sacrifice message.

Its a question of why you fight/die. Rose stops Finn from a pointless sacrifice that saves no one. It is actually juxtaposed well with [BLACKOUT]Luke[/BLACKOUT], whose sacrifice does save the ones he loves. Saves the Resistance.

 

[danoyse]

But Rose's line didn't have anything to do with sacrifice, it had to do with fighting (which she was doing five minutes earlier.) I kind of get what she was going for, but I came across as more of an anti-fight/anti-violence message than an anti-needless sacrifice message.

The line had everything to do with sacrifice. Finn was charging into that cannon to die. Rose’s line was telling him he didn’t have to. You save the things you love to make sure there’s something left when the fight is done.

She didn’t want him to stop fighting. Quite the opposite - she wanted him to keep fighting by not making a sacrifice that wouldn’t win the fight.

 

[Orba]

I wouldn't be half-surprised to see her use the Skywalker crystal and turn it into a double-bladed saber. I've always liked the idea of her going double-bladed since she's got the staff experience.

Do we know if the crystal from the saber survived the explosion? Personally I'd rather they went with a different colour (always wanted to see a live action yellow blade) so that the internet explodes with people complaining about where Rey could have found a new kyber crystal.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Yes. It is seen intact at the end of the film.

 

[Mask&Cape]

No idea. There wasn’t any language that I recall.

It’s more about the history about how Kenner made the original deal, and they got a crazy good deal, since every other toy company passed on it. They show how they made the original action figure prototypes, interviewed the guy who designed all of the Millennium Falcon toys (he’s still designing them!), and talked about the infamous Boba Fett figure. I mailed away for that action figure, I remember my mom checking to make sure that the rocket didn’t come loose before she let us play with it.

They also tour Steve Sansweet’s collection a bit, which I love to see more of. They had a Rancho Obi Wan setup at SW Celebration last year, and it was so cool.

I didn't get a chance to watch it tonight, hopefully tomorrow.

Comedy relief is one thing, but that scene was just bizarre. You don't fix a sparking circuit-board by sticking your finders in it to plug it like a leak. And I'm not just some obsessive techie, that's pretty common knowledge. Silly jokes are fine, but it has to be somewhat plausible-in universe.

I didn’t think it was corny. Rose’s sister died sacrificing herself in a battle they didn’t need to fight. If Finn flew into the cannon, he likely wouldn’t have stopped the First Order or saved the Resistance with his sacrifice, so the best thing to do was find another way. And they did. You don’t always have to die for the fight.

Nicely said.

 

[Mask&Cape]

Yes, she can stamp her own individuality on it, I like the idea Lobster had of her having a dual Lightsaber, perhaps one that can pull apart into two Lightsabers.

Has that been done on TCW or in a game? Seems familiar.

Or am I just thinking of the lightsabre builds sets?

This was one of my favourite episodes as well, and I've wanted to see a Jedi craft their Lightsaber in live action ever since.

Just love those episodes. You've made me raise my hopes about IX already - if Abrams doesn't do it I blame you.

Ever since the Nolan Batman movies (Which I love) people have gotten obsessed with "realism" in their fantasy, it's gotten tiresome.

Is that when every filmmaker started about keeping things "grounded".

I feel like Abrams was holding back on the

[/QUOTE]You must not have watched many movies last year. [/QUOTE]

Indeed.

 

[Mask&Cape]

Since seeing the film I have been curious if she is going to repair the Skywalker lightsaber or use the parts to build her own. Considering she is a tinker, she should be able to pull it off. But either way, I want the saber done by the start of the film, because there needs to be a rather large time jump imo.

Rey needs to build her own rather give the Skywalker lightsabre a repair job - part of her creating her own path.

What do you mean by a "large time jump"? I was thinking 3 to 5 years. You think it should be more?

Yes, Rey does need a lightsabre in those years between VIII and IX as Lucasfilm will be using that time period in comics, books and hopefully even animation, and she may be encountering the other Knights of Ren. However, Rey should be without a lightsabre in the early stories and assembling the parts should be a quest.

I really do want to see Rey build it on screen so losing the first lightsabre she builds herself could happen in the opening of IX, or just prior to the movie, and we get to see build one in IX.

 

[Mask&Cape]

It didn't have anything to do with that post, I actually remembered the BB-8 scene yesterday and didn't get around to posting it here until today.

For the record, I have no problem with the bomb/gravity thing. I just assumed the bombers had some sort of mechanism propelling the bombs downward and out of the ship (probably the same with Tie Bombers and whatnot.) Or maybe the bombs have boosters on them, there are a lot of explanations for something like this, I really don't see why it's become an issue with some people.

I actually had more of a problem with the fact that the bombers were designed to exhaust their entire payload in one shot. But I understand the plot convenience here, (and we don't know exactly what those bombers were originally designed for.)

Neither of those are really comparable to BB-8 sticking his fingers into a circuit-board to plug up a "leak" of sparks. That's not just a visual cheat for plot's sake, that's a Looney Tunes-level joke that would be more at home in a Star Wars parody.

My comment meant that by merely mentioning the ridiculousness of the "gravity criticism" that I had opened Pandora's Box of other ridiculous complaints about the "science of Star Wars".

You have a problem with Star Wars' portrayal of electrical engineering but not the use of magic, funky gravity, people who can understand grunts and whistles as words, sound in the vacuum of space, etc. etc.

Escapism.

You are forgetting how to just enjoy a movie.

 

[Mask&Cape]

Its a question of why you fight/die. Rose stops Finn from a pointless sacrifice that saves no one. It is actually juxtaposed well with [BLACKOUT]Luke[/BLACKOUT], whose sacrifice does save the ones he loves. Saves the Resistance.

The line had everything to do with sacrifice. Finn was charging into that cannon to die. Rose’s line was telling him he didn’t have to. You save the things you love to make sure there’s something left when the fight is done.

She didn’t want him to stop fighting. Quite the opposite - she wanted him to keep fighting by not making a sacrifice that wouldn’t win the fight.

Both are well said.

 

[Mask&Cape]

Do we know if the crystal from the saber survived the explosion? Personally I'd rather they went with a different colour (always wanted to see a live action yellow blade) so that the internet explodes with people complaining about where Rey could have found a new kyber crystal.

I'm open to correction here but I don't think the lightsabre colour is decided by the colour of the crystal.

I think all the crystals in the Younglings arc on TCW are blue but some of the blades are green.

 

[Mask&Cape]

Does any of the reference material explain the First Orders chain of command?

Is General Hux the highest ranking officer of the First Order? And is Phasma the leader of the every stormtrooper in the First Order or just the commander of the Hux's stormtroopers?

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

Hux really bugs me. I can easily buy Tarkin being a top military commander. He commanded respect. Not this clown. I find it hard to believe he wasn't Ozzel'd ages ago.

 

[Grootster]

My comment meant that by merely mentioning the ridiculousness of the "gravity criticism" that I had opened Pandora's Box of other ridiculous complaints about the "science of Star Wars".

You have a problem with Star Wars' portrayal of electrical engineering but not the use of magic, funky gravity, people who can understand grunts and whistles as words, sound in the vacuum of space, etc. etc.

Escapism.

You are forgetting how to just enjoy a movie.

I'm not forgetting how to enjoy a movie. I don't have a problem with magic, sound in space, aliens, and whatnot because those have all been a part of Star Wars since day 1. Pretty much all sci-fi/fantasy movies take liberty with science and physics, but it has to remain more-or-less within the realm of what's been established as okay for that particular universe.

When I step into the Star Wars universe I expect sound in space. I don't expect a droid to fix a ship by sticking his head into a circuit board like he's plugging a leak. It's the same reason why people are okay with Gandalf being able to use magic in LOTR, but it would raise an eyebrow if he were to suddenly drive a Lamborghini. It just wouldn't fit the universe that's been established in multiple movies.

The BB-8 joke would be perfectly acceptable in Spaceballs or Looney Tunes, but it just felt cheap in a Star Wars movie to me. I'm not saying it's a movie-ruining moment for me, it just kind of takes me out of the movie.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

No one but you honestly cares about the application of our own Earthbound science to the world of SW.

And no... Most people honestly have zero clue about circuit boards and how to repair them. If that were so no one would be calling in specialists to do said repair work. Everyone would own a soldering iron and be doing said work themselves... But they don't.

As far reaching as automotive repair and engine knowledge is in the culture films take liberties with cars all the time. Think of all the explosions that happen with cars in movies that fly in the face of real world physics. This is the nittiest of nitpicks.

 

[danoyse]

I'm not forgetting how to enjoy a movie. I don't have a problem with magic, sound in space, aliens, and whatnot because those have all been a part of Star Wars since day 1. Pretty much all sci-fi/fantasy movies take liberty with science and physics, but it has to remain more-or-less within the realm of what's been established as okay for that particular universe.

When I step into the Star Wars universe I expect sound in space. I don't expect a droid to fix a ship by sticking his head into a circuit board like he's plugging a leak. It's the same reason why people are okay with Gandalf being able to use magic in LOTR, but it would raise an eyebrow if he were to suddenly drive a Lamborghini. It just wouldn't fit the universe that's been established in multiple movies.

The BB-8 joke would be perfectly acceptable in Spaceballs or Looney Tunes, but it just felt cheap in a Star Wars movie to me. I'm not saying it's a movie-ruining moment for me, it just kind of takes me out of the movie.

Remember the time Han Solo punched the cockpit of the Millennium Falcon in the Empire Strikes Back and it turned back on?

 

[Grootster]

It's not a matter of Star Wars being scientifically accurate, it's a matter of Star Wars staying true to the aesthetic it's established.

Different movie series' have different tones and aesthetics. What's okay for one movie might not be okay in another. A lot of people complain about the "cute boyfriend" line in TFA for the same reason, to some it didn't feel like Star Wars dialog. As I said in my above post, magic is fine in LOTR, but Gandalf driving a car wouldn't fit within the universe. If Star Wars Episode 9 had Luke's Force ghost return driving a Lamborghini, would that be an acceptable form of humor?

Remember the time Han Solo punched the cockpit of the Millennium Falcon in the Empire Strikes Back and it turned back on?

Yeah, but that kind of thing often works in real life, and more importantly it didn't really feel dumb or goofy.

 

[danoyse]

A lot of people complain about the "cute boyfriend" line in TFA for the same reason, to some it didn't feel like Star Wars dialog.

Those people need to lighten up and find something better to do.

As I said in my above post, magic is fine in LOTR, but Gandalf driving a car wouldn't fit within the universe. If Star Wars Episode 9 had Luke's Force ghost return driving a Lamborghini, would that be an acceptable form of humor?

Of course not. Luke's Force Ghost would drive a Porsche.

Yeah, but that kind of thing often works in real life, and more importantly it didn't really feel dumb or goofy.

How many broken spaceships have you punched to prove this would work in real life?

 

[writer0327]

I'm not forgetting how to enjoy a movie. I don't have a problem with magic, sound in space, aliens, and whatnot because those have all been a part of Star Wars since day 1. Pretty much all sci-fi/fantasy movies take liberty with science and physics, but it has to remain more-or-less within the realm of what's been established as okay for that particular universe.

When I step into the Star Wars universe I expect sound in space. I don't expect a droid to fix a ship by sticking his head into a circuit board like he's plugging a leak. It's the same reason why people are okay with Gandalf being able to use magic in LOTR, but it would raise an eyebrow if he were to suddenly drive a Lamborghini. It just wouldn't fit the universe that's been established in multiple movies.

The BB-8 joke would be perfectly acceptable in Spaceballs or Looney Tunes, but it just felt cheap in a Star Wars movie to me. I'm not saying it's a movie-ruining moment for me, it just kind of takes me out of the movie.

I thought it was pretty funny myself. I wouldn't say it didn't fit the universe however. There was plenty of slapstick moments like that in the PT.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

I thought it was pretty funny myself. I wouldn't say it didn't fit the universe however. There was plenty of slapstick moments like that in the PT.

There is slapstick in the OT. Its name is Han Solo.

 

[danoyse]

I thought it was pretty funny myself. I wouldn't say it didn't fit the universe however. There was plenty of slapstick moments like that in the PT.

And in the original trilogy as well.

"Would it help if I got out and pushed?"

That's something people say about cars. They used it about a spaceship.

Or the mouse droid running away from Chewie in the first movie. That was pretty silly too. BB-8 was making the same mouse droid noises when he was 'undercover' on the First Order ship.

 

[DarthSkywalker]