HBO's Game of Thrones - - - - - Part 14

[DarthSkywalker]

I thought Season 3 was more or less equal to Season 1, but Season 4 could definitely trump them all yet. Hell, I like them all equally, but I will admit that Season 2 is the weakest.

As a sidenote, I watched some Season 1 episodes over the weekend and the one thing it doesn't have on the later seasons is the cinematography. Not that it wasn't good in the first place, but the show just looks so much better from Season 2 onward.

Season 3 doesn't have the weird wandering feel of most of season 2, but there are storylines that are clearly lacking, and a lot of build up. I really like season 3, but it almost feels like the whole thing hangs on Jaime and building to the Red Wedding. Season 3 was a better version of season 2 (a season that felt like it was simply building to Blackwater).

Season 1 never did that, it was so tightly written. Each episode had its own goals, their own OMG moments, while building to Baelor. It is why the pacing, editing and flow of season 1 is so much better then season 2 and 3. It helped season 1 a lot that Ned was the center. He had a connection to every storyline, and was able to be the focal point. Season 1 lacks a little bit in the looks, but makes up for it in the meat.

So far season 4 resembles season 1, though it feels even more cinematic, more polished.

 

[Roose Bolton]

I feel like a broke record on this. But yes, the big finales of Book 4 and 5 will come at the end of season 5. All signs point to it. A good portion of book 4 and 5 will be incorporated this season as well, and we already have seen some material that points to this.

It will be simple. The travelogue and lack of progression in AFFC and ADWD will cause them to be cutdown quite a bit. If they didn't, there would be long stretches were the stars of the show don't appear.

By season 6, we will probably be ahead of the books, unless TWOW actually gets printed next year.

We won't get

Spoiler

Any of the Barristan as Hand of the Queen chapters

in season 5.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Possibly, but that isn't a big finale. Those belong to

Spoiler

Jon, Dany, and Jaime.

 

[Roose Bolton]

Jaime lol

But my point is, that there's a decent sized plot line from ADWD that's not gonna be in season 5. And in terms of season 5 as whole it's not the events, it's the 7 new characters that they have to not only introduce, but also do well in a cinematic way. They need to establish who these people are, what their story is and give them a character arc.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Jaime lol

But my point is, that's still a decent sized plot line from ADWD that's not gonna be in season 5. And in terms of season 5 as whole it's not the events, it's the 7 new characters that they have to not only introduce, but also do well in a cinematic way, they need to establish who these people are, what their story is and give them a character arc.

Spoiler

It will be one of the two big cliffhangers. The audience will know where he is going.

And while some ADWD material might make it to season 6, we are probably looking at TWOW material in season 5 as well. I am with those that believe that either,

Spoiler

the Battle of Ice or the Battle of Meereen

will be in season 5.

For all intent and purpose AFFC and ADWD will be done by the end of season 5. Any new characters of consequence will be introduced, while the others will be cut down or cut completely.

Considering how they have handled Stannis and the Greyjoys so far, I honestly don't understand why you think newer characters of arguably less importance are going to get hours to themselves.

 

[Roose Bolton]

The Greyjoys weren't even in ASOS. They appeared in ACOK as pure set up for the post-War of the Five Kings stuff, and despite that D&D have given them stuff that doesn't necessarily need to be included. Balon was never as important as his three brothers, other than as a motivator for Theon's fall.

And Stannis, the fact that they're giving Stannis at least 4 episodes of added material points to them understanding his importance to the narrative at least.

And the fact is, Young Griff changes the entire scope of the storyline.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

The Greyjoys weren't even in ASOS. They appeared in ACOK as pure set up for the post-War of the Five Kings stuff, and despite that D&D have given them stuff that doesn't necessarily need to be included. Balon was never as important as his three brothers, other than as a motivator for Theon's fall.

And Stannis, the fact that they're giving Stannis at least 4 episodes of added material points to them understanding his importance to the narrative at least.

Spoiler

And the fact is, Young Griff changes the entire scope of the storyline.

Please stop writing characters who have not appeared on the show outside of spoiler tags. It is spoiler material and against the rules.

Balon's importance is tied to Theon, who is important.

Stannis importance on the show is being tied more and more to Mel. She is what makes his story tick on the show. We might be hanging out in Stannis camp, but it is Mel's show. He is almost a supporting character, though hopefully that will change this season. Even still, he is important, especially compared to a lot of the newer character in books 4 and 5.

Spoiler

As to Young Griff he changes little to nothing in terms of the narrative. First, he is fake. Second, he will spend most of his relevant screen time with "active" characters.

I don't even know why this is an argument, especially considering the words of the show runners. If they weren't going to do this, I don't think they would have spend through some storylines so much. Just look at Arya.

 

[Great Mind(s)]

Is that infamous line from Bolton going to make it into the show? I was somehow under the impression Reek wouldn't be able to walk or talk right anymore after his flaying. But I never read the books...

 

[Ezio Auditore]

Has Martin finished writing the entire series or is he still working on them? I heard he told HBO how he wants the show to end if he passes away for whatever reason....so I was wondering if he had the books done...

No, he hasn't. The last book to be published was A Dance With Dragons, which is the fifth one, back in 2011. The 6th is supposed to be published around these days (years). So we gotta looooong way to go yet.

In terms of chronology

1996 - A Game of Thrones
1998 - A Clash of Kings
2000 - A Storm of Swords
2005 - A Feast for Crows
2011 - A Dance with Dragons
2017 - The Winds of Winter
2069 - A Dream of Spring


If I were you, i wouldn't read book 3 now. You best watch this season without knowing anything that will happen at all.

I suggest you read the first two. And when this season ends, you pick up book 3.

 

[Hyde]

I haven't read AFFC or ADWD yet, but I find it hard to believe they can both be condensed into Season 5 given their size. The latter was split into two here in the UK because it was so big, ala ASOS. Since they take place simultaneously it'll be easy to take bits and mesh them with others but I really, really, really don't think they can fit 2000+ pages of material into one season, and then maybe bits of TWOW as well. I'm pretty certain it'll cover Seasons 5 and 6. If they even had to cut stuff out of Seasons 1 and 2, when their respective books aren't even 1000 pages, then they're not going to be able to fit more than double that in one season, cutting stuff or not.

Plus TWOW will probably be published by the end of Season 6 anyway. The real problem is getting ADOS, and if he wants to finish his books before the show ends then he's going to have to really hurry the **** up. Maybe he's already started writing it.

 

[Roose Bolton]

Please stop writing characters who have not appeared on the show outside of spoiler tags. It is spoiler material and against the rules.

Balon's importance is tied to Theon, who is important.

Stannis importance on the show is being tied more and more to Mel. She is what makes his story tick on the show. We might be hanging out in Stannis camp, but it is Mel's show.

Spoiler

As to Young Griff he changes little to nothing in terms of the narrative. First, he is fake. Second, he will spend most of his relevant screen time with "active" characters.

I don't even know why this is an argument, especially considering the words of the show runners.

To an Unsullied viewer I'm not spoiling anything.

Balon appeared for a few chapters in ACoK, then we never see him again in a POV chapter for the rest of the series. He's named dropped and that's it. The show is actually one upping it in that nature by showing him where he isn't included and in scenes that aren't vital. That fact he was mentioned again this episode (twice!) is telling.

We're still seeing Stannis, we're still getting the basic narrative story of the Davos chapters, and whilst D.B Weiss doesn't like or understand the character of Stannis, they're still showing an arc for him.

Spoiler

Young Griff is a Blackfyre, likely the spawn of Varys sister and Illyrio's wife and provides an entire new dimension to the conflict by showing that Red vs Black aspect is still dominating the inner workings of the war for the Iron Throne. They also need to introduce Jon Connington and incorporate his backstory and relationship with Rhaegar and Aerys into the narrative, which will take longer than the book since we aren't privy to any Rebellion flashbacks.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

I haven't read AFFC or ADWD yet, but I find it hard to believe they can both be condensed into Season 5 given their size. The latter was split into two here in the UK because it was so big, ala ASOS. Since they take place simultaneously it'll be easy to take bits and mesh them with others but I really, really, really don't think they can fit 2000+ pages of material into one season, and then maybe bits of TWOW as well. I'm pretty certain it'll cover Seasons 5 and 6. If they even had to cut stuff out of Seasons 1 and 2, when their respective books aren't even 1000 pages, then they're not going to be able to fit more than double that in one season, cutting stuff or not.

Plus TWOW will probably be published by the end of Season 6 anyway. The real problem is getting ADOS, and if he wants to finish his books before the show ends then he's going to have to really hurry the **** up. Maybe he's already started writing it.

Having read and listened to both, I can tell you now it will be rather easy, and probably produce much better material. To call them over descriptive travelogues is being nice. Basically a lot of filler in what results in two bridge books. They are not the sequel to ASOS. We are still waiting for that.

That is why the show runners have been saying they won't hold to the structure of past seasons in terms of adaptation of book material. If you think they are going to waste 2 seasons of the last 3/4 seasons on those books, I don't know what to tell you.

 

[Marvolo]

I haven't read AFFC or ADWD yet, but I find it hard to believe they can both be condensed into Season 5 given their size. The latter was split into two here in the UK because it was so big, ala ASOS. Since they take place simultaneously it'll be easy to take bits and mesh them with others but I really, really, really don't think they can fit 2000+ pages of material into one season, and then maybe bits of TWOW as well. I'm pretty certain it'll cover Seasons 5 and 6. If they even had to cut stuff out of Seasons 1 and 2, when their respective books aren't even 1000 pages, then they're not going to be able to fit more than double that in one season, cutting stuff or not.

Plus TWOW will probably be published by the end of Season 6 anyway. The real problem is getting ADOS, and if he wants to finish his books before the show ends then he's going to have to really hurry the **** up. Maybe he's already started writing it.

D&D have said from here on out they will not be condensing or splitting any book into a particular season. The days of adapting a particular book for a single season is over. They are taking from the whole of the rest of the story and making that into seasons 4-8. So in fact, no, they arent condensing books 4&5 into season 5. They are condensing books 3-7 into seasons 4-8. Thats their strategy from here on out. And these arent speculations, but words from their mouths. Its in interviews theyve done for the past 2 years. The show will end in June 2018. They planned the whole thing to be 80 hours from the beginning and have discussed the ending with GRRM, and have also said they will not wait for him to finish the books. D&D also have their follow up project already contracted. And HBO never intended to drag this out to accomodate Martin's ridiculous sloth pace. The train is moving and not lettin up.

 

[Ezio Auditore]

Having read and listened to both, I can tell you now it will be rather easy, and probably produce much better material. To call them over descriptive travelogues is being nice. Basically a lot of filler in what results in two bridge books. They are not the sequel to ASOS. We are still waiting for that.

That is why the show runners have been saying they won't hold to the structure of past seasons in terms of adaptation of book material. If you think they are going to waste 2 seasons of the last 3/4 seasons on those books, I don't know what to tell you.

I agree. I think that the last quarter part of book 5 is the beginning of the sequel for ASoS.

Although i really liked AFFC and ADWD( some chapters were really boring), for me the real meat of those two books (or should i say "that one big book"?) are the final AFFC chapters and, as i stated above, the final quarter of ADWD.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

To an Unsullied viewer I'm not spoiling anything.

It is against the rules and avoids any grey area on the subject.

Balon appeared for a few chapters in ACoK, then we never see him again in a POV chapter for the rest of the series. He's named dropped and that's it. The show is actually one upping it in that nature by showing him where he isn't included and in scenes that aren't vital. That fact he was mentioned again this episode (twice!) is telling.

It came up during Theon scenes. Not that they won't add more Greyjoys, they will. That doesn't mean they are going to give them loads of screentime. That belongs to the Starks, the Lannisters and the Mother of Dragons.

We're still seeing Stannis, we're still getting the basic narrative story of the Davos chapters, and whilst D.B Weiss doesn't like or understand the character of Stannis, they're still showing an arc for him.

You do realize that is the point? It is basic. Very close to the bare minimum. At the same time we get more Mel. Stannis doesn't take up loads of time on the show. That is the point. We will get the relevant new storylines in very quick and easy terms.

Spoiler

Young Griff is a Blackfyre, likely the spawn of Varys sister and Illyrio's wife and provides an entire new dimension to the conflict by showing that Red vs Black aspect is still dominating the inner workings of the war for the Iron Throne. They also need to introduce Jon Connington and incorporate his backstory and relationship with Rhaegar and Aerys into the narrative, which will take longer than the book since we aren't privy to any Rebellion flashbacks.

And this will all be handled in the same way as Stannis, Theon's trip to home, or Oberyn. 10 mins will suffice, with another 20-30 mins spread throughout the season. The rest will come through interaction with established characters.

It is not difficult to gauge.

 

[Marvolo]

Honestly I wouldnt expect to see much more than highlights of AFFC or ADWD on the tv show.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Honestly I wouldnt expect to see much more than highlights of AFFC or ADWD on the tv show.

I think season 5 will be more of a "greatest hits" take on book 4 and 5 with a sprinkling of book 6, which I think will be for the best.

I think they are going to start structuring the seasons around the "most important" leads, like they did for season 1 and season 2.

 

[Kane52630]

 

[Golgo-13]

Just watched sundays ep…

Good riddance!

 

[Drizzle]

You know, a while back I would have said the Purple Wedding was my most anticipated moment of Season 4, and while that may be true, now that it's done I can't wait for this huge finale they say they've cooked up.

 

[Kane52630]

 

[Drizzle]

 

[Sawyer]

 

[DarthSkywalker]

That Mrs. Doubtfire gif needs to be cut together with Jaime running after Joffrey.

 

[Spidey-Bat]

My thought when I saw Jaime running was, "Help is on the way, dear!"