Henry Cavill IS Clark Kent/Superman - Part 5

[Da-Scribe]

I have been waiting for BN v misslane for months. Lois is the key.

 

[Black Narcissus]

I have been waiting for BN v misslane for months. Lois is the key.

Huh?

I've had misslane on ignore for weeks now.

 

[misslane38]

I mean, this is so much better IMHO.

Love this with DCAU's Superman, Tim Daly:

Even this is better:

Gotta love this quote from Mark Waid, author of Kingdom Come:

Has it been interesting to you, the way that your takes on these characters have informed what’s come in the last 20 years? Obviously we now have a generation of people who are coming up who are writing for whom Kingdom Come is kind of a key piece of the comics canon. Yeah, that terrifies me. [Laughs] Not because I’m protective of it. Not because I feel like it’s our toy and nobody else should play with it. That’s not it at all. It’s just the idea that I see some touches of Kingdom Come here and there that are well thought out and well executed and make me feel good, and I see other places where they just ignore the fact that it’s supposed to be a cautionary fable. It’s not supposed to be like this! We weren’t saying Lois should die and Superman and Wonder Woman should be together for ever and ever. That wasn’t the point of the story; that was unintended consequences. Every once in a while somebody will make a choice and defend it as, “Well, it’s the way it was in Kingdom Come,” to which you just want to go, “No! No, that was a cautionary fable!”​

​

I also loved the way Bryan Q. Miller handled Clark, Lois, Diana, and Steve in the Smallville: Season 11 comic arc "Olympus"

 

[Da-Scribe]

Huh?

I've had misslane on ignore for weeks now.

Oh.

 

[Black Narcissus]

Oh.

Kill Lois.

And if they give WW a love interest, it should be Supes.

 

[misslane38]

Kill Lois.

And if they give WW a love interest, it should be Supes.

I don't care if you're ignoring me. I don't even care if this is in jest. Every writer who has ever done what you're suggesting has either regretted it or has offered such a story up as a cautionary tale of WHAT NOT TO DO. Pairing Superman and Wonder Woman has never done either character any favors. Wonder Woman, in particular, suffers because it means romantically linking her to the one man who is more powerful than she is. Her story and her mythology is built on the idea that men can and should accept being in a relationship with a woman who is more powerful than he is. It's also so un-romantic. A romance based on murder and sloppy seconds. Even Waid's Kingdom Come has Superman ordering the dish that was the Bronze Age code word for sex with Lois (beef bourguignon) at the Planet Krypton restaurant even while his newly pregnant wife, Diana, is sitting there next to him.

To stay focused on the shipping, but refocus on Henry Cavill. Here is what he has had to say on the matter of Lois vs. Diana:

“Yes, the goddess can do all the normal things which are normal in a relationship, and not have any fear of Superman. But you also need to have that baseline of humanity, which Lois provides. And literally keeps his feet on the ground, keeps him down to earth.”

“Superman and Lois are both extraordinary individuals. Lois Lane is an incredibly intense journalist who can probably be considered quite abrasive by some of her peers who don’t have the same hunger and drive. And Superman’s a very unique individual with an incredible soul and an incredible heart. They are exceptional individuals who rub off on each other. To be with anyone else would probably be rather boring.”

 

[BH/HHH]

God forbid anyone say anything bad or crack a joke about Lois Lane

 

[Superchan]

I liked Tomasi's run on superman/wonderwoman especially the part where superman had to prove himself to Diana's relatives (namely Apollo).
Meeting your GF's family is somewhat scary and now imagine said family is made up of greek gods! Grant Morrison always said that the best superman stories are ones that touch on very human issues, only dialed up to a million!
To cut a long story short, Lois has always been (with very few exceptions) an annoying, b****y concept who only exists to be the damsel, so if they do away with her and hook superman and wonderwoman up then I'll have no probs with it.

 

[Black Narcissus]

Lois is the chick you smash pre super saiyan, but once you go super saiyan, you gotta smash another powerful being.

 

[misslane38]

God forbid anyone say anything bad or crack a joke about Lois Lane

Jokes are fine. Joking repeatedly about the violent death of a female character is not funny. Don't you think it's a little odd that all of these so-called attempts at humor depend on a woman's murder or death?

 

[BH/HHH]

Jokes are fine. Joking repeatedly about the violent death of a female character is not funny. Don't you think it's a little odd that all of these so-called attempts at humor depend on a woman's murder or death?

What does it matter that the character is a woman? People aren't been sexist here they're making jokes based on reactions they know they'll get.

 

[misslane38]

I liked Tomasi's run on superman/wonderwoman especially the part where superman had to prove himself to Diana's relatives (namely Apollo).

I thought the entire run except one or two of Soule's issues was awful. The writing for Wonder Woman was especially poor. After six issues, the title essentially began repeating itself by constantly cycling through the same tired themes, plot devices, and characterizations. What was worse was that 80 percent of the stories were Superman-centric, which is terrible writing for Wonder Woman in a shared title. The book consistently hemorrhaged readers, too.

Grant Morrison always said that the best superman stories are ones that touch on very human issues, only dialed up to a million!

Grant Morrison is also someone who has consistently written stories that celebrate Superman's relationship with Lois Lane. It was Morrison, for example, who wrote DC One Million, which is a story about how Superman and Lois became gold and silver versions of themselves millions of years into the future so their romance would be eternal. He wrote a multiverse story in his New 52 Action Comics run in which a Lois without a Superman found herself in a world without a Lois. Of course, Morrison also wrote the beautiful love story in All Star Superman as well.

To cut a long story short, Lois has always been (with very few exceptions) an annoying, b****y concept who only exists to be the damsel, so if they do away with her and hook superman and wonderwoman up then I'll have no probs with it.

That's some Grade A sexism right there.

 

[misslane38]

What does it matter that the character is a woman? People aren't been sexist here they're making jokes based on reactions they know they'll get.

It matters because what you are referring to is a textbook sexist trope called "Women in Refrigerators." Making jokes about violence against a female character for the sole purpose of essentially fueling a shipping conflict catfight mentality is sexist.

 

[Black Narcissus]

Superman should be a Rolex wearing, diamond ring wearing, kiss stealing, whoo! wheelin dealin’, limosuine riding, jet flying son of a gun and having a hard time holding these alligators down!

Lois be damned.

Whooo!

 

[Polux]

Superman should be a Rolex wearing, diamond ring wearing, kiss stealing, whoo! wheelin dealin’, limosuine riding, jet flying son of a gun and having a hard time holding these alligators down!

Lois be damned.

Whooo!

 

[Superchan]

I thought the entire run except one or two of Soule's issues was awful. The writing for Wonder Woman was especially poor. After six issues, the title essentially began repeating itself by constantly cycling through the same tired themes, plot devices, and characterizations. What was worse was that 80 percent of the stories were Superman-centric, which is terrible writing for Wonder Woman in a shared title. The book consistently hemorrhaged readers, too.

Sure but I still liked it.

Grant Morrison is also someone who has consistently written stories that celebrate Superman's relationship with Lois Lane. It was Morrison, for example, who wrote DC One Million, which is a story about how Superman and Lois became gold and silver versions of themselves millions of years into the future so their romance would be eternal. He wrote a multiverse story in his New 52 Action Comics run in which a Lois without a Superman found herself in a world without a Lois. Of course, Morrison also wrote the beautiful love story in All Star Superman as well.

Sure, Morrison was always pro lois and clark.

That's some Grade A sexism right there

No it's called being factual! Besides I'm saying that I prefer my boy kal to be with the powerful feminist icon (wonderwoman) instead the b****y damsel disguised as the modern working woman, lane is lame and long live Diana!.

 

[misslane38]

Sure but I still liked it.

Never said you didn't or couldn't.

Sure, Morrison was always pro lois and clark.

Such a talented man whose opinions I agree with most of the time.

No it's called being factual. Lois was always the b****y damsel disguised as the modern working woman, lane is lame hence DC's attempt to hook superman up with wonderwoman.

Not factual at all. Having read all Superman comics from every age, watched every television show and film, and read every non-fiction book about her and Superman, I can't say that your take on the character is remotely close to accurate.

 

[Superchan]

Never said you didn't or couldn't.

Never intended to imply that you did.

Such a talented man whose opinions I agree with most of the time.

Ditto, except for his love for the Lois and Clark Dynamic but then again no one is perfect.

Not factual at all. Having read all Superman comics from every age, watched every television show and film, and read every non-fiction book about her and Superman, I can't say that your take on the character is remotely close to accurate.

I too have read almost every mainstream superman comic to come out since 1938 and my opinion on the character will forever stand.
Lois has been nothing but a distraction hence why she got her own book in the 60s just so the writers don't have to deal with her and focus on the man himself.

 

[matt47]

Batman wouldn't have been able to save Lois because he can't lift heavy stone and concrete, which were what made it so Lois was drowning in the first place. Either he would have struggled so long with engineering a way to free Lois that she would have died anyway, or he would have gotten hurt or trapped himself trying to get the spear. After getting the spear, it would also take him much longer to get it to where Doomsday was than it did for Superman.

Yeah I meant that Lois was trapped in a different way than in the actual film so Batman could save her.

 

[TheRedWraith]

What annoyed me too was the fact that Batman just forgot about the spear during the DD fight. He didn't know Lois was getting it. Would've been great to see Batman start making his way over to the spear while WW and Supes took on DD and once Batman gets there he realizes Lois is drowning and he saves her. Superman sees this and flies over (while WW is holding her own against DD) and thanks Bats for saving her.

Then they come up with the plan that Superman flies the spear into DD and Batman will shoot the kryptonite at the right time (like in the movie), Batman says something about how selfless Supes is n all that, touching moment between the two characters. Then Bats runs off to get into position and that's when Lois n Clark have their moment.


Literally just came up with that.

Wow, I like that much better than my idea as it makes less of a change to the film while still fixing a flaw with the final battle, though I still prefer the idea that instead of making a perfect shot plan with Supers that Bats is still on a suicide mission and wants to kill Doomsday himself but Superman doesn't allow him to do it (giving Supes one more scene with Bats where he shows off his compassion and humanity) followed by his scene with Lois.

Now going into it with the mindset of being more willing to make slightly bigger changes I'd have the Batwing drop Bruce off at the ruin where the spear was while he has Alfred go over to Stryker's Island to distract Doomsday and keep him busy and on the island while Bruce gets the spear, but it doesn't work and Doomsday after destroying the Batwing jumps back into the city.

 

[Fallen Angel]

Not sure if its' been posted or not but...

Zack posted this on his Vero account. Flashback scene in JL?

 

[matt47]

Not sure if its' been posted or not but...

Zack posted this on his Vero account. Flashback scene in JL?

edit

 

[TheRedWraith]

Not sure if its' been posted or not but...

Zack posted this on his Vero account. Flashback scene in JL?

You're a little late someone beat you to the punch, now it could be a flashback or it could be something Superman sees in a dream state.

*

....Man I've seen MoS too many times....That's from the "maybe" flashback.

Ah

 

[The Guard]

What annoyed me too was the fact that Batman just forgot about the spear during the DD fight. He didn't know Lois was getting it. Would've been great to see Batman start making his way over to the spear while WW and Supes took on DD and once Batman gets there he realizes Lois is drowning and he saves her. Superman sees this and flies over (while WW is holding her own against DD) and thanks Bats for saving her.

He doesn't forget about it so much as he has to resort to Plan B, which is survival and his backup weapon. He gets in a plane crash on the way to get to the spear, so he can't continue to use the Batwing to get there. I don't think he ends up anywhere near the fight location when he crashes (Look how far Superman has to fly with it during the final part of the battle).

Anyway, when Batman emerges from the plane crash, Doomsday has been engaged and is bellowing in rage and about to attack, so Batman arms himself with his Kryptonite weapon, which he thinks can hurt Doomsday, and this is his backup plan.

Superman and Wonder Woman and Batman briefly discuss what is going on, its clear the spear is still important. Superman makes it clear that he knows the spear may kill Doomsday. Doomsday unleashes his energy attack and Batman has to dive for cover.

When we next see Batman, its about a minute into the fight, and he's climbing out from under the concrete he dove under to survive Doomsdays blast.

He's watching godlike beings fight a monster, and there's just not much for him to do at that point as a human.

I suppose he could have fired his Kryptonite weapon earlier in the fight, but the whole point is that he has one round and is waiting for the right moment, and Clark and Diana have not even remotely subdued Doomsday until toward the end of the fight.

I suppose he could have tried to run to where the spear was, but remember, Lois moved it. She was clearly trying to hide it when she moves it from where he originally left it. So practically speaking, he could have gone back and then not been able to find the damn thing or her, as he doesn't have superhearing or X-Ray vision.

Could they have had Batman and the entire fight end up nearer the spear and things play out differently? Sure, but that would have made for a very convenient plane crash, and him not going after the spear makes sense in the context of what we're shown, as them being further away from it helps in the scale of the situation and the scope of what Superman does later on, rushing to save Lois across a great distance and then flying back all that way under Kryptonite poisoning to defeat Doomsday.

 

[TheRedWraith]

He doesn't forget about it so much as he has to resort to Plan B, which is survival and his backup weapon. He gets in a plane crash on the way to get to the spear, so he can't continue to use the Batwing to get there. I don't think he ends up anywhere near the fight location when he crashes (Look how far Superman has to fly with it during the final part of the battle).

Anyway, when Batman emerges from the plane crash, Doomsday has been engaged and is bellowing in rage and about to attack, so Batman arms himself with his Kryptonite weapon, which he thinks can hurt Doomsday, and this is his backup plan.

Superman and Wonder Woman and Batman briefly discuss what is going on, its clear the spear is still important. Superman makes it clear that he knows the spear may kill Doomsday. Doomsday unleashes his energy attack and Batman has to dive for cover.

When we next see Batman, its about a minute into the fight, and he's climbing out from under the concrete he dove under to survive Doomsdays blast.

He's watching godlike beings fight a monster, and there's just not much for him to do at that point as a human.

I suppose he could have fired his Kryptonite weapon earlier in the fight, but the whole point is that he has one round and is waiting for the right moment, and Clark and Diana have not even remotely subdued Doomsday until toward the end of the fight.

I suppose he could have tried to run to where the spear was, but remember, Lois moved it. She was clearly trying to hide it when she moves it from where he originally left it. So practically speaking, he could have gone back and then not been able to find the damn thing or her, as he doesn't have superhearing or X-Ray vision.

Could they have had Batman and the entire fight end up nearer the spear and things play out differently? Sure, but that would have made for a very convenient plane crash, and him not going after the spear makes sense in the context of what we're shown, as them being further away from it helps in the scale of the situation and the scope of what Superman does later on, rushing to save Lois across a great distance and then flying back all that way under Kryptonite poisoning to defeat Doomsday.

I think his grapnel gun could have gotten him there faster so that he at last attempted to search for it and runs across Lois about to die.