How come don't believe in evolution if...

[Movies205]

Then do it, prove creationism is better than evolution. Provide facts that prove bio-diversity didn't matter 5000 years go or so. Give me some facts that creationism is better or equal to evolution. Look we are talking about the origin of the universe, which means that one theory is correct and one is incorrect. Don't give me this PC "everyone's opinion is equal" BS, because that isn't true. Evolution isn't prefect, but it is a better theory. If people want to believe God created the world through evolution, that's fine to, no one can prove or disprove that. But don't tell me a theory that ignores bio-diversity is better than one that doesn't.

Opinions are only as good as those that are backed up so if a CREATIONIST has a backed up opinion then it should be respected that was my point, and my point address to the maker of this thread. I'm not a creationist though so I'd feel inadequate trying to make a case for them since my point was that they should respected.

However religion, at least for me, is not about facts it's about truth. I'm a christian because there something very powerful in what Jesus said, not the fact he could do parlour tricks but about forgiving each other and what not. That is what's important to me, not how the earth was created.

 

[DorkyFresh]

evolution has yet to be proven, since the missing link has yet to be found.
and it probably never will be.

i'm not saying science has explained the missing link....i'm just saying that everything science HAS explained has been proven. unlike religion...

 

[The Overlord]

Opinions are only as good as those that are backed up so if a CREATIONIST has a backed up opinion then it should be respected that was my point, and my point address to the maker of this thread. I'm not a creationist though so I'd feel inadequate trying to make a case for them since my point was that they should respected.

However religion, at least for me, is not about facts it's about truth. I'm a christian because there something very powerful in what Jesus said, not the fact he could do parlour tricks but about forgiving each other and what not. That is what's important to me, not how the earth was created.

Give me an example of a creationist being able to back their theory and explain why bio-diversity doesn't apply to their theory and then I will be impressed, until then I will regard it as the inferior theory.

The problem here is some Christians want to treat the Bible as a text book, instead of a philosophical text. When people are saying the bible must be taken literally, they make the Bible into a strict and non sensical text. But if take the Bible form a philosophical standpoint, it makes more sense, people can seek subtext and find their own meaning to the words, digging deeper and looking beyond merely literal intereptions, it becomes more meaningful. That's the problem with creationism, it comes out of a literal reading of Bible, instead of a philosophical one.

 

[The Overlord]

I don't know, and frankly, I don't care. As a Christian, it shouldn't concern me, and it doesn't. The goal of Christianity is not to find the Garden of Eden.

I can easily believe that God put it in some kind of safe and keep it there until needed...

So you would want evolution supporters to provide the missing link, but you don't have to provide the Garden of Eden? Why is that not a double standard?

 

[huskerwebhead]

Wrong.....dude. Can you look at the Mona Lisa and suppose that the paints just jumped on the canvas into the complex work of art we see today? Can you look at a building and not think that there was mind and hands that put it together in a functioning way?? That my friend, stretches credulity. The balance in nature, the human eye, the human body....the universe. Order cannot come from choas unless a mind is reeling in the choas and setting it in order.

*sigh* Sorry, but just because it makes sense to you does not make it a fact. Creationism is just as much a theory as Evolution...maybe more so. Until you can prove anything (i.e. God's existence) then that's all it will ever be. And unfortunately, unless we build a time machine we probably won't have answers to either until we die.

Please stop comparing the complexity/design of living, biological forms to that of inanimate objects. It's illogical and does nothing to help your argument. It's apples to oranges. In fact, it's not even Apples to Oranges....it's Apples to Tennis Balls.

As for the great complexity of human design...take a look at this page regarding the human eye and it's many imperfections. Hardly a perfect design, and more "likely" the result of an imperfect evolution and cumulative natural selection:

http://www.2think.org/eye.shtml

Science and religion don't oppose each other. Let me ask you this: "Even if creation is just a random bunch of biochemical processess to you, where does the soul come from? Thoughts? Emotion? A sense of morality?? Right & Wrong???

While I do believe in evolution, I'm not opposed to the idea that a supreme intelligence may have started the process. I'll even go as far as to say that it might have guided it at some points. That doesn't discount evolution though. Science and religion can go hand in hand if you have an open mind. Now, do I believe that this intelligence is the God from the Bible...No. But that's a whole other discussion.

Where does the soul come from? Thoughts? Morality? I don't think anyone can truly answer these questions. But what is the soul? Can you define it? What is sentience? Do Animals have souls? Plants? Are they sentient? So many questions that have to be answered to figure all that out. One could argue that all those things are created by the brain...over time through thousands of years of socialization. But I'm not a theologist...No where near qualified to really dive into this subject.

The Bible wasn't written to show bio-diversity. But it does account for God creating mant different types of life.....animal and plant. It's not a text book. It was written for the purpose of showing man
1. Who God is.
2. What man's condition is.
3. To show man how to fix his condition thru a relationship with His Son.

The most important thing you said in that last section was that "it's not a text book." Correct. It's not....it's a story...a fairy tail...mythology. Sure, there are some verifiable facts such as existing locations and events, but that doesn't prove it's all true. Amazing Spider-Man #36 takes place in New York...in the aftermath of the 9/11 attacks. Real place, real event...but doesn't make anything else in the book true. It's not a text book, and it shouldn't be used as such. If the only proof you have is what's written in the bible then you have no proof at all. Evolution is not a complete theory...that's why it's called a "theory." We haven't found the missing link, we may never find it. But there are mounds of other evidence that still points in the direction of evolution. And we will continue to look for the answers through evolution as it is the most logical scientific theory we have right now...as we understand things. As time goes by we may gain a new understanding of how things work...evolution may get tossed for a totally different theory. Only time will tell, and only through scientific research and discovery will that ever be possible.

The only other thing I wanted to touch on was the statement "If we evolved from apes/monkeys then why are apes/monkeys still around??" This is a huge misunderstanding of the "we evolved from apes" statement. We DID NOT evolve from Apes, or monkeys, or chimps. We evolved from a common ancestor....yes. All primates evolved from a central starting point...maybe even points. The evolutionary tree is more like a bush. Not one big trunk with a few branches sticking out...but a whole jumble of branches starting real close to the ground going in all directions. Sure there is a central root, starting point...but it's much more complex. Each of those branches are different...some short representing species that failed to adapt and died out, some real long with branches of their own. Those branches being long or short depending on how that species faired. We didn't evolve from apes/monkeys...but, to some extent, along side them. Variations in weather, mating, predators, food, landscape, mutations shaped each individual species into what they are. That being said, this is not necessarily the only view on evolution and the "evolutionary tree." It just happens to be the one that makes the most sense to me. Please don't take it as the end-all-be-all.

 

[Mike_D202]

The problem here is some Christians want to treat the Bible as a text book, instead of a philosophical text. When people are saying the bible must be taken literally, they make the Bible into a strict and non sensical text. But if take the Bible form a philosophical standpoint, it makes more sense, people can seek subtext and find their own meaning to the words, digging deeper and looking beyond merely literal intereptions, it becomes more meaningful. That's the problem with creationism, it comes out of a literal reading of Bible, instead of a philosophical one.

Um..I believe that more athiests look at it in a text-book maner more than christians...otherwise they would have no mud to sling.

 

[Dew k. Mosi]

Well, weren't the Monkees british?

No, only one was. Davy was born in Manchester, England. Micky was a former child actor born in LA, Mike was born in Houston, Texas, and Peter was born in Washington, D.C.

 

[The Overlord]

Um..I believe that more athiests look at it in a text-book maner more than christians...otherwise they would have no mud to sling.

I mean reading the Bible as a literal text, instead of a philosophical text. If you are demanding that the Bible should be taken a literally, you are turning it into a text book or just a boring and non sensical rule book, which makes it very easy atheists to knock down. But if you say the Bible should be taken philosophically where things in the bible are not meant to be taken literially, the Bible becomes a better text and harder to knock down. That is the problem with creationism, it comes out of literial reading of the bible and is thus easy to knock down.

 

[The Chairman]

I believe in micro-evolution but not macro-evolution. Evolution essentially says that we arose naturally without any previous form of life to aid us, when Louis Pasteur, one of the most respected scientists of all time, proved that life cannot arise from non-life. Not to mention that if evolution is true, we're almost accidents in a sense, which would kind of suck. Some people need to believe in something that aids them in life, some form of hope to shield from the mundaneness of life.

For awhile I was a theistic evolution, but I rethought my opinion after evaluating the fact that I believe in a perfect God and wondered why a perfect God would use a flawed method to create us. Also, a lot of our bodies' parts, such as the human brain, are far too complex to just come about naturally IMO. The Pope even said this and it was discussed in a previous thread.

If anyone has certain questions, here's some websites to answer some questions. I'll probably get flamed for being a psycho-evangelical creationist, but heh, who cares.

http://www.answersingenesis.org/creation/v25/i4/bigbang.asp

http://www.answersingenesis.org/creation/v20/i2/creation.asp

http://www.answersingenesis.org/creation/v17/i1/god_evolution.asp

http://www.answersingenesis.org/docs/405.asp

http://www.answersingenesis.org/home/area/tools/cains_wife.asp (this sheds light on one aspect on the Scopes-Monkey Trial)

http://www.answersingenesis.org/docs/2.asp

http://www.creationevidence.net/whocares.shtml

http://www.bibleplus.org/creation/evidence.htm

 

[Mr. Socko]

Homo-superiors do exist!

 

[Machx72]

Which theory has more scientific facts to back it up?

In regards to creationism, where is the garden of Eden?

It's a little "garden" right above every woman's "eden."

Quote that to your mom and ask her to show you.

 

[amazingdm]

Did you just compare humans/monkees to americans/britains?

Okay, going by that logic...then americans are more evolved than brits?

Yes. Considering British are still basically British and Americans went from British to American (a lot of cultural CHANGEs) then yes, we are more evolved.

Now an idiot who doesn't understand evolution would hear "more evolved" and think "hey he's saying they're better than us". But more evolved does NOT mean better than, it just means more changes.

It has evolved more = it has changed more
some changes could be for the worse

 

[amazingdm]

You guys got into a big debate and tried to get into the nitty gritty of things. So I ignored all that.
I just want to know why, when the evidence is right in front of us, in our genes, like a history book, people just ignore it?

 

[Super Kal]

So you would want evolution supporters to provide the missing link, but you don't have to provide the Garden of Eden? Why is that not a double standard?

Because there are more important things in Christanity than the Garden of Eden.

 

[amazingdm]

why do people bring up the missing link? There is a clear chain of evolution from one ancestor to the next all the way up to us.
It didn't go Ape - missing link - us.

 

[Super Kal]

because there is one between primordial ooze and us

 

[Tyrinus]

A large part of creationist's problems arise in they simply don't understand the way evolution works. More than likely they were taught evolution from someone with more of a creationist background than a scientific one.

And it's debates like these that make me smile. Smile because I'll be in Hell, away from these kind of people, and won't have to put up with them.

If there is a Hell that is, which I doubt.

 

[amazingdm]

I large part of creationist's problems arise in they simply don't understand the way evolution works. More than likely they were taught evolution from someone with more of a creationist background than a scientific one.

And it's debates like these that make me smile. Smile because I'll be in Hell, away from these kind of people, and won't have to put up with them.

If there is a Hell that is, which I doubt.

LOL
true

people get these odd notions that ALL animals are evolving into humanoids. They aren't. They're just evolving to what suits their environment best. What's better at being a fish, a human...or a fish??

They think "more evolved" = better than

 

[amazingdm]

New question

People like to say "if we evolved from monkeys, why are there still monkeys?" (And monkey is just being used as a generic term here, don't get nitpicky and say "oh we evolved from a common ancestor of apes" or whatever blablabla)

so my question is, why WOULDn'T there still be monkeys?

 

[JTIZZLEVILLE]

I am a Christian and I believe in evolution. What I mean is, I believe that things change to adapt to their current situation. It makes perfect sense. If you move from Alaska to Florida, your lifestyle evolves. You no longer wear heavy coats to keep you warm but you wear more suitable clothing.

We all change over time and the same can be said for our ancestors.

But to say that we cam from nothing.....now that is just stupid.

 

[Kritish]

Has the fossill record confirmed Darwin's theory like he promised it would?

No.

The "missing Link" is still missing.

So you don’t count Neanderthals and Homo Erectus as proof?

I'm still waiting for that missing link.

If you still need proof for evolution you’re beyond help. Evolution is as much of a scientific fact as gravity, we can observe the Galapagos islands just as much as we can watch an apple fall from a tree.

 

[Memphis Slim]

I am a Christian and I believe in evolution. What I mean is, I believe that things change to adapt to their current situation. It makes perfect sense. If you move from Alaska to Florida, your lifestyle evolves. You no longer wear heavy coats to keep you warm but you wear more suitable clothing.

We all change over time and the same can be said for our ancestors.

But to say that we cam from nothing.....now that is just stupid.

Christian doctrine and evolution are opposed to each other. You cannot be a christian and believe in that. Jesus himself refered back to Adam (real historical man). Paul referred back to Adam as a real man who committed sin in the Garden). To dismiss the Genesis account does away with the original sin and that does away with the sacrifice on the cross. If there was no Adam, then there was no sin. Thus no need for a savior.

Plus Darwin's theory is based on superior species killing out the weaker. Which means that death existed before man's fall into sin. God did not create death.

 

[Kritish]

I am a Christian and I believe in evolution. What I mean is, I believe that things change to adapt to their current situation. It makes perfect sense. If you move from Alaska to Florida, your lifestyle evolves. You no longer wear heavy coats to keep you warm but you wear more suitable clothing.

We all change over time and the same can be said for our ancestors.

But to say that we cam* from nothing.....now that is just stupid.

*Came
No, we didn’t come from “nothing” not a single scientist is claiming that. DNA and cells originate from chemicals, we’ve observed it happen even in labs.

 

[Kritish]

Christian doctrine and evolution are opposed to each other. You cannot be a christian and believe in that. Jesus himself refered back to Adam (real historical man). Paul referred back to Adam as a real man who committed sin in the Garden). To dismiss the Genesis account does away with the original sin and that does away with the sacrifice on the cross. If there was no Adam, then there was no sin. Thus no need for a savior.



Plus Darwin's theory is based on superior species killing out the weaker. Which means that death existed before man's fall into sin. God did not create death.

The fossil record delivers a fatal blow to creationist dogma. You can’t ignore proto-humans such as Homo Erectus.

 

[ang_hulk]

I'm gonna voice my opinion w/out belittling others beliefs by using big words which one can find in a dictionary (like most posters here like to do).

I just dont understand why the other apes didnt evolve like our ape species.

The other apes/monkees arent even close to how we're evolved present time.

thats not true.its often the big question non believers pose.They are EXTREMLY SMART! and so much like us its scary,we just got thier before them and thier is nothing that says they wont continue to evolve into human like beings.I want you to think about somthing.Thiers a gorilla,a famous,amazing gorilla called coco.Coco has nearly masterd sign language to the point of her being able to TEACH other GORILLAS!.She was recued at a yound age,the age when her general personality would be set.Anyways,coco had a kitten,the kitten died and she to this day mentions the kitten to people whenever they speak of cat or pets.she had another kitten after and often signed to the kitten about the other one and how she was different and the same.Coco found her own favorite color,she choose it from a blanket her care taker gave her and she often collects red objects.Once,coco met with fred rodgers,when fred came in he signed hello to coco and guess what? she took off his shoes!.Coco has been known to help in the kitchen,she can make a cake now after her owner signed her the instuctions.She has taught youger gorillas some signs and always speaks to them with her hands.she has addresed crowds and has made quite a few friends and often visits siminars for the def and mute and is rumored to be learning brail.Now let me ask you,can you sign the instuctions on the back of a betty croker cake mix? I sure as hell cant but I know the instuctions off by heart...think about alright? gorilla,in your kitchen,baking a two layer cake........and signing to another gorilla not to touch the pan because it is hot.....now why arent they like us?