Comics I just thought of something

[Shin-Natsume]

i read soemthing on shortpacked and that made me thinking..

So, Peter is eternally 26 years old, maybe 27...
(ultimate Peter being 16 now, ages 1 year in 6 years or so)

so in two years, im 26 myself, so peter and i have had the same childhood time, since when he stays the same age, his birthdate and his childhood move forward in time.

so he grew up watching knight rider and macguyver (ultimate peter probably watched pokemon)

the thing is, if our childhood reflects our adulthood, then peter must actually change over the years. while in the sixties, he had his childhood in the fifties, late fourtys. the overall progression at that time shaped his character, but when he grows up now, or say, 20 years ago, his character got shaped completely different, because of a new era, a new way of life.

so neccesarily, he is not the same peter that he was ten years ago. but how much change is good?
i mean, compare yourself to your parents... the way they grew up shaped their lifes and the way you grew up shaped yours. twenty years ago, peter grew up to be liek your dad, uncle or your neighbor...

but now, he grew up to be you...

 

[hex]

i read soemthing on shortpacked and that made me thinking..

So, Peter is eternally 26 years old, maybe 27...
(ultimate Peter being 16 now, ages 1 year in 6 years or so)

so in two years, im 26 myself, so peter and i have had the same childhood time, since when he stays the same age, his birthdate and his childhood move forward in time.

so he grew up watching knight rider and macguyver (ultimate peter probably watched pokemon)

the thing is, if our childhood reflects our adulthood, then peter must actually change over the years. while in the sixties, he had his childhood in the fifties, late fourtys. the overall progression at that time shaped his character, but when he grows up now, or say, 20 years ago, his character got shaped completely different, because of a new era, a new way of life.

so neccesarily, he is not the same peter that he was ten years ago. but how much change is good?
i mean, compare yourself to your parents... the way they grew up shaped their lifes and the way you grew up shaped yours. twenty years ago, peter grew up to be liek your dad, uncle or your neighbor...

but now, he grew up to be you...

Okay, I don't want to say my age, necessarily, but let's just say I'm old enough to remember eating C-3PO's for breakfast. And I can honestly say, I'm probably the same kinda guy I was 20 years ago, and by that I mean, I still have the same interests, I have the same kind of sense of humor, I still think Cheetara from Thundercats is hot, um.. I still know what sucks and what doesn't. And guess what, I've gone through a lot in my life, but I'm still the same guy at heart. So.. regardless of the changing of the times.

Peter Parker, the guy I grew up with, the guy I thought I knew, should still be Peter Parker. Not how he's been written in the last 10 years. One can argue how his character has been shaped differently over years, wherein lies the problem. Why do certain comic characters still exist in the hearts of fans to this day?

Because at some point a fan discovers a character, the core of that character , the defining character trait, strikes a cord with the reader. The reader relates and the idea of what character represents, stays with the reader.

Spiderman comics sales have been declining since Maximum Carnage. Why is that?

Ultimate Spiderman outsells any Spidey book. Why is that?

Because Spidey fans want to read the Spidey that we all know still can exist. If only the people at Marvel can just remember who Spidey used to be, and what he used to represent.

And guess what, when I read the back issues of Spidey back when Stan wrote him, and compared it to the Dave Micheline years, Spidey was still Spidey. Though I haven't seen him around since playing Maximum Carnage on genesis. =/

 

[Doc_OCK_4MUGEN]

I feel sorry for the kids who meet with this abomination that Marvel wants to call Spidey...

 

[spider greg]

Okay, I don't want to say my age, necessarily, but let's just say I'm old enough to remember eating C-3PO's for breakfast. And I can honestly say, I'm probably the same kinda guy I was 20 years ago, and by that I mean, I still have the same interests, I have the same kind of sense of humor, I still think Cheetara from Thundercats is hot, um.. I still know what sucks and what doesn't. And guess what, I've gone through a lot in my life, but I'm still the same guy at heart. So.. regardless of the changing of the times.

Peter Parker, the guy I grew up with, the guy I thought I knew, should still be Peter Parker. Not how he's been written in the last 10 years. One can argue how his character has been shaped differently over years, wherein lies the problem. Why do certain comic characters still exist in the hearts of fans to this day?

Because at some point a fan discovers a character, the core of that character , the defining character trait, strikes a cord with the reader. The reader relates and the idea of what character represents, stays with the reader.

Spiderman comics sales have been declining since Maximum Carnage. Why is that?

Ultimate Spiderman outsells any Spidey book. Why is that?

Because Spidey fans want to read the Spidey that we all know still can exist. If only the people at Marvel can just remember who Spidey used to be, and what he used to represent.

And guess what, when I read the back issues of Spidey back when Stan wrote him, and compared it to the Dave Micheline years, Spidey was still Spidey. Though I haven't seen him around since playing Maximum Carnage on genesis. =/

This is very true. I think the 90s were not a very good decade for Spidey,his Parker personal life has gone absolutely nowhere. I think a big part of the problem was the corporate handling of the character, ever since Marvel went public with their stocks it seemed like they just trying to get out as much as they could regardless of quality. Another is because of the speculator boom, I worked in a comic store in the early 90s so I saw the whole thing with customers, who didn't read the books but bought multiple copies of comics until they realized they weren't going to get rich within a few months and dropped everything and left the real comic fans,and it seems like comics in general have been struggling since then, therefore giving us a lot of "Special events" *waves hands in air* whoooooo!
To get back somewhat on topic, it's okay for Peter to be aware of the times of the moment (tv shows etc.) it's a way of keeping it in synch with newer younger readers ( I still remember in one of the Annuals he said he was "going to miss the A-team again" awesome show!) The thing I don't like in recent years is he has had a personality change it seems like they're making Peter a funny guy, they way I saw it Spider-man was a way for Peter to let his inhibitions out while wearing the mask. There was a contrast between the two, that's part of the reason no one believed he could be Spidey, even though he took loads of pics of him. These days he's going into Comedy clubs on amateur night, or saying dumb stuff to Tony Stark and just being annoying overall.
Even though I don't really like how they're doing it, I hope this BND series gets things back to basics.
Oh yea, I remember eating C-3POs also.

 

[dan1]

I feel sorry for the kids who meet with this abomination that Marvel wants to call Spidey...

Hey Doc, I would feel sorry for them too, but if they aren't willing to buy back issues and read those to get caught up to speed, then I feel less sorry for them, and more annoyed that Marvel is catering to non-comic book fans/aficionados, for the sake of, really, just a few more sales a month.

The non-comic book fans are still going to see the Movies and buy the toys and watch the cartoons. But Marvel, needing to squeeze out a little more profit is willing to treat back issues, that only make money for the shops (and not Marvel anymore), like a blind date from 10 years ago not worth remembering.

Pathetic, and reprehensible attitudes/actions for any self respecting comic book publisher.

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

Spiderman comics sales have been declining since Maximum Carnage. Why is that?

Ultimate Spiderman outsells any Spidey book. Why is that?
=/

Couple of things:

1) Comics sales in general have been declinning since Maximum Carnage (i.e; the spectator-boom of the early 90's), however; sales on Amazing Spider-Man have doubled since Joe Straczynski took over, and have remained there...


2) Sales figures for July have Amazing Spider-Man at #10, and Ultimate Spider-Man at #24... USM hasnt out-sold ASM in awhile.

 

[Dangerous]

Early 90's Spidey was gold, but by the time we get to the Clone Saga it all started to go downhill pretty fast. Osborn returns- Mackie- the reboot- Chapter One (vomit).
For me mid-late 90's Spidey comics generally sucked.

 

[Doc_OCK_4MUGEN]

Hey Doc, I would feel sorry for them too, but if they aren't willing to buy back issues and read those to get caught up to speed, then I feel less sorry for them, and more annoyed that Marvel is catering to non-comic book fans/aficionados, for the sake of, really, just a few more sales a month.

The non-comic book fans are still going to see the Movies and buy the toys and watch the cartoons. But Marvel, needing to squeeze out a little more profit is willing to treat back issues, that only make money for the shops (and not Marvel anymore), like a blind date from 10 years ago not worth remembering.

Pathetic, and reprehensible attitudes/actions for any self respecting comic book publisher.

But the problem is that Modern Marvel doesn't give a rat's ass about continuity... They destroy Continuity/Characters in order to tell "compelling stories" Kinda like a preschooler trying to fit a square peg in a round hole...

 

[Blader5489]

Ultimate Spiderman outsells any Spidey book. Why is that?

Because it's better, that's why.

 

[Dangerous]

It has already been pointed out that USM no longer out sells ASM.
Also- it sucks .

 

[Shin-Natsume]

you dont got my point.
my point is:
compare your dad to yourself..

your dad=original spider-man
yourself=spider-man now

also, USM doesnt suck-.-

 

[wolvie2020]

you dont got my point.
my point is:
compare your dad to yourself..

your dad=original spider-man
yourself=spider-man now

also, USM doesnt suck-.-

Dude, you had a brilliant thought here.

And YES, a lot of people here MISSED the point

It's an idea that isn't about *****ing.

If Peter Parker is the everyman, he has to be relatable the most people. Thus, he has to keep with the times to work.

I love when you get to see Peter's taste in music/film. I've got ASM 136, (when Harry confronts Pete as GG for the 1st time,) and MJ makes fun of him for listening to Ella Fitzgerald. A few years ago, he was singing Bohemian Rhapsody naked, (and caught by Randy and his GF!) and played Super Mario with all of his neighbors.

The Peter listening to Ella Fitzgerald could have easliy over the years have spawned the Peter that played video games with his mates.

To me though, the Peter Parker saga is almost a constant coming of age story. Dealing with changes, and dealing with new challenges. I think as long as the spirit of Peter Parker is there, you don't have to be any particular age to have to relate to Spider-Man

 

[Doc_OCK_4MUGEN]

Yeah all those years Peter's evolved as a normal human...

ultimate will always be the cheap knock off... even if the stories on the Original Spidey continuity are effed up...

 

[Gabbra49]

Always been a big fan of The original spidey and now usm as well. USM no question has been better than current spidey for a couple years now. Hoping slott can turn that around though. Slott is gonna have one big mess to clean up after OMD but if their is anyone that can pull it off its him.

 

[Venom 1988]

USM no question has been better than current spidey for a couple years now.

I'd have to disagree with that. Tho 616 spidey been getting a lot of crappy treatment lately, especially with OMD, USM has been going downhill since Carnage. The Hollywood arc IMO was the last good USM story.

 

[Gabbra49]

Interesting i think the only real bad arc for USM has been the carnage and the one with that mutant kid. The rest i thought was awesome compared to some of the crap JMS has been passing of as of late. I will always think the 616 title is better no question but lately 616 has just about hit rock bottom. USM continues to deliver IMO.

 

[Dangerous]

FNSM and Sensational have both sported some great arcs in the couple of years. FNSM- the Vulture 3 parter w/ Scott Eaton on pencils (amazing), and Sensational w/ Feral which I thought was pretty damn fine except the ending was a little weak. WAY better stuff than USM imo, but then I am repulsed by the concept of USM and stopped reading it by #19 when I realized it sucked.

 

[Gabbra49]

SSM and FNSM were the only two greats things about the current spiderman as of late.

 

[hex]

I feel sorry for the kids who meet with this abomination that Marvel wants to call Spidey...

seriously, I know. Kids today only know spidey from Tobey's whiney gunhand pointing, "emo" parker..sad...

 

[hex]

The thing I don't like in recent years is he has had a personality change it seems like they're making Peter a funny guy, they way I saw it Spider-man was a way for Peter to let his inhibitions out while wearing the mask. There was a contrast between the two, that's part of the reason no one believed he could be Spidey, even though he took loads of pics of him. These days he's going into Comedy clubs on amateur night, or saying dumb stuff to Tony Stark and just being annoying overall.
Even though I don't really like how they're doing it, I hope this BND series gets things back to basics.
Oh yea, I remember eating C-3POs also.

Interesting point. I had forgotten the contrast between Pete's personality, and Spidey. The mask was Peter's escape. I do hope the next generation writers can somehow remember that.

 

[hex]

Couple of things:

1) Comics sales in general have been declinning since Maximum Carnage (i.e; the spectator-boom of the early 90's), however; sales on Amazing Spider-Man have doubled since Joe Straczynski took over, and have remained there...


2) Sales figures for July have Amazing Spider-Man at #10, and Ultimate Spider-Man at #24... USM hasnt out-sold ASM in awhile.

heheh, Captain Stacy, I recall you as well.. it's been sometime since I've posted on these boards on a regular basis. Judging from your spelling of the word "declinning" I would assume you are fellow canadi"en" . heh

Anywho.. while I was simply trying to make a point with my questions..
I'm sure you were trying to be informative.. but the gauntlet has been thrown my ole nemesis, and I must answer the call of (horn blows) COMIC BOOK BOARD DEBATE!!!!!!

1) While it is true comic book sales have declined in general, it is apparent, that the Spiderman books in general have suffered the most. The restructuring of all the Spiderman books, ending of titles (web of..etc) the retconning of story lines past etc. The general consensus of every guy I talk to while in the various comic book stores I still actually frequent. It's always the same thing. Spiderman especially the run by my once beloved JMS, are the WORST RUN IN THE HISTORY OF SPIDEY! Why?

I understand and respect JMS as a writer who requires freedom to write interesting stories. However when dealing with an established character, there are certain rules one must respect, and adhere to.

While sales of ASM may have "doubled" I'm sure that the current sales are still well below the sales before even Todd's run on the book. And I just realised this particular point may be moot, for if factor in the price of books and amount of books printed between said periods, it may factor out even.

2)Okay sales of USM no longer outsell ASM. I wonder why? Could it be the Civil War, or Peter unmasking himself, (a book even I had to buy just to actually believe Marvel had gone and done another "why I stopped reading Spiderman" reason)

hmm.. I wonder?

 

[hex]

Because it's better, that's why.

lol, EXACTLY!t:

btw, I was simply trying to state the obvious in my question.

 

[hex]

you dont got my point.
my point is:
compare your dad to yourself..

your dad=original spider-man
yourself=spider-man now

also, USM doesnt suck-.-

I apologize Shin-Natsume, I was trying to point out that there really should be a difference between the original spiderman, and spiderman now.. That's the problem with Spidey!

and yes Dangerous is a ******, if he thinks USM sucks.. Tho' lately I have to admit... the storylines are a little disappointing.

 

[hex]

Dude, you had a brilliant thought here.

And YES, a lot of people here MISSED the point

It's an idea that isn't about *****ing.

If Peter Parker is the everyman, he has to be relatable the most people. Thus, he has to keep with the times to work.

I love when you get to see Peter's taste in music/film. I've got ASM 136, (when Harry confronts Pete as GG for the 1st time,) and MJ makes fun of him for listening to Ella Fitzgerald. A few years ago, he was singing Bohemian Rhapsody naked, (and caught by Randy and his GF!) and played Super Mario with all of his neighbors.

The Peter listening to Ella Fitzgerald could have easliy over the years have spawned the Peter that played video games with his mates.

To me though, the Peter Parker saga is almost a constant coming of age story. Dealing with changes, and dealing with new challenges. I think as long as the spirit of Peter Parker is there, you don't have to be any particular age to have to relate to Spider-Man

As I said in my last post, I was responding to Shin's statement, comparing current spidey and old spidey of yesteryear, but the point of it is interesting if you're comparing how Peter's character has changed with the times, but unfortunately this is not the case, EVERYTHING ABOUT Spiderman has changed. When a character changes with the times, the core of the character stays the same, everything else changes accordingly.

If one wishes to alienate the audience, which Marvel has done brilliantly, then by all means change everything about the character. I realize Shin was trying to start an interesting thread, however I had state the inherent flaw in the original intent of the question.

I was trying to point out that, Spidey should still be Spidey, that's how a character or franchise etc.. remains timeless.

 

[Venom 1988]

and yes Dangerous is a ******, if he thinks USM sucks.. Tho' lately I have to admit... the storylines are a little disappointing.

Hes a ****** because he thinks USM sucks? Wow