Discussion in 'Misc. Comics Films' started by Rorschach2012, Apr 19, 2013.
I really didnt like Iron Man 3.
Man of Steel wins.
Critic is 50+% and Audience is 82%
Didn't like MoS but I want to see a sequel whereas I wanted SR dead in the water.
Well, critics and B.O. tell us that Iron Man 3 was the better movie. And I didn't like all of MOS, but I easily put MOS over IM3.
The reason i bring up critics is because of just how bad the scores were. If it was in the 70's or high 60's no one would really care but its rotten. look at every possible list you can find about top films of the year, decade, all time, IMDB top 250, Rollingstone etc. .and try to find me a film in any of those lists that have a rotten rating or below 60 metacritic score. Like it or not, those ratings closely mirror film quality in general.
Bays Transformers have a huge disparity between critic and audience ratings..huge. But you don't see people around here praising those films do you? And its the same people who used the 'box-office doesn't equal quality' argument against IM3 that are now doing a u-turn and using that argument to support MOS. Its just funny.
I think it's generally accepted that the 1st Transformer wasn't bad I certainly liked it but the sequels which have actually made more money really fell off and MoS currently does have better IMDB and RT audience ratings than them.
Like i mentioned in my previous post MoS actually has all around better audience ratings than the transformers sequels (which is what i think most people refer to when complaining about the series). Also its audience rating is about equal with IM3.
When the editor of Rotten Tomatoes himself comes out about how he thinks the critics on his own site got it wrong, you know we're dealing with a special case here for MOS.
Well, critics and ratings are only gladly invoked when they match our opinions. Critics opinions are interesting just to compare and contrast. But both the BO and the GA ratings did favor Transformers because people enjoy CGI fests.
I've never cared about RT myself. I usually go to IMDB, it usually lines up with my opinions a little more.
That's only a nitpick and not something that's "terribly bad". Superman made his introduction to the military, although made a bigger impact during the battle of Smallville.
And what else did Pa Kent say? He said Clark will have to make a huge chance later in life on what he'll do with his life, either to help humanity or not. Right now as a young boy and young man, Jonathan Kent didn't want Clark to get himself in harm's way when it'll be more important when Clark is an adult and can make the tough choices himself without someone like Jonathan to hold his hand.
She met Clark inside the Fortress, by remembering he was the one that helped with her bags when she arrived to where the Fortress was. As a reporter, Lois would know better when the man she saw is this Superman character. Once more, this is a nitpick for what the viewer wanted to see without what is in the film where most do not deem it to be "terribly bad".
All? Really? Only Pete and Lana and the Kents did their best into making them think they were just imagining it all.
As I mentioned earlier, Goyer does need a tad bit work, just as this as I would agree lines like that need to be cut.
I saw MoS again and this time I wasn't falling asleep every 5 minutes(I'm just not cut out for midnight showings any more) and I liked it better this time but still think it's a deeply flawed film. IM3 is as well but there the big flaw is kind of encapsulated entirely around the Mandarin. With MoS it's more systemic. Ultimately both are decent films but I still give the edge to IM3. I gave IM3 a 7.5/10(bottom of the barrel along side TIH amongst MCU films) and I give MoS a 7/10 which is not quite as good as Batman Begins(8.5/10) but for me is DC's first good movie since that one and it's the only Snyder film I've ever liked at all.
I gotta wonder why Zod is such a moron though. I mean he's approaching Nero in ST1 levels of senselessness. Why insist that Earth be terra-formed? That's just asking for conflict that was completely unnecessary. Just tell Kal-El to give them the codex and then they'll go build New Krypton on another world. It's not like this version of Zod had any desire to rule over humanity. He didn't. He didn't even want to keep the unnatural powers they get from Earth's sun. Otherwise, why bother to terra-form at all if it's gonna just take away your powers?
I was pretty underwhelmed with the cerebral elements of MOS. IM3 had better reviews and has (will) top the box office as well. So while opinions may differ from person to person, in the end, IM3 will be considered the best film. For me personally:
Downey gave his best Tony Stark in IM3, Black infused more heart and varieties of emotion in his film, the Mandarin twist was ****ing hilarious, and the film had great offbeat moments of humor and chaos. The script in IM3 was miles above MOS, and IM3 was simply more clever. Just a solid movie all around. MOS was decent, but minimized its intelligence to appease to popcorn munching Transformers and Pirates of the Caribbean fans.
Not even really far to judge these two, as one is a third installment and one is the first. I doubt MOS could come up with a better third installment, and IM1 is better than MOS in every filmmaking sense (minus the over abundance of bombastic action).
I think Thor 2 will beat them both, personally as well as critically.
I'll agree the Mandarin twist was "****ing hilarious".
Too bad it SHOULDN'T have been.
Why? It was an ingenious way to explore our contemporary beliefs on terrorism. It was a mirror for us to laugh at ourselves for our preconceptions on the 'face' of evil. Besides, Killian was the Mandarin. Only thing I didn't like about the twist was that Killian wasn't Asian, but then again, it would have been too obvious.
I'm actually a big Mandy fan (unlike many who hate on the twist because the wiki page said he was somebody else). If you've actually read comics with Mandarin I'll understand if you don't like the twist. People who haven't need to keep their mouths shut. I thought Black did a great job using two characters to cover all of the bases that make up the character.
Because the twist was lousy for even trying to be funny. I certainly hated it because Kingsley would have been a great REAL Mandarin. Tough chance for what could've been a phenomenal villain portrayal.
A Mandarin that's an American white guy with lava powers(thus getting rid of the rings) is like a Dr. Doom who's got no armor, isn't eastern European and is an American CEO with electrical powers. You've taken away about 90% of what makes him who he is.
And a seventy year old middle eastern with no athletic prowess and no powerful abilities what so ever is closer to the Mandarin? Kingsley had the external features of the character down, Pierce had the internal with his motivations, fighting style, powers, and scientific prowess. Combined together, we got a great, unique look at the character that contemporary audiences could actually relate too.
Not to mention the door is still open for the 616 Mandarin to show up yet...
Box office for a spin-off sequel to the Avengers vs. box office for a reboot of a franchise that was down in the dumps? Not really a fair fight at all. Transformers 2 got absolutely trashed by critics but made a ton of money at the box office. Doesn't mean it's a better film than movies that made less.
No, I was actually against Kingsley getting the role for precisely those reasons. But at least they gave us a long heads up on it to allow the ideas of this new change to a Bin Laden-esque villain to sink in and for us to come to accept it. And then they gut punched us.
I live in perpetual hope.
And let me be clear, I don't think what they did in IM3 was terrible just on it's own. It was sorta clever. But it was terrible because of who they were screwing over to do it. If they'd done it with Mallen then I'd be hunky dory about it all.
Have you read any comics involving the Mandarin?
Loads from the silver and bronze ages.