BvS Is anyone else not excited about Superman and Batman? I feel nothing but dread. - Part 2

[regwec]

Maybe not, but I think the elements of the audience which demand such simplistic fare are probably better left behind.

 

[lc23]

So whining, moaning, and bashing MoS in all the other threads on the BvS boardto the point of going off topicis a-okay, but not hating on MoS in this one is a cardinal sin? That's totally not hypocritical at all.

 

[Persistence]

Who said what you're saying lc23?

 

[Bathead]

It seems obvious this movie isn't going to be great character and plot development wise. The overall rushed, directing-by-committee, and cramming of unnecessary characters for marketing.

Superman was too melancholy in the last film and now that he's paired up with Batman it seems unlikely that's going to change. Look at all the marketing of Superman standing in the rain looking all grim. Can't show him smiling or something? Where is the beacon of hope?

The action will be great. We know Snyder isn't directing The Dark Knight, Iron Man, or The Winter Soldier or X-men United. The question is will this movie be ok like last endeavor (Man of Steel / Iron Man 2) or crap (X-men 3, Xmen Origins, Iron Man 3).

I think what's obvious you're making a lot of judgements based on nothing but rank speculation and guesswork. How about waiting until you see the final product before making such specious suppositions?

 

[Visualiza]

So whining, moaning, and bashing MoS in all the other threads on the BvS boardto the point of going off topicis a-okay, but not hating on MoS in this one is a cardinal sin? That's totally not hypocritical at all.

It's actually the other way around, bud.

People who have negative things to say have been chased out of these forums since the beginning. Here we have the one thread that's predicated on negative sentiment, and there are still zealous sycophants in here trying to silence anyone who isn't also a slavishly devoted fan.

Nobody is saying that liking the movie and voicing that is prohibited, what some of us are saying, however, is that people like you need to stop derailing this thread by silencing the very people it attracts. Chatter about how awesome MoS is all you want; I'm sure we all welcome it so we can have a discussion, but some of us are tired of being told that we're trolls for thinking otherwise. It puzzles me that so many of you would prefer to have a dogmatic, one-sided debate rather than a healthy, enlightening, and mature discussion between people on opposite sides of the fence.

 

[Visualiza]

Who said what you're saying lc23?

Nobody did. It's the same strawman we've been hearing since day one is all.

 

[regwec]

You were "chased out" of an internet forum? How spineless can you possibly be?

 

[The Batman]

I think we all know the answer to that question.

Yeah, we do.

Exactly. It's amusing to me that the most dogmatic sycophants who are supposedly upbeat and hopeful for this movie can be so malicious and quarrelsome. The sad part is that there are some lifelong fans of the character who are constantly shooed away and derided simply for voicing their displeasure with Snyder & Co.'s interpretation of the character. If a Superman fan doesn't belong on a Superman board, then I don't know who does. Your sig is a very appropriate description of the post you're replying to, btw.

The BvS forums, poisoning the well one post at a time.

Honestly, some of my favorite discussion comes from people who, like you said, are longtime fans of the character who were disappointed with MOS. You can tell that guys like Lencho know so much about the character of Superman, not just Donner or whatever happened after 1986. Most of the guys who hate this thread would rather post the same gifs/pictures over and over again, praise Cavill's looks over and over and over again, and essentially want this board to be a glorified lounge that occasionally stops to praise whatever bit of news/information Snyder/WB gives us.

Who said what you're saying lc23?

I find its best to ignore lc23....his posts are usually strawman arguments that describe no one in the thread.

 

[Visualiza]

You were "chased out" of an internet forum? How spineless can you possibly be?

So much for the cheer and mirth, eh?

 

[Lencho01]

With the Superman we're introduced to in MOS, I don't see him and Batman as a case of good cop/bad cop...more like Gray Cop/Dark Gray cop.

Not that Superman was dark in MOS....but he just dosen't seem like the completely bright, idealized figure of the comics. Then again, B v S Superman could end up being that.

Batman will have his turn to tell Superman about who he really is or his destiny. t:

 

[lc23]

Who said what you're saying lc23?

Lemme reword that: whining about people invading and killing the joy in "your" thread, after you consistently doing the same thing in a multitude of other threads is hypocritical.

I have a better question for you. How does one official picture of Superman standing in the rain in what is most likely Gotham City equate to "all that marketing"? So far it's been one picture that's been reposted over and over. The background is a gloomy, rainy miserable-looking cityscape. If he was at Disneyland on a beautiful, clear sunny day and clasping a giant lollipop while hugging a giant teddy bear, and was surrounded by fluffy kittens and puppies and still had that same expression, I would see your point. But he wasn't.

 

[The Batman]

Batman will have his turn to tell Superman about who he really is or his destiny. t:

Man, you joke about that, but, lol....

I wouldn't be surprised if that actually happens. Especially with Batman being older than Supes.

 

[Lencho01]

Man, you joke about that, but, lol....

I wouldn't be surprised if that actually happens. Especially with Batman being older than Supes.

I'll throw in WW too.

 

[The Batman]

^ Lol, to be fair, so many movies/tv shows nowadays basically consist of the supporting cast telling the main character who they are or what they're supposed to do.

 

[Visualiza]

Lemme reword that: whining about people invading and killing the joy in "your" thread, after you consistently doing the same thing in a multitude of other threads is hypocritical.

...I don't think you can provide an example of anyone in this thread doing anything of the sort. While that sort of thing does go on from time to time, we're not a part of some hive mind whereby we can be held responsible for the behavior of others, like-minded or otherwise. Whatever the case, how does that excuse the behavior of some folks here? Do two wrongs make a right all of a sudden, or is this a case of 'everything is fun and games until Superman gets hurt'? If it really irks you that much, then, I don't know...be the bigger man or woman and set the example? Don't resort to such pettiness yourself? Just a thought.

 

[Flint Marko]

So much for the cheer and mirth, eh?

Well played.
It blows my mind some are still coming into this thread and complaining about people discussing their problems with man of steel. Grow up, people.
It's a discussion based forum; just because you don't agree with what's being said or have heard similar arguments before doesn't give you the right to squash the discussion.

 

[Persistence]

I think what's obvious you're making a lot of judgements based on nothing but rank speculation and guesswork. How about waiting until you see the final product before making such specious suppositions?

Fair enough, but this thread is about speculation. I haven't seen any reports that Snyder cares about story and character development...just wall to wall action. I hope the main screen writers do some more interviews.

 

[Flint Marko]

Snyder didn't seem all too concerned with anything but long, drawn out gratuitous action in the last installment. I wouldn't be surprised if that hasn't changed with this next film.

 

[lc23]

...I don't think you can provide an example of anyone in this thread doing anything of the sort. While that sort of thing does go on from time to time, we're not a part of some hive mind whereby we can be held responsible for the behavior of others, like-minded or otherwise. Whatever the case, how does that excuse the behavior of some folks here? Do two wrongs make a right all of a sudden, or is this a case of 'everything is fun and games until Superman gets hurt'? If it really irks you that much, then, I don't know...be the bigger man or woman and set the example? Don't resort to such pettiness yourself? Just a thought.

Actually, I could easily provide an example, but I'm going to take your advice. I was staying out of this before for the most part, but whenever I see blatant hypocrisy, I get the compulsive urge to call it out.

 

[Persistence]

Lemme reword that: whining about people invading and killing the joy in "your" thread, after you consistently doing the same thing in a multitude of other threads is hypocritical.

I have a better question for you. How does one official picture of Superman standing in the rain in what is most likely Gotham City equate to "all that marketing"? So far it's been one picture that's been reposted over and over. The background is a gloomy, rainy miserable-looking cityscape. If he was at Disneyland on a beautiful, clear sunny day and clasping a giant lollipop while hugging a giant teddy bear, and was surrounded by fluffy kittens and puppies and still had that same expression, I would see your point. But he wasn't.

So the movie takes place mostly in Gotham..Batman's turf? I haven't followed that much. You can tell what tone Warner Brothers wants Snyder to use based on the marketing. The S symbol is barely visiable in the logo...Superman has to be standing in the rain/depressed...he can't be in action pose or standing proud. These marketers spend millions on this type of stuff....I just haven't seen any evidence this movie is going to be lighter in its portrayal of Superman. I hope more evidence proves that notion wrong.

 

[Visualiza]

^ Lol, to be fair, so many movies/tv shows nowadays basically consist of the supporting cast telling the main character who they are or what they're supposed to do.

Indeed, but like anything else, there's a right way to do it and a wrong way to do it.

The right way would be the preachy exposition given to Neo in The Matrix.

Needless to say, MoS is an excellent example of the wrong way.

 

[Persistence]

I can defintely see Affleck looking at Cavill and saying "I'm a man of the shadows...I belong down here...but the world...the world needs a beacon of hope. I was skeptical at first...but I think the world needs to see you out in the spotlight". Then we see Cavill flying through a couple of buildings slow-mo

 

[lc23]

So the movie takes place mostly in Gotham..Batman's turf? I haven't followed that much. You can tell what tone Warner Brothers wants Snyder to use based on the marketing. The S symbol is barely visiable in the logo...Superman has to be standing in the rain/depressed...he can't be in action pose or standing proud. These marketers spend millions on this type of stuff....I just haven't seen any evidence this movie is going to be lighter in its portrayal of Superman. I hope more evidence proves that notion wrong.

What? Where did I say that? All I said is the background in this one official shot appears to be Gotham City. I don't know what exact tone they're going for in this movie. I haven't seen enough yet. I hope Clark is happier/a bit less melancholy in general considering that unlike in MoS, he will have a steady job, a significant other, should have some friends, will know who and what he is, and will be established as Superman. Sure he will have the lingering traumatic memories from the past, but I don't see why that should keep him from being happy in his day-to-day life now that he has someone besides his widowed mother to lean on for support.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

Man, a lot of arguing in this thread, so I'll guess I'll explain my thought process about the movie:

First of all, I enjoyed Man of Steel. Yes, it is flawed and there are a few problems I have with the film, mostly with Goyer's writing and the fact that they completely handwaved the aftermath of the Battle of Metropolis for the "He's so hot" scene. Still, I thought it was a nice start for the Superman movies.

When they announced Batman vs. Superman, I was a uneasy over the prospect of having a a Man of Steel "sequel" have Batman, especially when Snyder announced it with a quote from The Dark Knight Returns, a graphic novel I feel is one of the most misunderstood stories in history of comics, and also painted Superman in a very negative light.

I also did not like that David Goyer was coming back as main writer, as I feel he is a writer is good ideas, but often poorly executes though ideas with cheesy, heavy handed dialogue and story plots points that are not thought out well enough (The whole third act of Man of Steel is an example).

Another issues I had wasn't the number of heroes in this movie (for all we know most of the heroes announced could be one scene wonders), but just one casting: Gal Gadot as Wonder Woman. I'm not gonna make a absolute conclusions, because hell, she could knock it out the park but until I see at least a trailer or something more substantial with her as Diana I'm just not excited at the prospect of her as Wonder Woman nor do I see why anyone else is excited, to be honest. But if you are excited, be my guest. It's just my opinion, and your opinion about her is fine too.

I feel like a few of my other issues have been alleviated too. Chris Terrio is rewriting Goyer's script, which is a very good thing as a Terrio's an Oscar Winning Screenwriter who help better execute Goyer's ideas, as coming up ideas is Goyer's best attribute. I always felt what Snyder always needed was a smart, skilled screenwriter to work with.

My other issues with The Dark Knight Returns being an inspiration has been alleviated also with Snyder coming out and saying it won't be an adaptation and he won't be using that version of Superman, which makes me think he's only using that elements of the TDKR version of Batman, which is something I can deal with.

Right now, my mentality went from annoyed about the preproduction of this movie to cautiously optimistic that Snyder can make something great out of this. I look forward to seeing a trailer or more footage eventually.

 

[Lencho01]

^ Lol, to be fair, so many movies/tv shows nowadays basically consist of the supporting cast telling the main character who they are or what they're supposed to do.

That is true. But, I wonder why people like to do it with Superman so much. I can't think of other superheroes having to deal with destiny stuff like him. Spidey in the ASM films, maybe?