The Dark Knight Rises Is Nolan's Dark Knight trilogy right-wing?

Dem mind programming right-wing batmovies, mang. Damn that Nolan.
 
Why are people so obsessed with viewing everything as left wing or right wing these
days?

(This isn't a dig at you Hooper-Man by the way :))
 
Please oh please don't ruin these amazing films by bringing up the utter boredom that is politics.
 
Your avatar is the best thing.

I hope I'm wrong but it looks scarily like he'll be cracking Occupy skulls
 
Breaking news, I've been told the ending:

It'll be a long commercial against Obamacare
 
TDK isn't a right wing movie, it's just more honest than most superhero films about how a city responds to a supervillain.

Regarding the surveillance scene, the fact that the wise Lucius Fox says 'this is wrong' indicates how Nolan probably feels on the matter, even if it gets results in that instance.

As for TDKR? Haven't seen it.
 
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You realise you can argue the exact opposite too, right?

Batman Begins - Came out during Bush administration
Gotham's economy is suffering and the people of the city are tired. Batman tackles corruption, takes down selfish, backstabbing board-memebers, he takes the power back from those in charge and delivers it to the people.

The Dark Knight - Obama "Rises"
All about Dent's change, betting it all on one figure to battle the corruption by legal means. The whole idea of putting trust in the people, and letting people make decisions themselves (the ferry scene). This film is the transition between a Gotham controlled by corrupt bureaucrats and under-the-table deals, to a Gotham for the people, by the people.

The Dark Knight Rises - Defending the current order of things
It's been peace time for years, and now an opposing force comes in, guns a-blazing (similar to how many conservatives have threatened to "take back the country with force"), threatening to take that all away. They smear Dent's name by throwing the Two-Face fiasco in the peoples' faces and instead of remembering the good Dent did, they are starting to focus on the bad.


The great thing about these films is the duality of the political undertones. They're not just one side of the political spectrum; it's both and even then it points out the faults in the actual system overall.
 
Hey, I get that people really hate "reading too much" into things. But I study film for my degree here in Ireland, and when you get into it it makes everything far more rewarding! You can appreciate films as multilayered texts. For instance I read an essay on the Dark Knights use of light and dark, mirrors and glass which blew my mind and opened the film up to much more rewarding interpretations. This is just speculation of course in but I think that deep readings of texts in important and not just mindless consumption.

read the full blog post and see! I love the films too but I can't help analysing them :P

http://fundividedattention.wordpress.com/2012/06/27/occupy-christopher-nolan/
 
Actually, I rather enjoy different interpretations of these movies. Politics is everywhere whether we like it or not. Saying 'lalala I don't want to talk about it, it's just a movie' seems a little childish.
 
@Asteroid-Man

I like your interpretations a whole bunch but I think the end of the Dark Knight is what counts. The upholding the lie to maintain order or to justify their actions. Which is WMDs in Iraq! Also, TDK came out before Obama got elected.
 
hatebox said:
Actually, I rather enjoy different interpretations of these movies. Politics is everywhere whether we like it or not. Saying 'lalala I don't want to talk about it, it's just a movie' seems a little childish.
Click to expand...

This!
 
I'm not going to say there's deliberate political allusions or anything as crass as right or left wing propaganda, but you could definitely take it from some of TDK and as it looks...a lot of TDKR.

When you make a film about society and a city in the wake of terrorism, crime...political subtext is almost inevitable.
 
Batman's facist tendencies have been touched upon many times in the comics, but even then it's still a stretch to say Batman = Bush. The film goes out of its way to suggest that A) the surveillance is morally dubious (why mention it at all otherwise) and B) that it's used for a specific purpose and then done away with. Unlike real life government surveillance.

The final speech shows that Batman is essentially a practicioner of realpolitik and understands the reality of the world he lives in. Within that world he strives for the best he can achieve. The conflict between that realism and his moral code is what gives the character his drama.

With Bush there is no such drama as nothing whatsoever suggested he had a consistent moral code.
 
Oh, I think the series is definitely more nuanced than right or left (I just tried to get a headline that'd grab the attention and bate some debate!) but I couldn't imagine that the political subtext is coincidental. I think it's quite intentional! Have you looked at my article on it, @Sharkboy?
 
Hooper-man said:
@Asteroid-Man

I like your interpretations a whole bunch but I think the end of the Dark Knight is what counts. The upholding the lie to maintain order or to justify their actions. Which is WMDs in Iraq! Also, TDK came out before Obama got elected.
Click to expand...

Has a lot less to do with WMD's in Iraq than holding up the public perception of inspiring public officials. That Bane is apparently going to reveal what really happened with Dent is a bit like when the FBI tried to blackmail Martin Luthor King Jr. for supposedly cheating on his wife.

Its the narrative of the public persona that inspires people and keeps them going.
 
Or Wikileaks? Revealing to the world the truth about the US's horrendous actions in Iraq. WMDs were lies to justify an illegal war, claiming moral high ground and maintaining order. TDK seems to argue that the ends justify the means.
 
Hooper-man said:
@Asteroid-Man

I like your interpretations a whole bunch but I think the end of the Dark Knight is what counts. The upholding the lie to maintain order or to justify their actions. Which is WMDs in Iraq! Also, TDK came out before Obama got elected.
Click to expand...

I don't think he meant it was inspired by Obama specifically but was driven by what people desired at the time (and also was very much the mounting narrative about both candidates at the time, both candidates tried to portray themselves as a move away from the political establishment at the time, hence Obama's "Change" and McCain's constant self-labeling as a "Maverick" and the inclusion of a little known female Alaskan governor as a running mate.)
 
Hooper-man said:
Or Wikileaks? Revealing to the world the truth about the US's horrendous actions in Iraq. WMDs were lies to justify an illegal war, claiming moral high ground and maintaining order. TDK seems to argue that the ends justify the means.
Click to expand...

Except the ends of apprehending the Joker/maintainting pulbic belief in a fallen official aren't really comparable to invading a country for oil. As the ending of TDK itself implies, context is everything.
 
hatebox said:
Except the ends of apprehending the Joker/maintainting pulbic belief in a fallen official aren't really comparable to invading a country for oil. As the ending of TDK itself implies, context is everything.
Click to expand...

But given that pretty much everything else Bruce does in that film, as I point out in my article and as demonstrated by cracked.com, IS comparable with Bush's administration in relation to the war on terror is the final message not important or related?
 
Asteroid-Man said:
You realise you can argue the exact opposite too, right?

Batman Begins - Came out during Bush administration
Gotham's economy is suffering and the people of the city are tired. Batman tackles corruption, takes down selfish, backstabbing board-memebers, he takes the power back from those in charge and delivers it to the people.

The Dark Knight - Obama "Rises"
All about Dent's change, betting it all on one figure to battle the corruption by legal means. The whole idea of putting trust in the people, and letting people make decisions themselves (the ferry scene). This film is the transition between a Gotham controlled by corrupt bureaucrats and under-the-table deals, to a Gotham for the people, by the people.

The Dark Knight Rises - Defending the current order of things
It's been peace time for years, and now an opposing force comes in, guns a-blazing (similar to how many conservatives have threatened to "take back the country with force"), threatening to take that all away. They smear Dent's name by throwing the Two-Face fiasco in the peoples' faces and instead of remembering the good Dent did, they are starting to focus on the bad.


The great thing about these films is the duality of the political undertones. They're not just one side of the political spectrum; it's both and even then it points out the faults in the actual system overall.
Click to expand...

This. Sadly most people are too politically one-minded to ever grasp this very simple, but very true concept.
 
People see these things if they're already looking for them to be there. The people who are seriously tunnel-visioned will only see that their beliefs are supported. People who live their lives only to bring down others will be in an uproar that the opposition is put on a pedestal in the movie. Doesn't matter which end of the spectrum you're on, both sides can be upheld in a debate. I honestly never looked at political undertones in these movies, and never felt the need to try. It's not about politics, but humanity.
 
The rendition and phone tapping have all been done in the comics - the paranoia, libertarian worldview Batman works under has been going since the cynical 70s - so you can't blame Nolan for having that layer in the film. I honestly believe it was a fundamental element to Batman he was interested in and decided to play upon rather than make it a conscious appraisal of Bush.

I also disgree with your opinion that Begins and TDK portray the state with 'order, heroism and honor'. Nolan's Gotham is woefully corrupt at every level, and I hope TDKR maintains that because that's partly why batman has to exist. The attraction of his tragedy is fighting a lost cause within a rotten city.

Since the 'Dent issue' will be brought up in TDKR I'd reserve judgement on how the series as whole tackles it - TDK's closing speech won't be the final word on the matter.
 
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