James Bond: 007 - Spectre - Part 10

[The Guard]

Silva is the person fed up with their boss, who leaves the company and forms his own business. He sets out on his own. Having employees does not change that.

I'm not sure what your point is, or how this is relevant to the larger issue we are discussing.

I never said him having employees changed anything. I'm just saying he clearly does not only work alone.

The scene where Q examines the ring does say Silva was a part of SPECTRE. It shows that they are all a part of SPECTRE. That was the point of the scene with Q and the ring.

Then explain the ring scene with Q.

I don't remember the ring scene that well. I had to use the restroom pretty badly and was basically waiting for an opening.

But I don't remember Q saying Silva was part of it...I remember him saying they were all connected via DNA or some kind of digital file on the ring, based on operations they had committed or something like that.

Then what was the point of the meeting scene? And yes, they all do that those rings. That is how Bond gains access, by having the ring. It shows him as a member.

The point of the meeting scene was to introduce SPECTRE, introduce Oberhauser, and to show what SPECTRE was doing worldwide as an organization, and how that tied into the larger storyline.

The point of the meeting scene was certainly NOT to show that there were only that many people (the ones around the table) working with/for Spectre.

Yes, showing the ring is how Bond gains access to THAT MEETING. It shows him (purportedly) as an important member (they caught onto him right away anyway).

There's nothing that says that every soldier, spy, etc who works with Spectre has one.

You are allowing for plot contrivances to allow something wholly convenient to exist.

Umm...that's the point of contrivance as a storytelling element.

So?

 

[The Guard]

The nano-blood was

It was pretty much the same concept as the chip in CASINO, wasn't it? Just smaller.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

i was expecting Bond to recognize the similarity. But he said nothing.

 

[TeeKay]

I'm not sure what your point is, or how this is relevant to the larger issue we are discussing.

I never said him having employees changed anything. I'm just saying he clearly does not only work alone.



I don't remember the ring scene that well. I had to use the restroom pretty badly and was basically waiting for an opening.

But I don't remember Q saying Silva was part of it...I remember him saying they were all connected via DNA or some kind of digital file on the ring, based on operations they had committed or something like that.

The point of the meeting scene was to introduce SPECTRE, introduce Oberhauser, and to show what SPECTRE was doing worldwide as an organization, and how that tied into the larger storyline.

The point of the meeting scene was certainly NOT to show that there were only that many people (the ones around the table) working with/for Spectre.

Yes, showing the ring is how Bond gains access to THAT MEETING. It shows him (purportedly) as an important member (they caught onto him right away anyway).

There's nothing that says that every soldier, spy, etc who works with Spectre has one.



Umm...that's the point of contrivance as a storytelling element.

So?

 

[I SEE SPIDEY]

I'll never forgive this movie for retroactively trying to ruin Silva for me.

 

[TeeKay]

Yep the whole let's tie everything together IMO was so forced and unnecessary. And Silvia was a much better villain than eh, dammit I don't even remember his name. The villain of Spectre. He did nothing significant IMO.

 

[Frankeh]

I'll be the minority here and say that this was Craig's best Bond to date.

Loved the classic Bond tropes being reintroduced yet grounded in the series' newfound sense of edge/realism (car gadgetry, Bond/villain torture scene, Bond & Swann given a tour through the main villain's lair, etc.).

Moments like Bond falling on the couch in Mexico City and waving to the bodyguard at funeral in Rome were nice marks of humor that I thought the previous films were missing.

M, Moneypenny, & Q were well used too. Moneypenny isn't, nor should be, a main character so I thought her screentime was justifiably short.

Was expecting to come to this thread to see other positive reactions, but the vibe seems relatively disappointed. Oh well...I wasn't a huge fan of Skyfall, so perhaps it makes since that this is more up my alley than it is for fans of SF)

I thought the movie had very effective humor. I also liked that scene with the mouse.

And I 100% agree with you on Moneypenny. She retired from field work in the last movie, what were people expecting her to do in this movie? I mean she still does more than in most Bond films. Some criticisms are nitpicky.

 

[I SEE SPIDEY]

Yep the whole let's tie everything together IMO was so forced and unnecessary. And Silvia was a much better villain than eh, dammit I don't even remember his name. The villain of Spectre. He did nothing significant IMO.

Silva being apart of Spectre is almost as obnoxious as Sandman being Uncle Ben's killer.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

I'm not sure what your point is, or how this is relevant to the larger issue we are discussing.

I never said him having employees changed anything. I'm just saying he clearly does not only work alone.

He does work alone. He is his own boss. He takes the jobs he wants. That is the point. If he worked for someone else, he'd have to take their orders.

I don't remember the ring scene that well. I had to use the restroom pretty badly and was basically waiting for an opening.

But I don't remember Q saying Silva was part of it...I remember him saying they were all connected via DNA or some kind of digital file on the ring, based on operations they had committed or something like that.

The scene placed all the villians from the last 3 films in SPECTRE. Working for SPECTRE. That was the point of the scene. It is why they put people we know were a part of SPECTRE like White and Greene, on the same page as Silva.

The point of the meeting scene was to introduce SPECTRE, introduce Oberhauser, and to show what SPECTRE was doing worldwide.

The point of the meeting scene was certainly NOT to show that there were only that many people (the ones around the table) working with/for Spectre.

Yes, showing the ring is how Bond gains access to THAT MEETING. It shows him as an important member.

There's nothing that says that every soldier, spy, etc who works with Spectre has one.

Do you remember why Bond is at the meeting? Why the meeting is taking place? Because M knew that Sciarra's death would force a meeting of all the major players in SPECTRE to show up to pick his successor.

Umm...that's the point of contrivance as a storytelling element.

So?

So just because you want to buy it doesn't mean anyone else has too. They can call it what it is. BS that hurts the overall idea and individual movies.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

Possibly controversial: but I thought Waltz as Blofeld was the worst villain of the Craig run. Yes, I even preferred Dominic Green. At least I remember his creepy stares and his girly screams. Three days on and I remember nothing about Waltz' performance as Blofeld. No memorable lines or character moments. Anything. Even the scar was mediocre.

 

[redfirebird2008]

Silva being apart of Spectre is almost as obnoxious as Sandman being Uncle Ben's killer.

You are correct of course. The Guard would say you have a very shallow reading of the film.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

I thought the movie had very effective humor. I also liked that scene with the mouse.

And I 100% agree with you on Moneypenny. She retired from field work in the last movie, what were people expecting her to do in this movie? I mean she still does more than in most Bond films. Some criticisms are nitpicky.

What? M retired from field work to, and he still went around shooting people. Moneypenny just retired. No reason she wouldn't have a gun as well. In Skyfall, she had a gun at the meeting.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Possibly controversial: but I thought Waltz as Blofeld was the worst villain of the Craig run. Yes, I even preferred Dominic Green. At least I remember his creepy stares and his girly screams. Three days on and I remember nothing about Waltz' performance as Blofeld. No memorable lines or character moments. Anything. Even the scar was mediocre.

I don't know if he was worse the Greene, but I didn't like Waltz's performance. He seemed so bored. The only thing I liked was him in the shadows and the way he starred at them at the end.

 

[redfirebird2008]

Waltz was not anywhere near as interesting as what we have seen from him with Tarantino. Quentin seems to have the magic touch for Christoph's ability. The writing for this film just wasn't that good, especially the third act.

 

[TeeKay]

Silva being apart of Spectre is almost as obnoxious as Sandman being Uncle Ben's killer.

Agreed. Specter was such a huge step down from Skyfall. Sure it was entertaining but man, the villain was so underutilized and just bleh. I don't think he has that much screentime either. I only remember seeing him at the meeting where he was sitting in the shadows, then his place where he tortured Bond and the end. That was it. I like the actor but he was given nothing to do.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

a lot of people liked that Waltz didn't ham it up. But I thought he should have. The script gave him absolutely nothing to play with. He should've compensated by amping his talents up to 12.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

a lot of people liked that Waltz didn't ham it up. But I thought he should have. The script gave him absolutely nothing to play with. He should've compensated by amping his talents up to 12.

The lines seemed to be meant to be hammed up. That was what made the flat reading so weird imo.

 

[Frankeh]

What? M retired from field work to, and he still went around shooting people. Moneypenny just retired. No reason she wouldn't have a gun as well. In Skyfall, she had a gun at the meeting.

No, she didn't. Bond tossed her one that was laying around. She was still involved, I don't see how it's a flaw she wasn't shooting anyone.

 

[I SEE SPIDEY]

Possibly controversial: but I thought Waltz as Blofeld was the worst villain of the Craig run. Yes, I even preferred Dominic Green. At least I remember his creepy stares and his girly screams. Three days on and I remember nothing about Waltz' performance as Blofeld. No memorable lines or character moments. Anything. Even the scar was mediocre.

I thought Waltz was borderline bad. That "Cucko" thing was funny, not scary or interesting.

I might start calling that character Blow-Feld.

 

[redfirebird2008]

The lines seemed to be meant to be hammed up. That was what made the flat reading so weird imo.

That would be at least partially Mendes' fault as the director. I don't get the sense he really wanted to be part of this project in the first place, which might explain the lack of consistency in tone throughout the film (the script itself is a problem of course).

 

[A Necessary Evil]

Just got back from my second viewing. Still unhappy with Brotherfeld and Silva being a SPECTRE operative, but I love this film. Waltz sells him being a psycho nut very well, but even then I don't find it that bad- as it was only 2 winters.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

No, she didn't. Bond tossed her one that was laying around. She was still involved, I don't see how it's a flaw she wasn't shooting anyone.

Oh I don't know, considering the moment they got out there, she and everyone in her car got shot at, maybe she should of had a gun. Why did M and Bond have guns?

That is even worse, because M brought Bond equipment at the meeting. Why wouldn't he arm Moneypenny? The point is, she knows how to use a gun, and yet didn't have one when she clearly needed one and the boys were playing Rambo.

 

[A Necessary Evil]

Oh, and nanoblood shouldn't be an issue IMO because they already had that in CR.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

That would be at least partially Mendes' fault as the director. I don't get the sense he really wanted to be part of this project in the first place, which might explain the lack of consistency in tone throughout the film (the script itself is a problem of course).

Agree on Mendes being at fault for this as well.

 

[SheldonLevene]

Silva being a SPECTRE guy doesn't bother me for essentially two reasons. He's a rouge agent of MI6 and it makes sense that he would elicit bankrolling from some larger organization. It also doesn't mean that his actions were contrived or dictated by Waltz. Rather...he had a vendetta and exercised an option that was mutually beneficial to him.

Partner (loosely) with a large operation while still being able to do as he pleases and more expertly and tactically carry out his revenge.

I never took it that he was ordered around by our big baddie this time.