Comics JMS off Amazing

[roni14]

Because you've read so much Spider-Man back issue, right?! [/quite]
Fans like you make comic book fans look like Star Wars fanatics.

What? I take offense to that!

 

[Kevin]

What? I take offense to that!

to what?

 

[kainedamo]

You haven't read 20+ years of Spider-Man comics. I have.

See, this is my point. That doesn't make you a bigger fan. I started reading comics when I was about 14, I am now 22. You've been alive longer. That's all it means. Doesn't make you a bigger fan.

I'm not being a snob.

You quite clearly are.

I'm definitely not being condescending. Look up condescending; I've given you the benefit of the doubt so many times. It took us weeks of posts from Herr Logan, Dragon, and others to get you to admit that Sins Past timeline was wrong. Remember when you defended it before you even really truly read the back issues that emcompassed the whole issue?????!!!!

The fact that I was wrong in those issues is irrelevant. Doesn't make you a bigger fan. Lets not forget what we are talking about, and were talking about back then - the matter of the length of time Gwen was out of the country. I'm willing to suspend my disbelief, you are not. That is the only difference between us. I wish you could see it that way. But you have no respect for a difference in opinion. You just HAVE to be right, don't you?

When I was new to Spider-Man comics I didn't have a problem with knowing that I didn't know a lot of the history and if I wanted to know it I would ASK SOMEONE and truly absorb it, or go read the issues before being judge and jury. You read Stan Lee and the issues surrounding the Sins Past timeline now. Great. There is still way over 1,000 issues besides that, that may, just may change your opinion a little.

I've read most of Stan's run, Gwen's death, and Sins Past. What issues would suddenly make me think "that son of a ***** JMS had no right manipulating continuity!!"

I've read most of them, so my opinion is truly cemented in reality. Yours' is based on some kind of psychosis

LOL. Nice.

I don't get paid to analyze you. I'm guessing you don't have an older brother though. Just a hunch. No disrespect to anyone here. Maybe an only child. Not close to your grandparents.

What the heck has this got to do with anything? I do have an older brother. I also have three sisters. I only have one surviving grandparent. I'm not close to her.

Then you are a casual comic book fan, because NO major continuity errors were made before he came on board. Now major continuity errors are the consistant 'norm.'

What do you consider a casual fan? Do you consider a 22 year old man that has been buying comics almost weekly ever since he was 14 to be casual? Maybe you just consider someone a casual fan when you don't agree with them.

Something that you have to consider is that comic books are very different these days. It's a different era. Look at the Punisher. Garth Ennis almost completely ignores what went before - and it works. I'm not saying this is the way it should be with other characters, but for the Punisher, it works. Today's writers want to appeal to a more broad and mature audience. I'm not saying in the 80s it wasn't like that. I'm just saying, guys like Bendis do for todays audience what Stan did for people in the 60s.

You can't expect writers to come up with new, exciting storylines that explore the depth of our favourite characters and for them not to touch whats happened in the past. I'm something of an aspiring writer, and I'd hate to work in the land of Marvel if I thought fans expected me to be creative in a rigid box where I can't touch on the past. I'm not saying the past should be ignored. I'm just saying, tweaking, and manipulation of the past can be forgiven if it is done well.

If you really feel that way, you should have NO OPINION on continuity...since you don't care! If you don't care, then stop pretending to. Read Spider-Man all you want. Be his biggest fan. Seriously! But, don't throw your two cents into a subject that you don't care about.

There you go, ladies and gentleman! I'm not entitled to an opinion

here are titles for People that don't appreciate the 40+ year history of Spider-Man comic books. One is Ultimate Spider-Man, . It was originally designed for the young reader who only cares about today.

By all means read the Amazing Spider-Man, but your opinion on long running timeline related issues, is far down the "Totem" wink wink Pole. Nobody here respects it and nobody cares about what you think on Timeline issues, unless they're writing a paper on young kids disrespecting long standing fans.

And you say you're not a snob and that you're not condescending.

I never said you weren't entitled to an opinion. I may have called you pathetic, but I never said you can't have an opinion. Thats what you have done to me. Its precisely, in my eyes, what makes you pathetic.

 

[USMC]

I'm just saying, tweaking, and manipulation of the past can be forgiven if it is done well.

 

[farmernudie]

^LOL


Ok......i see both sides....and Dan1 said a few things about family and anaylzing you that may be a little over the top...

But overall, as a long time fan i see his point completely and "hear him" entirely, it is prolly how a bunch of us "old timers" feel (haha...only 32!)....but just didn't agree with everything in HOW he said it all to you.

We are all fans...tho....and don't need to compare who is bigger than the other.

Regardless, Spdiey of late has not been treated like the Spidey we've read our entire lives since we've been able to read.

 

[VICTORVONDOOMX]

See, this is my point. That doesn't make you a bigger fan. I started reading comics when I was about 14, I am now 22. You've been alive longer. That's all it means. Doesn't make you a bigger fan.

Look man, you are absolutely correct about the above. However anyone who loves a story based on continuity errors (and in my personal opinion, a complete lack of understanding of who the character is) and states that said continuity errors (enormous ones... in NO way small ones) are no big deal simply is not as big a fan as someone who is unaccepting of these errors. period.

That's like saying that someone who doesn't really care when the Dallas Cowboys lose is as big a fan as the guy who paints themselves in blue and silver each Sunday and weeps when the Dallas Cowboys loose simply because they've both been watching the games for awhile.

With all due respect, kanedamo, who are absolutely wrong on this point. Dan is a significantly bigger fan than you. This is obvious.

 

[kainedamo]

Look man, you are absolutly correct about the above. However anyone who loves a story based on continuity errors (and in my personal opinion, a complete lack of understanding of who the character is) and states that said continuity errors (enormous ones... in NO way small ones) are no big deal simply is not as big a fan as someone who is unaccepting of these errors. period.

That's like saying that someone who doesn't really care when the Dallas Cowboys lose is as big a fan as the guy who paints themselves in blue and silver each Sunday and weeps when the Dallas Cowboys loose simply because they've both been watching the games for awhile.

With all due respect, kanedamo, who are absolutely wrong on this point. Dan is a significantly bigger fan than you. This is obvious.

You're both fanboys. You can't accept that someone has a different opinion. Spider-Man is the character that got me into comic books. Its arguable that Spider-Man is what got me into wider literature. First, I watched the cartoons in the 90s. I was blown away. I fell in love with the character right there and then and couldn't wait to watch the next episode. Then I saw the comic book, sitting there in the newsagents, I had to buy it. Then I bought it monthly. I became interested in other superheroes, and picked up their books too. Then I started reading Frank Millar, and Alan Moore, Robert Crumb, and others.

I'm a different breed of fan from yourself and dan. I'm of a different generation. You and dan are completists. I buy comics for the sheer joy of reading them, not to complete a set like some Pokemon nerd. If something is a blatent disregard of continuity, I won't like it. For example, whats happening with Wolverine at the moment. There is no way his healing ability should be that good, both for the sake of story and because it flies in the face of previous storytelling. As for Gwen Stacy - was she away weeks, months? It happened so long ago, that it is the difference between my left hand and right hand. A writer should be able to tweak the past a little bit.

Could the story have been planned better? Yes. I would have loved to see the story as it was originally intended - with Peter being the Father. Should JMS have dropped the story when he couldn't have Pete as the Father? Maybe. But you have to consider, its likely JMS had already had things mostly scripted and planned out. Another thing you have to consider, these writers work on a very tight schedule. They don't have the luxery of taking a year long break to work on a big story, and work out all the kinks.

When taking these things into account, and the fact that all we are talking about is a period of time a character was out of the country in a story that was told DECADES ago, its not just forgiveable. Its practically almost unnoticable. Except, of course, to fanboys. Who are kind of like fundamentalist Christians who take every word of the bible literally. Hmm, another reason you're both like fundamentalist Christians... "You're not a real Christian!! I am a real Christian! I am a better Christian than you!!". Sound familiar?

There are worse continuity flaws in the Civil War series, and all of that has only been written over the last year.

 

[VICTORVONDOOMX]

Ah... now I see the problem: You're simply childish. I was respectful in my reply to you but you begin your post with name calling.
Also, I'm not a completeist. I believe in good stories and haven't bought an issue of Amazing since Sins Past.
Further, the continuity errors I'm referring to concern the PERSONALITIES of Gwen, Pete & Norman, not simply who went where when.

Please continue to agrue and whine and demonstrate your lack of maturity. I'll really enjoy it.

 

[kainedamo]

I found your post insulting.

 

[VICTORVONDOOMX]

Good. It was meant to be.


Of course you didn't mean to be insulting when calling me a fanboy or comparing me to a Pokemon nerd. heh. Poor little thing.

 

[kainedamo]

Good. It was meant to be.

But you said, and I quote...

I was respectful in my reply

So you're full of ****. Don't call me childish for insulting you, if you had meant to be insulting yourself.

 

[VICTORVONDOOMX]

Wow. You really are ignorant.

Let me explain it to you since SO MUCH obviously MUST be explained to you.

In post #406, I was respectful. In post #407 you began name calling and being condescending because you are such a better type of fan. In post # 408 I meant to be insulting. Get it?

Does it actually hurt to think? Is that why you avoid it so strenuously? Or is it just that you are too superior to actually attend to what's going on around you? Moron.

 

[kainedamo]

Wow. You really are ignorant.

Let me explain it to you since SO MUCH obviously MUST be explained to you.

In post #406, I was respectful. In post #407 you began name calling and being condescending because you are such a better type of fan. In post # 408 I meant to be insulting. Get it?

Does it actually hurt to think? Is that why you avoid it so strenuously? Or is it just that you are too superior to actually attend to what's going on around you? Moron.

Well obviously, when I said I found your post insulting, I was refering to #406. Only in bizarro land was that post respectul.

Really, you getting so angry and all. It's all indictive of the fact that you have issues with people that don't agree with you. Get some sleep or something, man.

 

[VICTORVONDOOMX]

You simply have issues with reality, since in #406, I'm only pointing out the obvious in a very neutral way. Get over it or continue to cry about it. Either way, it doesn't matter to me.

And mad? Please. As I said; I'm enjoying your whining.

 

[Mephisto]

OUCH!

Pwnd by DoomX!

 

[kainedamo]

OUCH!

Pwnd by DoomX!

Stupid phrase. Always used when its not true, too. Doomx is just trying to get the last word in, like a big child, while I laughed and went to bed.

We really should stop insulting each other.

Doomx never even addressed the points in my argument up above. Y'know, where I was being all reasonable and saying Sins Past could have been planned better.

 

[farmernudie]

To try to put it nicely and neutrally...

I think he was trying to say that besides the continuity errors of the timeline she was gone....they also totally messed with Gwens character and personality...having her do something that was outside the realm of believability for fans who read about gwen at the time day in and out. She wouldn't have ever slept with harry's father...PERIOD.

It is highly annoying for a writer to write someone SO FAR out of character that it is just plain obvious it was written to drum up some drama and controversy only. Let alone, "tweaking" the continuity "a little" as you would say.

MArvel shouldn't throw core convictions of a character or core traits and flush them and just say..."well, people do weird things and can change""...that is a lame marvel excuse, and one i've also heard many "fans" fall back on too.

With that theory....Wolverine may have well had a fling with Norman Osborn too....it's JUST as believable.

 

[kainedamo]

Sweet and innocent girls can do surprisingly bad things. Its more than believable. It happens every single day in the real world. Heck, when I was 18 I slept with a 16 year old Christian girl who was hardcore Christian, went to Church every sunday, all that jazz. She wasn't just Christian, she was one of those born again nut cases. It just shows you. Another girl I know through a friend, you wouldn't think it to talk to her, she appears so sweet, but shes a coke head.

Were comic book fans always this whiney? The death of Gwen Stacy drummed up alot of contraversy at the time it came out, so I guess so!

 

[farmernudie]

Cocky and nasty bad to the bone tough guys (wolverine) do surprisingly bad things too. It's totally believeable. That too happens every single day in the real world.

Who is whiney????? I wrote a very non confrontational post without a single name calling of any sort and again you include name calling of sorts. That is so sad. I don't get it.

......oy.....................i tried...........

I'm not going to bother explaining Gwen to you, or Pete and his gang back then, and all the interpersonal relationship dynamics, even with May and Mr. Osborn and etc relating to the younger set with the older set back then...., nor in general the overall innocence of the characters compared to 2007 and the amount of sex and shock and awe pumped into everything from (let-alone) comic books to tv and movies compared to then either. There are too many points to be made, and it seems pointless...because poiting out the facts i guess will require us on here to be called WHINEY or other names it appears.

 

[arachnid-guy]

(On a side note....I like your comic book Kainedamo).

It's fun!

 

[farmernudie]

Ok.......and since I replied....your post is now different.

Now i also see you are insulting BORN AGAIN CHRISTIANS and relating them to NUTCASES.

Very generalizing and degrading.

I am not going even comment anymore with you personally, whether other people want to it is up to them, (nor will i call names like you do or insult a majority section of americans who happen to be "born again christian nutcases"...)

If other people want to give yout he time of day so you can insult them on here..that is their choice.

This should be a light hearted forum to discuss (SPIDEY) COMICS....which its okay to get a bit heated TALKING ABOUT THE FACTS...OR YOUR VIEW OF THEM...but not to call names, or label people and get mean.

 

[kainedamo]

Cocky and nasty bad to the bone tough guys (wolverine) do surprisingly bad things too. It's totally believeable. That too happens every single day in the real world.

Who is whiney????? I wrote a very non confrontational post without a single name calling of any sort and again you include name calling of sorts. That is so sad. I don't get it.

......oy.....................i tried...........

I'm not going to bother explaining Gwen to you, or Pete and his gang back then, and all the interpersonal relationship dynamics, even with May and Mr. Osborn and etc relating to the younger set with the older set back then...., nor in general the overall innocence of the characters compared to 2007 and the amount of sex and shock and awe pumped into everything from (let-alone) comic books to tv and movies compared to then either. There are too many points to be made, and it seems pointless...because poiting out the facts i guess will require us on here to be called WHINEY or other names it appears.

Apologies. I wasn't calling you whiney, I was talking about comic book fans in general. I wasn't referring to you. I should have made that clearer.

As for the born again Christians, I was also being general about that. Not talking about all of them, but some of them. I wouldn't think I'd have to point that out. So you can relax.

 

[kainedamo]

(On a side note....I like your comic book Kainedamo).

It's fun!

Thanks

 

[farmernudie]

kainedamo: I slept with a 16 year old Christian girl who was hardcore Christian, went to Church every sunday, all that jazz. She wasn't just Christian, she was one of those born again nut cases.

And not to get into a theological debate, but just to point out something to you, so you won't sound uninformed again...."CHRISTIANS" by definition are ones who are "born again" through their belief in Jesus Christ.

So stating.....

She wasn't just Christian, she was one of those born again nut cases.

....is redudant at best, and even extra insulting to Christians, the majority of americans and the founding American faith specifically evenmore.

Maybe you can re-edit that post again and add (incorrectly) some extra talk about Muslims or Jews and insult them with names too??

Thanks so much for the thoughtful, nice, non-comic book descriptions you've shared with us today on this forum there, kainedamo.

 

[kainedamo]

Again, I wasn't talking about all Christians. I really don't want to live in a world that is so PC I have to had in a whole extra sentence every single time I wanna talk about stuff... "Not talking about all Christians, just some, the ones that are nut cases, no offense meant to Christians, sorry!!".