News reporter and photographer shot and killed on live broadcast this morning

[Webfoot Hero]

Do you mean how gun advocates keep fighting to remove all restrictions on gun ownership? There's another word for you to look up: compromise.

And those people are wrong too. The vast majority of people for gun rights want the laws already on the books enforced and make small adjustments as necessary, not a complete overhaul that calls for bannings of certain weapons based only on looks and layers of government regulation and tracking that are unfeasible for law enforcement agencies to handle without massive spending hikes.

 

[DeadPresident]

On the subject of guns and the minority population - did you hear about the "Oath Keepers" in Ferguson, DP?

They apparently are (or were, IDK if they're still down there) advocating for the peaceful protestors to exercise their right to firearms. Your thoughts on that?

Are you asking me facetiously?

I don't know anything about it and don't have much contextual information, so I can't really comment.

 

[Greenians]

Is there an actual proper debate going on in the States about Gun ownership? I mean is the 2nd amendment in danger of being binned by lawmakers?

 

[Webfoot Hero]

Is there an actual proper debate going on in the States about Gun ownership? I mean is the 2nd amendment in danger of being binned by lawmakers?

With Republicans in charge of both house of Congress and a Democrat as President, not really.

 

[Teelie]

Few countries have the USA's history and seem to be as hellbent on maintaining the current scenario, despite many social symptoms pointing to the disparity, as the USA is.

But w/e, it ain't my country so I don't have to deal with all the crap you guys do. Whatever anyone believes is up to them, I'm pointing out a theory. All I know is, if I was part of a group that was stealthily subjugated and kept from progressing in terms of quality of life, if guns were easily accessible after a while I might be tempted to gun down some people I thought might be part of that system. It's an academic discussion to me.

It ain't my opinion that matters, ask some disabled, homosexual, black or Hispanic Americans how included and cared for they feel as people. If anyone in positions of power cares about them, I guess.

You don't live in this country but you are more than willing to condemn it as if you knew all the intricacies of it while overlooking all the ugliness of your own and every other country in Europe, Asia and Australia; a country that is astoundly far more racist than the U.S. but regularly gets a pass. Whereever you come from, I guarantee you that it is not as free of the problems the U.S. suffers from. They are only marginalized compared to the scrutiny the United States is given.

 

[Teelie]

And those people are wrong too. The vast majority of people for gun rights want the laws already on the books enforced and make small adjustments as necessary, not a complete overhaul that calls for bannings of certain weapons based only on looks and layers of government regulation and tracking that are unfeasible for law enforcement agencies to handle without massive spending hikes.

Enforcement though, how dare someone enforce the gun laws. That is why we have such a hodge-podge and constant demand for new laws. The gun rights advocates scream bloody murder (ironically) any time someone tries to enforce them so politicians, being politicians, make new, ineffective, unenforced laws and restrictions to placate both sides while do nothing to fix anything.

The existing gun laws need to be completely rebuilt from the ground up and re-examined for modern life but that like so many other laws on the books, will never happen. Too many entrenched interests want the murky, hard to clarify system we have in place already.

 

[DeadPresident]

You don't live in this country but you are more than willing to condemn it as if you knew all the intricacies of it while overlooking all the ugliness of your own and every other country in Europe, Asia and Australia; a country that is astoundly far more racist than the U.S. but regularly gets a pass. Where ever you come from, I guarantee you that it is not as free of the problems the U.S. suffers from. They are only marginalized compared to the scrutiny the United States is given.

I'm not condemning the US, I'm making observations. It is what it is, I don't know all the intricacies, I don't even know all the broad topics, but I can put two and two together and I've been exposed to enough information about American society and the variables that contribute to how a society functions to be able to make a broad argument. I'm also not saying these issues are exclusive to the US, not by any stretch, like you say, each country has its own divisional issues.

I do agree about the Australians though.

By and large, the reason why the USA is scrutinized so much is because supposedly it's the land of liberty, freedom and opportunity - at least that's what its legacy suggests and what the powers that be keep telling their people. It holds itself to higher standards than the rest of the world and so should be judged by them too.

And I'm South African, I know all about the "intricacies" of a country divided by race and how difficult it is to get people to even talk about the issues that affect them, for the few that have the insight to acknowledge they're affected by it. And yeah, I know it isn't "free" from those problems, no country is unless its population is 99% homogenous and they've never ventured beyond their own shores.

 

[Greenians]

With Republicans in charge of both house of Congress and a Democrat as President, not really.

Could there be in the future? whats the chances of a referendum on the 2nd Amendment. seems a bit nuts that any whack job can own a gun....

 

[Teelie]

Could there be in the future? whats the chances of a referendum on the 2nd Amendment. seems a bit nuts that any whack job can own a gun....

Any Amendment in the Bill of Rights (the first ten) is almost certainly off limits to significant alteration. Minor adjustments are made as technology and culture evolve but to ever strike or alter one so significantly from its original intentions will never happen. The problem of course is defining the intention of said Amendments and the most contentious one of all is what interpetation you have for the Second.

 

[regwec]

Yes, that's true, but they don't really have a massive population of a minority that they enslaved and treated like second class people for over a century. One can point at the Indian contingent, but their relationship with white England hasn't been nearly as fractured as black and white America's has. Also, England doesn't have systemically pervasive mechanisms to keep a certain contingent of their demographics from achieving economic and political mobility, the US does.

When it comes to historically recent excursions of rape and plunder the English are definitely the guiltiest bunch next to the US, as any country in the commonwealth can attest to, but suffice it to say their social abrasion hasn't been on the same level of America's by quite a stretch.

It's an interesting point, but I don't think these mass shootings can be characterized as purely a symptom of trans-ethnic tension. Colombine and Sandy Hook had little to do with it, and nor did rare examples from Europe such as Raoul Moat or Anders Brevik.

 

[Greenians]

Any Amendment in the Bill of Rights (the first ten) is almost certainly off limits to significant alteration. Minor adjustments are made as technology and culture evolve but to ever strike or alter one so significantly from its original intentions will never happen. The problem of course is defining the intention of said Amendments and the most contentious one of all is what interpetation you have for the Second.

Bit in bold - why is it off limits? These things were written hundreds of years ago. The world has moved on, i suggest USA do as well. Surely if majority of people want it to be amended then it has to be. Democracy, and all that...........

 

[DeadPresident]

It's an interesting point, but I don't think these mass shootings can be characterized as purely a symptom of trans-ethnic tension. Colombine and Sandy Hook had little to do with it, and nor did rare examples from Europe such as Raol Moat or Anders Brevik.

I agree, and I'm not trying to claim causality, I'm just saying it's a contributing factor. By no stretch am I saying anything about all mass shootings, but gun violence on a wider, yet smaller scale? I think there's some evidence to support it.

It strikes me as too coincidental that gun deaths appear to be more prevalent in states with higher levels of racial and cultural diversity, and Webfoot's post indicating that areas with higher unemployment show higher levels of gun violence. The social psychological aspect is well researched, I'm just putting pieces together. In group Vs. Out group discourse is a human imperative, combined with access to guns and a declining pool of resources everyone is vying for? It's not exactly rocket science to assume some of the tension and violence could be attributed to these phenomena.

It doesn't create the whole picture, I'm not disputing that, but it's a part of the puzzle, that's all.

 

[Webfoot Hero]

Bit in bold - why is it off limits? These things were written hundreds of years ago. The world has moved on, i suggest USA do as well. Surely if majority of people want it to be amended then it has to be. Democracy, and all that...........

The reason why lawmakers don't make wholesale changes to the Constitutional amendments is that it takes two-thirds of both houses to make such a radical change. Trying to get that amount in agreement on a vote about the 2nd Amendment is almost impossible. That's why it's more feasible to make laws that nibble around the edges of the 2nd Amendment instead of hitting it head on.

 

[Leenie]

Haven't watched the video, haven't listened to the audio ... And I refuse to.

This whole thing is horrible enough. Reading the responses from the significant others hit me really, really hard. My heart weeps for their families and loved ones.

 

[Matt Mortem]

Bit in bold - why is it off limits? These things were written hundreds of years ago. The world has moved on, i suggest USA do as well. Surely if majority of people want it to be amended then it has to be. Democracy, and all that...........

Because too many hyper nationalistic uber patriots hold America's founding fathers in such reverence. Seriously, I'm surprised America didn't create a church of the founding fathers. Criticism of them is not allowed and every word and every law they ever passed is gospel.

 

[Thundercrack85]

Bit in bold - why is it off limits? These things were written hundreds of years ago. The world has moved on, i suggest USA do as well. Surely if majority of people want it to be amended then it has to be. Democracy, and all that...........

They're the founding principles of the United States, and its greatest contribution to well, the modern world. Even France copied it.

They're not going to change the Bill of Rights.

 

[Victarion]

Are you asking me facetiously?

I don't know anything about it and don't have much contextual information, so I can't really comment.

No, since it seems like something that would tie into your work I wanted to hear your thoughts on it. Before looking into it I thought they were just there to race bait and stir up the protestors.

 

[Greens]

Because too many hyper nationalistic uber patriots hold America's founding fathers in such reverence. Seriously, I'm surprised America didn't create a church of the founding fathers. Criticism of them is not allowed and every word and every law they ever passed is gospel.

White upper class slave owners wrote a stipulation about arms in the time of the musket but we're NOT allowed to update it.

 

[Thundercrack85]

White upper class slave owners wrote a stipulation about arms in the time of the musket but we're NOT allowed to update it.

You realize that in 18th century America, having a musket was sort of the norm for anyone 16 or older?

Just look at New England.

 

[Greenians]

Because too many hyper nationalistic uber patriots hold America's founding fathers in such reverence. Seriously, I'm surprised America didn't create a church of the founding fathers. Criticism of them is not allowed and every word and every law they ever passed is gospel.

This x 100. Totally agree.

 

[Greenians]

The reason why lawmakers don't make wholesale changes to the Constitutional amendments is that it takes two-thirds of both houses to make such a radical change. Trying to get that amount in agreement on a vote about the 2nd Amendment is almost impossible. That's why it's more feasible to make laws that nibble around the edges of the 2nd Amendment instead of hitting it head on.

What about a referendum for the people?

Fek, we just had one recently to have same sex marriage.......

 

[Greens]

You realize that in 18th century America, having a musket was sort of the norm for anyone 16 or older?

Just look at New England.

I'm mentioning the musket because the Founding Fathers couldn't possibly have foreseen the way weapons would develop into the killing machines they are now.

 

[Webfoot Hero]

This x 100. Totally agree.

We're sorry if we don't like having wholesale changes to our government system on whim just to make others feel better, especially those from foreign countries.

 

[Thundercrack85]

I'm mentioning the musket because the Founding Fathers couldn't possibly have foreseen the way weapons would develop into the killing machines they are now.

Between Ben Franklin and Thomas Jefferson, you might be surprised.

But I just think you have to understand American history. The 2nd Amendment wasn't added for slave owners. It was a right most Americans felt very strongly about, especially in light of British gun grabbing.

 

[Webfoot Hero]

What about a referendum for the people?

Fek, we just had one recently to have same sex marriage.......

Those don't happen here because it's the way the government is structured and laws are passed. You can get away with it in a country like Ireland, but in a country as big and populous as the US, it's just not feasible to vote on every major issue like that.