Official Cyclops/marsden Thread

[Octoberist]

Wolvervine came in like a trouble making woman stealer. Honestly I don't blame Cykes too much.

 

[The Geek Vault]

I felt bad for Cyclops in X2 although my friend pointed out that like if he cries would that mean that his tears are lazer.

 

[Ions]

Easily. Which is what I love about how he's been written.

Yeah, if the scenes they cut were still there. What scenes he has had, would make even more sense.

 

[Octoberist]

bump

 

[Minisinoo]

Heh. I doubt anyone is surprised by the fact I desperately want to see more of both Jean and Cyclops in X3. Such was both my hope and expectation, after X2.

Then all the bad news began -- we had tango with directors, and the rumors started popping up about Cyke dying, and while I'd love to be optimistic (as TNC admonishes ), I find it harder and harder as time goes on. New rumors keep getting in the way. Now there's one from a supposed extra that (among other things) mentions Marsden's entire shooting time takes one day ... I'm skeptical, frankly (I'm always skeptical of rumors coming only from one source), but if he really has no more of a scene than is in that original script, that could, indeed, be shot in a single day -- assuming no equipment or weather problems.

I keep circling back to that leaked script and official denial of those rumors. The thing that bugs me is that at no point have Rothman, Kinsburg, et al., outright denied any of the rumors individually except, I think, the supposed sex scene. The romance is apparently true, however. What has been said is that the script is old. But I haven't heard the scriptwriter come out and say, "Oh, no, Cyclops isn't dying, don't worry." Hmmm.

Now, speaking as a writer, it's perfectly possible to do HEAVY revision to something and not change the fundamental plot elements. So their reactions to the rumors seems more like verbal sleight of hand than denial. Later, they can't be accused of lying because they haven't. They said the script has been heavily revised. I'm sure it has been. That doesn't mean three mutants (including Cyclops) aren't dying, one isn't being depowered, and Storm w/ Wolverine isn't leading the X-Men. (Whether or not some or all of the murdered mutants will return in the final act ... that script leaked did not HAVE the third act included. So I cling to that as my sole source of possible optimism.)

In any case, while I'd REALLY, really like to be proven wrong, I've pretty much lost my faith. I shall continue to listen to the hype, of course, hoping for better news about my boy -- but I'm not really counting on it. Shall content myself instead with my own narrative version of Jean's return, which has rather more of both Cyclops and Jean.

--Minisinoo
The Medicine Wheel: X-Men Fanfiction

 

[The Original Bamfer]

You may get it... soon, if things go the way they should!

 

[Minisinoo]

You may get it... soon, if things go the way they should!

Was that directed at me, or someone else? If you've got possible good news, PLEASE! Spill!

--Minisinoo
The Medicine Wheel: X-Men Fanfiction

 

[The Original Bamfer]

Oh, I don't have more than what I've shared, but we may have some incoming news about the plot soon... I'm sure we'll hear some Cyke stuff!

 

[The Guard]

WHAT!!!???

.. Guard, Are you telling me that you could actually look at the ENTIRE Begins movie and compare Halle Berry's Storm character depiction and developement (From both X1 & X2) to Chris Bales Batman depiction and developement and NOT find more interesting dialouge and character driven devices?????

No. Did I ever remotely imply that? I simply said I don't think Christian Bale had amazing dialogue compared to Berry's Storm. The characters, while written differently, were written on a similar level.

I wont argue with you that Chris Bale is a better actor, or at least attempted to get inside his character in Begins (where as Halle always seemed clueless to me in both movies). But If you strip away the acting and just put dialouge and character interaction on paper Batman Begins kills X1 or X2.

I'd agree with you in terms of character interaction and development (to a point). Dialogue, no. X-MEN and X2 had some fantastic dialogue. BEGINS certainly does not "kill it" in that regard.

I mean Batman is a movie about ONE HERO!!! It is totally and completely focused on BRUCE WAYNE/BATMAN. If nothing else, Begins excels in this area!!! There is no-way you can compare anyones role in either of the Xmen movies to what was attempted with Bale and Batman

No, you can't compare an ensemble film's development favorably to a movie that usually focuses on one character. Nor have I.

Your point of view would be better served choosing a movie with an ensemble cast, cause you have nooooooooooo chance of holding this one down!

Holding what down? I'm not sure you even understand what I said in the first place.

BWAAhahahaha, no chance Guard, none!!!!

Yes, halle should have done something with it. Slowed it down, put some POWER into it, but the dialouge was still incorrect for the "Goddess".

Storm doesnt ask qustions, she commands the forces of nature, for example....

She's not asking a question. She's clearly basically telling him "You ****ed with me, prepare to be friend".

Minor change but HUGE difference!

Not really. One comes across as more sarcastic. Both of them are "questions", though, despite your attempt to make it a command.

See how using what was there, it's more commanding than asking.

She's not really asking anything, though. She's telling him.
And it is more in line with the character. It's then up to Halle to give it the heart of Storm.

Storm would never have said she "feared humans"

Why not? Now, to anyone else, she obviously wouldn't have said that. But in that situation, with the things that were happening between them...she did. She opened up. That's why this scene SHOULD have been more powerful. For a character so sure of herself in other scenes (and you saw some of this in the film, but Halle didn't make it very obvious) to have these hidden doubts...it speaks to audiences, it's something people can identify with. Too bad she half-assed it. And thank goodness Davidson didn't.

she would never have "squeeked" and ran from the room like a timid mouse.

She's running to tell the others that Kelly is dead. No, Storm probably wouldn't have squealed like Halle did, but that's Halle for you. I don't think running to get help after a man you were just holding hands turned into a puddle is timid. Makes sense to me. What's she supposed to do, grab a mop?
And if Halle or Singer (they're both responsible) had cared or wanted to know they could have done something about it.
You keep telling me this, and quite honestly, I don't really care. Should they have done things differently? Almost certainly. But what's done is done. All we can judge is what's there, and since every other actor in the cast didn't need their hand held by Bryan Singer to give a fantastic to great performance, I choose to blame Halle for her performance.

They seemed to hear the critics for X2 and it was a little better. In which case I would accept arguements that Halle failed us more than the writing. But again I can show several examples of it being a combination of Halle's character ignorance and the writer/editor/director's vision.

True, but Halle Berry is clearly a large part of that equation.

I do agree with you on one part Guard. What is the definition of "More to Do"? Halle did everything but fly in X2 (and even then she piloted the blackbird). I'm through with "more to do", unless it is directly tied to more accurate character depiction. Otherwise "more to do" will just be a "Big disappointment".

I just think it's ridiculous that people have this "She had no important scenes" attitude. I don't know if they've figured it out yet, but the X-films don't revolve around one character, yes, even Wolverine. Storm had several very good, very cool scenes that both advanced the plot and should have/could have showed people the Storm they're a little more used to.

I must admit that the whole of Guard's argument is flawed on the basis that he doesn't look at the other side of the story and decide that this other side must have some valid points, and that's where I come in.

The whole of my argument is flawed? I'd be careful with that, because I tend to make good, well-thought-out points. What other side of the story am I not considering? Not AGREEING with the other side doesn't equal not considering. It's not my JOB to bring the other side's views to light, that's THEIR job. This is, in essence, a debate. I'm presenting my side.
Yeah his control issues stemmed his repression, but they would not have had to go into all that.
Just give cyke more than one attribute. His powers/mutation almost forces him into it, and that would have been easy to show. And now that I think about it. One of the biggest parts of Cyke's character that was missing (besides his presence) from the silver screen was the relationship.[/quote]
Why? Because we didn't see them having sex?

We were told, but where was the expression of their love.

Expression of their love as in...physical? There were a number of hugs and "I really love you" kisses in the films, and almost every single scene between Scott and Jean shows just how much they care for and support each other. The emotion shown in several scenes in particular should clue you in to how strong their love is/was.
Why the heck did Jean choose Cyke? "He's the guy you marry"...

Really!??? Did they even share a kiss, hold hands, come outta of the same bedroom? Are we sure these two are together?

Is that what you equate "love" with? Just physical stuff? During the scene in Alkali base, Scott comes up to Jean, hugs her tightly, kisses her, holds her to him and says something to the effect of "I thought I lost you". You can clearly see how much they care about each other in that sequence, and in the stuff in the X-Jet before she sacrifices herself.

Sorry guys, it's evident to everyone without ruby quartz lenses what and who these movies favor.

Where did that come from? I assume it's a "Wolverine thing", but when was that point ever contested?

 

[Doomed_hero]

Cyclops is the first X-Men and I find it sad the hand he has been dealt in the movies. X3 could have been his movie yet in every interview I have seen, I hear no mention of him getting a extended role and all about Halle(who I find is very overrated and got alot more to do alredy in X2). Also I find it sad that I hear the audience saying that they where really pushing for Jean and Logan to get together in the films. Cyclops and Jeans love story has been a main part of X Lore and they hardly even show it.

Cyclops is the leader of the X-Men and deserves the respect and time to be fleshed out. This could have been the chance, yet I hear no mention of him in any interview. It is sad that in a movie with the Pheonix, there is hardly talk of the man who brought her back with there love.

 

[The Original Bamfer]

I felt bad for Cyclops in X2 although my friend pointed out that like if he cries would that mean that his tears are lazer.

W...T...F...?

 

[JP]

WTF??

 

[Octoberist]

LOL. Crying out lazers. I love that!

 

[aaron]

lol, very funny.

 

[Minisinoo]

Well, there is some speculation that Cyclops can't cry, at least not with his eyes open, or the force blasts (lasers! Sheesh!) would destroy the tears, like they destroy everything in their path. Probable. But that doesn't mean he couldn't cry with his eyes shut, of course. The lids would block the blasts, and the tears (from the tear duct) would still leak out over his skin.

--Minisinoo
(Who has spent way too much time working out the logistics of such things. LOL!)

The Medicine Wheel: X-Men Fanfiction

 

[aaron]

lol. if u think too muhc, you end up worse off than when u started.

 

[paec_djinn]

I keep circling back to that leaked script and official denial of those rumors. The thing that bugs me is that at no point have Rothman, Kinsburg, et al., outright denied any of the rumors individually except, I think, the supposed sex scene. The romance is apparently true, however. What has been said is that the script is old. But I haven't heard the scriptwriter come out and say, "Oh, no, Cyclops isn't dying, don't worry." Hmmm.

Now, speaking as a writer, it's perfectly possible to do HEAVY revision to something and not change the fundamental plot elements. So their reactions to the rumors seems more like verbal sleight of hand than denial. Later, they can't be accused of lying because they haven't. They said the script has been heavily revised. I'm sure it has been. That doesn't mean three mutants (including Cyclops) aren't dying, one isn't being depowered, and Storm w/ Wolverine isn't leading the X-Men. (Whether or not some or all of the murdered mutants will return in the final act ... that script leaked did not HAVE the third act included. So I cling to that as my sole source of possible optimism.)

Omg... you've just scared me again! And the most scary thing is, this actually makes a little sense, although I have hope that this will be wrong. Cyclops has always and will probably always be my favourite X-Men and I really hope he will probably have a much larger role (say, how about lead or co-lead character).

But now that I think of it, if he dies but has a good enough role to play, I'll be content... unless Storm becomes the leader in which I'll really really be pissed. I never really liked Storm and the movies made me hate her even more.

 

[aaron]

i forgot we know nothing of the 3rd act, which gives me so much hope.

 

[aaron]

hopefully the war thats been built up in the first 2.

 

[aaron]

well if you check over to the other thread, mike sampson pretty much confirms cyclops' x3 death

 

[Electrix]

Cyclops R.I.P

 

[aaron]

thats really pissed me off

 

[Maze]

If Cyclops die the way it is rumored ,it will be a mistake.

1st you find a way for him to go out with a bang.
You do something significant for the character , not something which seem just there for shock value .

secondly ,even if i enjoyed some of his scenes ( mostly the cut one) anyways,he has not been develloped enough for the audience to care about his death.

if the rumors are true ,I really hope that the people in charge will realize their mistake.

 

[paec_djinn]

well if you check over to the other thread, mike sampson pretty much confirms cyclops' x3 death

Which other thread? Who's Mike Sampson?

 

[X-Maniac]

Marsden is committed to the Superman franchise.

Cyclops WILL almost certainly die. The vaporisation scene posted in that alleged script review was a shocker, especially when presented like it was, out of context of the main movie. But it could work if handled well. I'd rather disintegration as his final fate than seeing him slammed into a tree as in the bogus (fan) script at IMDB.