Official Script Discussion

CFlash said:
armageddon :csad: armageddon armageddon :wow: armageddon armageddon armageddon armageddon armageddon armageddon armageddon McGuffin plot device McGuffin plot device :oldrazz: McGuffin plot device McGuffin plot device :o McGuffin plot device McGuffin plot device McGuffin plot device McGuffin plot device McGuffin plot device godzilla godzilla :wow: godzilla godzilla godzilla godzilla godzilla :cmad: godzilla godzilla godzilla godzilla godzilla armageddon armageddon armageddon armageddon armageddon armageddon armageddon
very insightful indeed, cflash.
 
CFlash said:
Everyone is holding out hope that the script has been revised.
But, judging from Bay's (what can you say about this guy that hasn't already been said?), Rogers (Catwoman), not to mention Murphy's (LGX) past efforts I wouldn't hold my breath. Kurtzman holds some promise (MI3, The Island). But, I sincerely doubt the script has changed enough to make a difference. The explosions, death, and mayhem will be pretty tho.

Replying to myself. I just watched MI3 last night (hadn't seen the whole thing before... it just looked stupid to me) and I gotta say it was pretty freakin good. In fact, I liked it a lot. Coupled with the pretty good story in The Island (which I think Michael Bay ruined in terms of direction) and I think Orci and Kurtzman taking over the script is a VERY good thing. For the first time I gotta say that I believe that the leaked TF script HAS to have been revamped since. If TF is half as good as MI3, I'm psyched.
 
Copied from one of the allspark threads:

In a rare round table, 'Transformers' writers invite a dream team to give creative input.
By Jay A. Fernandez, Special to The Times
November 22, 2006

When a round table of screenwriters assembled at the swanky Viceroy hotel in Santa Monica back in May to look over the "Transformers" screenplay, it may not have had the solemn purpose of King Arthur's knightly conferences nor the savage wit of Dorothy Parker's vicious circle, but it did portend something significant.
While bringing in a group of writers to brainstorm on a project is relatively common in television and feature comedies and animated films, especially early in the development process, big studio action movies like this one — born of the original mid-'80s television cartoon series — rarely get this kind of treatment. More often than not, these are precisely the projects that end up pitting screenwriters against one another for credit in Writers Guild arbitrations after they've been cycled through by producers intent on having them rewrite each other.
In this context, the "Transformers" round table's most remarkable aspect is that the gathering was organized not by DreamWorks but by the film's hired screenwriters: Alex Kurtzman and Roberto Orci ("The Legend of Zorro," "Mission: Impossible III"). A few weeks before production started on the Michael Bay-directed sci-fi blockbuster about a war between dueling machine races on Earth (due in theaters next Independence Day), Kurtzman and Orci compiled a wish list of writers they admire who also happen to be fans of the Transformers brand. Their mission was to look over Kurtzman and Orci's latest draft — the last before shooting would begin — and punch it up one final time.
Kurtzman and Orci's dream team included David Ayer ("Training Day," "Harsh Times"), Rawson Marshall Thurber ("Dodgeball"), stand-up comedian Patton Oswalt ("MADtv"), Jon Hurwitz ("Harold & Kumar Go to White Castle"), Lona Williams ("Drop Dead Gorgeous"), Jeff Nathanson ("Catch Me If You Can") and Don D. Scott ("Barbershop"). While all of the screenplay's major elements — structure, plot, characters — were locked down, these writers were asked to double check its logic and help squeeze whatever additional humor they could from potentially comedic moments.
Since the movie is meant to be a huge, supercool, PG-13, CGI-gasm of a movie, "fun" was the operating principle. With that in mind, at the start of the four-hour session Bay himself introduced the visiting writers to the material with some preliminary computer mock-ups of scenes that apparently got everyone fired up before going through the script from Page 1.
The filmmakers had already consulted in depth with the Army and Air Force, but Ayer, who was a sonar technician on a nuclear submarine in the Navy, brought some ground-level detail to the military aspects of the story. Nathanson, known for his deadpan straight shooting, was apparently on hand to be the in-house critic. And the rest were asked to enhance the setups and dialogue between the human characters and the giant talking machines.
Kurtzman and Orci have worked with Bay before, on "The Island," and as writers on "Alias" and "Xena: Warrior Princess," they also cut their teeth in TV's more communal writing atmosphere. This is something directors often do — show each other developing work for comment — but it requires a truly egoless approach to filmmaking. Which may be exactly why it's so rare in a business that hinges on credit (both the opening-title and capital-C, industry-clout varieties).
In this case, all invited writers signed a waiver that established they would get a standard $2,500 consulting fee and give up any claim to ownership of any ideas that make it into the film. Oh, and they'd get a catered lunch.
When I asked one longtime studio development expert with no connection to the film about the round table's import, he reacted with genuine surprise, saying of Kurtzman and Orci that it was a "good sign of their mental health." He described it as a smart and innovative approach to this kind of material — a franchise film with a lot of money riding on it — that he hopes other writers and studios will embrace.
But beyond that, in an environment where writer hirings and firings can happen more capriciously than Chloë Sevigny's wardrobe choices, it also gives the original writers something much desired but extremely elusive: a little bit of control over their own fate.
 
While I respect the writers for taking input from their peers and people like Ayer and Nathanson impress me, why didn't they involve any input from Transformers comic book writers? Seems too logical of a move I guess.

xwolverine2 said:
MI3 took a piss on john woo

The only thing good that came out of that mockery of a movie made by Woo was Thandie Newton's fine self.
 
if anyone has the script, PM it to me, i've been looking for it online and can't find it. thanks.
 
xwolverine2 said:
MI3 took a piss on john woo
nosebleed said:
The only thing good that came out of that mockery of a movie made by Woo was Thandie Newton's fine self.

:huh: You guys liked or didn't like MI3? I thought it was pretty ok... storywise. Even the MacGuffin was treated in a self-aware *wink-wink* way-- which suggests that Kurtzman and Orci know exactly what they're doing and aren't dumbly making contrived crappola. I dunno.
 
nosebleed said:
While I respect the writers for taking input from their peers and people like Ayer and Nathanson impress me, why didn't they involve any input from Transformers comic book writers? Seems too logical of a move I guess.

I completely agree. Jim Shooter and Bob Budiansky should have been included... if only to kinda probe what sorts of things were in their mind when they come up with the major elements of their original story and why, for instance, they chose the little slowpoke car to be the most visible character rather than the more popular at-the-time Knight Rider/Dukes of Hazzard-esque hotrods in the Autobots.
 
Didn't Budiansky completely rape the TFTM comic with awful revisionism of classic lines?

I doubt he gives a toss if that's anything to go by (not including past comments).
 
Spark said:
Didn't Budiansky completely rape the TFTM comic with awful revisionism of classic lines?

I doubt he gives a toss if that's anything to go by (not including past comments).

That is true, however I think he did add some good story telling that was still transformers true. I dont' know, I could be wrong, Its been sooooooooo long.
 
Spark said:
Didn't Budiansky completely rape the TFTM comic with awful revisionism of classic lines?

I doubt he gives a toss if that's anything to go by (not including past comments).

I dunno. Maybe. I have the comic in the closet... maybe I'll check it out.
I do know I was never a fan of The Movie so I probably wouldn't have cared if he did.

In any case, AFAIK he's largely responsible for all the characters personalities (bios, backstory, skills and abilities, etc) that we all know today.
 
CFlash said:
:huh: You guys liked or didn't like MI3? I thought it was pretty ok... storywise. Even the MacGuffin was treated in a self-aware *wink-wink* way-- which suggests that Kurtzman and Orci know exactly what they're doing and aren't dumbly making contrived crappola. I dunno.

Oh, I most definitely liked MI:3 the most out of the series. It proved that JJ Abrams skills as a director (first movie btw) are immense. Woo's POS made me yearn for the credits to finally come up.
 
CFlash said:
I dunno. Maybe. I have the comic in the closet... maybe I'll check it out.
I do know I was never a fan of The Movie so I probably wouldn't have cared if he did.

In any case, AFAIK he's largely responsible for all the characters personalities (bios, backstory, skills and abilities, etc) that we all know today.
Yeah, credit where credit's due.

I just think it weird that he thought a substandard (IMO) rendition of TFTM was an easier route back into Transformers writing. Those lines are like sacred text to a lot of people. :ninja:
 
CFlash said:
I dunno. Maybe. I have the comic in the closet... maybe I'll check it out.
I do know I was never a fan of The Movie so I probably wouldn't have cared if he did.

In any case, AFAIK he's largely responsible for all the characters personalities (bios, backstory, skills and abilities, etc) that we all know today.
keven O Neal played a hand in the transformers as well he also named OP.
 
nosebleed said:
While I respect the writers for taking input from their peers and people like Ayer and Nathanson impress me, why didn't they involve any input from Transformers comic book writers? Seems too logical of a move I guess.



The only thing good that came out of that mockery of a movie made by Woo was Thandie Newton's fine self.
So true. I openly admit that i mastrubate to her image regularly. :o
 
As for me, I think it is last chance for Bay to prove me that he is a good director.

TF can grow as a new Casino Royle or become another T3.
 
Does anyone have the latest version? i cant find it anywhere online anymore. if someone could PM me, id love to get a look at it.
 
My script review
Overall this script or this interpretation with never make Transformers fans happy...even those in massive denial right now.

It's not a Transformers movie. We don't even meet the Transformers until page 60, and they have about an 85/15% ratio of screentime, humans to robots. For the most part the robots are non characters. Ironhide, Ratchet and Jazz have zero personality. Jazz gets punked like a b*tch too by Megatron after being hit by the Sabot, a Transformer killer.

The Good:
Ron, Spike's father, seems to be every bit of Sparkplug aside from the fact they never hint at any grease monkey profession. But he is every bit as strong willed and tough love as Sparkplug ever was, but sadly underutilized.

Sam (Spike) and Mikaela are the selling points. The two mismatched high schoolers who find eachother through a destructive robot war. Spike is quiet loveable and funny, in fact he is probably the best part of the film. Mikaela is an easy second, as her street smarts and conflicted personality will make her even more hawt than Megan Fox will on her own.

Bumblebee, while him speaking wouldn't have been a problem, is quiet charming and yet badass at the same time. Think Snake Eyes meets HERBIE. Strange combination, but it works.

Optimus slides into the number two spot for best robot. He is every bit as compassionate as the real Prime, every bit as noble...but sadly he is kind of a wimp. The Transformers, aside from Bee, are background noise; completely and utterly. But good background noise.

The Bad
To state again; the Transformers are background noise; completely and utterly. They add nothing to the script, add nothing to the plot except to fight Megatron who ends up being killed by Spike anyways. Which begs the question, if the humans (and they do) kill all the Decepticons...why did we bring in the Autobots. The Sabot takes care of everything.

Jazz gets punked, first by the humans and then wounded by Megatron, who rips out his spark. Jazz cannot even fight back in that scene.

Soundwave/Frenzy is a disgusting mess, the description sounds like a annorexic gremlin...like third world country annorexic. He gets killed twice, by women knocking his head off...as if once was not enough.

The only Decepticon of any use in the plot is Megatron [and really Barricade]. All of them except Starscream (who does absolutely friggin NOTHING!) die. None of them except Megatron and Barricade learn english. And similar to the Autobots they have ZERO personality. Starscream calls Megatron "Lord Megatron"...that's about his only line. Never does it suggest he is a backstabber, never does it suggest he has any particular skill...in fact I imagine general audiences will have a hard time caring he survives.

After being on the Allspark, and hearing how they could give these lifeless alien killing machines distinct personalities I feel nausious. The reason Bay designed the Transformers like he did, sans mouths, monterous, is because that's how he treats them. They are personality less montrousities with little or no regard for life. Even the Autobots don't seem to aware, or don't seem to have any reason to protect humans.

To a general audience member Optimus also will have little personality, for fans Peter Cullen ought to give them what they are looking for though.

The dialogue is also cliche'. Everyone of the military guys comforms to the disaster movie stereotype...even having one with that sweet girl and newborn back home...puh-lease.

The real dilemma is the lack of actual Transformers, they are virtually abscent from the first hour, and when we finally meet them it comes out of nowhere.

This is why the Ark would have been a far better choice for the script, it would have given a far better set up. And the Autobots should have come in at page 20 not 60.

Unfortunately this stuff is pretty much unfixable, lest you film a whole new movie. This could have been an excellent film, but rather than featuring the Transformers story (or giving us any reason why we should care about them) it gave us a full on human story...with little Transformer to human interaction. That's sad.
 
nosebleed said:
The only thing good that came out of that mockery of a movie made by Woo was Thandie Newton's fine self.
meh........

MI:III was awesome
 
Just pointing out that Jazz is hit by a pulse blast from Megatron, not a sabot round.
Although I agree on the point about how effective humans are against Decepticons. It's just annoying.

That said, they wrote/filmed dialogue and scenes which weren't in the February script so there's still hope on that score.

I just hope Spike's scene was one of thos things which was rewritten because it could potentially ruin the finale for me.
 
nosebleed said:
While I respect the writers for taking input from their peers and people like Ayer and Nathanson impress me, why didn't they involve any input from Transformers comic book writers? Seems too logical of a move I guess.

I disagree, mainly because Budianski and co. know squat about writing movies, but also because the input they could give (i.e. TFs history and personalities) is irrelevant. I bet they don't even remember most of what they wrote for the comics, and are probably embarrassed by a lot of it.
 
Spark said:
Just pointing out that Jazz is hit by a pulse blast from Megatron, not a sabot round.
Although I agree on the point about how effective humans are against Decepticons. It's just annoying.

That said, they wrote/filmed dialogue and scenes which weren't in the February script so there's still hope on that score.

I just hope Spike's scene was one of thos things which was rewritten because it could potentially ruin the finale for me.
Oh he wasn't [blackout]hit by the Sabot[/blackout]...I misunderstood what it said then, I just assumed the blast came from the [blackout]Sabot[/blackout].

It won't: Back when X3 was coming out there was this big to do about how "Cyclops will live, it's in the rewrite" and people came up with all these convoluted scenes and additional filmings and additional photography to justify it. What did we get? The exact same script, maybe a little shorter. Chances are editting will cut out useless scenes, not add new ones to please a small section of fans who would just complain about the first draft anyways. If anything I can see general audience people having huge problems with the sheer amount of useless robot characters who add nothing to the plot or story.
 

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