Poorly Written Script

Movies205

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Something that really hurt this film was the script. The script had plot-holes, terrible plot structure, an abudance of exposition, cliches, needless characters, and terrible set-up payoff. Truely when reading this someone should of saw something wrong and not just written it off as, "It's being faithful to the source material". That is not an excuse, if something's wrong then fix it. The first 30-40 minutes felt completely forced, why not just cut it out? Everything that was seen in the first 30-40 minutes has been done to death so if you need to go that route, why not use plot structure to make it interesting. It should of started when Johnny was older and the Devil coming back to reclaim the deal.

The script makes absolutely no sense, if this was to happen to someone, and the devil didn't show up for another 20 years, a person would slip into denial and try to forget it happen. And the person would not choose to make his life-profession the profession that killed his dad and ruined his life. Which leaves us with Roxanne, what the ****? Who stays in love with a highschool fling for 10 years, it doesn't make any sense, and reeks of the crappy writing that use to fly in comics. Why is Roxanne in the movie? She serves no real purpose since the love relationship is completely superficial and forced, she simply serves as a crappy plot device for later on. We're also forced to bear the scene we've seen a hundred times, "I Don't believe you, LIAR!" Come on, if someone you really cared about actually told you something that ridiculous, you would not call him a liar, because if he was, he would of given a more believable lie.

Another useless character is Caretaker, all he's used for is to play up the shoddy writing by having a cliche character walk us through this, funny enough they use the same exact techinique in Spawn with Cogliostro. It wouldn't have been so bad, had he actually done something in the end other than ride with Johnny to the climax only to fade into thin air, at least Cog kicked ass at the end of Spawn.

Then MSJ goes on to break the cardinal rule of fantasy writing which is breaking established rules within a world, he doesn't define whether Ghost Rider is a seperate entity or not. He has him have a cut after transforming for Johnny but doesn't explain why he isn't dead from being shot at. He says he only transforms at night but then he can transform in the shadows. Terrible writing which tries to hide behind the crappy excuse of "Following the source material".
 
People like you are the biggest problem when it comes to movies. You are like one of those pompous hollywood critics who swear they know whats best for everyone. This movie was made to do nothing more than be an entertaining, special effects pop corn fest. Thats it, it wasnt going for an oscar or any other lame ass un-deserved trash award. Its a comic book film, you and the rest of hollywood are just reading WAYYYY to much into it.
 
Just because its a comic book movie doesn't mean it has to have. Bad-acting,no plot,plot holes,bad fight scenes,bad FX,and no lighting to set mood what so ever.
 
People like you are the biggest problem when it comes to movies. You are like one of those pompous hollywood critics who swear they know whats best for everyone. This movie was made to do nothing more than be an entertaining, special effects pop corn fest. Thats it, it wasnt going for an oscar or any other lame ass un-deserved trash award. Its a comic book film, you and the rest of hollywood are just reading WAYYYY to much into it.

Christ... What is your problem? How am I being pompus? How do you justify plot-holes? Poor characterization? Useless Characters? Etc... Dude I love ****in Top Gun and Bad Boys 2, stop being such a fanboy. Just because something isn't taking serious subject matter doesn't mean we have to piss all over it and act like it's crap thus making anything and everything okay. All it means is that it's allow to do things that are more fun however it still needs to be coherent. So please I can accept someone liking the film we all have different opinions but if you can't take your head out of your ass, you don't belong here, you belong in the "We can't take critique of our film since hte best excuse we have to offer is it's a popcorn film" This is for serious film discussion.
 
I really wish you could have separated that stuff. It's just piles of sentences rolled together. Please use paragraphs next time, it's hard for me to read altogether.
 
Christ... What is your problem? How am I being pompus? How do you justify plot-holes? Poor characterization? Useless Characters? Etc... Dude I love ****in Top Gun and Bad Boys 2, stop being such a fanboy. Just because something isn't taking serious subject matter doesn't mean we have to piss all over it and act like it's crap thus making anything and everything okay. All it means is that it's allow to do things that are more fun however it still needs to be coherent. So please I can accept someone liking the film we all have different opinions but if you can't take your head out of your ass, you don't belong here, you belong in the "We can't take critique of our film since hte best excuse we have to offer is it's a popcorn film" This is for serious film discussion.


Like i said, you are reading WAYYYYYY to much into it.
 
I really wish you could have separated that stuff. It's just piles of sentences rolled together. Please use paragraphs next time, it's hard for me to read altogether.

Done, sorry... When I post on these boards I'm just simplying posting my thoughts and it usally comes out as a messy stream of conciousness.
 
Thanks man. Alot easier to read now, and I agree. MSJ did seem to use alot of cliche'd ideas, it's like he just used his first or second draft. I don't think the movie was an entire mess, but writing was one of it's downs. MSJ is not that great of a writer anyway.


It's best when director's direct and leave the writing to the writers(refers to Lucas)
 
Get out, if you can't discuss things like an adult, go talk with the kids about how "the fire looked really purdy".


The movie wasnt made to be broken down the way you and the rest of Hollywood are doing, its as simple as that. Sure ppl are going to but all that does is take away what the film was created to do. Continue to discuss all the small details that were off in the film, going by the box office numbers, apparantly no one cares.

O and the fire did look amazing :cwink:
 
Another problem was the casting in the sense that the script is obviously written for someone in there late twenties to early thirties. I mean if you were going to cast Nic Cage at least you could have written the part for his age instead of just trying ot play it off and having it just smack the audience in the face.
 
Im reading similar complaints,about the story in Ghost Rider.The script could have been better.
 
The movie wasnt made to be broken down the way you and the rest of Hollywood are doing, its as simple as that. Sure ppl are going to but all that does is take away what the film was created to do. Continue to discuss all the small details that were off in the film, going by the box office numbers, apparantly no one cares.

O and the fire did look amazing :cwink:

Is that why it's going fall by 50-60% and make around 110 mil for it's entire bo run, considering the fact that it has a similar opening weekend to Batman Begins which will have made double what GR's going to amke :) This movie oging fall fast... Look take other "Pulp Movies" like Bad Boys 2 or Top Gun and put the script to the questions I Asked and you'll find it passes with flying colors. Hell take any Will Ferral movie and it'll pass those questions.
 
O im not saying the script or acting was perfect, but that wasnt a big concern for me being as this was a comic book film. It was just a fun, cool ride. Kick ass special effects with kick ass characters, thats all i really wanted from Ghost Rider.
 
As I said in the other thread had it just been the 20 minutes that GR was featured, I'd have been far more satisfied because then I wouldn't have to suffer through the crappy script.
 
Cage was decent. I'm sure we all can think of an action star would could have done better though. Only reason why I'd say Cage was good for the role is because he really likes the GR character.
 
If it had been written to his age it would of been better... Cage doesn't work well unless a script fits his style, at least that's what I've noticed.
 
O im not saying the script or acting was perfect, but that wasnt a big concern for me being as this was a comic book film. It was just a fun, cool ride. Kick ass special effects with kick ass characters, thats all i really wanted from Ghost Rider.

No it's not fun if it makes no friggin coherent sense. Perhaps we were to turn off our brain, but why should we? Mindless does not equal fun.

I agree completely with your assessment Movies205. The script was an abysmal mess. The caretaker has one last burn in him so he uses it to take Johnny to the town and then fade into the desert? WTF? Doesn't the chopper from hell come equipped with GPS? Why not just use Mapquest? Or how about just riding on the back of the motorcycle and then flaming up when it came time to battle?

And why did Hydro-demon attack Ghost Rider when he was delivering the scroll to Blackheart just like he was instructed to do?

And why does Satan need a piece of paper to own someone's soul? And why does he need a bounty hunter on a friggin motorcycle when he can just teleport to where he is going?

And you made a great point about the knife. Why can a knife hurt him, but not cop bullets?

And why are the souls in thatwestern town so much more important than say, the millions of Nazi's that were killed in WWII? Seems that 1000 souls are pocket change when compared to the millennia of evil bastards that have died?

And why would Satan give his bounty hunter the ability to stare into sinners' eyes and turn the pain they've caused against them? What purpose does that actually fulfill in Satan's grand scheme?

Parts of the movie were beautiful, but the entire movie was vapid and pointless.
 
Goddamn Killgore, I only thought about the glaring plotholes... When you take it further it really falls apart. Also the chopper and the cops were completely useless, in terms of setup and payoff, they really just were there to kill time and to give GR something to hit.
 
Yeah, I forgot about the pointless cardboard cop scenario.

Beyond the script, is Sam Elliot's mustache eating his face? He had stubble connecting his eyelashes across his cheekbones and down to his mustache. And WTF was up with Peter Fonda's bizarre action-figure posture?
 
I wasn't a huge fan of the direction either, it felt like an amature behind the lens and editing. The color was too neonish and bright for a GR movie. The editing was laughable in terms of trying to create atmosphere. If anything it felt like a crappier version of Spawn since used many of the same plot devices :(
 
And I so wanted to like it...

My wife was convinced that that's the best you could do with Evil Knievel running around with his head on fire as your concept. I'm sure that it could have been better.
 
And I so wanted to like it...

My wife was convinced that that's the best you could do with Evil Knievel running around with his head on fire as your concept. I'm sure that it could have been better.

I've tossed some ideas around in my head as a wanna-be writer... It would benefit by making the main character more relatable and real. If they had started the story right before the Devil came to reclaim on his deal it would of been way better. Also having him be a stunt motorcyclist is ******ed since his life to begin with seems to be pretty shallow. Give him a life to lose, set it up as he has a past we don't know about. A past in the circus, where he lost his father, yada yada. Have this unfold over time, get rid of roxanne, replace it with a new love interest, one that make sense. Have her be a symbol of his new life. Then tear all that away as he turns into the bounty hunter... Let the adventure begin. Make the demon a separate being Johnny has no control over, one who comes out at night, one johnny loathes. These were some ideas floating in my head, however I don't write fan-fiction...
 

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