Pyro vs. Human Torch

[unstoppable]

I found this on google and thought it was funny

 

[Varient]

?
It's canon,.. Johnny storm has complete control over the flame he generates,.. has limited control of flame thats not his,...

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

Just for kicks and fun, who would win?

Torch creates fire and can blast it, and withstand it. I'm sure ppl will post some impressive feats on Torch.

Pyro control's fire, but Torch could roast him with a direct attack. Also lacks compared to Torch on impressive feats.

The fight comes not with power as Pyro needs something to make fire for him and Torch when flamed on is on fire literally. The question comes tho just how good is Pyro's flame controlling ability. Can he turn back any of Torch's attacks and use them against him, and can he manipulate the fire directly on Torch's body and make him flame off? Also who has better control over all of Torch's attacks, can Pyro take each and every blast Torch throws at him and just turn them into some firebird or something and send them right back, or does Torch's control over flame trump that?

When Pyro had the legacy virus (he's dead now btw right? If so then this fight counts when he was alive), a comment was made in the 'Search for Xavier' arc that Pyro's power had never been so ferocious before, so maybe theres more power than he's shown. Anyway, think I'm going with Torch, Pyro has done some powerful things before but Torch can prob just keep pumping out the fire and Pyro would burn out before Torch I think.

What could Pyro do to the Torch? Johnny flames off, and beats Pyro's lame ass into the ground. Game over.

 

[The Question]

What could Pyro do to the Torch? Johnny flames off, and beats Pyro's lame ass into the ground. Game over.

Okay, everyone here really isn't seeing the potential of what Pyro could do when fighting Johnny. Johnny blasts him, Pyro just redirects the fire. Pyro can alsy make fire solid, meaning that he could toss Johnny around like a ragdoll when he's flamed on.

 

[Silicon Surfer]

The Torch can also absorb fire into himself without known limit so Pyro can't use fire against him because Johnny would simply absorb the flame. Fire is simply a useless weapon against the Torch.

 

[juggster-rules]

johnny can creat fire with his own hands. he doesnt need some stupid flame thrower and all that. if pyro shoots at him ht can catch it and send it back to him less than a sec faster than pyro can even control it.

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

From the FF Handbook 2005;

"Johnny can manipulate existing flame, and absorb heat"...

He's also a far better fighter than Pyro...

So again i ask: What could Pyro POSSIBLEY do to the Torch...?

 

[Arach Knight]

Generally speaking, it would be a standstill. Pyro's manipulation of fire is far more vast than the Human Torch. Johnny can aborsb it, and has limited shaping abilities, but Pyro has been known to create monsterous sized beats, out of actual flame, that he controls as avatars of sorts. Johnny would be terribly ineffective against Pyro. He may be a better fighter (which is debatable in the least), but the instant Pyro uses something as simple as a lighter, he is a threat to Johnny. Johnny would have to be in flame form, in order to not get hurt by a flame based attack from Pyro. Just the same, in flame form, he has no effective projection based attack, against Pyro. It would essentially be ad nauseum...save for one unmentioned factor. Johnny controls more than just fire. He controls the degree of the temperature. Pyro has no such control or immunity however, as his control of fire, is merely over it's physical manifestation, not over it's quality. Even Pyro would have no saving grace, if Johnny were to go nova. Even without going nova, Johnny could effectivly use a high degree of heat, that is capable of burning Pyro, even at a distance. Of course, this is only in the hypothetical sense, because we know that Johnny isn't a killer.

 

[The Question]

From the FF Handbook 2005;

"Johnny can manipulate existing flame, and absorb heat"...

He's also a far better fighter than Pyro...

So again i ask: What could Pyro POSSIBLEY do to the Torch...?

You have to remember: Pyro is not only far superior to Johnny in terms of actually manipulating flame, but he can make fire solid. As long as Johnny is flamed on, Pyro can toss him around like a ragdoll. He might even be able to force him to stay flamed on. And if Johnny turns off his power, Pyro would certainly have enough ammunition to hurt people around them. Which he would be willing to do, since he is a mass murdering terrorist.

 

[Franklin Richards]

I doubt that Pyro could toss Johnny around when he's flamed on. The best Pyro could hope for is to extract the flame off of Johnny's body. And Johnny could prolly hold him to a stalemate when it comes to his personal flame aura.

Also Johnny's flame control is pretty good. He can shave people with his flame. He's also makes elaborate constructs like Pyro. Buzzsaws, cages, rings, geometric shapes. Maybe not as animated as Pyro in that aspect.

Also the fact that Johnny is immune to flame even when he's flamed off is a big factor. He could walk up to Pyro and walk through his constructs and then proceed to physically kick his ass.

And let's not discount the Nova Flame. I doubt that Pyro could control that much power. Maybe I'm wrong. I just don't know the upper limits of Pyro.

I still say in the pyrokinesis department it would be a stalemate of sorts. Maybe one could win, but it wouldn't be quick or easy.

Gotta go with the Torch.

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

Lol, you guys need to read some FF comics.

1st; it's NOT debateable that that Torch is a better fighter. While flamed off, Johnny has engaged The Inhumans' Gorgon, Karnak, Triton, and Medusa in un-armed combat...and held his own. Give me an example of Pyro performing an equal or greater fighting performance.

2nd; What IS debateable is the statement that Pyro manipulates fire better than the Torch. Johnny has created multiple vesions of himself to confuse opponents before and made them all actually fly, and made constructs just as big as any of Pyro's monsters......"solid"? Big deal. If they're fire, they have heat, and Johnny (say it with me, class) ABSORBS heat!

So i ask for a 3rd time: What could Pyro POSSIBLEY do to the Torch?

 

[The Question]

Lol, you guys need to read some FF comics.

1st; it's NOT debateable that that Torch is a better fighter. While flamed off, Johnny has engaged The Inhumans' Gorgon, Karnak, Triton, and Medusa in un-armed combat...and held his own. Give me an example of Pyro performing an equal or greater fighting performance.

No one said that Pyro would take Johnny in hand to hand combat.

2nd; What IS debateable is the statement that Pyro manipulates fire better than the Torch. Johnny has created multiple vesions of himself to confuse opponents before and made them all actually fly, and made constructs just as big as any of Pyro's monsters......"solid"? Big deal. If they're fire, they have heat, and Johnny (say it with me, class) ABSORBS heat!

But if Pyro can creat solid flame constructs, then he could solidify Johnny's flame aura and toss him around without even trying.

So i ask for a 3rd time: What could Pyro POSSIBLEY do to the Torch?

He could freeze Johnny in his tracks by solidifying his flame aura. He could amnipulate Johnny;s flames and use them to kill hundreds of people around them. While he couldn't really hurt Johnny, simply being in the same room with him just gives Pyro a bigger weapon.

 

[Franklin Richards]

Lol, you guys need to read some FF comics.

I know that wasn't directed at me.

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

Lol, you guys need to read some FF comics.QUOTE]

I know that wasn't directed at me.

Hell no, lol.

 

[Kitsune]

right HT can only genrate flames not control someone elses he will probably lose deal with it

Actually he can. Heck HT can eqtinguish flames and beat the #$%@ out of Pyro.

 

[Franklin Richards]

He could freeze Johnny in his tracks by solidifying his flame aura.

I think the point, Cap'n is arguing is the fact that even if the flame is solid, Johnny could just soak it up like a sponge. Solid or not.

 

[The Question]

I think the point, Cap'n is arguing is the fact that even if the flame is solid, Johnny could just soak it up like a sponge. Solid or not.

I'm not so sure about that. Technically, Johnny can only absorb heat, not fire (which does beg the question as to why he cannot also freeze things). It's just, without heat, the fire dies. However, fire is not normally solid, so it's not quite certain that Pyro's solid fire consructs behave like normal fire does.

 

[Franklin Richards]

No, he can absorb the actual plasma created by fire. He does have to expel it if it's a great amount though.

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

No one said that Pyro would take Johnny in hand to hand combat.



But if Pyro can creat solid flame constructs, then he could solidify Johnny's flame aura and toss him around without even trying.



He could freeze Johnny in his tracks by solidifying his flame aura. He could amnipulate Johnny;s flames and use them to kill hundreds of people around them. While he couldn't really hurt Johnny, simply being in the same room with him just gives Pyro a bigger weapon.

1) In post #33 Arachknight questions Johnny's superior fighting skills.

2) "freeze johnny in his tracks"? Debateable. Maybe...if Pyro has greater control, which no one has proven yet. Regardless, all Johnny has to do is flame off and confront Pyro physically.

3) "kill hundreds of people around them"? I suppose, assuming Johnny was stupid enough to engage Pyro near a large crowd....but last time i checked, Johnny was a member of the FF...not the New Warriors.

 

[SSJ4_Mikael]

Pyro can cotroll all fire within a radius of 100 m.
If Human Torch charges against Pyro he will turn into a puppet, and Pyro will hold the stings.

 

[The Question]

No, he can absorb the actual plasma created by fire. He does have to expel it if it's a great amount though.

But fire doesn't create plasma.

2) "freeze johnny in his tracks"? Debateable. Maybe...if Pyro has greater control, which no one has proven yet. Regardless, all Johnny has to do is flame off and confront Pyro physically.

True. Of course, one could argue that Pyro could force Johnny to stay flamed on.

3) "kill hundreds of people around them"? I suppose, assuming Johnny was stupid enough to engage Pyro near a large crowd....but last time i checked, Johnny was a member of the FF...not the New Warriors.

Or, Pyro could take the fight into the streets. I mean, there's no way Johnny could have complete control over when and where the fight took place in all scenarios.

 

[Franklin Richards]

But fire doesn't create plasma.

Fire happens because the heat generated by the oxidation reaction makes the air molecules agitate very vigorously. The molecules bump into one another and during this process their motion energy (kinetic energy) is transferred temporarily to their electrons. The electrons jump further away from the atomic nuclei, but most of them don't go sufficiently far away to actually escape their grip (this process is called "excitation"). When the electrons return to their original orbits, they release the extra energy as light. Some of the electrons might escape the molecules, leaving behind charged ions, but they are quickly caught back by other ions. Fire is thus only a very limited form of plasma.

I was just trying to describe the stuff that fire is that's not heat.

 

[yenaled]

Pyro gets a vote because he needs love.

Poor Pyro.

 

[The Hill]

Couldn't Pyro snuff out the fire Human Torch summons around him or directs at him? He (Pyro) could prevent Storm from 'Flaming On', right? so it would just come down to a hand to hand.

 

[Silicon Surfer]

The Torch has routinely created multiple images of himself and controlled them all at the same time with each having apparently independant actions. That is more sophisticated control than Pyro has ever manifested so far as I know. Pyro has always stuck to single large constructs.

Johnny is almost certainly superior in the flame control dept. as well. Johnny can absorb flame not just heat. He has absorbed all the flame from a multi-story building fire into himself.